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Berserk => Current Episodes => Topic started by: Aazealh on September 18, 2009, 07:19:20 AM

Title: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 18, 2009, 07:19:20 AM
Title: ファルコニア - Falconia (http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/)



(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/berserk_img_bottom.jpg)    (http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/vol34.jpg)

http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/34/ (http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/34/)
http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/opx/index.html (http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/opx/index.html)

In shops of the book company Yurindo (http://www.yurindo.co.jp/), an exhibition of Miura's original works as well as some reproductions will take place from 9/25 to 10/25.



4 appendices:

- Alternate cover of volume 34 (done by Miura)
- Big poster 50 cm x 60 cm (Guts vs Zodd picture, click below to enlarge)
- Apostle-themed dice-based game (not featured)
- A separate booklet focusing on the characters and world of Berserk (with Guts on the cover)


(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/34-another-cover_large.jpg)

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/20th-bigposter_small.jpg) (http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/20th-bigposter_large.jpg)  (http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/character-world_large.jpg)



Some other bonuses in limited numbers:

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/CS.jpg)

Berserk-themed book cover protection, available in Circle K Sunkus stores.

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/suica-seal.jpg)

Some SUICA "seals" available from Book Express.

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/uchiwa.jpg)

Fans available in Yurindo stores.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Slime_Beherit on September 18, 2009, 07:59:42 AM
Ah man this is awesome!!!! though i don't know if i want to use that alternate cover, i would feel like framing it instead. The poster looks pretty cool too, though it looks like Zodd's gonna win as one of his horn looks like its gonna pierce Guts' heart :zodd:. The part that kills me is that the place where i get my Japanese Berserk volumes and Young Animal , said even though i reserved the YA they can't guarantee a copy :mozgus: :judo:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skull Knight on September 18, 2009, 08:43:11 AM
Damn, it's a shame this issue can't be ordered individually without a pricey subscription  :chomp:(not all of us are made of money)  :puck: I guess the only way I will be able to get the variant slipcover is through high res scans from some generous person, which makes me sad.  :judo:

I agree this Volume 34 cover with Griffith and Zodd is amazing! Some of the more recent Volume covers (the profile ones) weren't really all that interesting in my opinion. Not that they were bad...just not attention grabbing...but wow 34 is Miura at his best! 

Can't wait to pick this one up!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on September 18, 2009, 08:47:07 AM
Well I am pretty fucking excited that a separate book Berserk's world and characters will be available.  :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: slan69 on September 18, 2009, 08:55:23 AM
Well I am pretty fucking excited that a separate book Berserk's world and characters will be available.  :isidro:

Where can you buy this from? I know it is most likely going to end up on YJA, and maybe even eBay.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 18, 2009, 09:00:19 AM
Damn, it's a shame this issue can't be ordered individually without a pricey subscription  :chomp:(not all of us are made of money)  :puck: I guess the only way I will be able to get the variant slipcover is through high res scans from some generous person, which makes me sad.  :judo:

You'll be able to buy that issue of YA and the accompanying bonuses from Yahoo! Japan auctions.

Where can you buy this from? I know it is most likely going to end up on YJA, and maybe even eBay.

It'll be bundled with YA. And I doubt it's going to end up on eBay.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: PineappleSkewer on September 18, 2009, 10:10:14 AM
That poster of Zodd and Guts is a must have for me! It would be even nicer if there was a bit of BG in there.


A Berserk fan? Well, I guess you wouldn't look like as much of a pansy with Guts on it.:troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Drakull on September 18, 2009, 11:08:28 AM
Thanks Aazealh for these news !
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Cronus on September 18, 2009, 11:37:58 AM
That 34 cover is absolutely the best yet.  Can't wait to get my hands on it!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 18, 2009, 12:51:41 PM
Thanks Aaz for the great news!

The alternate Book 34 cover really stands out to me. It's pretty awesome to see Guts and Griffith both decked out in full armor. I love the rendering of "sane" Berserker Guts especially.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Draculoid on September 18, 2009, 01:45:33 PM
Thanks you so much for posting all these scans :D looking at all the new stuff for the 20th anniversary special really made my day ^^
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: yesmilord on September 18, 2009, 01:50:00 PM
I'm going to hit up my local Kinokuniya today and see if they'll be getting any of these in (or if I could even order it through them).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 18, 2009, 01:53:20 PM
Oh man, too cool! Thanks for posting pics of all those goodies, Aazealh! Both the regular and alternate cover for Vol. 34 kick ass. I'll see if I can snag this off of Yahoo! Japan Auctions or at the Kinokuniya down the street.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Vampire_Hunter_Bob on September 18, 2009, 03:09:04 PM
It's so beautiful. Serious shame I don't have the funds to order that issue right now.  :judo:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: The Beast of Darkness on September 18, 2009, 03:22:28 PM
Aazealh, thanks to have posted all these goodies, everything looks promising!
The new artworks are magnificent! :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Armando on September 18, 2009, 04:50:22 PM
Alternative cover is so BADASS!!!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 18, 2009, 06:00:04 PM
These are some spectacular freebies! If I had to pick, I'd say I'm most interested in the mini-booklet about the characters and world of Berserk. That sounds really intriguing. I wonder how extensive it'll be, and if it'll include English translations of the names, like they do with the current character summaries in the volumes.

I've already requested Wed. off work so I can take in all the 307 goodness without distraction  :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Riastrathe on September 18, 2009, 07:43:15 PM
I absolutely love it all; covers, everything. I agree the mini-booklet, I'm looking forward to the most and hope that it holds some new or clarifying information. Also is the booklet written by Miura which I assume or just someone writing with the same view/info as us.

This is probably my most anticipated episode so far.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 18, 2009, 08:39:02 PM
Also is the booklet written by Miura which I assume or just someone writing with the same view/info as us.

It's not sure yet that it will contain much text (could very well be mostly pictures), but if it does it will have probably been written by people from the YA staff, possibly with Miura's collaboration.

EDIT: The page for the Berserk event is up on Yurindo's website: http://www.yurindo.co.jp/info/0909berserk34.html (http://www.yurindo.co.jp/info/0909berserk34.html)

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/berserk_illust2.jpg)  (http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/berserk_illust1.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: JezzaX on September 19, 2009, 05:57:14 PM
Can I have both those and the Guts vs Zodd poster please? They are all very sexy  :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Shadow8 on September 19, 2009, 05:58:09 PM
I will buy the magazine for my collection. :guts:

I can't wait the booklet
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 20, 2009, 03:16:37 AM
Wow, that stuff is awesome! :magni:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dembol on September 20, 2009, 08:42:02 AM
Nice. Now all I need to do is somehow get my hands on this issue...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 20, 2009, 08:49:19 AM
Looks like my guess was correct: the city of Falconia has appeared, and Ganishka may apparently have turned into a tree. :guts: The city has a very... futuristic look to it, if you ask me. Locus will feel right at home! :void:

The episode is 23 pages long, all two-page spreads save for one. Next episode will be released on October 9.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Death May Die on September 20, 2009, 09:21:33 AM
Good call Aaz. I'm loving the two page spreads.

The place is massive. So this is what all those bodies paving the stone path leads too.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 20, 2009, 09:24:29 AM
The place is massive. So this is what all those bodies paving the stone path leads too.

Yup, looks like it. I'm wondering if what's left of the citizens of Wyndham will be enough to populate this gigantic city or if they'll bring in people from all around Midland. And I know we're saying this every time and it gets old and all but seriously, Guts is going to have a hard time getting his revenge. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Death May Die on September 20, 2009, 09:31:36 AM
Guts is going to have a hard time getting his revenge. :ganishka:

I was thinking the same thing. Its going to be just as fun seeing that place come down as it is watching it appear.

God Hand Beings. Monstrous Apostles. Towering Empire. Army of the Endless Dead.
~ Ha! No match for a man with a 9ft sword and a elf.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 20, 2009, 09:39:09 AM
Looks like my guess was correct: the city of Falconia has appeared
Interesting that though Falconia appeared, it's not in place of the towering figure of light at the end of 306. On the first preview page, you can see the "tree" still outside Falconia. Yet, by the end of the episode, there's no evidence of it (or perhaps it's just not within view of this angle). It hasn't even changed, if going strictly by the first preview page. What the hell is it, then?

Another cool thing I was interested in is the imagery of human and creature together along the outside of the city. A fitting motif. Also, I'd like to see the sigil above the doorway to the city in more detail. Looks like a falcon motif, obviously, but ... I wonder if there's some other imagery in it.

Oh yeah and, I wonder what's inside  :carcus:


Since we've been on break for so long, I thought it would be useful to do a quick review of volumes 33-34 in preparation for the coming episode(s). Please don't hesitate to comment on what you think these situations will set up for the groups in the near future.

Guts' perspective:
The group has set sail from Vritannis to Skellig in search of Elfhelm for a safe haven and a cure to Casca's mind. Roderick, who is still determined to spark a romantic interest in Farnese, has lended his ship, the Sea Horse. While aboard, Isidro trains with Azan, who is shocked to be on the same boat with his former comrades after being exiled from the Holy See. He futilely pretends not to know them. Farnese expands her magic studies with Schierke into astral projection, during which they are both faced with the uncomfortable reality that the man they admire is undeniably devoted to Casca. Guts nearly drowns while rescuing Casca, and remembers their time together, and how they got to where they are now, realizing the past still weighs him down in more ways than one.

Pirates attack the Sea Horse, leading to a confrontation that shows Roderick's nautical skills. During the battle, Guts has a fever, and while asleep, the Beast delivers a message. It says the chains that bind it won't hold forever, and it will emerge again, swallowing Guts completely after his new friends are inevitably killed. Guts remembers nothing from the dream. During the victory celebrations, Magnifico unveils his ambition to Roderick of exploiting the magical riches of Elfhelm -- a plan that coincides with he and Roderick's earlier talks of discovering new, uncharted territories, albeit for different reasons. Roderick doesn't seem interested, but Puck humorously takes a quick liking to the prospect of becoming the new king of his homeland. And while Farnese and Roderick draw closer, Serpico finds himself losing footing with his half-sister.

Guts, Puck, the beherit, Casca and Schierke sense something evil across the world. Schierke says it feels like the world is being ripped in two. Later, the group is washed over by the tidal wave spreading across the globe as the worlds are merged.

Griffith's perspective:
Raban and others in the resistance lead a rescue mission for the citizens still inside Wyndham behind enemy lines. Meanwhile, Griffith leads the Falcons and what little troops the Holy See Alliance has sent with them to gather around Wyndham, preparing for the promised decisive battle against the Kushans. Fearing his loss of control in Griffith's presence and sensing that nothing he can do will be effective against him, Ganishka makes a desperate bid for power by entering the apostle chamber. Immediately afterward, his fog envelops the city, devouring every living thing it touches, reducing his forces within the city to empty armors. The citizens of Wyndham are all saved from the fog by their children's prophetic dream, and use the armors to escape from the city without raising alarm among the troops stationed outside. En route to safety, they encounter Silat and the Bakiraka. They are able to pass without incident after a Kushan emissary of Griffith's, Jaris, convinces Silat to let them pass.

Ganishka emerges from the apostle chamber as a towering mass of evil. Driven mad by power, he crushes Wyndham and tramples his remaining forces while Daiba tries in vain to bring his master back to his senses. Ganishka-like creatures spawn from the craters of his footsteps and assault the Falcons. Griffith commands them to unleash their evil, exposing their monstrous forms to the humans. The humans reel in terror, but as apostles give their lives in defense, Sonia reminds them that they are on the same side. The humans rise to protect them, leading to a collusion of humans and apostles.

Griffith flies on the back of Zodd to the top of the towering figure, where is left a part of Ganishka that is still sane. We see a flashback of how Ganishka became an apostle -- ruled by fear all his life he sacrificed his like-minded, traitorous son. Griffith drops his guise and turns into Femto to unlock the power inside Ganishka, but The Skull Knight appears at the critical moment, slicing at Femto with the Yobimizu no Tsurugi. Femto distorts space and manipulates the slash so that it strikes Ganishka, creating a rift that erupts a wave of astral power that envelops the world, creating a new one where human and astral creatures coexist.

The humans and apostles stare upward, transfixed by the glowing light coming from the towering form.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: slan69 on September 20, 2009, 09:46:33 AM
Holy shit Falconia looks amazing! All I can say is goodluck Guts.  :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: The Beast of Darkness on September 20, 2009, 10:07:11 AM
Falconia is gigantic!
Guts and his companions are going to have a hard time getting on top of that,
just imagine the bloodbath that is going to take place in there!  :beast:
By the way, any guess about what is the enormous form that we can see behind Falconia, in the sky?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 20, 2009, 10:21:07 AM
By the way, any guess about what is the enormous form that we can see behind Falconia, in the sky?

I've wondered about that as well, but I couldn't think of anything obvious. Could be a giant monument within Falconia or something else created from Ganishka.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 20, 2009, 10:33:44 AM
I've wondered about that as well, but I couldn't think of anything obvious. Could be a giant monument within Falconia or something else created from Ganishka.

Looks like it could be a giant orb or dome. Of course, it could be a lot of things from this vantage point.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: DrPepperPro on September 20, 2009, 10:40:41 AM
I was thinking it could be a giant beherit, in shape only or maybe more.  But ya could be anything.

And at first glance I thought those things flying above the city were:

(http://www.skullknight.net/forum/oekaki/pictures/201.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: JezzaX on September 20, 2009, 10:41:23 AM
Whoa, that's huge and looks fantastic. Let the speculation begin on the object behind/in Falconia
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on September 20, 2009, 10:41:37 AM
Very nice, Falconia looks amazing! :isidro:

Since we've been on break for so long, I thought it would be useful to do a quick review of volumes 33-34 in preparation for the coming episode(s). Please don't hesitate to comment on what you think these situations will set up for the groups in the near future.

Good sum up. let's try.

Guts' perspective:
The group has set sail from Vritannis to Skellig in search of Elfhelm for a safe haven and a cure to Casca's mind. Roderick, who is still determined to spark a romantic interest in Farnese, has lended his ship, the Sea Horse. While aboard, Isidro trains with Azan, who is shocked to be on the same boat with his former comrades after being exiled from the Holy See. He futilely pretends not to know them. Farnese expands her magic studies with Schierke into astral projection, during which they are both faced with the uncomfortable reality that the man they admire is undeniably devoted to Casca. Guts nearly drowns while rescuing Casca, and remembers their time together, and how they got to where they are now, realizing the past still weighs him down in more ways than one.

Pirates attack the Sea Horse, leading to a confrontation that shows Roderick's nautical skills. During the battle, Guts has a fever, and while asleep, the Beast delivers a message. It says the chains that bind it won't hold forever, and it will emerge again, swallowing Guts completely after his new friends are inevitably killed. Guts remembers nothing from the dream. During the victory celebrations, Magnifico unveils his ambition to Roderick of exploiting the magical riches of Elfhelm -- a plan that coincides with he and Roderick's earlier talks of discovering new, uncharted territories, albeit for different reasons. Roderick doesn't seem interested, but Puck humorously takes a quick liking to the prospect of becoming the new king of his homeland. And while Farnese and Roderick draw closer, Serpico finds himself losing footing with his half-sister.

Guts, Puck, the beherit, Casca and Schierke sense something evil across the world. Schierke says it feels like the world is being ripped in two. Later, the group is washed over by the tidal wave spreading across the globe as the worlds are merged.

Well I think that the rebound of this huge merging will soon produce effect for the travel; There could be appearence of sea monster and so on, but even some unexpected things.
Moreover, the other members of Guts' party as you said still have their goals, and I think they have to rely too with those huge changes(that I think will move on even the political one of every country).
If as we thought on one hand the people under Griffith wings will eventually find a safe protection from those astral creatures, we have to think what other countries will do, and Roderik and magnifico too.
I think Schierke would be a good help for people ad guide to explain(and eventually fight) supernatural creatures, without necessarely deal with Falconia.
Guts, at this rate, is too weak to fight, then I think that he will have some other role in the near future.


Griffith's perspective:
Raban and others in the resistance lead a rescue mission for the citizens still inside Wyndham behind enemy lines. Meanwhile, Griffith leads the Falcons and what little troops the Holy See Alliance has sent with them to gather around Wyndham, preparing for the promised decisive battle against the Kushans. Fearing his loss of control in Griffith's presence and sensing that nothing he can do will be effective against him, Ganishka makes a desperate bid for power by entering the apostle chamber. Immediately afterward, his fog envelops the city, devouring every living thing it touches, reducing his forces within the city to empty armors. The citizens of Wyndham are all saved from the fog by their children's prophetic dream, and use the armors to escape from the city without raising alarm among the troops stationed outside. En route to safety, they encounter Silat and the Bakiraka. They are able to pass without incident after a Kushan emissary of Griffith's, Jaris, convinces Silat to let them pass.

Ganishka emerges from the apostle chamber as a towering mass of evil. Driven mad by power, he crushes Wyndham and tramples his remaining forces while Daiba tries in vain to bring his master back to his senses. Ganishka-like creatures spawn from the craters of his footsteps and assault the Falcons. Griffith commands them to unleash their evil, exposing their monstrous forms to the humans. The humans reel in terror, but as apostles give their lives in defense, Sonia reminds them that they are on the same side. The humans rise to protect them, leading to a collusion of humans and apostles.

Griffith flies on the back of Zodd to the top of the towering figure, where is left a part of Ganishka that is still sane. We see a flashback of how Ganishka became an apostle -- ruled by fear all his life he sacrificed his like-minded, traitorous son. Griffith drops his guise and turns into Femto to unlock the power inside Ganishka, but The Skull Knight appears at the critical moment, slicing at Femto with the Yobimizu no Tsurugi. Femto distorts space and manipulates the slash so that it strikes Ganishka, creating a rift that erupts a wave of astral power that envelops the world, creating a new one where human and astral creatures coexist.

The humans and apostles stare upward, transfixed by the glowing light coming from the towering form.

Here we have had a lot of sensational developments, and on the top of unexpected things now we can see Falconia.
I have always thought that Griffith would have build up a brand new country with the help of everyone more or less like Gaiseric, but the fact that it has appeared well set already, I think that suggests that even this country was desired already from mankind. Than everything is the will of God, that has to obey to the common coscience.
However I think that SK may go after Guts to explain the current situation;
Then I still can't imagine if Griffith will remain as Femto or not;
We have to see how Federico is gonna handle all this, and how the other nobles will act.
Anyway I think that the whole family of Farnese will rely on differend forces..
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Doc on September 20, 2009, 01:27:08 PM
Wow! Griffith's dream is finally coming to fruition. Sensational images there!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Proj2501 on September 20, 2009, 03:22:54 PM
Wow, I didn't see Falconia just appearing like this...
...but since Miura's the man selling it, I'll gladly buy it.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 20, 2009, 03:33:57 PM


This is amazing! I'm sure amazed how that looks. Thank you Miura for always delivering such great art every time.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 20, 2009, 04:04:30 PM
Moreover, the other members of Guts' party as you said still have their goals, and I think they have to rely too with those huge changes(that I think will move on even the political one of every country).
What Locus said was true -- the previous power structures of the world, and politics, no longer have any meaning. No city will be able to defend against such an unprecedented attack. This changes everything.

Quote
If as we thought on one hand the people under Griffith wings will eventually find a safe protection from those astral creatures, we have to think what other countries will do, and Roderik and magnifico too.
I think Schierke would be a good help for people ad guide to explain(and eventually fight) supernatural creatures, without necessarely deal with Falconia.
Guts, at this rate, is too weak to fight, then I think that he will have some other role in the near future.
That's a good plan, except for the fact that Guts and Co. are headed to an isolated island of elves, not to train and protect humans. Unless you mean in the looooong run.

Quote
Here we have had a lot of sensational developments, and on the top of unexpected things now we can see Falconia.
I have always thought that Griffith would have build up a brand new country with the help of everyone more or less like Gaiseric, but the fact that it has appeared well set already, I think that suggests that even this country was desired already from mankind.
Or just the desire of one very influential person.  :griffnotevil:

Quote
We have to see how Federico is gonna handle all this, and how the other nobles will act.
Anyway I think that the whole family of Farnese will rely on differend forces..
Federico Vandimion is screwed. Money can no longer buy him safety. Unless there happen to be some creatures willing to be hired for gold.


Something that caught my eye in these preview pages that could simply be a coincidence.


(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-sigil.jpg) (http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-sigil2.jpg)
(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-sigil.jpg)

I know they aren't exactly the same, there's clearly a falcon motif going on with the Falconia sigil, but considering the connection between these two and their empires, I thought it could be more than just coincidence.


Oh yeah, and I think Zodd is trying to lay claim to the fruits of Falconia before others get a chance.  :zodd:

(http://skullknight.net/images/zodd-dibs.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: KazigluBey on September 20, 2009, 04:10:12 PM
I'm going to wait until the episode to see how the city as a whole looks (if it is displayed in the episode that is) before I pass final judgment. At the moment I don't care much for the look of the entrance.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 20, 2009, 04:12:09 PM
I'm going to wait until the episode to see how the city as a whole looks (if it is displayed in the chapter that is) before I pass final judgment. At the moment I don't care much for the look of the entrance.
Let me guess. It didn't align with your personal expectations. You were hoping for something like this:

(http://skullknight.net/images/castle.jpg)

PS: Fixed your "chapter" blunder.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: jackson_hurley on September 20, 2009, 04:20:19 PM
Wow nice preview! thx Aaz for posting it.

Now I wonder, after this episode there is a chance we get a new chapter starting in a few episode (maybe in a couple).. What will it be about considering that Falconia has appeared. I can't wait to see what is next. Chapter of the ocean travels chronicle... Chapter of the Elfin home? Or will a new arc begin too? so many questions and only time will tell!  :iva:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Lithrael on September 20, 2009, 04:33:42 PM
I'm going to wait until the episode to see how the city as a whole looks (if it is displayed in the episode that is) before I pass final judgment. At the moment I don't care much for the look of the entrance.

Well, I agree it looks a little bit theme park, but cmon, he can't just have the WHOLE wall surrounded by giant spearmen-with-griffin statues, that'd just be ostentatious.     :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Oburi on September 20, 2009, 04:42:12 PM
WOw Walter nice find with the symbol. Very interesting...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 20, 2009, 04:51:54 PM
And at first glance I thought those things flying above the city were:

http://www.skullknight.net/forum/oekaki/pictures/201.jpg (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/oekaki/pictures/201.jpg)

Hahaha, that would be quite... unexpected. :void:

I have always thought that Griffith would have build up a brand new country with the help of everyone more or less like Gaiseric, but the fact that it has appeared well set already, I think that suggests that even this country was desired already from mankind. Than everything is the will of God, that has to obey to the common coscience.

You speak of a country, but Falconia is a city. And none of what's happening right now necessarily means that Falconia as it is shown was desired by mankind.

Now I wonder, after this episode there is a chance we get a new chapter starting in a few episode (maybe in a couple).. What will it be about considering that Falconia has appeared. I can't wait to see what is next.

This very episode could be the beginning of a new chapter for all we know. Or it could be the next one. Same with the arc. We'll find out soon enough.

Well, I agree it looks a little bit theme park

I'm genuinely curious to know what reminds you of a theme park in those pictures.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 20, 2009, 06:53:59 PM
Let me guess. It didn't align with your personal expectations. You were hoping for something like this:

Or something like THIS:

(http://www.boingboing.net/images/_ve_2003_moscow_images_03.jpg)

Though it's not too late for a giant statue of Griffith inside. Anyway, to be honest, I can't criticize anyone that doesn't like it, because I found it a bit weird looking too at first glance. =)

Then again, it's some sort of giant fantastical alien structure that has no earthly business existing in the "real world," so it should be a bit off-putting and ostentatious. It's a grower too, because by this morning when I gave it another look I really liked the design and that was not the case last night. I guess a simple description of it would be something neoclassical? Or beyond neoclassical, as Aaz points out, it has that futurist architectural vibe as well.

Another reason not to get too hung up on this structure is that it's just an outer shell, when I was imagining Falconia, it was always as a fantastic castle city, and I'm still hoping to see one inside!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 20, 2009, 07:25:35 PM
Then again, it's some sort of giant fantastical alien structure that has no earthly business existing in the "real world," so it should be a bit off-putting and ostentatious. ... I guess a simple description of it would be something neoclassical? Or beyond neoclassical, as Aaz points out, it has that futurist architectural vibe as well.
I'd say it somewhat resembles the larger-than-life feel of building plans during the Third Reich, and what Hitler had planned for his thousand-year reich. Especially if what we perceive as a dome in Falconia actually is a central dome:  http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2009/02/totalitarian-architecture-of-third.html

Quote
Based on the Pantheon in Rome, the Volkshalle would still be the largest enclosed space on the planet if it had ever been built. It would have been over 700 feet high and 800 feet in diameter, sixteen times larger than the dome of St. Peter's in the Vatican. Inside, there would have been space for 180,000 people and there is speculation that such a huge capacity could have caused the building to have its own weather system.
(http://skullknight.net/images/volkshalle.jpg) (http://skullknight.net/images/volkshalle2.jpg)

It's towering, imposing and undeniably modern, but still hearkens back to some classical standards.

Obviously there's more going on in Falconia's depiction, and it's by no means a 1:1 comparison, but I can see a resemblance.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 20, 2009, 07:38:39 PM
I'd say it somewhat resembles the larger-than-life feel of architecture during the Third Reich http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2009/02/totalitarian-architecture-of-third.html

http://skullknight.net/images/volkshalle.jpg http://skullknight.net/images/volkshalle2.jpg

It's towering, imposing and undeniably modern, but still hearkens back to some classical standards.

Obviously there's more going on in Falconia's depiction, and it's by no means a 1:1 comparison, but I can see a resemblance.

Yeah, very good call, not just resemblance to the structures themselves but the philosophy behind such architecture. You can see a particular resemblance in the Olympic stadium from this angle, though it's likely just coincidence:

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/falconiastadium.jpg)

And it's also fitting since Griffith is worse than Hitler! :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Death May Die on September 20, 2009, 07:43:25 PM
The orb figure isn't just the Sun is it? I don't know. What I find kinda cool, is all the apostles are in one spot now. Gathered together, I'm thinking now its a bit more practical that Guts has a good chance of killing them all. Rather spending a life time finding them one by one. Thats just me.

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 20, 2009, 07:43:36 PM
Wow. Just wow. Seems like Griffith and the God Hand are safely locked away from any means of harm (well, with the exception of Skully, I suppose). Poor Skully has made the situation so much harder both for himself and for Guts.

Quote
What I find kinda cool, is all the apostles are in one spot now. Gathered together, I'm thinking now its a bit more practical that Guts has a good chance of killing them all. Rather spending a life time finding them one by one. Thats just me.

How would that make it easier? It'd be like the Eclipse all over again. Far too many of them (plus most of them are the best Apostles), plus all of those humans on Griffith's side.

Miura has really taken the story and cranked up the epic scale to the very top by doing this. It honestly has me very excited to see what Guts and Skully will do about this...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 20, 2009, 07:48:04 PM


In the second page where you can see the people and apostles entering, is this on top of Ganishka's remains, are those clouds?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 20, 2009, 07:52:00 PM
Then again, it's some sort of giant fantastical alien structure that has no earthly business existing in the "real world," so it should be a bit off-putting and ostentatious.

Yeah, specifically there's the fact it clearly appears to have popped up instantaneously as opposed to having been built. It looks completely out of place, but then again, shouldn't it? It's like a plastic toy city has been laid down there by a giant child (hmm, I enjoy making these analogies more than I should :griffnotevil:).

Another reason not to get too hung up on this structure is that it's just an outer shell, when I was imagining Falconia, it was always as a fantastic castle city, and I'm still hoping to see one inside!

Yeah, I think we'd better wait until we see the whole thing before coming to conclusions anyway, because there's likely more to it than what we've seen.

The orb figure isn't just the Sun is it? I don't know.

Nah, you can see clouds or smoke going behind it.

In the second page where you can see the people and apostles entering, is this on top of Ganishka's remains, are those clouds?

Please clarify your question. The city appears to be on the ground. Is that what you're asking?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 20, 2009, 08:25:38 PM
The orb figure isn't just the Sun is it?

It's Griffith's orb of power! :SK: :idea:

Yeah, specifically there's the fact it clearly appears to have popped up instantaneously as opposed to having been built. It looks completely out of place, but then again, shouldn't it? It's like a plastic toy city has been laid down there by a giant child (hmm, I enjoy making these analogies more than I should :griffnotevil:).

Haha, it's funny you should mention that, because that was actually one of my initial issues with it, it was so big and the perspective so hard to comprehend that parts really did look like a toy, made of plastic, or even like paper in places. Actually, it reminded me of a 3D puzzle castle I built as a kid, fittingly enough.

Yeah, I think we'd better wait until we see the whole thing before coming to conclusions anyway, because there's likely more to it than what we've seen.

Yeah, it's just one image, and I'm sure it's not the best to come.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 20, 2009, 08:26:59 PM


Please clarify your question. The city appears to be on the ground. Is that what you're asking?

Yeah, it appear to me the second time I looked at the pic to be up in the sky or somewhere high because the ground around seemed to me like dust or clouds around the structure. Well it doesn't really matter, it looks great either way.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 20, 2009, 08:32:39 PM
I'm frothing from all the story possibilities from here. :mozgus:

And to think that we may be seeing Elfhelm soon. It shall be interesting comparing the two.

I can only imagine that Griffith's throne room to be something spectacular and of course with him sitting there with a halo as his crown. :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Tirade on September 21, 2009, 12:59:03 AM
Wow, all kinds of berserk goodness.  I love that poster and the Berserk World book.  The alternate cover for #34 with Guts looks fantastic.  About the only thing that looks lame is the game. 

As for the story, I'm a bit behind.  I need to catch up on my Berserk reading.  However, I love that we finally get to see Falconia.  Good stuff.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Serpico on September 21, 2009, 01:16:11 AM
And I know we're saying this every time and it gets old and all but seriously, Guts is going to have a hard time getting his revenge. :ganishka:

I think things are gonna be evened out a little when most of the non-flying apostles die taking the stairs.   :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 01:20:02 AM
As for the story, I'm a bit behind.  I need to catch up on my Berserk reading.  However, I love that we finally get to see Falconia.  Good stuff.
You should definitely read them, but check page 2 of this thread for a summary I wrote of the past 2 volumes.

I think things are gonna be evened out a little when most of the non-flying apostles die taking the stairs. 
:ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on September 21, 2009, 01:33:09 AM
And it's also fitting since Griffith is worse than Hitler! :troll:[/center]

I know you are joking but I am wondering now that the "main evil" has been eliminated and everyone is starting to move into their new residence. How are things going to be run? An all equal society? Are the humans going to have to wear something to signify their status? Is everything nice and pristine on the outside but a huge bloody meat grinder on the inside much like Mozgus's torture room was? I need to know!

 :???: - Lord Griffith! What are these yellow stars that we are all wearing?
 :griff: - Well you see guys... its going to work like this.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 01:53:34 AM
How are things going to be run? An all equal society? Are the humans going to have to wear something to signify their status? Is everything nice and pristine on the outside but a huge bloody meat grinder on the inside much like Mozgus's torture room was? I need to know!
Well, obviously there are no real answers now. But remember that this will ultimately be the age of darkness, not a renaissance of humanity.

Also, while nothing definitive is out there right now, we do have a thread where we all speculate what to expect from Falconia. : http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=9599.0
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 21, 2009, 02:14:59 AM
Wow, I really like the design of Falconia. It's massive, alien and intimidating (I'm glad you posted the comparison to the architecture of Nazi Germany, Walter). Much like Griff, I can't wait to see the inside.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jerk on September 21, 2009, 06:55:28 AM
Yeah, it appear to me the second time I looked at the pic to be up in the sky or somewhere high because the ground around seemed to me like dust or clouds around the structure. Well it doesn't really matter, it looks great either way.

I noticed that too, it looks like Falconia is in the sky!  :???:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 07:48:23 AM
About the only thing that looks lame is the game.

I think it looks fun, actually. You play the life of an apostle, from your sacrifice to eating humans, avoiding death at Guts' hands, encountering Daiba and the Daka and finally joining the Band of the Falcon. :zodd:

I noticed that too, it looks like Falconia is in the sky!  :???:

It more likely is just the ground, flattened to dust by Ganishka.



Starting with the next issue...

New arc: Fantasia
New chapter: "Elf Island" (Skellig? Or maybe Elfhelm, though usually a different kanji is used)

:badbone:

Said next issue should also feature some Berserk color work.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jerk on September 21, 2009, 08:06:31 AM
I must say, the story has taken some amazing turn of events!  Now we get to see our heroes arrive at elfhelm?! COOL!!  :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: ZODDOII on September 21, 2009, 08:19:02 AM
WoW....is really shock me~ Griffith's kingdom finally come out... and millennium falcon finally over~  :griffnotevil: :magni:

Can't wait to see it :SK: :zodd:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Deathbringer on September 21, 2009, 11:28:54 AM
So i assume there wasn´t a time skip of any kind since Griffith´s story is supposed to move in parallel with Guts and it would be kinda unnatural to see Guts and co without his usual build up of new places and events.

Which would mean that this Larger-than-life city of gigantic proportions just poped out of nowhere in an instant. If it´s indeed the case, i´d like to see how exactly it was formed as in i wanna see pretty pictures of magic building it a orgasmic visual spectacle.

The city itself doesn´t disappoint, it gives me a very greek vibe, mainly because of the statues. I´m pretty eager to see how it looks behind the titanic walls.

Edit. Finally we´ll be getting back to Guts. Which makes this episode all the sweeter.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 11:41:03 AM
So i assume there wasn´t a time skip of any kind since Griffith´s story is supposed to move in parallel with Guts and it would be kinda unnatural to see Guts and co without his usual build up of new places and events.

There wasn't a time skip because this episode is the direct continuation of the precedent one. We can tell that much from the two pictures we've seen.

Which would mean that this Larger-than-life city of gigantic proportions just poped out of nowhere in an instant. If it´s indeed the case, i´d like to see how exactly it was formed as in i wanna see pretty pictures of magic building it a orgasmic visual spectacle.

Well you just need to wait a few days more then.

The city itself doesn´t disappoint, it gives me a very greek vibe, mainly because of the statues.

Yeah, they're classical representations of Greek soldiers. Reminiscent of Gaiseric's era. :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 01:39:09 PM
Hmm, just a thought but that preview made me immediately wonder about the future of Guts' left arm -- possibly affected by the merging. Afterall, his perception that his arm was still there was what got him in trouble in ep 287. And if that turns out to be so ... what else might manifest...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 02:16:22 PM
Hmm, just a thought but that preview made me immediately wonder about the future of Guts' left arm -- possibly affected by the merging. Afterall, his perception that his arm was still there was what got him in trouble in ep 287. And if that turns out to be so ... what else might manifest...

I thought something along the same lines. It's certainly an enigmatic shot. Can't wait to find out! :guts:



And a closer look at the "roll and move"-type board game.

I thought yesterday that Falconia might resemble the Forbidden City of Chinese emperors in a way, despite the overall Greek style of the first two pictures we saw, and I guess in a way, it does. Behind those huge, impenetrable walls is a beautiful city. The title of the episode: Falconia. Now the question is "what are those stairs in the distance leading to?" Maybe... The altar of Griffith's MALEFIC ORB OF DEATH?! :magni:

Also notice how it looks like the deformed creatures Ganishka had spawned have turned into "small" trees matching his own giant tree. I wonder whether the dead apostles suffered the same fate or not. Interesting as well to see how everything in the city seems to be turned inwards (specifically thinking of the huge Falcon figures on the walls here).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 03:03:40 PM
The mystery of Ganishka's transformation revealed!   :isidro: Now, I wonder if will it exhibit special properties, or _just_ be a massive tree?

And yeah, Aaz called it. It really IS a giant Secret of Mana tree  :badbone:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: NightCrawler on September 21, 2009, 03:15:30 PM
Looks amazing. I love it when shit gets bigger-than-life epic. But i hope it doesn't come with a price.
Anyway, exciting times ahead!

Although i can't say i'm excited with the name of the upcoming arc...

(http://www.desconspiracao.com/images/Disney/fantasiaMM.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 03:29:30 PM
Just because it's called Fantasia doesn't mean there are going to be anthropomorphic mice and dancing broomsticks.  :femto:

Anyway, it's very exciting that a new arc is beginning. What we're witnessing is years in the making. Millennium Falcon has been Miura's longest arc ever. We've been with it for 8 long years, comprising 131 episodes across 12 volumes.

Yet I can still remember when we were anxious for it to START. I'm getting old... :flora:

Also, some minor props to Jackson_Hurley for indirectly calling the name of the new Chapter:
I can't wait to see what is next. Chapter of the ocean travels chronicle... Chapter of the Elfin home?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 04:42:04 PM
The mystery of Ganishka's transformation revealed!  :schnoz: Now, I wonder if will it exhibit special properties, or _just_ be a massive tree?

Its sap will bring eternal life to those who drink it! :ganishka: But seriously, I do think it will exhibit special properties, no better way to say it.

And yeah, Aaz called it. It really IS a giant Secret of Mana tree  :badbone:

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/zodd.gif) (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10467.msg171220#msg171220) With the city of Falconia right next to it! (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10467.msg171220#msg171220)

Looks amazing. I love it when shit gets bigger-than-life epic. But i hope it doesn't come with a price.

Who are you kidding, we all know there will be a grisly price, and we're eagerly awaiting it. :zodd: After all, there seems to be a Coliseum-like structure within the city, and what could that be used for? ... "RELEASE THE HYDRA!" :void:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on September 21, 2009, 04:44:26 PM
First of all, great preview! Epic.

Now the question is "what are those stairs in the distance leading to?" Maybe... The altar of Griffith's MALEFIC ORB OF DEATH?! :magni:

Maybe it contains Idea. :idea: That orb seems quite huge.

The mystery of Ganishka's transformation revealed!  :schnoz: Now, I wonder if will it exhibit special properties, or _just_ be a massive tree?

Maybe it'll be a defensive device in case Guts would break in Falconia after Griffith.  :griffnotevil:

I think that it might protect Falconia from an eventual attack from astral creatures.

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Tirade on September 21, 2009, 05:02:13 PM
I think it looks fun, actually. You play the life of an apostle, from your sacrifice to eating humans, avoiding death at Guts' hands, encountering Daiba and the Daka and finally joining the Band of the Falcon. :zodd:

Well I'm sure the idea behind the game is fun.  However, I was more referring to the "board game" like feel.  I miss the old TCG game.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 21, 2009, 05:16:07 PM
HOLE-LEE SHIIT!

I'd like to say something more intelligent, but that's just pretty fucking awesome looking. Particularly the walls with the militant looking falcons on them and the inner city, I feel like one of the goobers staring at it there, "It's beautiful... it's just as I always imagined it would be!"

Looks amazing. I love it when shit gets bigger-than-life epic. But i hope it doesn't come with a price.
Anyway, exciting times ahead!

Even NightCrawler is excited!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 05:51:17 PM
Maybe it contains Idea. :idea: That orb seems quite huge.

That seems... unlikely to me. Especially since Miura told us not 6 months ago in his reply to our letter that he didn't even know if the Idea of Evil would appear again directly.

Well I'm sure the idea behind the game is fun.  However, I was more referring to the "board game" like feel.  I miss the old TCG game.

Ah. Well, after all it is a board game. I love the TCG too, but it really isn't comparable to this little extra available for free in the magazine and that was probably put together in 2 days' time.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: CCS on September 21, 2009, 07:01:40 PM
Geezus...this is just insanity. Guess Griffith wouldn't just settle for taking over an existing kingdom. He had to go all out and create his own.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Uriel on September 21, 2009, 07:10:16 PM
I'm posting after a SkullKnight.net hiatus to report that I, too, am bursting with excitement!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 07:25:25 PM
Going back to Guts' artificial arm in the next episode's preview, I'm thinking he might now be able to feel it somehow, almost like a real limb. The result of being in Fantasia, and a nice follow up to his reflexion on what he's lost in episode 287.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 21, 2009, 08:07:09 PM
Going back to Guts' artificial arm in the next episode's preview, I'm thinking he might now be able to feel it somehow, almost like a real limb. The result of being in Fantasia, and a nice follow up to his reflexion on what he's lost in episode 287.

That would be extremely cool. Not only would he have the use of both arms but his strength and ability as a swordsmen would greatly improve, as well.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Chaos on September 21, 2009, 08:13:27 PM
Going back to Guts' artificial arm in the next episode's preview, I'm thinking he might now be able to feel it somehow, almost like a real limb. The result of being in Fantasia, and a nice follow up to his reflexion on what he's lost in episode 287.

To elaborate on him feeling the arm somehow, what do you think the likely hood of him gaining a stronger (for want of a better term) connection with The Berserker's Armor are? And if so, what might that entail?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 08:16:54 PM
Yeah, if Guts gets the mobility of his left arm back, it would be a huge asset for him. However, the other, deeper implications of this potential development are what intrigue me the most.

To elaborate on him feeling the arm somehow, what do you think the likely hood of him gaining a stronger (for want of a better term) connection with The Berserker's Armor are? And if so, what might that entail?
That's something I wondered about myself on page 3. "What else might manifest..." I think the armor will still function the same way. It is afterall a magical artifact. But there's another potential problem with this merging idea.

Though the Beast only exists in Guts' mind, and harnesses the od of the armor, it has an undeniable connection to the armor. We've seen it swimming up its cape, and essentially possessing the armor itself. If the Beast could accomplish that all that BEFORE the merging, I would imagine its grip on reality would only be stronger now.

Of course, there are a number of scenarios for how this will play out, but I see this whole situation as a double-edged sword for Guts.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 21, 2009, 08:23:06 PM
speculatespeculatespeculate

As I sit here with my Guinness 250th Anniversary Stout, I can't help but wonder, what was the significance of the God Hand images in Episode 306? Was it that Void, Ubik, Conrad, and Slan's preferred ... uh .... "astral chill-zones" have now appeared and are in plain sight for all to see?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 21, 2009, 08:28:21 PM
That would be the implication from last episode, yeah.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 21, 2009, 08:38:19 PM
I for one simply cannot wait to see how this effects the magic users (Schierke and Daiba especially).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 21, 2009, 08:40:48 PM
As I sit here with my Guinness 250th Anniversary Stout, I can't help but wonder, what was the significance of the Godhand images in Episode 306? Was it that Void, Ubik, Conrad, and Slan's preferred ... uh .... "astral chill-zones" have now appeared and are in plain sight for all to see?

Or if not that, at least the doors are open. The Ubik one is particularly disturbing for the fact that all those misfits looks to be marching out of that place. :carcus:

Good thing Falconia has walls, those Midlanders better just hope those creatures aren't already on the other side! :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 21, 2009, 08:43:02 PM
That would be the implication from last episode, yeah.
Whew. Okay, I'm glad I'm not a dummy this time around.

For a while, though, I thought, for some reason, that they were all gonna appear and somehow aid Femto or join his posse. By all means, I know Femto is NOT the leader of The God Hand, but I figured maybe his demon-godly FRIENDS would maybe help him out here and there.

Then again, to disprove my own theory, if we take into account Slan's "WHATEVA! I DO WHAT I WANT!" demeanor, then why would Void, Ubik, and Conrad not be doing their own thing? Oh, the plague and the rats is more proof that The Godhand is sort of a "let's all do our own thing" club, aside from the ceremonies they gotta perform every now and then.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: berserkfan on September 21, 2009, 09:22:33 PM
looks good and all, but when are they going to actually start talking again??
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: slan69 on September 21, 2009, 09:28:36 PM
looks good and all, but when are they going to actually start talking again??

You know this episode doesn't have to have word's in it because I feel that it's speaks for itself. :femto: There might be words in the next episode but really who's to say. Even if there are still no words in the next episode it wouldn't matter to me, as long as I get to see the amazing artwork and the story progressing.  
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 21, 2009, 09:37:57 PM
Uh, folks, there's already narration and speech bubbles visible just on the preview pages. (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/griffnoevil2ani.gif)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 21, 2009, 09:58:22 PM
looks good and all, but when are they going to actually start talking again??
As silly as Mr. Berserkfan's question may seem, I understand.

Earlier today, I was reviewing Volumes 21-22 when Griffith re-emerged. Those two-page spreads were amazing. I can look back and think, "Wow, what an astounding moment."

So, once volumes 34-35 are properly released along with, say, volumes 36-40, those impatient people with occasional "HURRY UP AND TELL MORE STORY" syndrome (like myself, I must confess), will look back and say, "Wow, that was an extremely pivotal moment."

People seem to forget that GRIFFITH'S DREAM IS BEING REALIZED AND WE ARE BEARING WITNESS. I forget this at times, as well. It's natural to want more and more of a perfectly executed story. Obviously, none of us have seen 307 yet, but it will be another addition to the moment that is Griffith's epic victory. I know "epic" is overused these days, but, really, "epic" fits.

Bear in mind, fellow Berserk nuts, that we have been seeing the perfect presentation of a moment we have all waited for.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 21, 2009, 10:04:39 PM
I don't mind, I actually appreciate people complaining that there's not enough talking in Berserk now. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Xem on September 21, 2009, 10:05:06 PM
Couldn't resist not checkin out the spoiler pictures this time... again. The castle looks amazing, I can't wait to see it in it's entirety... and Guts' reaction when he sees it as well.  Hehe, :sad: .

Then we get another episode two weeks later!

Hopefully I'll finally be able to stop hearing my rather less intelligent friends ask me, "Are they still on the boat?" Not that I care that they're on it, but because it's a pretty condescending question to an uber fan such as myself. Does anyone else have to deal with stupid shit like that?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 21, 2009, 10:13:39 PM
Does anyone else have to deal with stupid shit like that?

Not me, I"m pretty much a lone wolf among my friends when it comes to manga in general, they prefer anime and are too lazy and impatient when it comes to manga releases. That's why I'm here in SK.net, a way better place to talk about Berserk and other topics.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 21, 2009, 10:31:16 PM
To elaborate on him feeling the arm somehow, what do you think the likely hood of him gaining a stronger (for want of a better term) connection with The Berserker's Armor are? And if so, what might that entail?

Well his "connexion" to the armor is already pretty good if you ask me. A little too good even. So in that regard I don't see too many changes. Maybe he'll be able to benefit from its Od more easily without being completely subjugated... But it's still kind of a stretch I think. The answer to the problem the armor poses lies more in Elfhelm in my opinion (whether it is through training himself, modifying it, adding warding talismans, etc.).

As I sit here with my Guinness 250th Anniversary Stout, I can't help but wonder, what was the significance of the God Hand images in Episode 306? Was it that Void, Ubik, Conrad, and Slan's preferred ... uh .... "astral chill-zones" have now appeared and are in plain sight for all to see?

Slan speaks of Sephirah, the plural of which is Sephiroth. They are not mentioned to be specific places within the astral world, so please don't make up your own zany terms like that. Anyway, no, actually I don't think they're in plain sight for all to see. And I don't think it's what the previous episode implies either. I believe it represented their coming into the world in a more figurative way. But keep in mind this doesn't change the fact that the members of the God Hand might be able to interact with the world more directly now.

Then again, to disprove my own theory, if we take into account Slan's "WHATEVA! I DO WHAT I WANT!" demeanor, then why would Void, Ubik, and Conrad not be doing their own thing?

Slan said they were doing just that in volume 26. They all do their own thing, it's really nothing new.

looks good and all, but when are they going to actually start talking again??

Why even post this? What's the point?

So, once volumes 34-35 are properly released along with, say, volumes 36-40, those impatient people with occasional "HURRY UP AND TELL MORE STORY" syndrome (like myself, I must confess), will look back and say, "Wow, that was an extremely pivotal moment."

But in the meantime we'll have endured their "stupid shit", to quote Deci. And that's not especially enjoyable. There is nothing redeeming about such comments. When Guts and the others were in Vritannis, some people complained there was too much talk. Now they're saying there isn't enough talk. For years we heard people asking when they would get on the boat, and when they did we had people asking when they would get off it. You'd think folks would realize the irony of the situation after a while, but no, it just goes on and on. If there has been one constant from episode to episode over the years, it's pointless, short-sighted remarks like those. And man does it get old.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: CowTip on September 22, 2009, 12:14:00 AM
But in the meantime we'll have endured their "stupid shit", to quote Deci. And that's not especially enjoyable. There is nothing redeeming about such comments. When Guts and the others were in Vritannis, some people complained there was too much talk. Now they're saying there isn't enough talk. For years we heard people asking when they would get on the boat, and when they did we had people asking when they would get off it. You'd think folks would realize the irony of the situation after a while, but no, it just goes on and on. If there has been one constant from episode to episode over the years, it's pointless, short-sighted remarks like those. And man does it get old.

This will always be as different people have different opinions on what they find the most enjoyable. You'll never be able to please everyone all the time. It's not a whole lot different than the people who claim "This is awesome!" It's a personal opinion that's almost equally worthless and unless you want to get rid of one type it'll be hard to get rid of the other unless a rule is instituted that only positive things are allowed to be said about each and every episode.

That said, while this is indeed an interesting development, I'm looking forward to the aftermath myself so we can start getting some real concrete details as to what's been going down here, but I'm definitely enjoying the awesome art of these last few episodes.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 22, 2009, 12:28:13 AM
This will always be as different people have different opinions on what they find the most enjoyable. You'll never be able to please everyone all the time. It's not a whole lot different than the people who claim "This is awesome!" It's a personal opinion that's almost equally worthless and unless you want to get rid of one type it'll be hard to get rid of the other unless a rule is instituted that only positive things are allowed to be said about each and every episode.

It's not that deep or innocent, as Gobolatula and Aaz alluded to: fickle, impatient buffoons will complain about anything for the sake of hearing themselves bray until someone puts them out of their misery. :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: CowTip on September 22, 2009, 12:30:14 AM
Well, of course there's always those as well~

And how ominous their fate! :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 22, 2009, 12:31:10 AM
Yeah, I love that Femto emoticon. :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: jackson_hurley on September 22, 2009, 01:09:35 AM
nice long preview! very very nice! we can see two creatures on the first double spread with the small trees. They are at the bottom of the page. I wonder what they are. I don't think it matters much but my curiosity demands satisfaction!  :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Smith on September 22, 2009, 01:12:36 AM
Nice Epic Preview, Thanks Aaz for sharing with us...  :guts:


Just because it's called Fantasia doesn't mean there are going to be anthropomorphic mice and dancing broomsticks.  :femto:

Anyway, it's very exciting that a new arc is beginning. What we're witnessing is years in the making. Millennium Falcon has been Miura's longest arc ever. We've been with it for 8 long years, comprising 131 episodes across 12 volumes.


Just a clarification though... Isn't Millennium Falcon suppose to be 13 volumes long instead? Cause I remember it start from the begining of vol 22 and end at first episode of vol 35...  :???:


Anyway after vol 22, I realised each volume contain exactly 10 episodes also...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 22, 2009, 01:17:19 AM
Just a clarification though... Isn't Millennium Falcon suppose to be 13 volumes long instead? Cause I remember it start from the begining of vol 22 and end at first episode of vol 35...
Yeah, you're right. My mind must have initially refused to acknowledge 1 episode counting as a volume. :farnese:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skull Knight on September 22, 2009, 05:36:07 AM
The artificial arm preview picture is very interesting....
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: flagawax on September 22, 2009, 09:13:48 AM
Thanks Aaz, very nice preview.
But I don't really understand, Falconia is a city?
Wonderful alternate cover for volume 34.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 22, 2009, 09:22:38 AM
This will always be as different people have different opinions on what they find the most enjoyable. You'll never be able to please everyone all the time. It's not a whole lot different than the people who claim "This is awesome!" It's a personal opinion that's almost equally worthless and unless you want to get rid of one type it'll be hard to get rid of the other unless a rule is instituted that only positive things are allowed to be said about each and every episode.

:schierke: Please spare me the bullshit life lesson full of platitudes about how we're all different, especially if you're going to misrepresent what I said. That some people post pointless comments isn't an excuse for other people who post other pointless comments, but at least the folks posting "awesome!" in excitement have their candor going for them (and in SK.net's particular case, they might just think there is nothing left to add that wasn't already said). Anyhow, the subject of my rant does not directly relate to people liking or disliking episodes but rather to those who are seemingly perpetually looking forward to something else without really caring about the current events. And it's not necessarily different people over the years either, that's the whole point.

we can see two creatures on the first double spread with the small trees. They are at the bottom of the page. I wonder what they are.

At first glance yesterday I thought they were apostles. And I still do.

But I don't really understand, Falconia is a city?

Yes, Falconia is a city. As we always knew it would be. What is it you don't understand about it? For years now we've known it would be the capital of Griffith's kingdom. For as long as we've known its name, in fact.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Kavaron on September 22, 2009, 10:02:56 AM
Any more info on Falconia? It is not even in the glossary of skullknight.

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 22, 2009, 10:16:50 AM
Any more info on Falconia? It is not even in the glossary of skullknight.

What more do you want? It's being created in this episode. It's the capital city of Griffith's soon-to-be kingdom. That's all there is to know about it.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Kavaron on September 22, 2009, 10:30:41 AM
So. A city appears out of nowhere and it is the capital of the new world? Or is the old capital transformed into Falconia?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: flagawax on September 22, 2009, 11:06:49 AM
Yes, Falconia is a city. As we always knew it would be. What is it you don't understand about it? For years now we've known it would be the capital of Griffith's kingdom. For as long as we've known its name, in fact.
A capital where monster and human live together... and have children, etc. :ganishka:

So. A city appears out of nowhere and it is the capital of the new world? Or is the old capital transformed into Falconia?
Perhaps the capital comes from Ganishka's explosion...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 22, 2009, 11:07:06 AM
So. A city appears out of nowhere and it is the capital of the new world? Or is the old capital transformed into Falconia?

It's the capital city of Griffith's soon-to-be kingdom (or empire or whatever), like I said. It might be a little presumptuous to outright call it the capital of the whole world, though for all intents and purposes it could very well end up playing that role. We'll have to wait and see how far Griffith's rule reaches, geographically, before we can speak further on the matter.

As for how it is being created, it's happening in this episode. Which means you'll have to see it for yourself to know. It's apparently situated where Wyndham used to be, but in itself that doesn't mean much. I guess it could be argued that since Wyndham was ground to dust under Ganishka's feet, it's not a transformation, but again, to be sure you'll need to read the episode and see it for yourself.

A capital where monster and human live together... and have children, etc. :ganishka:

We'll see. You should have been surprised to see humans and apostles teaming up together quite a few episodes ago though. :slan:

Perhaps the capital comes from Ganishka's explosion...

It appeared as a result of what happened to Ganishka (like the worlds merging, you know), but that doesn't really answer his question.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: D-Scape on September 22, 2009, 12:14:43 PM
Man! Looking at the preview I could almost hear music by martial industrial/neoclassical band Triarii playing in the background.

I totally didn’t expect Falconia’s design to be like that, but that’s just refreshing - the final result was grandiose. Miura seldom meet my expectations, he EXCEEDS them (it also happened when I anticipated Ganishka’s final form and got something far more terrifying than I had imagined). Superb!

I can definitely see why people compare it to the architectonical dreams of Albert Speer and Hitler. I have a fetish for freakishly huge structures and the models of Volkshalle was indeed going through my mind when I spotted the giant dome in the background. Another association was the Ericsson Globe in Stockholm - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globen). Maybe it's Griffith's private arena where he will host spectacular ice hockey tournaments.

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Irvine on September 22, 2009, 05:33:55 PM
Nice pictures...but I'm disappointed....  :puck:
At least episode 308 is about Elfhelm.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 22, 2009, 05:41:43 PM
Nice pictures...but I'm disappointed....  :puck:
Just a quick prediction -- you'll continue to be disappointed until the series is over, and then you'll still be disappointed.

Quote
At least chapter 308 is about Elfhelm.
It's EPISODE. And just because the newest Chapter title relates to Elfhelm doesn't mean the next episode will be about Elfhelm.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 22, 2009, 05:46:37 PM
Nice pictures...but I'm disappointed....  :puck:

C'mon how can you be dissapointed at such grand event? It has been since Volume 5 that Griffith told Guts he will get his own kingdom. Now 29 volumes later it's sure coming to that conclusion.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 22, 2009, 06:12:14 PM
Just a quick prediction -- you'll continue to be disappointed until the series is over, and then you'll still be disappointed.

Actually, I'm throwing my money behind shameless revisionist history once the series is in context for them, "Ooooh, I've always liked this favorite parts!"

C'mon how can you be dissapointed at such grand event? It has been since Volume 5 that Griffith told Guts he will get his own kingdom. Now 29 volumes later it's sure coming to that conclusion.

See mine or Aaz's recent posts. In most cases it comes down to dumb expectations and a reactionary attitude that would critique twenty pages in the middle of a story that's already thousands long with thousands more to go, as if this is some culminating episode of Berserk rather than just the most recent. Again, usually reactionary and dumb, but maybe in this case they're just really excited about Elfhelm, so that's why I'm withholding this (reads from right to left =):

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/weekly.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Irvine on September 22, 2009, 06:51:39 PM
I'm not interested in Griffith or his kingdom. So 307 is a disappointment for me. I don't say that this episode isn't good but I thought 307 is about Guts.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 22, 2009, 06:55:36 PM
I'm not interested in Griffith or his kingdom. So 307 is a disappointment for me. I don't say that this episode isn't good but I thought 307 is about Guts.

Stop polluting the thread with posts like these. If you want to whine about the story, do it someplace else. Besides, the second they get to Elfhelm, you'll find something else to whine about. And what gave you the idea that 307 would be about Guts, anyway?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 22, 2009, 07:01:52 PM
I'm not interested in Griffith or his kingdom. So 307 is a disappointment for me. I don't say that this episode isn't good but I thought 307 is about Guts.

Well, that's fine, I obviously can't relate to not caring about Griffith, but it has been a while since we've spent some serious quality time with our Gutsywutsy, so I can see why you're personally disappointed. Maybe next time (though I'm secretly rooting against you and for more Griffith). :guts:

Stop polluting the thread with posts like these. If you want to whine about the story, do it someplace else. Besides, the second they get to Elfhelm, you'll find something else to whine about. And what gave you the idea that 307 would be about Guts, anyway? :femto:

Fixed. =)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 22, 2009, 07:04:10 PM
Fixed. =)

Haha, thanks! The first opportunity I get to use the new Femto icon and I miss it. :void:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: yesmilord on September 22, 2009, 08:27:11 PM
(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/weekly.jpg)

I lol'd irl.
Although yes, we've been on Guts hiatus for a while now, I am going to also reinforce the fact that this is indeed the kingdom of Griffith's dreams! Spam more spreads Miura!

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 22, 2009, 09:49:26 PM
I love that image Griffith, I know a certain imageboard that might be seeing it pretty often now.  :troll: As much as I want to see what Guts is up to, people have to look at this in the long run.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: DetriusXii on September 22, 2009, 10:04:16 PM
Just had a random musing, but let's say  the physical world and the spiritual world is divided again and is divided quickly.    Anyone living on three stories or higher of this mythical superstructure is going to plummet to their death and quite a few people are going to be crushed by the falling bodies plummeting towards them.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on September 22, 2009, 10:17:25 PM
Just had a random musing, but let's say  the physical world and the spiritual world is divided again and is divided quickly.    Anyone living on three stories or higher of this mythical superstructure is going to plummet to their death and quite a few people are going to be crushed by the falling bodies plummeting towards them.

I'm don't think it quite works that way. We don't know for sure how long it took for all the astral creatures to appear and for Falconia to be there. I don't think there's an undo button in the berserk world that will make this new "age of darkness" to go away as quickly as it seems that it has come.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on September 23, 2009, 05:11:47 AM
Huh, So Rome was built in a day.  :troll:

sorry, had to get that out of my system. have to say, I love the look! it's VERY different then what I had always thought it would look like. (the roman influence) But that's not a bad thing in the least.  :serpico: It still looks grand, and like a kingdom not of a natural world. (just look at the size of those statues!  :isidro:)  from the looks of it, there going to need way more people to fill that baby up, then just what was there at the grand opening.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 23, 2009, 07:32:10 AM
Just had a random musing, but let's say  the physical world and the spiritual world is divided again and is divided quickly.    Anyone living on three stories or higher of this mythical superstructure is going to plummet to their death and quite a few people are going to be crushed by the falling bodies plummeting towards them.

Could be, but we don't know how it really works, so the structure, once it has appeared in the corporeal world, could also remain there even if the worlds were suddenly split apart again for all we know. It would be fun to see it all crumble like the tower did in Albion though. :void:

We don't know for sure how long it took for all the astral creatures to appear and for Falconia to be there.

Yeah man, was it 30 seconds or a minute? Important details.

I don't think there's an undo button in the berserk world that will make this new "age of darkness" to go away as quickly as it seems that it has come.

That's a good point. If what happened were to be undone, maybe it'd take place over centuries, like what seemed to have happened in the past (spiritual beings and magic users slowly disappearing).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: puella on September 23, 2009, 07:38:02 AM
Huh, So Rome was built in a day.  :troll:
I wonder if some astral creatures slaved over it in secret for decades to prepare for its instantaneous appearance. :iva: It's a real "fantasia", right from the start.

By the way, I have been thinking about what could possibly lead Guts to stay in Elfhelm for a while.
Maybe the Elf King will tell him:

1) It takes a long time to cure Casca
2) It takes a long time to Guts to heal, including making his arm and eye regrow. :isidro:
3) Guts should learn some special skills to cope with Griffith.

Now, once they have decided to stay there for some time, what will they do?

1) Farnese masters her training to be a witch.
2) For Guts, what should he do? Farming or smithing?
3) Magnifico meets a girl there, which gives him a fair reason to stay? Or he starts business plans with the mischievous elves...
4) Farnese is a good reason for two of the guys to stay there, Roderick and Serpico.
5) Schierke should learn more about the real astral world and such.
6) Every member should listen to and learn from the Elf King to deal with the new world.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 23, 2009, 07:45:36 AM

Now, once they have decided to stay there for some time, what will they do?

1) Farnese masters her training to be a witch.
2) For Guts, what should he do? Farming or smithing?
3) Magnifico meets a girl there, which gives him a fair reason to stay? Or he starts business plans with the mischievous elves...
4) Farnese is a good reason for two of the guys to stay there, Roderick and Serpico.
5) Schierke should learn more about the real astral world and such.
6) Every member should listen to and learn from the Elf King to deal with the new world.
Oh man, the possibilities are making me too excited! I could read a whole side comic of Magnifico's misadventures with the elves. His facial expressions are just too great.  :magni:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on September 23, 2009, 09:10:15 AM
Well, If there's another reason to be added for why they would stay, I would think the seas would be mighty unsafe after the merger of the worlds. Wouldn't even want to get near the beach after all that stuff went down. :magni: So they would have to prepare for sea travel in a whole new light I think. Magical wards on the ship?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on September 23, 2009, 09:18:38 AM
By the way, I have been thinking about what could possibly lead Guts to stay in Elfhelm for a while.
Maybe the Elf King will tell him:

2) It takes a long time to Guts to heal, including making his arm and eye regrow. :isidro:

Yes I was wondering about this scenario too. Moreover, if that would be the case, I think that:

-His arm could be replaced with a magical one;
-Guts will be somehow able to control his actual one;
-As you said, he will gain back his eye and arm.

I think it is quite a possibility since the episode 287 events.

About the other members of Guts' party, I always thought that once on Elfhelm, it'd be a good chance to compare each other, for example Farnese and Serpico.
Maybe they could have a talk about the fact that they are kindred or something like that.

I guess that Guts would think how to act if Casca would turn sane again, and Azan may explain what happened after the Albion collapse.

Maybe we'll have some breathing space from everyone, even from Roderik and Magnifico.

Of course I'm almost sure that Puck is gonna be a guest star.  :puck:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on September 23, 2009, 09:30:39 AM
Hmm, wonder if the reason puck left elfhelm could cause a problem for them. probably not to much of a ruckus in the end, but always wondered why he's so quiet about the place.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: fuxberg on September 23, 2009, 10:17:35 AM
As much as Guts would like to have his arm back, I think he'd find that canon more useful than a real arm.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on September 23, 2009, 10:21:48 AM
As much as Guts would like to have his arm back, I think he'd find that canon more useful than a real arm.

Yes but that arm was not able to grab the people he loves. I would not be that surprised if he choose his real arm.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 23, 2009, 12:19:43 PM
4) Farnese is a good reason for two of the guys to stay there, Roderick and Serpico.

I was thinking the other day that maybe at some point Roderick will have to leave the island, and by then Farnese could choose to go along with him. I think it would make for some interesting developments and a poignant reunion later on. Of course she could also stay and he'd promise to come back for her or something else equally romantic. So many possibilities.

Well, If there's another reason to be added for why they would stay, I would think the seas would be mighty unsafe after the merger of the worlds. Wouldn't even want to get near the beach after all that stuff went down. :magni: So they would have to prepare for sea travel in a whole new light I think. Magical wards on the ship?

That's a good idea and I find it plausible, however putting wards on the ship would probably not take them very long (as in: it wouldn't take them years). It's also worth mentioning that they haven't actually arrived at Skellig yet. Maybe they will in the next episode, but maybe it'll take a few more before that.

-His arm could be replaced with a magical one

Seems kind of unlikely compared to the possibility of him gaining a certain "connexion" to his actual artificial forearm.

Hmm, wonder if the reason puck left elfhelm could cause a problem for them. probably not to much of a ruckus in the end, but always wondered why he's so quiet about the place.

Might be. His secrecy about it has sparked numerous discussions in the past. A quick search should prove fruitful if you care to read more. :slan: Anyway, it will certainly be interesting, no matter what happens. After the Return of the Trolls, it's time for the Return of the Elf! :puck:

As much as Guts would like to have his arm back, I think he'd find that canon more useful than a real arm.

Not necessarily. Realistically a real arm is infinitely superior to a prosthesis, regardless of how good it is. The cannon is great but it doesn't make up for the rest. Besides, like Marik pointed out, the whole point of episode 287 was that the artificial arm will never be a perfect replacement for a real arm. That being said, your comment isn't devoid of interest in the sense that Guts' arm cannon is pretty much a staple of his character at this point. For him to regain his eye and arm would be quite an event and honestly I don't see it happening.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Deathbringer on September 23, 2009, 02:06:33 PM
I´m liking the theories about Guts' arm, most of all the one where it presents the possibility of Guts prosthesis starting to act and feel like a real limb as an after effect of the Astral realm connecting with the real world. That would keep one of his character trademark that he had since volume 1 *and* give him a advantage in hand movement and coordination, which would probably work wonders with the Dragon Slayer.

I´m disappointed that Miura never went anywhere with Rakshas hidden from everyone´s sight during the events taking place at Ganishka's core. I thought he was going to take an opportunity at finally killing Griffith but he ended up doing nothing. Next time then.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Vampire_Hunter_Bob on September 23, 2009, 02:22:40 PM
I´m disappointed that Miura never went anywhere with Rakshas hidden from everyone´s sight during the events taking place at Ganishka's core. I thought he was going to take an opportunity at finally killing Griffith but he ended up doing nothing. Next time then.

Well I'm sure Rakshas was up to something important, it's just we the reader are just meant to be kept in the dark about what he was doing there.  
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 23, 2009, 02:31:06 PM
I´m liking the theories about Guts' arm, most of all the one where it presents the possibility of Guts prosthesis starting to act and feel like a real limb as an after effect of the Astral realm connecting with the real world. That would keep one of his character trademark that he had since volume 1 *and* give him a advantage in hand movement and coordination, which would probably work wonders with the Dragon Slayer.

Yeah and most importantly it's what the preview picture we got seems to be hinting at.

I´m disappointed that Miura never went anywhere with Rakshas hidden from everyone´s sight during the events taking place at Ganishka's core. I thought he was going to take an opportunity at finally killing Griffith but he ended up doing nothing. Next time then.

We should be careful not to take Rakshas' words when he and Griffith met too literally. So far he's been serving him like the others. Also, like VHB said, because we didn't learn what he was doing there doesn't mean it was meaningless. I guarantee you it wasn't. Just be patient. :rakshas:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 23, 2009, 02:55:48 PM
About the other members of Guts' party, I always thought that once on Elfhelm, it'd be a good chance to compare each other, for example Farnese and Serpico.
Maybe they could have a talk about the fact that they are kindred or something like that.

I guess that Guts would think how to act if Casca would turn sane again, and Azan may explain what happened after the Albion collapse.

Maybe we'll have some breathing space from everyone, even from Roderik and Magnifico.

Of course I'm almost sure that Puck is gonna be a guest star.  :puck:

Yes, I'm very much looking forward to seeing a time of reflection for Guts party. Good point about Azan, I'm hoping he shares his stories about what has been happening on his end since his disappearance, and why he is no longer a knight of the Holy See (it's obvious why, but I'm still interested in hearing about what the Holy See said to him and the like).

And I'm sure Puck and Ivarella are going to enjoy their stay very much.

And like Aaz said, they're not even at Skellig yet, maybe they will have an encounter with one of these new creatures before they reach their destination (like a sea based creature or an aerial creature)?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Shadax on September 23, 2009, 05:01:59 PM

I´m disappointed that Miura never went anywhere with Rakshas hidden from everyone´s sight during the events taking place at Ganishka's core. I thought he was going to take an opportunity at finally killing Griffith but he ended up doing nothing. Next time then.

We still have to even delve more deeply into the moonlight boy thing. But in the end, small details like with Rakshas come into play later at some point, which I really like about this series. Berserk doesn't simply pull plot conveniences out of nowhere.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on September 23, 2009, 09:47:50 PM
Quote
That's a good idea and I find it plausible, however putting wards on the ship would probably not take them very long (as in: it wouldn't take them years). It's also worth mentioning that they haven't actually arrived at Skellig yet. Maybe they will in the next episode, but maybe it'll take a few more before that.
I didn't think it would take years either, Couple of week's top's. Roderick's ship is pretty big, and depending on what it would all involve, could be pretty simple,(a day, just painting something on the bottom or the like. ) or really complicated, with a whole new look for the ship being the end result. (basically just engraving's all over the hull of the ship.) could be anything really. Of course, could be nothing too.  :casca:

Quote
I´m disappointed that Miura never went anywhere with Rakshas hidden from everyone´s sight during the events taking place at Ganishka's core. I thought he was going to take an opportunity at finally killing Griffith but he ended up doing nothing. Next time then.
Well, I remember after the skull knight showed up and all hell broke loose, People wondered what happened to Rakshas then as well. he could have hitched a ride on skull knight to tie up any loose end's.  :rakshas:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skull Knight on September 24, 2009, 01:34:34 AM
Just to be clear, Episode 307 is being printed in Young Animal 18, while the Berserk 20th Anniversary is Young Animal 19, correct? I kept thinking the 20th Anniversay was 9/25 but the 9/25 issue is 18?

http://www.e-hon.ne.jp/bec/SA/DetailZasshi?refShinCode=0900000004910283040999&Action_id=101&Sza_id=C0 (http://www.e-hon.ne.jp/bec/SA/DetailZasshi?refShinCode=0900000004910283040999&Action_id=101&Sza_id=C0) Right?

EDIT: Nevermind, I got it figured out. Apparently The 10/9 Issue is the 20th Anniversary Edition (19) but will be ON SALE 9/25. I guess they release them 2 weeks in advance of the print dates.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 24, 2009, 02:10:03 AM
I'd say that website you linked to just got the date wrong. Because if you look here: http://www.younganimal.com/berserk/34/ you can clearly see that issue 19 is the one with 307 and the 20th anniversary celebrations. And it's out this friday (9/25).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skull Knight on September 24, 2009, 05:27:15 AM
I got my copy of YA 19 ordered!  :guts: Now it will be a very painful wait....I'm very excited to get this nice variant cover!  :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 24, 2009, 06:51:50 AM
I didn't think it would take years either, Couple of week's top's.

Ok, but that's not really what puella had in mind when she mentioned staying in Elfhelm for a while. They don't even need any pretext other than rest to stay in there for months in the first place.

EDIT: Nevermind, I got it figured out. Apparently The 10/9 Issue is the 20th Anniversary Edition (19) but will be ON SALE 9/25. I guess they release them 2 weeks in advance of the print dates.

YA issues are always dated after the next issue, never the actual date they are being released on. It can be a bit confusing, which is why I usually refer to them solely by their issue number myself.

I got my copy of YA 19 ordered!  :guts: Now it will be a very painful wait....I'm very excited to get this nice variant cover!  :troll:

That's great, but please stop posting about it in this thread. Make one in the Merchandise section if needed. Also I'd like to remind everyone that buying one Young Animal is great, but that it's not supposed to be an exceptional event. Never forget that readers are supposed to purchase every issue they read (even if they just read Berserk).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skull Knight on September 25, 2009, 05:26:14 AM
With all this speculation over Guts regrowing things, if Guts WERE to regrow his eye at Elfhelm (which I doubt) he wouldn't know because his eyelid is sealed shut! Wasn't that the normal procedure to prevent infection in medieval times? Otherwise it would mean he's putting in a lot of effort to keep his eye closed when people are around and when he's alone too!

Maybe with the right elf dust he could regrow a limb like a lizard though! I would be happy just to see him recover and stabilize a bit since he hasn't been doing good physically for a long time now. His body has been put though so much and the armor is hurting as much as it is helping.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 25, 2009, 09:00:32 AM
Maybe with the right elf dust he could regrow a limb like a lizard though!

Yeah... Maybe not.

Anyway, moving back to the topic at hands: Falconia, I believe it could be very well be related to Gaiseric's old capital. It would concord with the Greco-Roman influence in the architecture and would provide a basis for its appearance, since that old city had both become legendary (see the tale told by Charlotte in volume 10) and was laying as ruins under Wyndham. Of course, like I told Deci in the Episode 306 thread, there's more going on than the city just reappearing like it used to be, since it's very doubtful it had a Falcon motif. But it looks like it was used as the foundation from which Falconia was then built and shaped. I find this whole idea very interesting, but the real awe-inspiring thing is to think it's been planned at least 25 volumes ago.

This gives another dimension to Walter's earlier post (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739) about the similarity between symbols of the two eras. It also opens the door to a lot of comparisons between Gaiseric and Griffith. Was Gaiseric's fall over a thousand years ago already part of the plan for the events currently happening? Was Griffith modeled after him? Ah, and about that round shape in the sky, I've come to the conclusion that it's just the top of Griffith's ridiculously huge castle. So big it completely dwarfs the city itself.

Random side note, but I'm hoping the Characters & World booklet included in this issue of YA will help us clarify some of the name spellings for which we still don't have an official confirmation.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 25, 2009, 09:56:23 AM
that's approximately where Gaiseric's Imperial Capital once was, something which still exists in the minds of the people of Midland, and like that water shrine in Enoch or Flora's tree, who's to say it can't exist again? Rome... rebuilt in a day. :SK:
Huh, So Rome was built in a day.  :troll:

Hey, try making that joke BEFORE it happens, buddy. :iva:

Anyway, moving back to the topic at hands: Falconia, I believe it could be very well be related to Gaiseric's old capital. It would concord with the Greco-Roman influence in the architecture and would provide a basis for its appearance, since that old city had both become legendary (see the tale told by Charlotte in volume 10) and was laying as ruins under Wyndham. Of course, like I told Deci in the Episode 306 thread, there's more going on than the city just reappearing like it used to be, since it's very doubtful it had a Falcon motif. But it looks like it was used as the foundation from which Falconia was then built and shaped. I find this whole idea very interesting, but the real awe-inspiring thing is to think it's been planned at least 25 volumes ago.

This gives another dimension to Walter's earlier post (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739) about the similarity between symbols of the two eras. It also opens the door to a lot of comparisons between Gaiseric and Griffith. Was Gaiseric's fall over a thousand years ago already part of the plan for the events currently happening? Was Griffith modeled after him? Ah, and about that round shape in the sky, I've come to the conclusion that it's just the top of Griffith's ridiculously huge castle. So big it completely dwarfs the city itself.

The Falconia Dome, where Apostles will engage in gladiatorial entertainment! Anyway, I hope it does turn out to be modeled directly off Gaiseric's kingdom as we've all speculated to some degree. First, it would be a fitting return considering how it was likely destroyed, almost like the worlds aren't just merging, but going back in time or regressing. Anyway, your response to my quote above contained some more relevant items, perhaps even concerning the would-be dome.

I wonder how SK would react to that. :SK: Would Griffith change the decoration? Or just sit on his old throne? :griffnotevil:

Anyway, I'd covered an even cooler idea in a previous thread: Griffith's dream castle on top of the hole that the Tower of Rebirth sat upon, and gruesome secret rituals taking place in the heart of the night, straight out of a Conan adventure.

:griff: : "Brings the prisoners to my private chambers!"

I definitely want to see Skully's reaction (though the fact none was previewed isn't promising for it in this episode), you might have been right on with the redecorating :ganishka:, and wouldn't it be ironic if Griffith's possible uber dome housed his previous home, when he was under the King's... attentive care. :rakshas:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 25, 2009, 10:22:48 AM
Anyway, I hope it does turn out to be modeled directly off Gaiseric's kingdom as we've all speculated to some degree. First, it would be a fitting return considering how it was likely destroyed, almost like the worlds aren't just merging, but going back in time or regressing.

Yeah, the whole "going back to how things were with a twist" thing is really intriguing. We need to find out what the God Hand's (or their master's) ultimate goal is exactly. :SK:

Anyway, your response to my quote above contained some more relevant items, perhaps even concerning the would-be dome.

Hahaha yeah, we'd seen it all coming! :void:

I definitely want to see Skully's reaction (though the fact none was previewed isn't promising for it in this episode), you might have been right on with the redecorating :ganishka:, and wouldn't it be ironic if Griffith's possible uber dome housed his previous home, when he was under the King's... attentive care. :rakshas:

"Home sweet home!"

I knew it had messed him up! :ganishka: Anyway, I think we'll see what SK has to say about it in Elfhelm. I imagine he'll have a talk with Guts there and will clarify things a little bit. Of course, some of the other inhabitants there could also be able to shine some light on how things were in the distant past and on what happened back then.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 25, 2009, 11:28:45 AM
Yeah, the whole "going back to how things were with a twist" thing is really intriguing. We need to find out what the God Hand's (or their master's) ultimate goal is exactly. :SK:

Yeah, it's puzzling, one thought that occurs to me, though it's literally just the first thing I came up with considering the question, is that they needed to go through all this in order to install themselves as governors of the world of Gaiseric's era, except they couldn't do it as the world was then, so they had to get away from that world in order to even install themselves as governors, and now that they've fully realized that, they're reinstalling that old world, except with themselves already as the principle, if that makes any sense. Basically, just to control that world, they had to destroy it, then build it back up it again, from scratch, in their image. Anyway, just something out of my ass, I'll call it the "roundabout theory." :badbone:

Hahaha yeah, we'd seen it all coming! :void:

www.skullknight.net/griffith/arnoldisee.wav

"Home sweet home!"

I knew it had messed him up! :ganishka:

Yeah, Griffith's going to spend all his free time sitting in the dark of his old jail cell. :femto:

Anyway, I think we'll see what SK has to say about it in Elfhelm. I imagine he'll have a talk with Guts there and will clarify things a little bit. Of course, some of the other inhabitants there could also be able to shine some light on how things were in the distant past and on what happened back then.

I hope so, that talk has been a long time coming though. It's hard to imagine him being forward with information about himself at this point, but perhaps as you say, someone in Elfhelm will take the initiative and then force Skully to speak (like Schierke with the armor). I'm sure what Griffith's done will be the talk of the town, and it might even be Skully's place to report on it.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 25, 2009, 11:43:48 AM
Yeah, it's puzzling, one thought that occurs to me, though it's literally just the first thing I came up with considering the question, is that they needed to go through all this in order to install themselves as governors of the world of Gaiseric's era, except they couldn't do it as the world was then, so they had to get away from that world in order to even install themselves as governors

Brings back memories of my ooooold theory that the God Hand tried to recruit Gaiseric, but he told them to shove it. :badbone:

Yeah, Griffith's going to spend all his free time sitting in the dark of his old jail cell. :femto:

Brooding and thinking about Guts. His dream, at last! :ganishka:

I hope so, that talk has been a long time coming though. It's hard to imagine him being forward with information about himself at this point, but perhaps as you say, someone in Elfhelm will take the initiative and then force Skully to speak (like Schierke with the armor). I'm sure what Griffith's done will be the talk of the town, and it might even be Skully's place to report on it.

Yeah, I mean at this point it's going to be hard skirting around the issue. And knowing Guts' feelings towards cryptic talk, he might just get angry and "demand" answers. :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Vampire_Hunter_Bob on September 25, 2009, 02:08:40 PM
Yeah, it's puzzling, one thought that occurs to me, though it's literally just the first thing I came up with considering the question, is that they needed to go through all this in order to install themselves as governors of the world of Gaiseric's era, except they couldn't do it as the world was then, so they had to get away from that world in order to even install themselves as governors, and now that they've fully realized that, they're reinstalling that old world, except with themselves already as the principle, if that makes any sense. Basically, just to control that world, they had to destroy it, then build it back up it again, from scratch, in their image. Anyway, just something out of my ass, I'll call it the "roundabout theory." :badbone:

Brings back memories of my ooooold theory that the God Hand tried to recruit Gaiseric, but he told them to shove it. :badbone:

I was always a big fan of that theory.

However, what would be the reason to have the majority of humanity under the command of one kingdom that's ruling over the majority of people? There has to be more to it than controling humanity.

It could be that Gaiseric's reign had somehow removed the threat that the astral creatures had brought originaly.  :???:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 25, 2009, 07:24:22 PM
Ah, and about that round shape in the sky, I've come to the conclusion that it's just the top of Griffith's ridiculously huge castle. So big it completely dwarfs the city itself.
Yeah I agree. It's likely just "the top," within which -- who knows. Could be a grand hall, or something more unexpected and otherworldly.

... [The God Hand] needed to go through all this in order to install themselves as governors of the world of Gaiseric's era, except they couldn't do it as the world was then, so they had to get away from that world in order to even install themselves as governors, and now that they've fully realized that, they're reinstalling that old world, except with themselves already as the principle, if that makes any sense.
One problem with that theory, not that I'm not intrigued -- it presupposes there was a previous God Hand, when GH members are born every 216 years. However, there's no denying there are similarities in what happened now and what happened 1,000 years ago, not even to mention the physical and figurative similarities between Griffith and Gaiseric's separate empires. I made a thread about it last year: http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=9533.0. But now, with the appearance of Falconia, there's even more ammo for it.

What I'd like to know is whether Gaiseric's capital was truly built on the backs of laborers or by other, more spectacular means, as we've seen here.

It's hard to imagine him being forward with information about himself at this point, but perhaps as you say, someone in Elfhelm will take the initiative and then force Skully to speak (like Schierke with the armor). I'm sure what Griffith's done will be the talk of the town, and it might even be Skully's place to report on it.
I'm seeing a scene in my head, bear with me through the fanfic  :carcus:

Guts and everyone arrive and settle in Elfhelm just as a council convenes to discuss the latest occurrence. They say their agent on the front lines is scheduled to give them a status report of the changes in the world. Then, the Skull Knight arrives, bearing dire news.  :SK:

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 25, 2009, 08:24:55 PM
Brings back memories of my ooooold theory that the God Hand tried to recruit Gaiseric, but he told them to shove it. :badbone:

Yeah, it's fun imagining all the possible scenarios, the flip side being there's just too many to go with any.

Yeah, I mean at this point it's going to be hard skirting around the issue. And knowing Guts' feelings towards cryptic talk, he might just get angry and "demand" answers. :guts:

That'd be fantastic to see, never imagined Guts to Skully, "Stop fucking with me!"

However, what would be the reason to have the majority of humanity under the command of one kingdom that's ruling over the majority of people? There has to be more to it than controling humanity.

Well, my point was that they'd be gaining greater control of the world at large, not just humanity.

Yeah I agree. It's likely just "the top," within which -- who knows. Could be a grand hall, or something more unexpected and otherworldly.

Yeah, if not the dome, then the big electrode!

One problem with that theory, not that I'm not intrigued -- it presupposes there was a previous God Hand, when GH members are born every 216 years.

Actually, I didn't mean to presume anything about the makeup of the God Hand at the time, any plurals were just casual reference to whatever God Hand was then.

This did get me thinking about that though. Four or five angels allegedly destroyed Gaiseric's Kingdom, and as the old theories ponder, was this some form of God Hand putting their plan in motion, or was it a counter to God Hand, perhaps another magic user summoning powerful beings like the Four Kings. In either case, it makes me wonder if Gaiseric's Kingdom was the settling of a world chaotic in every way, even astrally, and the foundation of a more "human world", something which couldn't be undone even after it was destroyed (or because it was =).

What I'd like to know is whether Gaiseric's capital was truly built on the backs of laborers or by other, more spectacular means, as we've seen here.

I think we should just go with the obvious, this event is something special ("I don't see Gaiseric having a moment around here!" :femto:), and even if it's a fantastic recreation of a long lost Kingdom, it doesn't mean that Kingdom was originally created by fantastic means. Tying it into the above speculations, perhaps this is the synthesis between man-made and magic-made.

I'm seeing a scene in my head, bear with me through the fanfic  :carcus:

Guts and everyone arrive and settle in Elfhelm just as a council convenes to discuss the latest occurrence. They say their agent on the front lines is scheduled to give them a status report of the changes in the world. Then, the Skull Knight arrives, bearing dire news.  :SK:

 :ganishka: Haha, I love it, it reminds me of Star Wars, "Many Schnozes died to bring us this information." :schnoz:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: DetriusXii on September 25, 2009, 09:38:41 PM
Yeah I agree. It's likely just "the top," within which -- who knows. Could be a grand hall, or something more unexpected and otherworldly.
One problem with that theory, not that I'm not intrigued -- it presupposes there was a previous God Hand, when GH members are born every 216 years. However, there's no denying there are similarities in what happened now and what happened 1,000 years ago, not even to mention the physical and figurative similarities between Griffith and Gaiseric's separate empires. I made a thread about it last year: http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=9533.0. But now, with the appearance of Falconia, there's even more ammo for it.

What I'd like to know is whether Gaiseric's capital was truly built on the backs of laborers or by other, more spectacular means, as we've seen here.
I'm seeing a scene in my head, bear with me through the fanfic  :carcus:


Well, I'm wondering if perhaps the spiritual world is a finite resource and needs time to replenish.  Let's suppose Gaiseric did base his empire's infrastructure on mythical superstructures from the spiritual realm.   Eventually there was so many water ways, cities, grain stores, and libraries created from the spiritual realm that the energies that connected the two were exhausted.  So when the layers became severed, Gaiseric's infrastructure comes crashing down.  And as the regions of the physical world became separated from the spiritual world, the four angels retreated from that region and moved to another region, without realizing their presence accelerated the separation process.   So the citizens of these cities would see the four angels arrive from one location and then later, would see their infrastructure crumble.  Humans would blame the destruction of their cities on the four angels, but in reality, the four angels had no control over the destruction of their cities.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 25, 2009, 09:48:07 PM
What I'd like to know is whether Gaiseric's capital was truly built on the backs of laborers or by other, more spectacular means, as we've seen here.

I say it was built the hard way!

Actually, I didn't mean to presume anything about the makeup of the God Hand at the time, any plurals were just casual reference to whatever God Hand was then.

We could simply do away with the God Hand and go straight with their master here. :idea:

In either case, it makes me wonder if Gaiseric's Kingdom was the settling of a world chaotic in every way, even astrally, and the foundation of a more "human world"

Not that this proves anything, but that's precisely how I've always thought of Gaiseric's empire (kingdoms are for losers :troll:) myself.

I think we should just go with the obvious, this event is something special ("I don't see Gaiseric having a moment around here!" :femto:), and even if it's a fantastic recreation of a long lost Kingdom, it doesn't mean that Kingdom was originally created by fantastic means. Tying it into the above speculations, perhaps this is the synthesis between man-made and magic-made.

My thoughts exactly. Griffith is a mere emulator. :void:     Ok I'll stop with that now, I promise.

Well, I'm wondering if perhaps the spiritual world is a finite resource and needs time to replenish.  Let's suppose Gaiseric did base his empire's infrastructure on mythical superstructures from the spiritual realm.   Eventually there was so many water ways, cities, grain stores, and libraries created from the spiritual realm that the energies that connected the two were exhausted.  So when the layers became severed, Gaiseric's infrastructure comes crashing down.  And as the regions of the physical world became separated from the spiritual world, the four angels retreated from that region and moved to another region, without realizing their presence accelerated the separation process.   So the citizens of these cities would see the four angels arrive from one location and then later, would see their infrastructure crumble.  Humans would blame the destruction of their cities on the four angels, but in reality, the four angels had no control over the destruction of their cities.

To be honest it all sounds very far-fetched to me.


Side note: It would be a strange sight to see if Falconia's architecture were to be reflected in the way its inhabitants will dress as well (Greco-Roman fashion?).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Deathbringer on September 26, 2009, 01:22:36 AM
Side note: It would be a strange sight to see if Falconia's architecture were to be reflected in the way its inhabitants will dress as well (Greco-Roman fashion?).

That would be pretty fitting. If anything it´s another cultural change that would reflect the evolution of the world. I hope that the architecture of the city´s buildings  matches what we´ve seen of the city walls so far.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 26, 2009, 02:39:00 AM
Side note: It would be a strange sight to see if Falconia's architecture were to be reflected in the way its inhabitants will dress as well (Greco-Roman fashion?).

That's an interesting idea. Of course, Griffith/Femto could simply force the citizens of Falconia to adopt to his own dress code...

"Everyone must wear dark blue with lots of eye shadow and lipstick!" :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 26, 2009, 03:10:49 AM
I hope that the architecture of the city´s buildings  matches what we´ve seen of the city walls so far.
You can see some of them in the preview pages.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-architecture.jpg)

When compared to Gaiseric's fallen empire, you can definitely see at least one similarity:

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-architecture2.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Okin on September 26, 2009, 05:59:05 AM
Whatever Gaiseric was, I never thought he could be compared to Griffith. For some reason I always imagined that all GHs disappeared from history as all there connections to the physical world would be sacrificed in the Eclipse. However, the parallels between Falconia and Gaiseric's kingdom are undeniable in both the architecture and legendary origins. No matter how you describe it (Man fighting alongside monster in an epic battle against a giant tower of darkness led by a shining white knight), I think Griffith's conquest of Midland isn't going to be forgotten anytime soon.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 26, 2009, 07:45:07 AM
That's an interesting idea. Of course, Griffith/Femto could simply force the citizens of Falconia to adopt to his own dress code...

"Everyone must wear dark blue with lots of eye shadow and lipstick!" :femto:

I'd make a joke about Gothic architecture, but is there even a need to drive the point home? :ganishka:

For some reason I always imagined that all GHs disappeared from history as all there connections to the physical world would be sacrificed in the Eclipse.

If we assume that they were all prominent people of their era to some degree, it's logical that some traces of them would be left. However there would always be mystery surrounding their sudden and unexplained disappearance, so on the other hand they couldn't be among the most famous historical figures (not to mention that they might not have been the most prominent ones to begin with).

Let's look at Griffith's case. People remembered him from the hundred years war, but it's the Kushan invasion coupled with the supernatural and prophetic collective dream that kept him fresh in people's minds. Not to mention that he came back to the world a few years after becoming a member of the God Hand. That makes him a very special case. Had he disappeared forever and the country been slowly rebuilt, his name would have faded into legend. Which is likely what happened in the case of the other members of the God Hand. Hundreds of years later, they're probably only remembered by few.

Look at the "wise man" associated with Gaiseric, for example. While we don't have any solid proof that he was connected to the God Hand at this point, if he happened to be, he hasn't marked history nearly as much as Gaiseric himself or the events that ended his rule.

However, the parallels between Falconia and Gaiseric's kingdom are undeniable in both the architecture and legendary origins.

Well if Falconia was created using the legend and/or ruins of Gaiseric's old capital (not kingdom), which is what we're supposing here, it's only logical that there are parallels. To me the real question is whether Griffith's status as an invincible conqueror was modeled after Gaiseric's example as well. Taking the best historical example possible, and enhancing it to perfection by using magic (see what "宮本 グリフィス" said earlier).



Keep in mind this is approximative, but the text in the preview mentions something about oriental doctrine and how the tree is related as if it shows the "principles of everything" in the "secret mysticism" of the West. It seems to be compared to the original form of something that is rooted deep inside humans.

Not to be taken as a word of law, but I figured it'd be food for thought.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 26, 2009, 08:18:26 AM
Keep in mind this is approximative, but the text in the preview mentions something about oriental doctrine and how the tree is related as if it shows the "principles of everything" in the "secret mysticism" of the West. It seems to be compared to the original form of something that is rooted deep inside humans.

Not to be taken as a word of law, but I figured it'd be food for thought.
Sounds like you might have an idea there Aaz, in any case, there's definitely some evil afoot.  :idea:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 26, 2009, 04:55:48 PM
By the way, here's a bonus included in copies of volume 34, or at least those bought from a Yurindo shop:

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/EpisodePreviews/34-SchierkeCard.jpg)

Card signed by Miura thanking the reader for purchasing volume 34 (I got one! :badbone:). Could Elfhelm be a tropical island? :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 26, 2009, 04:57:29 PM
Hahaha, I love it. A tropical island theme. A possible hint at what's to come in Elfhelm, or just Miura playing around? Hm, food for thought!

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 26, 2009, 05:02:01 PM
ADOOOOOOOORABLE!

An insanely cute sketch. I love the beherit on Isidro's trident-thing. Also, Puck on his goggles is a nice touch.

Schierke looks awfully serious even when she's relaxing in the water. It's probably her first time swimming. Aaz you lucky bastard, enjoy this special bonus. I'm glad you were able to get it.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Oburi on September 26, 2009, 05:06:57 PM
HAha thats great, much thanks to you Aaz for posting that for our veiwing pleasure.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: slan69 on September 26, 2009, 08:57:16 PM
I am very depressed at seeing this photo of Schierke because I tried to win the YA#19 of YJA and it included this in it but sadly I lost. :judo:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 26, 2009, 10:27:45 PM
For your viewing pleasure, a quick photoshop cropping/merging of the 2-page city spread.


(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-low.jpg)
(Click for higher res) (http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-high.jpg)


(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-look.jpg)
This is how I feel.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 26, 2009, 10:49:41 PM
Well, those who expected to see more of the castle soon are going to be disappointed. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Serpico on September 26, 2009, 10:50:19 PM
By the way, here's a bonus included in copies of volume 34, or at least those bought from a Yurindo shop:

Card signed by Miura thanking the reader for purchasing volume 34 (I got one! :badbone:). Could Elfhelm be a tropical island? :guts:

Hah, thats totally unexpected from Miura to me. Thanks for sharing that Aaz, as well as all the other little bonus items you've posted in the past.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 26, 2009, 11:01:56 PM
Something I wanted to call attention to now that it's confirmed. The statues in the front of Falconia could carry a telling message about the future.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-statues2.jpg)
Falcon above man; man above beast. :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jaze1618 on September 26, 2009, 11:02:41 PM
Well, those who expected to see more of the castle soon are going to be disappointed. :ganishka:

What exactly do you mean here Aaz? Do you have knowledge about episode 308? Or is this speculation based on the signed card?

Thanks for the clarification. This episode it awesome, the castle looks great. I'm surprised there was so much that wasn't seen the in the preview pictures.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 26, 2009, 11:04:06 PM


(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-look.jpg)
This is how I feel.
I like how the guy next to the guy in the top right corner looks, he's kinda like, FFFFFFFF  :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 26, 2009, 11:54:30 PM
The apostles and humans have fought together. Think some of them will room together too? :magni: :zodd:

Either way, I bet apostles will get the primo real-estate first.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 27, 2009, 12:45:25 AM
The apostles and humans have fought together. Think some of them will room together too? :magni: :zodd:

Either way, I bet apostles will get the primo real-estate first.
I like thinking about what kinda of important jobs the apostles may have in this society.
"All rise in the court of the honorable Judge Zodd"  :zodd:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 27, 2009, 01:01:34 AM
I like thinking about what kinda of important jobs the apostles may have in this society.
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-collisseum.jpg)
This looks more like Zodd's place of business to me.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on September 27, 2009, 02:37:31 AM
Such an ominous Last page. :idea: And I love the shot of the lancer division.  :guts: Thanks everyone. I will thank Kentarou Miura with my cash, as always.  :serpico:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 27, 2009, 07:43:05 AM
What exactly do you mean here Aaz? Do you have knowledge about episode 308?

Have you read the thread in its entirety? There's a preview of episode 308 in this Young Animal. It shows Guts holding his artificial arm. And it will be the beginning of both a new arc and a new chapter. So I imagine 308 will cut back to Guts. Besides, this episode is a good way to end the chapter of Falconia, being itself called Falconia, and showing us the city while still leaving it very mysterious.

Anyway, it's nice to see Jarif among the onlookers, just confirming he's still there. Same for Daiba. :void:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Lithrael on September 27, 2009, 11:31:06 AM
Wowww...  thanks guys!  Love the reaction shots.  

Oh, and that card is adorable.  Glad you got one Aaz!  
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Cronus on September 27, 2009, 03:02:36 PM
Anyway, it's nice to see Jarif among the onlookers, just confirming he's still there. Same for Daiba. :void:

Daiba's picture in the episode is fucking hilarious.  New avatar...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: The Beast of Darkness on September 27, 2009, 03:29:10 PM
Thanks for episode 307.

Daiba's picture in the episode is fucking hilarious.  New avatar...

What's so "fucking hilarious" about it?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Gobolatula on September 27, 2009, 04:06:41 PM
I hate to dwell on the obvious here, but this episode is a true testament to Miura's mastery of architecture and landscape. A lot of great perspective work here. I spent a good deal of time staring at each page, especially the city drawings. As mentioned before, the onlookers' gaspy faces are an appropriate reaction to what's there in front of them.  :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dani on September 27, 2009, 04:38:59 PM
I can't believe it's been so long since Griffith made clear his intent, to come so far and finally we can see it all. I can't believe we get the next EPISODE so soon. Miura is the man.

The last page spread really hits home the amazing scale of Falconia.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on September 27, 2009, 05:20:25 PM
Thanks guys! I love the panels of apostles and Midlanders walking through the forest of transformed mini-Ganishka's next to the giant tree. The shot of Zodd and Griffith is great, too! Can't wait for a translation!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 27, 2009, 07:32:29 PM
The shot of Zodd and Griffith is great, too! Can't wait for a translation!

About what's being said in the episode, there is talk of northern legends as well concerning the tree, and Foss mentions the legendary capital that was buried under Wyndham before changing his mind, saying it couldn't possibly be the work of mortal men. The Pontiff then starts speaking of Falconia.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 27, 2009, 08:00:31 PM
Excellent stuff from this episode. Though I'm really iffy on this episode for one reason, that being all the shiningness and sparkles are kind of unsettling considering  :femto:'s "prophecy", wonder how long it's gonna last since everyone's marching in there like sheep to the slaughter so to speak.

edit: also a small comment about the statues on the entrance, did they remind anyone else of Roman soldiers? Was a pretty cool touch imo.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 27, 2009, 08:01:47 PM
...wonder how long it's gonna last since everyone's marching in there like sheep to the slaughter so to speak.
But they're marching into Griffith's protective wings.  :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 27, 2009, 08:30:45 PM
Excellent stuff from this episode. Though I'm really iffy on this episode for one reason, that being all the shiningness and sparkles are kind of unsettling considering  :femto:'s "prophecy", wonder how long it's gonna last since everyone's marching in there like sheep to the slaughter so to speak.
Femto didn't make a prophecy. Or did you mean the prophecy read by Farnese in vol 14 and Schierke in vol 22 regarding the Falcon of Darkness?

Either way, the age of darkness could have something to do with everyone NOT living in Falconia being totally screwed.

Quote
edit: also a small comment about the statues on the entrance, did they remind anyone else of Roman soldiers? Was a pretty cool touch imo.
It's been commented on for the past 5 pages actually, particularly the similarity between this architecture/style and that in Gaiseric's time. Where've you been?  :azan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Uriel on September 27, 2009, 08:37:05 PM
By a Balrog's Left Bollock -- that was awesome!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 27, 2009, 08:38:52 PM
Femto didn't make a prophecy. Or did you mean the prophecy read by Farnese in vol 14 and Schierke in vol 22 regarding the Falcon of Darkness?

Hahah don't hurt me Walter! Been mia the past few days and just dropped in to see what people were talking about. But yeah I'm referring to the Falcon of Darkness' prophecy, as Falconia's so clean looking and stuff, it suddenly shifting to demons r us would make me shit myself. >.<
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Vampire_Hunter_Bob on September 27, 2009, 09:07:41 PM
This is like a chain reaction of awesome episodes. Hell it doesn't even feel like it's been that long since Ganishka jumped into the apostle meat ball.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Grail on September 27, 2009, 09:29:28 PM
Big thanks for the episode, guys! I wonder how Griffith's going to keep that palace filled up... :isidro: Exactly how many rooms does a guy need? Though, it would be interesting to see if its supernatural construction would lead it to become an astral funhouse of sorts. Just a thought. :void:
This is like a chain reaction of awesome episodes. Hell it doesn't even feel like it's been that long since Ganishka jumped into the apostle meat ball.
Yeah, in spite of any breaks, it doesn't really feel like it's been what, close to a year? It all ends up blurring together eventually. Time flies when you're getting old! :flora:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 27, 2009, 09:36:27 PM
About what's being said in the episode, there is talk of northern legends as well concerning the tree, and Foss mentions the legendary capital that was buried under Wyndham before changing his mind, saying it couldn't possibly be the work of mortal men. The Pontiff then starts speaking of Falconia.
Whoa, missed this earlier! You and I called it from our earlier discussion  :carcus:

Really, I think it's implied that both Foss and the Pontiff are right -- it's Gaiseric's capital with some supernatural renovations, more or less as we expected. But man, to have that confirmed. Fills me with such ... happiness  :judo:

:femto: : "Hey, nice capital gramps. I think I'll take it."
:SK: : "!"
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: berserkfan on September 27, 2009, 10:50:56 PM
I think now that griffith has his own kingdom the age of darkness will turn out like this. Griffith will become mad with power and begin to subjugate humans in falconia allowing apostles to act as a secret police and attack them every night. From there on chances are he'll become bored with peaceful life and will hold coliseum tournaments with the winner having the privilege to face griffith in one on one mortal combat for the crown. Guts at hearing the news and always loving a good fight will hurry to falconia after receiving his power-up from the elf king, there he'll fight each one of his generals in the coliseum with zodd being the final one. After killing all of them, him and griffith will finally face each other, and guts will win and become the new king. The god-hand will slip back into the shadows and go back to their scheming ways.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Bekul on September 27, 2009, 11:08:43 PM
Er... no. Unless that was meant in jest! In which case... that is /extremely unlikely/.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 27, 2009, 11:33:43 PM
Rrrrrrright, well moving on...

Me and Aaz were talking earlier today about the differences in how the two capitals -- Gaiseric's and Griffith's -- were created. I think there are moral implications behind each capital's story, and it's kind of an offshoot of the dream chaser theme Miura has reiterated throughout the series. Dreams can be achieved, but at what cost? Simply put:

The old emperor built the capital on the backs of the people, but it was real.
The new emperor built the capital with magic, at the expense of the world.

Quote from: Volume 10, Dark Horse translation
Judo: "According to legend, I think [Gaiseric] gathered workers from all over the empire, and forced them through hard labor to build a large capital city. Then the king lived in the utmost extravagance while levying heavier and heavier taxes on the people. The city ended up becoming a melting pot of feasting and pleasure"
It wasn't an easy process for Gaiseric. It was hard labor, and presumably took years,  drawing the hatred of his subjects as a result of his monumental creation. According to legend, angels were sent to destroy the capital because of his sins -- possibly beginning the cycle of which we're now seeing the first full revolution of.

1,000 years later, Griffith's capital appears. It resembles the former emperor's city, but has been augmented by supernatural means. It cost nothing to build. Well, nothing except his humanity and the order and sanity of the world. The world had to change in order for the capital to appear, and that shift has placed all of civilization in danger.

But which emperor had the right idea? Either? Food for thought :badbone:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 27, 2009, 11:56:05 PM
But you don't think the story as told through Judo had been skewered Walter? With the possibility of the angels being the godhand(though not confirmed), I'm still reluctant to believe things went down as was written.  :SK:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 27, 2009, 11:58:33 PM
But you don't think the story as told through Judo had been skewered Walter? With the possibility of the angels being the godhand(though not confirmed), I'm still reluctant to believe things went down as was written.  :SK:
Yeah, thanks for the reminder :carcus: But whether they were God Hand or angel doesn't change Judo's story, or my point, at all. What's in question is Gaiseric's popularity after building the capital. My point is that his extravagant empire came at a price, as did Griffith's, though at a very different price.

There are two accounts of the emperor: Judo/Charlotte's tale and Mozgus', and in both they call him "sinful." Now, that can be interpreted a number of ways. Yes, it could simply be the Holy See's doctrine blasting the former world order with lies. Or ... that could have been a popular stigma circulated after Gaiseric's taxation to build the capital, and also by the have-nots living on the outside of the capital looking in and seeing extravagance (implied in Moz' story).

I concede that details in these legends were likely tainted over time, but I don't think we should outright ignore them because of that. I believe the core of these stories is true: the capital wasn't built on the backs of happy citizens, piling brick after brick in glee. Something triggered its downfall and decimation.

But I'd really rather we didn't get into speculative material, which is why I stuck as close as possible to the facts, as we know them, in my post. The specifics of what happened 1,000 years ago are far too vague to talk at length on. But since you drew it out of me, for the record, yes, I personally believe the angels were the God Hand, or a God Hand member -- hence the brands on the skulls of all the corpses.

I really hope we can steer the conversation in other, more fruitful directions though, because the how of all that is a real dead-end.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 28, 2009, 12:43:35 AM
^I see what you mean, and agreed on the how being a dead end, but in that case It's looking more like Gaiseric was probably more on the path of the "right idea" as you mentioned, because it may sound cold, but his actions really only effected the people he forced into labor, Griffith's has literally sacrificed the state of the world to achieve what Gaiseric did, so obviously the price here is much higher, and like you mentioned, Gaiseric's kingdom was real in that it didn't require supernatural elements to be built, so while Falconia is all bright and sparkly, Gaiseric should be praised as he didn't have all the backing Griffith did.

EDIT: I'm hoping that's what you were looking for as far as a change in direction *picks up head and scurries off*
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Okin on September 28, 2009, 01:23:03 AM
:femto: : "Hey, nice capital gramps. I think I'll take it."
:SK: : "!"

Wait, so are we considering that this city appeared from the astral where the "idea" of Gaiseric's capital existed?

EDIT: Something worth talking about. Obviously there's faults in building a kingdom from harsh labor, but look at the Egyptians: They managed to convince their pyramid builders into thinking it was their place to work for the pharaoh, and they gave them plenty of reason to do so too. They had good lives overall, and still created some of the greatest structures in history. Here's a good documentary on it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJWrlYIf-Bw

The end of this first video and the next is where they explain how it was for the workers outside of the labor hours.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEaRJ4w1GKE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOjGRTREtnQ
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 28, 2009, 02:19:23 AM
Griffith's has literally sacrificed the state of the world to achieve what Gaiseric did, so obviously the price here is much higher, and like you mentioned, Gaiseric's kingdom was real in that it didn't require supernatural elements to be built, so while Falconia is all bright and sparkly, Gaiseric should be praised as he didn't have all the backing Griffith did.

Well, yeah I suppose. But Gaiseric didn't built it himself you know :guts: . And there's the other piece of the legend of why his subjects lost faith in him. According to Mozgus and Judo, after the capital was built, he taxed them heavily while living a life of extravagance inside his massive capital. A centralized empire like that probably wouldn't see very many benefits to outlying colonies (can't even really call them countries at this point, since they were all one back then. Which could have led to unrest and disdain.

Personally though, I really can't see SK eating grapes while being fed by 100 virgins. He doesn't seem the type to stomach that kind of extravagance. Which is why I'm disinclined to believe ALL the legends. But, maybe time changed him?

Wait, so are we considering that this city appeared from the astral where the "idea" of Gaiseric's capital existed?
Well, so far we're just talking about the chat between Foss and the Pontiff in this episode. Foss seems to recognize Falconia as the ancient capital, but then says that there are aspects of the city that weren't made by human hands (Im paraphrasing here, pending a full translation).

So yeah, I'd say some aspect of the astral or even ideal worlds played a role here. Or, as I said earlier in the thread, it was the desire of one very influential person. (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 28, 2009, 02:55:11 AM
^Agree 100% with the above post Walter, I know you wanted to steer away from the legends aspect, but if I may add, remember how Flora would tend to the berserk armor for SK? Schierke I believe did mention how Flora would fondly tend to the armor, and I don't think she'd hold any positive sentiment or attachment to an extravagant hedonist as in the legends.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jerk on September 28, 2009, 03:44:07 AM
It's all so mysterious, you really have to grasp every piece of the story and make all the connections to try and understand what the bollocks is going on here!  What does humanity desire? What does the Godhand really want? Who is the skull knight? What happened to Gaeseric and his empire?  So many questions, so little answers!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Buy Berserk! on September 28, 2009, 08:36:07 AM
Amazing episode. The culmination of so many things. I pity the people who couldn't buy YA this time, it's a truly magnificent issue. Volume 34 is not to be missed either. Worth an instant-purchase, as always.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dar Klink on September 28, 2009, 09:02:20 AM
Amazing episode. The culmination of so many things. I pity the people who couldn't buy YA this time, it's a truly magnificent issue. Volume 34 is not to be missed either. Worth an instant-purchase, as always.
:sad: no YA for me, but  :guts: ordered Volume 34! My first Japanese volume!
Oh man, Berserkfan has given me inspiration to write a Berserk fanfic along the lines of Dragonball or Yu Yu Hakusho's tournament arcs. why would I actually enjoy watching/reading that?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 28, 2009, 12:23:09 PM
You and I called it from our earlier discussion  :carcus:

You know, at this point I think it might be better to just start mentioning things we didn't call beforehand. :badbone:

Really, I think it's implied that both Foss and the Pontiff are right -- it's Gaiseric's capital with some supernatural renovations, more or less as we expected. But man, to have that confirmed. Fills me with such ... happiness  :judo:

Well, while it's not completely confirmed, the fact it's the first thing Foss was reminded of certainly lends credence to our earlier posts on the topic. I'd be interested to see what Wyndham Falconia's underground looks like now. Are the ruins still there? Did they disappear when Falconia appeared? Are there horrid creatures lurking in the dark down there now? :zodd:

I think now that griffith has his own kingdom the age of darkness will turn out like this.

You really like the movie Gladiator, don't you?

Griffith's capital appears. It resembles the former emperor's city, but has been augmented by supernatural means. It cost nothing to build. Well, nothing except his humanity and the order and sanity of the world. The world had to change in order for the capital to appear, and that shift has placed all of civilization in danger.

Hmm. One thing we should be careful not to do is focusing on Falconia too much in the grand scheme of things. For example the tree could play a much bigger role than the city at this point. While Falconia itself represents Griffith's dream, the tree (formerly Ganishka) was the gate from which the merging came. I guess what I'm getting at is that currently it might be a bit presumptuous to assume it was all done just so that Falconia would appear.

To me it's more probably one element among others in this new world the God Hand has engineered. For Slan, Conrad, Ubik and Void the reward was a much stronger influence on the the world, for Griffith it was the accomplishment of his dream (no doubt far exceeding what it actually was originally). But is it the end? Is that what the plan was all along? I don't think so. I believe the best/worst is yet to come.

I concede that details in these legends were likely tainted over time, but I don't think we should outright ignore them because of that. I believe the core of these stories is true: the capital wasn't built on the backs of happy citizens, piling brick after brick in glee. Something triggered its downfall and decimation.

In any case, we don't know the whole story. That something destroyed the city overnight is pretty much a given, but how the emperor ruled and what his subjects wanted... I think it's risky to venture into such speculation with so little information. I don't doubt some people were unhappy, but was it really everyone, or just a faction that eventually got to write history? We could easily speculate for hours on that subject.

Griffith's has literally sacrificed the state of the world to achieve what Gaiseric did

Repeating what I said above, but I think it's a bit simplistic to consider Falconia the end goal of the merging of the worlds.

Gaiseric's kingdom was real in that it didn't require supernatural elements to be built

We don't know the details of how the capital city of his empire was built, you said so yourself. But presumably magic and astral creatures were not uncommon during Gaiseric's time, so who's to say no supernatural elements were involved at all? And why is the supernatural itself automatically assumed to be a bad thing? Furthermore, why is the merging of the worlds reduced to a "price" Griffith had to pay for Falconia, when it's an event of a much bigger magnitude?

Wait, so are we considering that this city appeared from the astral where the "idea" of Gaiseric's capital existed?

The world of ideas and the astral world are different... Despite the case of the Idea of Evil, I wouldn't mingle the two.

Something worth talking about. Obviously there's faults in building a kingdom from harsh labor, but look at the Egyptians: They managed to convince their pyramid builders into thinking it was their place to work for the pharaoh, and they gave them plenty of reason to do so too. They had good lives overall, and still created some of the greatest structures in history.

Simply said, they were qualified workers, not actual slaves.

:sad: no YA for me, but  :guts: ordered Volume 34! My first Japanese volume!

Too bad, you're missing out. I have to say though, there's nothing too exceptional in the Character & World booklet (its purpose mostly seems to be to recapitulate the story for newcomers). Reminds me of the "Review the Berserk" pages Young Animal featured a while back. Still, convenient little thing for the average reader.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: CowTip on September 28, 2009, 01:54:09 PM
Honestly, it's hard for me to imagine a lot of these people's lives being much worse than they already were under the rule of Ganishka. Bring on the crazy magically appearing city~
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 28, 2009, 03:11:32 PM
Honestly, it's hard for me to imagine a lot of these people's lives being much worse than they already were under the rule of Ganishka. Bring on the crazy magically appearing city~
Falconia is kind of an exclusive city though. It can only house and protect some of the population from the terrors of the outside. What's going to happen to the others, like say Vritannis?

:magni:      :chomp:


No city will be able to withstand a full-on attack by astral creatures without the help of trained magic users. Take Enoch as an example -- as it was probably meant to be all along.

Or is quelling the hordes of astral creatures the next use of Griffith's apostle army? :???:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 28, 2009, 05:29:13 PM
Or is quelling the hordes of astral creatures the next use of Griffith's apostle army? :???:

Their numbers seem barely enough to defend Falconia itself as it is.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 28, 2009, 05:53:02 PM
Here's a pertinent thought, Falconia is obviously quite humongous from the wide shots we've seen, and I doubt all those present will be enough to fill it, or even come close. So, perhaps all the supernatural oogie boogies running around out there will serve as the ultimate motivation for people, the world over, to seek refuge within its walls and Griffith's dominion. Maybe that's the whole point of the Age of Darkness; join us, or deal with it yourself. (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/griff-notevil34animated.gif)

Then again, despite obvious the problems "fantasia" presents, I don't think we should go too far in assuming it's going to be so untenable for humans in the rest of the world. Not all these creatures are Trolls and Ogres, and a natural order or ecosystem may fall into place with both friendly and unfriendly creatures present and perhaps balancing each other to a agree. Anyway, we tend get used to things... and therefore they become easier to kill, just look at Griffith's men in the face of Ganishka's offspring. If farmers can figure out how to put some of these new beasts to work in their fields, they will. =)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 28, 2009, 05:58:39 PM
Here's a pertinent thought, Falconia is obviously quite humongous from the wide shots we've seen, and I doubt all those present will be enough to fill it, or even come close. So, perhaps all the supernatural oogie boogies running around out there will serve as the ultimate motivation for people, the world over, to seek refuge within its walls and Griffith's dominion. Maybe that's the whole point of the Age of Darkness; join us, or deal with it yourself. (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/griff-notevil34animated.gif)
Despite all I've said, I think there's probably still more to come that will change the circumstances in the world. Namely, how/what/if the God Hand will take an active role and emerge from the shadows.

Quote
Then again, despite obvious the problems "fantasia" presents, I don't think we should go too far in assuming it's going to be so untenable for humans in the rest of the world. Not all these creatures are Trolls and Ogres, and a natural order or ecosystem may fall into place with both friendly and unfriendly creatures present and perhaps balancing each other to a agree. Anyway, we tend get used to things... and therefore they become easier to kill, just look at Griffith's men in the face of Ganishka's offspring. If farmers can figure out how to put some of these new beasts to work in their fields, they will. =)
I'm unsure those unicorns would make good plow horses, and I doubt the farmers will be able to convince the zombies and dragons to be harnessed  :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 28, 2009, 06:09:19 PM
Despite all I've said, I think there's probably still more to come that will change the circumstances in the world. Namely, how/what/if the God Hand will take an active role and emerge from the shadows.

That's the $64 million question... it would be interesting if they did reveal themselves fully, with the Apostles already "unleashing their evil," a fellow like Void suddenly doesn't seem so out of place (and it's fun to imagine housewives with babies happily strolling with him in the park, asking his sage advice =). But then, Griffith is still wearing his makeup in public, which leads to an even more exciting prospect to me; will the other God Hand members be able to take on human guises of their own? Is royal vizier Void already waiting in the throne room to advise the new King? :void:

(http://allglorytothehypnoblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/jafar.jpg)

I'm unsure those unicorns would make good plow horses, and I doubt the farmers will be able to convince the zombies and dragons to be harnessed :carcus:

You know what I mean though, these creatures will create some havoc, but they're not necessarily going to lay waste to world. It may function, for a while anyway, like any depiction of a fairy tale world.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: m on September 28, 2009, 06:11:59 PM
(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/griff-notevil34animated.gif)

It's the first time I've seen this emoticon and I like it a lot. Personally, I think it looks much better than the version available right now; it's more polished. Great job!!!

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 28, 2009, 06:16:17 PM
Thanks, Wally's been working overtime to get it just right. Anyway, back on topic...

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/gutsarm.jpg)

Anybody else think that when we next see Guts he might be flexing his metal arm like Arnold in T2? :guts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mStmiGS43jQ
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Chaos on September 28, 2009, 08:07:48 PM
I gotta say, the idea of Guts Flexing some metal sounds marvelous.  :guts:

Thinking about it though, maybe that image is suggesting he's gotta "gear up" again, implying maybe the journey to elf hell (ehm. Helm) isn't going so smoothly. Any thoughts? (my apologies if I missed anyone's comments on this matter already)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 28, 2009, 08:23:50 PM
Furthermore, why is the merging of the worlds reduced to a "price" Griffith had to pay for Falconia, when it's an event of a much bigger magnitude?
For the rest of the world and the story, absolutely. But for Griffith, his kingdom was his dream. Merging the worlds was a stepping stone to get there, for better (unlikely) or for worse (much more likely). That's all I'm saying.

maybe that image is suggesting he's gotta "gear up" again, implying maybe the journey to elf hell (ehm. Helm) isn't going so smoothly. Any thoughts? (my apologies if I missed anyone's comments on this matter already)
I really don't think that's the case. Look at the shimmering effect coming off the arm in the top right. This is the first panel we've seen of Guts after the wave that washed over everyone in ep 305. Since then, we've all been wondering what the consequence would be. But it actually makes some sense that he'll begin to have sensations in it, or even develop the ability to move it. "Man I gotta get some upgrades!" doesn't fit as well, to me.

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Chaos on September 28, 2009, 08:31:29 PM
I really don't think that's the case. Look at the shimmering effect coming off the arm in the top right. This is the first panel we've seen of Guts after the wave that washed over everyone in ep 305. Since then, we've all been wondering what the consequence would be. But it actually makes some sense that he'll begin to have sensations in it, or even develop the ability to move it. "Man I gotta get some upgrades!" doesn't fit as well, to me.



Oh, I'm not arguing that. I'm hopeful that's the case, since it does make sense. I was just thinking maybe something was coming up that would result in him having to use the arm (along with every other weapon at his disposal). With the appearance of all these mythical creatures, I don't see that being a far fetched thought that some monster appears on their journey. And even if he can't "feel" with the arm (which I sincerely hope is not the case, because, let's be serious, that'd be f**king sweet), he still might have to put it back on to do what he does best  :chomp:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Black_Devil on September 28, 2009, 08:39:56 PM
We don't know the details of how the capital city of his empire was built, you said so yourself. But presumably magic and astral creatures were not uncommon during Gaiseric's time, so who's to say no supernatural elements were involved at all? And why is the supernatural itself automatically assumed to be a bad thing? Furthermore, why is the merging of the worlds reduced to a "price" Griffith had to pay for Falconia, when it's an event of a much bigger magnitude?


I'm just going off the presumption that he built it without magic to try and address how Walter was probing for thoughts, seeing as how he didn't want to go into the speculative domain regarding the how.

But as far as the supernatural itself thing though, I'm not saying its bad, I'm just saying it'd be more remarkable if Gaiseric's empire was built without supernatural elements, whereas Griffith's kingdom was basically laid out before him after the sacrifice and everything, it's just the thought of it being something Gaiseric achieved on his own, though there's no way to verify if that was indeed the case, or how his empire fit into the plans at that time. Hopefully I managed to word my post better instead of fumbling it up :X.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 28, 2009, 09:08:50 PM
Here's a pertinent thought, Falconia is obviously quite humongous from the wide shots we've seen, and I doubt all those present will be enough to fill it, or even come close. So, perhaps all the supernatural oogie boogies running around out there will serve as the ultimate motivation for people, the world over, to seek refuge within its walls and Griffith's dominion.

Yeah, I remember posting about it some months ago. They'll definitely need to bring in more people, one way or another.

Then again, despite obvious the problems "fantasia" presents, I don't think we should go too far in assuming it's going to be so untenable for humans in the rest of the world.

I agree actually. It's going to suck, people are going to die, all that. But those who survive might find advantages too. A resurgence of magic, for one thing. It could simply be a matter of getting used again to the old style of life. Different rules to respect. Use some bays to keep the trolls away, that sort of stuff. Now of course, this is all ignoring the presence of the God Hand. They're the real threat. People have been talking about the Age of Darkness ever since the worlds merged, but it doesn't seem too dark yet to me. I say, let's wait and see what they're cooking up.

Despite all I've said, I think there's probably still more to come that will change the circumstances in the world. Namely, how/what/if the God Hand will take an active role and emerge from the shadows.

Why go through all that trouble if not to get to business? :idea:

Thinking about it though, maybe that image is suggesting he's gotta "gear up" again, implying maybe the journey to elf hell (ehm. Helm) isn't going so smoothly. Any thoughts?

The sound effect in the preview is that of a metallic "clicking" sound. Make of that what you will. Also worth noting is that in episode 305 he had bandages covering the artificial arm, but in the preview they've been removed.

For the rest of the world and the story, absolutely. But for Griffith, his kingdom was his dream. Merging the worlds was a stepping stone to get there, for better (unlikely) or for worse (much more likely). That's all I'm saying.

Of course, but it was his dream when he was human. It was his ultimate goal then. These days he's part of a group (God Hand), and while I'm sure he was very happy with the city and accompanying castle, I don't think it's the end of his ambition anymore.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 28, 2009, 10:13:24 PM
Every single reaction shot was very much a big  :schnoz: for everybody this episode. Makes me wonder just how the likes of Silat, the Tapasa and Daiba (known as the enemies to Griffith, of course) shall survive being left out of this new kingdom, how could they defend themselves from such foul [and powerful] beasts? Daiba could just fly away and use his magic, sure, but there's also the fact that he could become overwhelmed by all of this.

Quote from: 宮本 グリフィス
But then, Griffith is still wearing his makeup in public, which leads to an even more exciting prospect to me; will the other God Hand members be able to take on human guises of their own? Is royal vizier Void already waiting in the throne room to advise the new King?

I'm hoping Void would take on a more important role than just advisor, but good point, can the other God Hand members actually take on human guises of their own now? Makes me also wonder just how much power they now have in the Mortal world.

Quote from: Aazealh

I agree actually. It's going to suck, people are going to die, all that. But those who survive might find advantages too. A resurgence of magic, for one thing. It could simply be a matter of getting used again to the old style of life. Different rules to respect. Use some bays to keep the trolls away, that sort of stuff. Now of course, this is all ignoring the presence of the God Hand. They're the real threat. People have been talking about the Age of Darkness ever since the worlds merged, but it doesn't seem too dark yet to me. I say, let's wait and see what they're cooking up.

Here's a question I'm sure you should know the answer to, but what do the humans know of the God Hand? I cannot recall them being specifically referred to by any human character. Are they a force that has never been spoken of (and never heard of) or a mere legend passed on from one generation to the next? Foss seemed to know a surprising amount regarding Griffith's kingdom, which leads me to think that maybe there has been rumours passed around about them, maybe? Of course, humanity's knowledge of these forces would be absolutely minimal, but I was just wondering if any of them could catch onto the fact that the God Hand are sorta the authority on the world (being led by the Idea, of course).


It's all running smoothly for Griffith now, and with an almost rapidly quick episode following, I cannot wait to see any interior shots of his new home. Bet it's cosy :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jaze1618 on September 28, 2009, 11:33:48 PM
Regarding the school of thought that Griffith sacrificed the current state and order in the world for his kingdom, Isn't it more accurate to lend credit to the Beherit apostle? Didn't he sacrifice the world in order to become the egg of the 'desired' or 'new world' or something along those lines? Isn't this the culmination of his sacrifice leading into the creation of the new world?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Riastrathe on September 28, 2009, 11:55:26 PM
Hmm. I noticed Guts doesn't have any scars on his fingers and if you zoom up real close on ep. 305 I still see some drawn scars, I think. So I don't know but maybe guts has actually gotten better now.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 29, 2009, 01:52:28 AM
Well if youre going to throw in the term sacrifice then yes, that's more accurate.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 29, 2009, 08:56:33 AM
Makes me wonder just how the likes of Silat, the Tapasa and Daiba (known as the enemies to Griffith, of course) shall survive being left out of this new kingdom, how could they defend themselves from such foul [and powerful] beasts?

The Bakiraka really aren't the people I would be worried about. They're as capable as it gets.

Here's a question I'm sure you should know the answer to, but what do the humans know of the God Hand? I cannot recall them being specifically referred to by any human character.

Flora was a human character, wasn't she? :slan:

But to answer your question, most people don't know about the God Hand's existence. And while sometimes a few can get glimpses of them, they remain ignorant (like the heretics in Albion, viewing Slan as a fire goddess).

Foss seemed to know a surprising amount regarding Griffith's kingdom, which leads me to think that maybe there has been rumours passed around about them, maybe?

I don't understand what you're saying here. Do you mean Foss knows about the tale of Gaiseric's old capital? Or do you mean he believed Griffith would return, after having had the collective dream of the Falcon of Light? In either case, I don't think he has any particular knowledge of the God Hand. Maybe there are old stories about them that are still around, but if so we haven't been exposed to them yet.

It's all running smoothly for Griffith now, and with an almost rapidly quick episode following, I cannot wait to see any interior shots of his new home. Bet it's cosy :griffnotevil:

You don't seem to have caught up to the fact the next episode appears to be about Guts.

Regarding the school of thought that Griffith sacrificed the current state and order in the world for his kingdom

That's not a school of thought. And that sentence is really badly worded. Griffith didn't "literally" sacrifice the state of the world, unlike what Black Devil said. He was the main agent to effect the merging of the worlds, that's all. Overdramatizing is useless.

Isn't it more accurate to lend credit to the Beherit apostle? Didn't he sacrifice the world in order to become the egg of the 'desired' or 'new world' or something along those lines?

To be exact, he sacrificed the world around him. Hence the brand created from fires Guts saw on the land at the time.

Isn't this the culmination of his sacrifice leading into the creation of the new world?

Not really. What the beherit-apostle wanted wasn't exactly for the astral and corporeal worlds to be merged. In many ways, it could be argued that his wish was granted when Femto was incarnated. On the other hand, why not? I actually like the idea that it could be viewed as the culmination of his wish.

Hmm. I noticed Guts doesn't have any scars on his fingers and if you zoom up real close on ep. 305 I still see some drawn scars, I think. So I don't know but maybe guts has actually gotten better now.

Yeah, I noticed this as well. It's definitely possible, but Miura could have also just not drawn the scars in that panel. We'll see.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jaze1618 on September 29, 2009, 01:51:39 PM

To be exact, he sacrificed the world around him. Hence the brand created from fires Guts saw on the land at the time.


Yes, this. Thank you for that distinction.


Not really. What the beherit-apostle wanted wasn't exactly for the astral and corporeal worlds to be merged. In many ways, it could be argued that his wish was granted when Femto was incarnated. On the other hand, why not? I actually like the idea that it could be viewed as the culmination of his wish.


Yes I was rather excited by the idea as well.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Henry Spencer on September 29, 2009, 05:41:10 PM
The Bakiraka really aren't the people I would be worried about. They're as capable as it gets.

True, but regardless, I hope they survive. Wonder where the remaining Kushan will run to and if they will actually reform.

Flora was a human character, wasn't she? :slan:

To be honest, she slipped my mind.

But to answer your question, most people don't know about the God Hand's existence. And while sometimes a few can get glimpses of them, they remain ignorant (like the heretics in Albion, viewing Slan as a fire goddess).

Ah, figured as much. Seems like that ignorance may be their undoing, following Griffith's lead into the supposed haven they need during these turbulent times.

I don't understand what you're saying here. Do you mean Foss knows about the tale of Gaiseric's old capital? Or do you mean he believed Griffith would return, after having had the collective dream of the Falcon of Light? In either case, I don't think he has any particular knowledge of the God Hand. Maybe there are old stories about them that are still around, but if so we haven't been exposed to them yet.

Yeah, it was the former. I just was surprised that Foss seemed to know so much. Especially considering the other story floating around that was told by Charlotte seemed to be far from the real truth, I figured these aristocratic types to mess the stories up.

You don't seem to have caught up to the fact the next episode appears to be about Guts.

Ah, I caught onto that, just thought we may see the interior of Griffith's kingdom before moving on to Guts and co. Then again, Miura may want to leave that for later as a surprise.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on September 29, 2009, 07:12:16 PM
True, but regardless, I hope they survive.

Well like I said, I'm not worried.

Wonder where the remaining Kushan will run to and if they will actually reform.

If there are any Kushans left in Midland at all, you mean (other than those Griffith recruited). Assuming some are left, in my opinion it would only be in very small numbers and they would either flee or be massacred (or both).

Seems like that ignorance may be their undoing, following Griffith's lead into the supposed haven they need during these turbulent times.

It's not like the whole situation hasn't been meticulously planned long ago in order to manipulate everyone into doing what a superior power wants, though. Common people are completely helpless to have any meaningful impact on the world at this point, and their total ignorance of not only the God Hand but also how the world works can be both seen as a cause and a consequence for it.

Yeah, it was the former. I just was surprised that Foss seemed to know so much. Especially considering the other story floating around that was told by Charlotte seemed to be far from the real truth, I figured these aristocratic types to mess the stories up.

To know so much? He knows there is/was a legendary city buried under Wyndham. Like Charlotte, Judo and presumably every person with a little historical knowledge or who has sat around many a campfire to hear tales in his or her life. Also, I don't see how what Foss said contradicts what Charlotte said at all.

Then again, Miura may want to leave that for later as a surprise.

Yes. Besides, this episode was the perfect end for the arc, the chapter and this section of the story on Griffith's side. Hell, with some tweaks (Ok, heavy tweaks) it could even be an open ending to the very story itself.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Johnstantine on September 30, 2009, 04:05:35 PM
I really enjoyed this EPISODE.  Can't wait for my actual physical copy of it to come in!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on September 30, 2009, 04:59:54 PM
I really enjoyed this EPISODE.  Can't wait for my actual physical copy of it to come in!
Since I've had to correct yours and several other posts in this thread so far, let me repeat what's been reiterated many, many, many times on this forum.

More than in recent memory, the distinction between CHAPTER and EPISODE should now be clear. We are at the end of one CHAPTER, and the beginning of another. The Falconia CHAPTER has ended with EPISODE 307. That CHAPTER contained 72 episodes (236-307). The tentatively titled Elf Island CHAPTER is beginning with 308, along with a new ARC, a designation that thankfully no one ever seems to have a problem with...

So, by calling 307 a chapter, you're essentially saying that it's CHAPTER 307 of the Falconia CHAPTER. Which is wrong, not to mention stupid sounding.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Bekul on September 30, 2009, 06:52:09 PM
I've skimmed this long thread (enjoyable), but I don't think anyone has yet brought up the possibility that Falconia, as it currently stands, may currently be populated, or at least, not entirely empty. Which of course is mere speculation, but it's speculation I haven't seen brought up yet.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on September 30, 2009, 07:06:43 PM
I've skimmed this long thread (enjoyable), but I don't think anyone has yet brought up the possibility that Falconia, as it currently stands, may currently be populated, or at least, not entirely empty. Which of course is mere speculation, but it's speculation I haven't seen brought up yet.

I would like to speculate instead on the possibility that Griffith would rearrange the social class system.

Now as now, the laws of the world are replaced by the merging, and we don't know what Griffith plan to do after sittin on the throne.

Furthermore, the city is composed of several different structures, so I wonder who has to live in larger buildings and who have to live in ordinary house.

To me Falconia doesn't seem an ideal city like an heaven where everyone is equal, so I don't know how Griffith will handle this.

It would seem obvious and locigal that he would give massive buildings to the apostles, but I'm not sure about it.

I wonder if the greed of people and nobles will still continue to exists or despite different structures everyone will live better than before.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on September 30, 2009, 07:09:42 PM
Since I've had to correct yours and several other posts in this thread so far, let me repeat what's been reiterated many, many, many times on this forum.

More than in recent memory, the distinction between CHAPTER and EPISODE should now be clear. We are at the end of one CHAPTER, and the beginning of another. The Falconia CHAPTER has ended with EPISODE 307. That CHAPTER contained 72 episodes (236-307). The tentatively titled Elf Island CHAPTER is beginning with 308, along with a new ARC, a designation that thankfully no one ever seems to have a problem with...

So, by calling 307 a chapter, you're essentially saying that it's CHAPTER 307 of the Falconia CHAPTER. Which is wrong, not to mention stupid sounding.

Considering the unique juncture we're at between episodes 307 and 308, how do you know he wasn't talking about the actual chapter and corresponding volume release? :guts:

Just kidding, yeah guys, don't make us bite the bullet and make chapter a banned word on SK.net, it probably would be already if not for the aforementioned arc chapters, and I've already thought of a solution to that, so beware! In the meantime, I've made this humorous reminder ala the weekly readers (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/weekly.jpg) image macro. =)

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/episode.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on October 01, 2009, 01:29:41 AM
Jesus, Griff, is that from Salute Your Shorts?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on October 01, 2009, 01:45:45 AM
Excuse Me if the translation I read was off, But what I'm wondering is, how did they know what the name of his new capital was? I've reread the enitre seires about 10+ times, And don't remember any character saying Falconia. So, does that mean the legendary capital's name was Falconia?

I know That charlotte said, (I did A search, and couldn't Find anything about how people knew what the name of the capital was.) "Apparently the name of the city meant "Land in the middle of nations." So it received the name "Midland."" Was the city's name falconia? and does it mean Land in the middle of nations like she says?

Quote
Jesus, Griff, is that from Salute Your Shorts?
I remember that show, Loved Ug lee. (The guy in the picture, I think that was his name)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 01, 2009, 01:58:32 AM
I think you were just thinking about this one too hard. Falconia was named by the Pontiff in this episode, it's probably something he heard in a dream, him being so obsessed with Griffith and Falcon imagery and everything... And no, the only other time Falconia is mentioned is in the chapter/episode title page.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on October 01, 2009, 02:02:48 AM
I think you were just thinking about this one too hard. Falconia was named by the Pontiff in this episode, it's probably something he heard in a dream. And no, the only other time Falconia is mentioned is in the chapter/episode title page.
Mayhaps....  :troll: But I was trying to get all my facts straight before posting, the slightest little inconsistency Isn't really welcomed around these parts. even if it's just a poor choice of words, or thinking that people are smart enough to figure out what your getting at.  :ganishka: Was very VERY nervous about posting any speculation.  :magni:

I'll go with the dream Idea, since the name just coming to him is a weird one.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 01, 2009, 02:09:59 AM
Mayhaps....  :troll: But I was trying to get all my facts straight before posting, the slightest little inconsistency Isn't really welcomed around these parts. even if it's just a poor choice of words, or thinking that people are smart enough to figure out what your getting at.
Trust me, after you've read your 500th post across 10 years about Zodd being Guts father because they both have spiky hair, you'll get a little cranky too  :void:

Quote
I'll go with the dream Idea, since the name just coming to him is a weird one.
Not necessarily. Keep in mind the Pontiff is slightly bonkers, and is severely afflicted with a case of Griffith obsession. He was a sleepy, tired old man until his "rescue" by Mule and Sonia. It's pretty clear he was born and set on stage through Causality to serve this role.

That being the case, it's not difficult to see why such notions would occur to him, in a dream or otherwise.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on October 01, 2009, 02:42:13 AM
Jesus, Griff, is that from Salute Your Shorts?

It sure is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNT7uUXekjU :guts:

I'll go with the dream Idea, since the name just coming to him is a weird one.

Not necessarily weird, the Pontiff could have just simply coined the phrase there. Whether he thought or even heard of it before then is anyone's guess, but as presented it could have just been what "came to him" in the moment and so he christened it such.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Holyvampire21 on October 01, 2009, 04:16:55 AM
Trust me, after you've read your 500th post across 10 years about Zodd being Guts father because they both have spiky hair, you'll get a little cranky too  :void:
Not necessarily. Keep in mind the Pontiff is slightly bonkers, and is severely afflicted with a case of Griffith obsession. He was a sleepy, tired old man until his "rescue" by Mule and Sonia. It's pretty clear he was born and set on stage through Causality to serve this role.

That being the case, it's not difficult to see why such notions would occur to him, in a dream or otherwise.
Yes, I'm sure that would get irksome. Just a little Defensive After lurking about for so long. I read 4 or 5 pages of berserk A day as of late, and Have always wanted to have people to share discussions about it, with. But that said, I also know I grasp the story very well, and Would hate to have that come into question. so forgive me as I settle in around here.  :serpico:

Since most of everything and anything is in a sort of dreamlike state, (the kids in the forest of vol 22, as an example) I guess it's not out of bounds for a near death old man to come up with such a name. (I like the name, just not a normal one. if you know what I mean.) And since he is the pontiff, everyone there would accept his christening on the spot.

I will say this, (just to keep things going) I completely expect Rakshas to show up soon. I could be wrong, but from everything we've seen, I think he was there becuase the skull knight was expected to show up.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: KazigluBey on October 01, 2009, 05:03:34 AM
Considering the unique juncture we're at between episodes 307 and 308, how do you know he wasn't talking about the actual chapter and corresponding volume release? :guts:

Just kidding, yeah guys, don't make us bite the bullet and make chapter a banned word on SK.net, it probably would be already if not for the aforementioned arc chapters, and I've already thought of a solution to that, so beware! In the meantime, I've made this humorous reminder ala the weekly readers (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/weekly.jpg) image macro. =)

http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/episode.jpg (http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/episode.jpg)

It's Ug!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on October 01, 2009, 05:08:53 AM
I will say this, (just to keep things going) I completely expect Rakshas to show up soon. I could be wrong, but from everything we've seen, I think he was there becuase the skull knight was expected to show up.

Actually, I wonder about that. There already doesn't seem much room for him to do anything of significance now unless someone makes a move against Griffith, which is unlikely at this point (Who? Daiba, the Bakiraka, even for Skully it just seems futile right now). Anyway, if the next episode does transition to Guts and company, unless it bounces back quickly, we'll probably jump ahead in time when Falconia is a little more settled and it will be completely moot. Perhaps Rakshas appearance was as simple a matter as to show that he was there, and to do so without revealing his Apostle form at the same time as Irvine's, as Miura has obviously purposefully revealed Griffith's major Apostles' transformations one at a time.

Which just makes me even more curious about this reveal now. :rakshas:

It's Ug!

Except in this case it's going to be an "Ugh" whenever someone calls an episode a chapter. :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on October 01, 2009, 02:32:18 PM
It sure is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNT7uUXekjU :guts:

Ah, the memories. :void:

Not necessarily weird, the Pontiff could have just simply coined the phrase there. Whether he thought or even heard of it before then is anyone's guess, but as presented it could have just been what "came to him" in the moment and so he christened it such.

That's the way I read it. Just because we've known the chapter's name for several years doesn't mean the name existed in the world of Berserk before the Pontiff coined it.

"Damn you, old man! I was going to call it Femtonia..." :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Deathbringer on October 01, 2009, 04:07:35 PM
Don't know if this was discussed already but i'll throw it in regardless, did anyone recognized the regilious references that Miura brought with the Ganishka tree?

I can recognize Nordic reference to Yggdrasil and the Bodhi tree where Buddha reached nirvana but what was the last one? Some connection to Christianity?

And what was the point exactly? To make it as if the Ganishka tree fitted in several/every religion of the Berserk universe? Make it as universally enticing as possible, no?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 01, 2009, 04:11:43 PM
Don't know if this was discussed already but i'll throw it in regardless, did anyone recognized the regilious references that Miura brought with the Ganishka tree?
We discussed Yggdrasil as a possibility on three occasions in the ep 306 thread. And Aaz mentioned that several religions and cultures have some kind of a spirit tree of sorts.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 01, 2009, 06:29:25 PM
I've skimmed this long thread (enjoyable), but I don't think anyone has yet brought up the possibility that Falconia, as it currently stands, may currently be populated, or at least, not entirely empty.

That's probably because it's not very likely. What people would it be populated with?

I would like to speculate instead on the possibility that Griffith would rearrange the social class system.

Now as now, the laws of the world are replaced by the merging, and we don't know what Griffith plan to do after sittin on the throne.

Institute a democracy then immediately abdicate, of course! :schierke:

I wonder if the greed of people and nobles will still continue to exists or despite different structures everyone will live better than before.

I agree, it will be interesting to see. I can't imagine that everyone will be completely pleased.

I've reread the enitre seires about 10+ times, And don't remember any character saying Falconia.

The pontiff is the first character to utter it. Like Griff and Walter said, he might have come up with it on the spot or heard it in a prophetic dream. Or it might be written in some holy text. Doesn't really matter, and I don't think one option is more likely than the others. And of course it wasn't what Gaiseric's capital was called.

But that said, I also know I grasp the story very well, and Would hate to have that come into question. so forgive me as I settle in around here.  :serpico:

I mean no offense, but it sounds to me like those are just your own insecurities. Please don't blame them on us. If one grasps the story very well, no one will question that fact, and if somebody does, he or she will easily prove them wrong. Anyway, making mistakes is never a problem, what matters is one's attitude about it.

I can recognize Nordic reference to Yggdrasil and the Bodhi tree where Buddha reached nirvana but what was the last one? Some connection to Christianity?

It's not just limited to what you mention. The Bodhi tree originally comes from Hinduism, and in Europe or Russia there are many sacred trees in various mythologies (Norse of course but also Slavic or Finnish, etc.). Same in other parts of Asia and the Middle East, in Maya and Aztec cultures, and probably in Africa as well for all I know. It's a pretty universal element in myths all around the world. Anyway, concerning the "Western" reference in the episode, I would of course relate it to the Tree of Life of the Kabbalah. Self-evident if you ask me.

But in any case, remember that none of those exist in the world of Berserk, so don't think too hard about it.

And what was the point exactly? To make it as if the Ganishka tree fitted in several/every religion of the Berserk universe? Make it as universally enticing as possible, no?

The point is that it's present in myths, legends and tales all around the world, yes. Something rooted deep (see what I did here?) in mankind's collective consciousness. Making it a very strong element to connect the worlds together, perhaps even the strongest one? At this point it's hard to say. It would be quite the sight if people came from all over the world in pilgrimage to see the tree. They could even settle in Falconia afterwards. :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Griffith on October 01, 2009, 08:15:41 PM
What people would it be populated with?

(http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/freaks.jpg)

Here comes the welcoming committee! :ganishka:

The point is that it's present in myths, legends and tales all around the world, yes. Something rooted deep (see what I did here?) in mankind's collective consciousness. Making it a very strong element to connect the worlds together, perhaps even the strongest one? At this point it's hard to say. It would be quite the sight if people came from all over the world in pilgrimage to see the tree. They could even settle in Falconia afterwards. :slan:

By that same token, it's interesting that the Holy See's famous insignia is not present in the facade of the new city despite Griffith's affiliation with and validation through the Pontiff; all the symbols seem either representative of Griffith's new empire, hark back to the age of Gaiseric when the continent was united under one rule, or neutral otherwise. So the city itself has a universal appeal that could tap into everyone's collective history.

Utopia :griffnotevil: ...until after dark. :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 02, 2009, 07:28:58 AM
the Holy See's famous insignia is not present in the facade of the new city

But if we consider the 'Falcon of Light' prophecies beeing part of the Holy See's doctrin (which I'm not that sure about?), can't we say that Griffith himself is now part of the Holy See's symbolism? As the long awaited Savior! (Some kind of messianic view as compared to "our" religions.....)

Like a new "insignia" for people to worship and to follow! :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 02, 2009, 08:19:42 AM
But if we consider the 'Falcon of Light' prophecies beeing part of the Holy See's doctrin (which I'm not that sure about?)

You must be talking about the prophecy of the Falcon of Darkness. Said prophecy does not mention anything about a "Falcon of Light". And it is indeed present in the Holy See's scriptures. The Falcon of Light has a strong symbolism in the Holy See, but we currently do not know of any prophecies about it (which doesn't mean there might not be some anyway).

can't we say that Griffith himself is now part of the Holy See's symbolism? As the long awaited Savior! (Some kind of messianic view as compared to "our" religions.....)

He was already part of its symbolism before, however that doesn't address グリフィス's point, which is that despite being a prominent figure in that religion, his city, Falconia, does not really bear its mark.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 02, 2009, 11:06:26 AM
You must be talking about the prophecy of the Falcon of Darkness.
Exactly, thanks.

He was already part of its symbolism before, however that doesn't address グリフィス's point, which is that despite being a prominent figure in that religion, his city, Falconia, does not really bear its mark.
Right, what I meant is that the city itself has quite a lot of Falcon references, which in itself seems like a clear reference to the Holy See's aforementionned scriptures. To be even more precise, even if the mark we've been used to see is not clearly shown I don't have that "universal appeal" feeling that グリフィス did mention when looking at Falconia!
Furthermore for now we don't have any idea of what stand inside the city, so why not a "church" or a temple, who knows :???:?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 02, 2009, 11:24:23 AM
Right, what I meant is that the city itself has quite a lot of Falcon references, which in itself seems like a clear reference to the Holy See's aforementionned scriptures.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. Nothing in the story hints that falcons in general are a symbol of the Holy See. And nothing we've seen in Falconia so far is what I would call a "clear" reference to their scriptures, about which we know little to nothing anyway.

Furthermore for now we don't have any idea of what stand inside the city

Actually we do. Just look at this episode.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 02, 2009, 11:41:32 AM
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
OK, I guess it's just my feeling then.... :farnese: However, I always interpreted the insignia/mark we've seen used by followers of the Holy See as some representation of a symbolized Falcon...?

Actually we do. Just look at this episode.
Argh, I "re-read" the episode before my previous post, and just realizes after your post that we do! :schierke: And it's somehow inspired by Rome I guess (the Colosseum, St. Peter's Square). But no church/temple in view (for now), that's for sure!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 02, 2009, 12:07:50 PM
However, I always interpreted the insignia/mark we've seen used by followers of the Holy See as some representation of a symbolized Falcon...?

Of course it looks like a stylized falcon, especially to us, considering what we know. But that doesn't mean it's the only thing it symbolizes (in fact it isn't, as we've know for a very, very long time), and there's more to it than just the falcon part too. Furthermore, only that very specific symbol is used, we've never seen any actual falcons so far. In Falconia on the other hand, we have plenty of falcon statues and other esoteric symbols, but no sign of the Holy See's emblem.

Argh, I "re-read" the episode before my previous post, and just realizes after your post that we do! :schierke: And it's somehow inspired by Rome I guess (the Colosseum, St. Peter's Square). But no church/temple in view (for now), that's for sure!

Something tells me you didn't read the whole thread carefully. :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 02, 2009, 12:21:57 PM
Furthermore, only that very specific symbol is used, we've never seen any actual falcons so far.
Right, I must agree with that.... What is a bit misleading to me is that we don't know if that dream everybody had about a Falcon was part of the Holy See's religion, something that was awaited for a long time, or not. But with the little details we have about the Holy See's scriptures, I have to admit the Falcon symbolism can't be clearly associated with the Holy See.........

Something tells me you didn't read the whole thread carefully. :femto:
Well.... I tried to, but with all those colleagues passing behind my desk, and all those working people around here, it's not easy to read a thread peacefully at work!! :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 02, 2009, 12:25:19 PM
Regarding the Falcon symbols in Falconia, the main insignia above the gate to the city really looks familiar to me, though I do agree it's a bit of a stretch.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg)

When I first saw this, I thought hm, the arrangement of the wings at the bottom look a little familiar. They're curved a little unnaturally, unlike the others, which just look like outspread wings. These appear to be forming the double helix evident in the Holy See symbol, the Brand, and  :idea:

Well, that's just my take on it anyway  :void:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 02, 2009, 12:43:27 PM
What is a bit misleading to me is that we don't know if that dream everybody had about a Falcon was part of the Holy See's religion, something that was awaited for a long time, or not.

Nothing so far has suggested it was the case.

Regarding the Falcon symbols in Falconia, the main insignia above the gate to the city really looks familiar to me, though I do agree it's a bit of a stretch.

Neat observation, but a bit of a stretch, I have to agree.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 02, 2009, 12:46:13 PM
Another thing I noticed that hasn't really been discussed at length yet, the dome visible behind Falconia. There have been arguments about what it could be. But by raising the contrast around the dome, you can get a good idea.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-dome.jpg)   (http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-dome3.jpg)

This is the top of the dome. You can see the cloud shape around it is consistent with what you can see THROUGH the dome, meaning that it's likely a giant, translucent dome.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 02, 2009, 12:48:23 PM
Now that is what I call a brilliant observation! :guts:

This is the top of the dome. You can see the cloud shape around it is consistent with what you can see THROUGH the dome, meaning that it's likely a giant, translucent dome.

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/Case_closed.gif)
Case closed! :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 02, 2009, 01:04:13 PM
meaning that it's likely a giant, translucent dome
Yes, good find!!! :isidro:

but a bit of a stretch
A bit of a stretch, but I can see the double helix there!!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Jaze1618 on October 02, 2009, 01:12:15 PM
Regarding the Falcon symbols in Falconia, the main insignia above the gate to the city really looks familiar to me, though I do agree it's a bit of a stretch.

http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg (http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg)

When I first saw this, I thought hm, the arrangement of the wings at the bottom look a little familiar. They're curved a little unnaturally, unlike the others, which just look like outspread wings. These appear to be forming the double helix evident in the Holy See symbol, the Brand, and  :idea:

Well, that's just my take on it anyway  :void:


Notice also how the roots of the giant tree could also shoot deep down, into the shape of a double helix.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 02, 2009, 01:20:48 PM

Notice also how the roots of the giant tree could also shoot deep down, into the shape of a double helix.
Yeah, thats one of the first thoughts I had when I saw the two-page spread put together of that. But Im unsure if there will indeed be a connection. Could just be where Ganishka's legs were, afterall  :flora:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Skeleton on October 02, 2009, 04:13:08 PM
http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg

This may just be me being weird, but the first thing I thought of when I saw that was of the seraphim in Christianity.  Or more generally to the angelic hierarchy where the closer to the "top" you go, the more wings the angels have (angels and archangels having two, cherubim have four,  seraphim have six).  The seraphim, in Christianity, are described as an angel's face surrounded by six wings (six pairs, perhaps?  :serpico:) and are the top of the angel food chain, the closest ones to God.  I don't know though.  I'm just throwing the idea out there.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seraphim#Seraphim_in_Christianity
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 02, 2009, 04:14:52 PM
The seraphim, in Christianity, are described as an angel's face surrounded by six wings (six pairs, perhaps?  :serpico:) and are the top of the angel food chain, the closest ones to God.  I don't know though.  I'm just throwing the idea out there.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seraphim#Seraphim_in_Christianity
I'd say that makes much more sense than my theory.  :guts:  Visually and figuratively, I can see a parallel.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: RaffoBaffo on October 02, 2009, 09:41:09 PM
This may just be me being weird, but the first thing I thought of when I saw that was of the seraphim in Christianity.  Or more generally to the angelic hierarchy where the closer to the "top" you go, the more wings the angels have (angels and archangels having two, cherubim have four,  seraphim have six).  The seraphim, in Christianity, are described as an angel's face surrounded by six wings (six pairs, perhaps?  :serpico:) and are the top of the angel food chain, the closest ones to God.  I don't know though.  I'm just throwing the idea out there.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seraphim#Seraphim_in_Christianity

Lucifer was a Seraphim but unlike other Seraphim who had six wings, Lucifer was featured to have twelve wings.  :badbone:

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on October 03, 2009, 01:12:43 AM
Lucifer was a Seraphim but unlike other Seraphim who had six wings, Lucifer was featured to have twelve wings.  :badbone:

Well, there ya go. :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 03, 2009, 04:21:17 AM
I've read comments wondering what will happen with the former Kushans. I think with Falconia being the site of the merging and the appearance of the Gani-tree connecting with several world religions, the city could become the melting pot for all cultures. And maybe even beyond that -- a holy city, a mecca, ruled by a man people regard as a God. We could even be seeing the birth of a new religion here right before our eyes.

So many possibilities for the future... I can hardly wait.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on October 03, 2009, 04:46:08 AM
You know Walter when you put it that way, it also kinda reminded me of the Citadel in Mass Effect. Of course is not the same, but it sure has many different cultures and races. I do think with the Size of Falconia it will be a melting pot. Maybe we'll see some kind of pilgrimage by people far away just to witness it and they might end up staying.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 03, 2009, 04:58:52 AM
You know Walter when you put it that way, it also kinda reminded me of the Citadel in Mass Effect.
Hahaha I never expected to be discussing ME in the current episodes thread  :ganishka: But yeah, and the two cities could also be connected by their ... purpose.  :femto:

Quote
Maybe we'll see some kind of pilgrimage by people far away just to witness it and they might end up staying.
Yeah and they might seek it out for other reasons as well -- protection.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 07:08:04 AM
A bit of a stretch

But a neat observation nonetheless.

Lucifer was a Seraphim but unlike other Seraphim who had six wings, Lucifer was featured to have twelve wings.  :badbone:

I've never heard of this. What's your source?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on October 03, 2009, 08:32:04 AM
Now that is what I call a brilliant observation! :guts:

Yeah, indeed. Truly a good finding.

I've never heard of this. What's your source?

The only thing that comes in my mind is the Lucifer from Bastard!!, but I don't know how reliable as source it'd be.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 10:50:05 AM
I don't know how reliable as source it'd be.

Unreliable.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: RaffoBaffo on October 03, 2009, 11:02:28 AM
I've never heard of this. What's your source?
Italian Wiki,for example: http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerarchia_degli_angeli (http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerarchia_degli_angeli)

The only thing that comes in my mind is the Lucifer from Bastard!!, but I don't know how reliable as source it'd be.
Or Satan from Devilman:
(http://www.cjas.org/~bchow/gonagai/devilman/images/satan.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 11:12:28 AM
Italian Wiki,for example: http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerarchia_degli_angeli (http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerarchia_degli_angeli)

Sorry to say, but no source is cited for this particular information in that Wikipedia article... I'm curious to know where it is written in the Bible.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: RaffoBaffo on October 03, 2009, 11:55:58 AM
Sorry to say, but no source is cited for this particular information in that Wikipedia article... I'm curious to know where it is written in the Bible.
I don't know   :???:
I will do a research

EDIT:

Quote
Lucifer was the Creator's finest creation: the angel Samael, called Lucifer. It means "the bringer of light." Of all the angels he was the wisest, the most beautiful, the most poweful.Saving only the Creator, he is, perhaps, the most powerful being there is.
Quote
Samael is the "chief of Satans" (Deut. R. xi. 9; Jellinek, "B. H." i. 125), quite in the sense of "the prince of the devils" mentioned in Matt. ix. 34; but, on the other hand, he is "the great prince in heaven." (Pirḳe R. El. xiii., beginning), who rules over angels and powers (ib.; Martyrdom of Isaiah, ii. 2). As the incarnation of evil he is the celestial patron of the sinful empire of Rome, with which Edom and Esau are identified (Tan. on Gen. xxxii. 35; Jellinek, l.c. vi. 31, 109, etc.). He flies through the air like a bird (Targ. to Job xxviii. 7), and, while the ḥayyot and ofannim have only six wings, he has twelve, and commands a whole army of demons (Pirḳe R. El. xiii.). In so far as he is identified with the serpent ("J. Q. R." vi. 12), with carnal desire (Yeẓer ha-Ra'), and with the angel of death, all legends associated with Satan refer equally to him, while as a miscreant he is compared to Belial ( = "worthless"; see collection of material in Bousset, "Antichrist," pp. 99-101).
All these descriptions of Samael show that he was regarded simply as the principle of evil that brought upon Israel and Judah every misfortune that befell them. Even at the creation of the world he was Lucifer, who ever sought evil and who began his malignant activity with Adam. His opponent is Michael, who represents the beneficent principle, and who frequently comes into conflict with him (comp. Jew. Encyc. viii. 536 et seq.; Lucken, "Michael," pp. 22 et seq.).

Quote
In traditions concerning the rebellion of the angels in heaven (PdRE 13–14 (1852)), he is the leader of the rebel armies. Prior to his defeat he had 12 wings, and his place was higher than the ḥayyot ("holy heavenly creatures") and the seraphim. Several tasks are attributed to him: Samael is in charge of all the nations but has no power over Israel except on the Day of Atonement, when the scapegoat serves as bribe for him (ibid. 46).


This is all I've found
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: The Beast of Darkness on October 03, 2009, 12:57:38 PM
By looking at the insignia:
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg)

It reminded me the illustration on the cover of volume 18:
http://www.skullknight.net/encyclopedia/merchandise/manga/images/18high.jpg

Hope that we get the chance to see Griffith in this form, sooner or later!  :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 02:01:58 PM
This is all I've found

Ok, thanks anyway. This notion concerning Samael seems to stem from the Pirke deRabbi Eliezer then.

By looking at the insignia:

It reminded me the illustration on the cover of volume 18

I agree, the wing motif in general is reminiscent of that illustration.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: royoak on October 03, 2009, 05:53:02 PM
Quote
Lucifer was a but unlike other Seraphim who had six wings, Lucifer was featured to have twelve wings.  :badbone:

I've never heard of this. What's your source?

My interest in religion is rather rudimentary but perhaps I can shed a bit a light concerning that.

First of all, Lucifer was a Seraphim but has only six wings Cherub.
Sammael (jewish lore, Angel of death) has according to jewish legends 12 wings.
So, no definite source with name and date, only a quote:
"that great serpent with 12 wings that draws after him, in his fall, the solar system."

Sammael's etymology is "Venom of God". He's referred to as accuser, destroyer and seducer hence
he's also known as Satan. (One might argue that as well, since the Book of Enoch, the old Testament
and other sources, depict them as different beings (i.e. Satan=Sataniel))

Conclusion:
Lucifer =/= Satan (translation error, a misreading of Isaiah 14:12)
Lucifer: 6 4 wings (Seraphim Cherub)
Sammael (or Satan): 12 wings (source: jewish legends)

Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 06:20:19 PM
Nice post, royoak. Underlines how disputable many of those claims are. :slan:

(One might argue that as well, since the Book of Enoch, the old Testament and other sources, depict those as different beings (i.e. Satan=Sataniel))

Indeed.

First of all, Lucifer was a Seraphim but has only six wings.

But Ezekiel refers to him as a cherub.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: royoak on October 03, 2009, 06:30:24 PM
Quote
But Ezekiel refers to him as a cherub.
My bad, I mention the "Isaiah error" and make the same mistake. Lucifer is of course a cherub.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 03, 2009, 06:39:27 PM
Anyway, I think that's enough Biblical talk for now. We wouldn't want to get swamped down in thousand years old debates, would we? :SK: Especially since it's all about a hypothetic and pretty trivial connexion to a detail of Falconia's outer decoration.

The next episode is in less than a week. What are you guys expecting? Sea monsters? Skellig in sight? Guts healed? Go ahead and speculate. Anyone who predicts exactly what will happen wins a custom title.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: puella on October 03, 2009, 07:03:39 PM
The next episode is in less than a week. What are you guys expecting? Sea monsters? Skellig in sight? Guts healed?

What I keep wondering about is why they showed his arm in the preview page. :???:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: TheBranded1 on October 03, 2009, 07:56:10 PM
I say they see Skellig in sight, but in the midst of all this nice feeling of arrival, they encounter some kind of astral creature ( can't think of a specific one right now ) Also, that they might get some help from Skellig as they are being attacked.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 03, 2009, 08:17:26 PM
The next episode is in less than a week. What are you guys expecting? Sea monsters? Skellig in sight? Guts healed? Go ahead and speculate.
I've been wrong about this before but, given the monumental events that just occured at the center of the continent, I have a hunch the pacing will slow down for an episode or two, and that next episode will be more about character development aboard the ship in light of the effects of the merging. I.E. Guts' arm. We may even get our long-awaited answer of how/if it will affect magic users like Schierke.

What I keep wondering about is why they showed his arm in the preview page. :???:
I have a pretty good idea  :daiba:

I say they see Skellig in sight, but in the midst of all this nice feeling of arrival, they encounter some kind of astral creature ( can't think of a specific one right now ) Also, that they might get some help from Skellig as they are being attacked.
(http://skullknight.net/images/ocean-creatures.jpg)
These and more are all possibilities of what could be encountered on the ocean.

But I've been thinking of something similar to you, but different in a key way -- I've been thinking that Skellig could have some magical defenses that go haywire as a result of the merging. Massive waves blocking the way or something like that. Natural defenses, but enhanced by magic. Flora had Golems, afterall. Why not something similar or even more dramatic, for an island of magic creatures and magic users?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Slan_wings on October 03, 2009, 09:02:19 PM
 I hope to see some Farnese funny moments in the island full of elves and puck's descriptions are proven overexaggerated. I think its been too long since Farnese has been happily surprised.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: D-Scape on October 03, 2009, 10:31:34 PM
I believe there’ll be some astral-related changes out at sea. Maybe mermaids and other strange sea creatures will be seen swimming alongside the ship (I doubt they’ll encounter some hellish Leviathan this early on). Meanwhile a disturbed Schierke will try to explain the possible consequences of the apocalyptic events and everyone will go “OMGWTF”.
 
And I wouldn’t be surprised if this is the episode where someone shouts “Land O'hoy!”
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Mage on October 03, 2009, 10:35:56 PM
That alternate cover of vol 34 is gorgeous.  I would kill for a poster of that :zodd: (kind of reminds me of Cecil/Kain from Final Fantasy, by the way :schnoz: )
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dani on October 04, 2009, 01:30:48 AM
I'm thinking either they set foot on Skellig on the final panel (maybe a big reveal on the last panel?) or will held up by creatures or "defences" greeting them. This all intertwined with them discussing the effects of the merging.

I can't see anything major happening, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is a mention of some new possibility for the Guts arm thing and the whole magic users being affected issue.

To be honest, I just want to see them on Skellig. I think we won't be learning whether Casca will be healed for quite some time though (please, prove me wrong, make mention of this in the next EPISODE).

BTW, with previous preview panels in previous issues of YA, the pictures attached to the previews, did they ever hint or foreshadow what to come much? Obviously I don't think the next EPISODE notifications would spoil anything, but has anyone looked back on them to see if they meant anything in retrospect?
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 04, 2009, 01:42:44 AM
I'm thinking either they set foot on Skellig on the final panel (maybe a big reveal on the last panel?) or will held up by creatures or "defences" greeting them. This all intertwined with them discussing the effects of the merging.
Man, that's a lot of territory to cover in one episode!  :isidro:

Quote
BTW, with previous preview panels in previous issues of YA, the pictures attached to the previews, did they ever hint or foreshadow what to come much? Obviously I don't think the next EPISODE notifications would spoil anything, but has anyone looked back on them to see if they meant anything in retrospect?
It's episode, not chapter. Please read this post (click). (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg176409#msg176409) And the YA previews rarely say anything authoritative at all. The one we're discussing here is probably the most enigmatic one I can recall. One particularly embarrassing one circa vol 13 was written in English: "WHY HAS HE GOT BURNING WITH REVENGEFUL THOUGHT?!" These are either written by someone at YA or Miura's editor, but not the man himself.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dani on October 04, 2009, 01:50:42 AM
It's episode, not chapter. Please read this post (click). (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg176409#msg176409) And the YA previews rarely say anything authoritative at all. The one we're discussing here is probably the most enigmatic one I can recall. One particularly embarrassing one circa vol 13 was written in English: "WHY HAS HE GOT BURNING WITH REVENGEFUL THOUGHT?!" These are either written by someone at YA or Miura's editor, but not the man himself.

Thanks for clearing that up, I didn't think that the preview would have any hidden significance.

On a cheeky note, if the entire next EPISODE was just a montage of Guts company doing this;
(http://www.zweg.com/ico/facepalm.gif)
I would be quite amused.

"HE GOT BURNING", Reminds me of the Martian Successor opening title, "You Get To Burning" .
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 04, 2009, 01:56:01 AM
Thanks for clearing that up, I didn't think that the preview would have any hidden significance.
Well, don't get me wrong. Just because previous previews haven't been enlightening doesn't mean the one we see here isn't important. Anyway, the text here isn't as vital as the image. And as you may have already read in this thread, it could actually be showing that Guts will begin to have sensation in his prosthetic arm.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Xem on October 04, 2009, 05:29:37 AM
I think perhaps some people are reading a bit too much into the preview picture of Guts and his arm cannon. In my opinion, this was given merely as an indication that the story is being refocused onto Guts after this long Griffith/Ganishka debacle.

More than likely, the next episode will feature Guts. and Co. and probably show them finally arriving/seeing Elf Island.

Nothing more! If there's any twist, I imagine it'll be either the emergence of the Elf King or... something to do with Puck/Isidro...   :beast:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 04, 2009, 05:36:45 AM
I think perhaps some people are reading a bit too much into the preview picture of Guts and his arm cannon. In my opinion, this was given merely as an indication that the story is being refocused onto Guts after this long Griffith/Ganishka debacle.
While that could be, and I always appreciate an opposing viewpoint, I think you're underestimating the significance that the preview pic is a tight, focused picture of the prosthetic arm, with some special effects surrounding it in the upper right. If it was strictly intended to indicate a transitional change to Guts and co. it would probably be more effective as a picture of Guts face, not something enigmatic like this.

Furthermore, there's some basis for the theory it will become like another arm. In vol 33 it's reiterated that Guts thinks of it as a real arm despite its inorganic nature. That perception could make it a part of his astral body, which because of the merging, could make it part of his perceived body.

I admit that's a lot of maybes and could-bes, but I actually find the above theory more likely than the preview pic having nothing to do with the repercussions of the merging for Guts.

Quote
Nothing more! If there's any twist, I imagine it'll be either the emergence of the Elf King or... something to do with Puck/Isidro...   :beast:
You really think we'll see Hanafubuku within the first episode of the new chapter? We've waited nearly 8 years to see Elfhelm, I can wait a few more weeks/months for him to get a proper dramatic introduction.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 04, 2009, 08:18:56 AM
I believe there’ll be some astral-related changes out at sea. Maybe mermaids and other strange sea creatures will be seen swimming alongside the ship (I doubt they’ll encounter some hellish Leviathan this early on). Meanwhile a disturbed Schierke will try to explain the possible consequences of the apocalyptic events and everyone will go “OMGWTF”.
 
And I wouldn’t be surprised if this is the episode where someone shouts “Land O'hoy!”

Sounds good to me. I wouldn't outright deny the possibility of a hostile encounter though.

To be honest, I just want to see them on Skellig. I think we won't be learning whether Casca will be healed for quite some time though (please, prove me wrong, make mention of this in the next EPISODE).

Please not. Damn it people, savor the moment, don't be so impatient! It's taken us so long to get there, and now you want it rushed? Madness. This is the pivotal moment of the series. Not just the merging of the worlds and the apparition of Falconia, but the arrival at Elfhelm as well. Stop running around for a second and take some time to enjoy it.

BTW, with previous preview panels in previous issues of YA, the pictures attached to the previews, did they ever hint or foreshadow what to come much? Obviously I don't think the next EPISODE notifications would spoil anything, but has anyone looked back on them to see if they meant anything in retrospect?

There usually isn't any picture to illustrate the preview of the next episode. It's a rare occurrence. Whenever it happens though you can be sure it's related to what's going to happen. But not necessarily in an very meaningful way. As for YA's usual text previews, most of the time they're useless. Recently one announced Ganishka's flashback, and that's the most useful one I can remember in all the time I've been following Berserk. Other than that, they're typically infamous for being guesses that are as good as those of the readers. They were actually misleading a few times, saying stuff like "what will happen to Guts next?" when the next episode was actually about Griffith. Embarrassing.

One particularly embarrassing one circa vol 13 was written in English: "WHY HAS HE GOT BURNING WITH REVENGEFUL THOUGHT?!" These are either written by someone at YA or Miura's editor, but not the man himself.

Actually it's "Why has he got burned with revengeful thought ?" and those weren't previews, but sentences printed at the beginning of each episode during most of the Golden Age arc.

I admit that's a lot of maybes and could-bes, but I actually find the above theory more likely than the preview pic having nothing to do with the repercussions of the merging for Guts.

We'll see, but I wouldn't get carried away. Even if it has to do with the way Guts feels his artificial forearm, It's more likely to be subtle and subdued than anything else. And let's not forget about the sound effect either. It's a clicking noise. It could just be Guts rearming the cannon or putting the prosthesis on, maybe getting ready to come off the ship and/or to fight? Which, keep in mind, is not incompatible with him feeling something different with it, either right away or later on. Let's not limit ourselves here.

You really think we'll see Hanafubuku within the first episode of the new chapter?

Just a side note, but if we're going to refer to characters by their Japanese names, we should at least write it in a way that makes sense. In this case, Hanafubuku Ou. But really, I don't see the need to bother when "Elf King" or "King of the Flower Storm" would do the job wonderfully.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Marik on October 04, 2009, 11:05:26 AM
The next episode is in less than a week. What are you guys expecting? Sea monsters? Skellig in sight? Guts healed? Go ahead and speculate.

I think that while they are starting to see Skellig, the party start to think to each other(since the goal is near, and everyone will be questioning about the future). Then they feel some presence in the sea, and they'll see like D-scape said, some mermaids, that will be soon attacked by some sea monsters. So Schierke while trying a spell to protect the ship, some other power casts a barrier upon the ship in order to grant them a safe arrival to the shore of the Island. Once there everyone will notice a suggestive landscape and they will meet someone that was waiting for them(I think something like the Flora's awareness of them thanks SK). Here Guts will soon feels much better and several injuries will start to heal.

But I've been thinking of something similar to you, but different in a key way -- I've been thinking that Skellig could have some magical defenses that go haywire as a result of the merging. Massive waves blocking the way or something like that. Natural defenses, but enhanced by magic. Flora had Golems, afterall. Why not something similar or even more dramatic, for an island of magic creatures and magic users?

Good point. It could be quite possible.

Please not. Damn it people, savor the moment, don't be so impatient! It's taken us so long to get there, and now you want it rushed? Madness. This is the pivotal moment of the series. Not just the merging of the worlds and the apparition of Falconia, but the arrival at Elfhelm as well. Stop running around for a second and take some time to enjoy it.

Yes, I have to agree.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Doc on October 04, 2009, 04:02:23 PM
After hearing what Walter said, I'm inclined to agree. I think the next instalment will feature more interpersonal content rather than another epic revelation. Miura won't want to spoil us too much.  :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 05, 2009, 11:44:31 AM
Even if it has to do with the way Guts feels his artificial forearm, It's more likely to be subtle and subdued than anything else.

I had like to add that whatever may happen regarding Guts' arm due to the merging of the worlds may be cancelled if ever the worlds were to "un-merge"...?

So if Guts was able to feel his missing arm, or even more: move it like a real one, and then one day not anymore, wouldn't it feel weird? :???: To me it would.

Or maybe we are considering that the merging of the worlds is something definitive, that can't be turned back? I guess we won't know it for sure right now...
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 05, 2009, 01:01:31 PM
Or maybe we are considering that the merging of the worlds is something definitive, that can't be turned back? I guess we won't know it for sure right now...
Yeah, I think its pretty premature to be considering the effects of an "unmerging" when we dont even know the full effects of the merging. :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Dani on October 05, 2009, 04:11:28 PM
asmer does raise an interesting issue about whether or not the change is permanent. Although considering how it was created, it would probably take something as equally epic to undo and there's nothing like that in sight for now.

I liked the scenes showing the effects of the merging with ordinary folks going about their lives encountering all these strange, fantastic mythical beasts, it's weird to consider it all on a global scale, but that is what has happened. We have seen the entire globe of the Berserk world effected by the merging, so there isn't any country, mountain, town or city that wouldn't be affected.

When looking at this;

(http://skullknight.net/images/ocean-creatures.jpg)

This was created before the merging, so I don't think we'll see any less than these creatures very shortly, maybe through out the next few episodes, I wouldn't be surprised if we seen more than just these creatures. Also, I think that the picture is off a Water Sprite, more so than a mermaid. With Elf Island, a Water Sprite (a fairy essentially) makes more sense to me.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 05, 2009, 05:05:49 PM
So if Guts was able to feel his missing arm, or even more: move it like a real one, and then one day not anymore, wouldn't it feel weird?

I don't think it would be especially weird, no. It all depends on how it's done.

asmer does raise an interesting issue about whether or not the change is permanent. Although considering how it was created, it would probably take something as equally epic to undo and there's nothing like that in sight for now.

He didn't raise anything, this has already been discussed earlier. As it stands, it's unlikely there would be a complete, sudden separation. And don't forget there were already astral creatures in the material world before it merged with the astral world. But they had been disappearing, slowly and over many years. Hypothetically something similar could happen again.

When looking at this;

http://skullknight.net/images/ocean-creatures.jpg (http://skullknight.net/images/ocean-creatures.jpg)

This was created before the merging, so I don't think we'll see any less than these creatures very shortly, maybe through out the next few episodes, I wouldn't be surprised if we seen more than just these creatures.

You're making a critical mistake here. The world wasn't always as it used to be right before the merging. Long ago, astral creatures and magic in general were far more common. A time in which Flora lived, and from which her grimoires probably come from. Not to mention that those grimoires pertain to magic and to the astral world in the first place. It's what Schierke was actually talking about when we were shown that illustration. So there's no reason to think they are no longer relevant, especially since we've seen practically nothing of them. Similarly, it would be absurd to think that only the creatures shown in that panel will make an appearance.

Also, I think that the picture is off a Water Sprite, more so than a mermaid. With Elf Island, a Water Sprite (a fairy essentially) makes more sense to me.

That was a page in one of Flora's grimoires referring to the sea and how it is connected to the astral world. It was not specifically about Elfhelm. We're not even sure to actually see that particular creature (or the others shown in the book).
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 06, 2009, 06:58:06 AM
I hope they won't meet any big obstacle before reaching the land! We had the fight with the Pirates already, so why not a peaceful trip for once... :guts:

I like the aforementioned possibility that the preview hints that they may be packing their stuff.... maybe to finally land!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on October 06, 2009, 12:15:34 PM
I hope they won't meet any big obstacle before reaching the land! We had the fight with the Pirates already, so why not a peaceful trip for once... :guts:
Man, Asmer should get something taken away for being 100% wrong on this prediction  :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: asmer on October 06, 2009, 12:20:15 PM
Man, Asmer should get something taken away for being 100% wrong on this prediction  :ganishka:

Sounds fair to me...... :farnese:

But who would have guessed those pirates would be asking for more!!!!!! :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on October 23, 2009, 12:19:54 AM
Regarding the Falcon symbols in Falconia, the main insignia above the gate to the city really looks familiar to me, though I do agree it's a bit of a stretch.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-symbol.jpg)

When I first saw this, I thought hm, the arrangement of the wings at the bottom look a little familiar. They're curved a little unnaturally, unlike the others, which just look like outspread wings. These appear to be forming the double helix evident in the Holy See symbol, the Brand, and  :idea:

Well, that's just my take on it anyway  :void:

While reading episode 138, I noticed a similar motif adorning the walls where Mozgus is prostrating himself.

While these winged symbols look slightly different, the double helix theme is a bit more prominent in them, in my opinion. Also, while it's a little hard to tell from the scan I posted, the symbols have twelve wings, too.

EDIT: Clearer picture below.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: DrPepperPro on October 23, 2009, 01:06:00 AM
Cool beans.  Here's a clearer version:

(http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc145/DrPepperPro/0180102.png)

There's so many repeating motifs in that room, very nice to look at.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Rhombaad on October 23, 2009, 01:12:32 AM
Ah yes, much clearer. Thanks, DrPepperPro!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Oburi on October 23, 2009, 01:14:03 AM
Wow no shit. Nice find Rhombaad, and thanks for the pic Dr.PepperPro!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Aazealh on October 23, 2009, 07:30:49 AM
Good observation Rhombaad! Not exactly the same symbol, but definitely reminiscent. Now the question is, who put those symbols on the walls of Albion, and how long ago? :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on November 10, 2009, 04:14:19 PM
One of the symbols used in Falconia reminded me of something ... and I couldn't put my finger on it until now.

(http://ancientegypt.hypermart.net/lostsecrets/wingdisk.gif)
The Egyptian Winged Disk

And here's another, more ancient example: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/15932/15932-h/images/pg_150_f.png

It originally represented the protection of Horus, and could be seen over many entranceways in Egypt, which is how it's presented to us in Falconia -- above its entrance.

Quote
Horus was so pleased with him that he ordered Thoth to have a winged disk, with a serpent on each side of it, placed in every temple in Egypt in which he worshipped, so that it might act as a protector of the building, and drive away any and every fiend and devil that might wish to attack it. This is the reason why we find the winged disk, with a serpent on each side of it, above the doors of temples and religious buildings throughout the length and breadth of Egypt.
Of course, there's no serpent in the Falconia version...

Though it was originally meant to represent Horus, its usage has changed over time as various groups took it under their "wing," such as the Freemasons, so-called Illuminati, and Jehovah's Witnesses. These groups came to call it the "Sun of Righteousness." Which in some way, relates to the "true dawn" that Locus spoke of.

Many of these crackpot theories on its symbolism are collected here: http://www.seanet.com/~raines/disc.html

Quote
Russell apparently used the winged globe symbol to symbolize the coming New or Golden Age when righteousness would fill the earth and Paradise would be restored.
Quote
I have not been able to pin down to my own satisfaction exactly, or even roughly, what it meant other than perhaps a symbol of the coming Golden Age.
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: 01010111 on November 11, 2009, 05:36:17 PM
I was thinking the same thing when I read it, Walter!
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Truder on August 16, 2011, 02:16:22 AM
Wow, I learned a bunch from pages 11-13. I didn't know the Devil(satan/lucifer) had 12 wings :0
I think it would be a neat tid-bit if Miura put the 12-winged emblem knowing perfectly well what it meant. Ultimate Fantasy Novel indeed.

skimming through old threads is so much fun
The things you guys have said... lol!

EDIT: I just realized this makes more sense now:

(http://omisyth.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/fuckin-pwn-attack.jpg) :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 307
Post by: Walter on August 16, 2011, 05:37:57 AM
I wouldn't get too excited. It's really not that uncommon a motif. Just do a Google Image Search for "seraphim."