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Berserk => Current Episodes => Topic started by: Arles on April 08, 2014, 04:53:59 PM

Title: Episode 334
Post by: Arles on April 08, 2014, 04:53:59 PM
Title: 人の都 - Human city




Found this. http://oi59.tinypic.com/fbjejb.jpg (Link to camshot)

Not sure how legit it is. I can't read the kanji either.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Mangetsu on April 08, 2014, 05:07:41 PM
Found this. http://oi59.tinypic.com/fbjejb.jpg (Link to camshot)

Not sure how legit it is. I can't read the kanji either.

it looks legit, and it is possible too  :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 08, 2014, 05:24:39 PM
Found this. http://oi59.tinypic.com/fbjejb.jpg (Link to camshot)

Not sure how legit it is. I can't read the kanji either.

This is the best thing ever.  I love Miura.  I love Berserk.  My life is complete.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 08, 2014, 05:25:50 PM
Neat. Figured we'd see some of these older characters back in Falconia. Good to see them. And where there's Luca, there's Jerome, one of my favorite sub characters :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 08, 2014, 05:35:29 PM
That's ultra cool. Can't wait to see who else we might get to see in there.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 08, 2014, 05:36:55 PM
Well this is some interesting news indeed. Looks like it might be some of the first people Rickert will get to talk? I'll be glad to see them again!

And where there's Luca, there's Jerome, one of my favorite sub characters :carcus:

Yes! I was kinda hoping to see him again at some point, might get my wish. I really like the way this character was built.

That's ultra cool. Can't wait to see who else we might get to see in there.

Theresia?  :serpico:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Skeleton on April 08, 2014, 06:06:56 PM
Luca is my favorite minor character in Berserk.  I didn't think she'd appear in the story again.  It's great that we will get to see her. I hope she plays a respectable part in things to come.

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tama on April 08, 2014, 06:21:39 PM
Wow thats cool! I really hope we get to see Jill again too.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rhombaad on April 08, 2014, 06:44:56 PM
Awesome! I'm glad to see these characters again. It's been too long.

And where there's Luca, there's Jerome, one of my favorite sub characters :carcus:

He's one of mine, as well.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 08, 2014, 07:04:57 PM
Looks like it might be some of the first people Rickert will get to talk?

Seems so. She says she's in charge of whatever place she's pointing her thumb at. Maybe an inn or a refugee camp.

Theresia?  :serpico:

I almost made that joke. Almost.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 08, 2014, 07:15:23 PM
I almost made that joke. Almost.

Don't worry I made it for you.  :serpico:

haha well we never know. After all, Guts said that with the look she had, she's not ready to die yet. Maybe she'll try to wait for him there and get her revenge!  :???: (not being serious here of course)
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Oburi on April 08, 2014, 07:15:34 PM
Luca! Damn, that's awesome. I'm so excited to see what Falconia is like on the inside. :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 08, 2014, 07:24:51 PM
Well she doesn't look miserable from the picture, so I kinda hope that it's not gonna be a dump as Albion was. I don't think that'll be the case but at some point if a lot of people keep getting there it's a possibility imo.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: RaffoBaffo on April 08, 2014, 07:53:27 PM
Found this. http://oi59.tinypic.com/fbjejb.jpg (Link to camshot)

Not sure how legit it is. I can't read the kanji either.
"My name is Luka and I manage this tavern" or something like this.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 08, 2014, 08:15:03 PM
Well she doesn't look miserable from the picture, so I kinda hope that it's not gonna be a dump as Albion was. I don't think that'll be the case but at some point if a lot of people keep getting there it's a possibility imo.

Yes, the true dark age ushered in by the God Hand: inadequate housing!!  :schierke:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IncantatioN on April 08, 2014, 08:18:39 PM
^ haha.

Luca! I love her character and very excited to read the new episode. Thanks Arles and Raffo for the translation.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Arles on April 08, 2014, 08:37:42 PM
Here's the rest.
http://n2.upup.be/RalRxP0AEO(Be careful: NSFW ads next to the pictures)

I haven't watched the pics because I usually stay away from spoilers. From the thumbnails, they look awesome.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 08, 2014, 08:51:14 PM
Here's the rest.
http://n2.upup.be/RalRxP0AEO(Be careful: NSFW ads next to the pictures)

Falconia definitely has a Greco-Roman feel to it, it's interesting to see it more in detail. Brought back from the past! Rickert and the others are surprised to see Kushans in there. Jarif says that their medium (must be Sonia) noticed that many groups of trolls are attacking refugees from the East, so they are going out to rescue them. Rickert says "I'll meet Griffith..." while holding a scroll. In the bathhouse (which seems to be the establishment Luca is in charge of), Luca asks Erica where she's from, and Erica answers something about the mountains around the border being infested with trolls. The announcement at the end says Rickert and Griffith are to meet the following day.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 08, 2014, 09:00:25 PM
Yes, the true dark age ushered in by the God Hand: inadequate housing!!  :schierke:

haha not really what I had in mind. But that city can't stay beautiful forever. There MUST be a trap.  :mozgus:
to be honest I had more in mind what happened with Gaiseric's city. Don't get me wrong I don't think it'll turn out the same but something in the likes maybe. I think that has already been said in the spec section.

Falconia definitely has a Greco-Roman feel to it, it's interesting to see it more in detail. Brought back from the past! Rickert and the others are surprised to see Kushans in there. Jarif says that their medium (must be Sonia) noticed that many groups of trolls are attacking refugees from the East, so they are going out to rescue them. Rickert says "I'll meet Griffith..." while holding a scroll. In the bathhouse (which seems to be the establishment Luca is in charge of), Luca asks Erica where she's from, and Erica answers something about the mountains around the border being infested with trolls. The announcement at the end says Rickert and Griffith are to meet the following day.

thx Aaz!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IncantatioN on April 08, 2014, 09:01:05 PM
Thanks for that Aaz!

The announcement at the end says Rickert and Griffith are to meet the following day.

Wooooooooooooooo!!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Oburi on April 08, 2014, 09:05:59 PM
Wow. Its beautiful. Certainly has that Roman vibe too it. And hey look! Jarif! Another returning character I didn't think id ever see again.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 08, 2014, 09:44:46 PM
Here's the rest.

Thanks Arles. And for those who'd rather not browse through NSFW ads, I present: http://skullknight.net/images/334-preview1.jpg

Full ep should be out later this week.

Most interesting aspect to me was that there was nothing supernatural shown here. No apostles. No creatures (that part is obvious). Perhaps they live deeper inside, up that foreboding stairway. A segregated society? Also, in the upper-right of the third image, note the sky's hue. Could be that we're seeing a part of that mysterious dome that covers the risen area (seen in Ep 307). Another cool detail: Jarif's Falcon insignia on his Kushan helm.

Next ep: hope we go upstairs.

And hey look! Jarif! Another returning character I didn't think id ever see again.

You expected a named character that was introduced just a few volumes ago to vanish?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Devilwoman on April 08, 2014, 09:49:28 PM
 :isidro: Wow spoilers are out already. Thanks Arles!
This is really something.The whores from Albion are back. I wonder if they'll figure out they all know Casca and Guts. And I'm really curious about that scroll Rickert is holding. Great stuff but then again we'll have to wait another month for next episode :sad: .
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Oburi on April 08, 2014, 09:54:42 PM
You expected a named character that was introduced just a few volumes ago to vanish?

Felt longer.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tama on April 08, 2014, 10:34:57 PM
Thanks Arles. And for those who'd rather not browse through NSFW ads, I present: http://skullknight.net/images/334-preview1.jpg

Thank you Walter for the better preview; I wasn't sure what to expect inside, but it looks amazing, it must have taken quite a while to draw all the details, I was hoping before that we would go back to guts after this coming episode, but now I really want to see Rickert to meet Griffith!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: TheBranded1 on April 09, 2014, 12:12:46 AM
ありがと! This is a nice gift by Miura to show past su characters involved with guts here on falconia. I'm also waiting for a Jill cameo . Thanks for uploading the pics guys.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 09, 2014, 12:24:25 AM
The situation seems far more idyllic than I had anticipated.  So far, everyone seems quite happy and oblivious to any of the dark goings-on that we know are underlying all of this.  Although without the whole episode that might be a bit presumptuous.

I'm curious to see how it all works with new refugees coming in and finding their place, like Luca being in charge of the bath house.  Maybe they're assigned to appropriate positions upon arrival, or they get to choose whatever they want.  I'm wondering if it will end up being a wish fulfillment sort of thing: not only is Falconia the "last safe haven for mankind" but everyone is given their heart's desire as well.  A city with something for everyone.  It would be fitting I think (but I'm just speculating wildly).  Griffith's line of bullshit for Rickert might be something along the lines of, "Our friends died for the dream, Rickert.  And now everyone's dreams can be made reality.  It was for the greater good!" :griffnotevil: 

Griffith's "castle" looks rightfully ominous in the background of the last page, impenetrable and towering over all. :femto:  I'll go out on a limb and say it seems like the city below will remain this perfect human playground while all the dirty work will happen behind the walls of that castle/palace/fortress.  I look forward to seeing how this all plays out regardless.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Patou244 on April 09, 2014, 01:29:46 AM
oh my goodness it's LUCA!  :ubik: I have been hoping I would see her again. She was one of my favorite aspects of the conviction arc. I loved her personality and while she was interacting with mentally regressed Casca I always wanted a scenario where Casca with her old personality could interact with Luca. I can't wait for this episode to officially come out now!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 09, 2014, 01:32:37 AM
I know one character who'd like to be in the bath house...  :isidro:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: NeaR on April 09, 2014, 01:37:23 AM
Oh my God, haha I can't believe it's actually happening. I'm tingling... Man if we see Jill again that'd be so amazing, she is my favorite minor character . :slan:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Dar Klink on April 09, 2014, 02:09:51 AM
So happy to see Luca again and I also hope we get to see Jerome again too. He was a badass.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Benin on April 09, 2014, 02:20:12 AM
Boners Ahoy!! Ah to see apostles mingling with humans at market stalls, taverns and the like. That would be joyous.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Evilnemesis on April 09, 2014, 04:06:50 AM
Ah it's Luca! She's my favourite non-main character! She has beauty, wits, heart and is always optimistic even if life has gave her lemons. But she makes a damn good lemonade out of it!

Anyhow... all seems well and good, but I do hope she lives through whatever happens in that pending meat grinder demonic city.


That second to last page... Luca's arm.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Griffith on April 09, 2014, 04:27:37 AM
I was actually taken with how normal it all looks for the most part. From the outside its almost science fiction, and our expectations for the inside beyond that, but recognizable monuments aside the streets and buildings just look like streets and buildings; a castle city not unlike its forebears. Basically, it looks like a real place, not just a fantasy. I like that, though I still wouldn't mind Griffith's throne room being out of the Wizard of Oz (how funny if it too is relatively normal, though the staircase makes me think not =).

Anyway, talking about Falconia is almost burying the lede now, Luca and friends return! This is an unexpected but welcome surprise. I'm glad they still have a part to play in the story, which is why I don't expect to see Jill unless she does too.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Deci on April 09, 2014, 09:40:56 AM
So exciting!

Anyway, talking about Falconia is almost burying the lede now, Luca and friends return! This is an unexpected but welcome surprise. I'm glad they still have a part to play in the story, which is why I don't expect to see Jill unless she does too.

Ya I'm wondering about that too, her role in the future. My first thought was how it's definitely a nice ally of Guts to have if/when he shows up.

Thinking more though, very interesting to have her in play now. I keep thinking about how she witnessed"Griffith" first appearing again in Albion, met Skull Knight and the Egg Apostle, thanks to them has some very rare insight into how/why this world and Griffith came to be. Anyone who meets Skull Knight seems to have a bigger role!  :badbone:

We'll see!  :SK:  :ubik: :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Buy Berserk! on April 09, 2014, 11:07:16 AM
Glorious return.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 09, 2014, 11:12:37 AM
Daiba's new life: infiltrated agent! :daiba:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 09, 2014, 12:33:28 PM
Our first sign of something sinister is on page 17. They hear a scream from the other  barn, and Erica asks what that was. Luca says: a monster.  :magni:

Likely apostles feasting on horse meat. I guess that's a nice temporary solution to the inherent problem.  :beast:

The idea of Daiba as a stable man using his power to wrangle horses is adorable .
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 09, 2014, 01:41:10 PM
Daiba's new life: infiltrated agent! :daiba:

 My reaction and Ganishka's :ganishka:


I really like the market place in page 8-9. Citizens sure aren't questioning the abundance of basically everything, when they had a pretty hard time to feed themself in the past. They totally embrassed this ideal. How those vegetables/fruits are produced/enhanced and do they contain something else ? I'm eager to know more about those giant (falcon wing form) cristals we saw back in episode 333, to learn their (defensive/enhancer/others) functions.


As Walter said, I'm also pretty surprised there's no apostle in the city. Maybe their all sitting at a giant round table, feasting on the flesh of those who broke the rules of Falconia :beast: They could also wait after nightfall to hunt outside the city without actually getting notice. After all, Falconia is the safest place and beyond the walls, anything can happen.

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 09, 2014, 02:45:04 PM
Just from scattershot transcription I'm doing, Raban gives Rickert a recommendation to a guild for his services as a mechanic/smith. The document is his invitation and audience to the palace. Raban then says Rickert should meet with Griffith tomorrow, to which Rickert replies hesitantly: "...o- of course."
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 09, 2014, 03:23:58 PM
Neat! Thank you all. Beautiful episode as expected. I really like the shot from above just before the market scene. It made me think of old picture of my town way back in the early 1900. Anyway, can't wait for a full translation to learn more!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 09, 2014, 05:42:57 PM
I was actually taken with how normal it all looks for the most part.

Fittingly, the episode title is "Human city" (similar to that of episode 245, although not exactly the same in Japanese).

I like that, though I still wouldn't mind Griffith's throne room being out of the Wizard of Oz (how funny if it too is relatively normal, though the staircase makes me think not =).

I'm quite certain it will not disappoint. I actually have little interest in Rickert meeting Griffith in comparison; I just want to see the overlord's palace and the accompanying throne room. :void:

Anyway, talking about Falconia is almost burying the lede now, Luca and friends return! This is an unexpected but welcome surprise.

Their return is definitely awesome, especially since it's been so long ago since we last saw them. I'm more surprised by Daiba's presence there though, that cunning old man. Looks like he's hiding his Garuda in that secluded barn, and the thing gets restless everytime horses arrive. "It'd calm down if somebody brought it fresh meat."

Anyway, there's one interesting comment from Rickert on page 9, where he's quick to put two and two together. He says of the city that it flourishes, and can't be compared to the old Wyndham. "It's like the legendary capital city that's been sleeping underground has been revived."
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Oburi on April 09, 2014, 07:16:27 PM
Amazing! The image of Griffith sitting in his throne room is going to be a reveal of such grandeur it could be one of those epic two page spreads that come to define the series and stick with you for a long time. I mean honestly, as far back as when Griffith first talked about his dream to Guts, about obtaining his own kingdom, standing tall against the sun with such confidence... I almost can't believe its finally being realized. This is the moment that so many fans have pictured happening for years and years. This is the moment where we first see Griffith with his dream fufilled.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Arvin on April 09, 2014, 10:39:24 PM
Wow that came way earlier than I thought! I was expecting to get the episode by the end of the month (didn't mark exact dates, just knew it was this month and assumed it would come out later). What a pleasant surprise.  :ubik:

Although I'm happy to finally get to see the inner works of the city, I also had the impression that much of the scenery and architecture was more of the same that we have seen in that episode which gave us our first glimpse of Falconia, episode 307 I think which was also the city's namesake. It's amazing the level of detail that was put on that outside look, looking back, to the point it seemingly nailed down the look and vibe of each corner of this magnific city.

I guess I was also among the ones who was perhaps expecting a bit of something new when we get inside it, but it's not disappointing at all, and it's reasonable enough in the sense that something too mystique or otherwordly (even more than Falconia already is) could perhaps not be so much accepted or difficult to get used to initially by the population at large. Much of the world is already like that right now and what people would seemingly desire after the merging with the astral world, would be a place with enough familiarity to what they used to live and where they could get much of their routines back. Besides the safety this safe haven brings through Griffith's means, so that people wouldn't be devoured by the first thing they heard about in story tales.

It also brings back to the point that Griffith (and the large forces at work) could still be pulling the strings to make most humans still ignorant about the workings of the astral world, besides now being all over it, with all the rescuing and readapting of people process that we are seeing. Sure lots or most people would perish in this new world but perhaps some groups could learn interesting things with other spiritual or not so spiritual-now beings.

That aside, I still certainly expect some exquisite and mystic sceneries from Miura. Elfhelm is a sure-bet, or perhaps even some other unshown  parts of Falconia itself could bring a similar vibe, like the Throne room like some people are expecting or whatever is behind the doors of the big stairway. Perhaps Falconia as we know is merely a human facade. I like the idea of an apostle city after crossing the doors of said stairway.

Anyway, it's good to see that slowly but surely the gears of the plot are moving. Now Rickert has supposedly a indication letter and a meeting with Griffith. More than suspicion that he already had he's showing signs of being uneasy with the whole situation which he's more up to.

It's great to have Berserk back.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Death May Die on April 09, 2014, 11:28:07 PM
I'm noticing Ganishka's giant tree in the sky. The world truly has become something else entirely after the merging.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ZODDOII on April 10, 2014, 03:46:39 AM
 It's a truly waiting so long~ Waiting so long~!! :'( :'( :'( :ubik: Thanks :'( :) :'( :'( :'(

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-JrpEVLQnSKc/U0Yaj3N9FgI/AAAAAAAAAA0/aliuICy30LM/s561/_S300868.jpg)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Wi9Le7ah2Rs/U0YdF6lNkoI/AAAAAAAAABA/1FuQZW9w8ys/s472/_S310869.jpg)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-NpYaKs9tXfE/U0YdbEiIDFI/AAAAAAAAABI/g-TAI6I3Sto/s472/_S330871%2520copy.jpg)

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Uriel on April 10, 2014, 04:28:26 AM
The tears... they're so warm upon my face...
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Truder on April 10, 2014, 06:21:25 AM
It's been so long. I liked Gigantomakhia.. but I hope Miura doesn't make more side projects any time soon.  :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Johnny Apples on April 10, 2014, 01:57:25 PM
Their return is definitely awesome, especially since it's been so long ago since we last saw them. 

Perhaps there is hope that we'll get to see Theresia too?   :judo:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Bramwell on April 10, 2014, 03:51:09 PM
Don't mean to be crude, but damn Miura is good a drawing tits. I am very interested to see what Griffiths grand plan is.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 10, 2014, 06:27:21 PM
It also brings back to the point that Griffith (and the large forces at work) could still be pulling the strings to make most humans still ignorant about the workings of the astral world, besides now being all over it, with all the rescuing and readapting of people process that we are seeing. Sure lots or most people would perish in this new world but perhaps some groups could learn interesting things with other spiritual or not so spiritual-now beings.

Not telling them anything about it is already enough. Especially since they have a "safe haven" to which everyone flocks instead of learning to survive, adapt and rediscover the old ways (which includes siding with some benevolent beings to protect themselves against the dangerous pests like trolls). That's one big way in which Falconia can already seem dark as it is right now: people are utterly dependent on it. I'm curious to know how much freedom the citizens have... Do they live where they're told, do what they're told? Can someone refuse to work? Are there beggars? It'll be interesting to learn more about that seemingly idyllic society.

Perhaps there is hope that we'll get to see Theresia too?   :judo:

While there's life there's hope. What would be the point though? Why do you even want to see her again?

Don't mean to be crude, but damn Miura is good a drawing tits.

That and everything else.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Irvine on April 10, 2014, 07:16:52 PM
I wonder...

Could it be that Dhaiva might be a serious threat to Griffith in the future? He is a sorcerer after all.  :daiba:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 10, 2014, 07:38:38 PM
I wonder...

Could it be that Dhaiva might be a serious threat to Griffith in the future? He is a sorcerer after all.  :daiba:

I like Daiba a lot (really, quite a lot) but uh... he's a second-class sorcerer next to someone like Schierke.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 10, 2014, 07:47:36 PM
I like Daiba a lot (really, quite a lot) but uh... he's a second-class sorcerer next to someone like Schierke.

I could see him being "usefull" at some point depending on what's going to happen (opening the doors  :serpico:). But like you said far from Schierke's level.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Arvin on April 11, 2014, 03:06:17 AM
Don't mean to be crude, but damn Miura is good a drawing tits. I am very interested to see what Griffiths grand plan is.

Haha, yes indeed, his are very realistic ones. Lawl, that sounds so wrong.  :ganishka:

I was also pleasantly surprised to see Luka and her group of (now assumed) ex-meretrice.
I won't lie, I also wish now to see cameos of Jill and, of course, Theresia as most of we do.  :slan:

Not telling them anything about it is already enough. Especially since they have a "safe haven" to which everyone flocks instead of learning to survive, adapt and rediscover the old ways (which includes siding with some benevolent beings to protect themselves against the dangerous pests like trolls). That's one big way in which Falconia can already seem dark as it is right now: people are utterly dependent on it. I'm curious to know how much freedom the citizens have... Do they live where they're told, do what they're told? Can someone refuse to work? Are there beggars? It'll be interesting to learn more about that seemingly idyllic society.

Agreed.

And all valid questions which I also hope to see adressed in the coming episodes. I actually haven't seen a translation of this episode so perhaps even some tidbits could have been mentioned at some panel. But given the abundance of crops, fields, fruits, vegetables and so on, it doesn't seem like beggars will have to beg much in order to have money for food. Actually I haven't noticed a single coin circulating from the people there gathering the available food. Makes you think if money has any meaning now and if so what kind of system will be or already is implanted.

If I had to venture a wild guess at this point, based on Griffith's earlier views of how rank and nobility shouldn't influence one's social status, the seeming absence of some kind of trade coin in this episode and also how Luka and her friends already have a suitable occupation and Rickert is on his way with the appointing letter; perhaps all that will show as a meritocracy close to Griffith's earlier ideals. But then there is the Holy See, the nobles, Foss... I guess you can't run from some kind of pre-installed hierarchy, although if that is the case I think they wouldn't be nearly as influent as they once were and they would have to prove their worth on a more consistent basis (Holy See aside). The nobles point of view would be a nice one to address all the socio-economic issues that Falconia could present.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on April 11, 2014, 10:18:37 AM
Great to see Luca and her sistas, again. She was one of my favourite minor characters to the point that part of me wishes that she had accompanied Guts & co on their quest at the expense of say... Farnese, who hasn't grown on me.

For all the talk of former characters popping up out of the woodwork, I hope (and trust) this won't become a regular event. I trust Miura enough that we won't be seeing anyone else appear for the sake of 'Ohai gaiz remember me?' It would make the Berserk world look small and not jive with the crapsack milieu that we've become accustomed to... which was BEFORE the place was swarming with astral monsters.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Jaze1618 on April 11, 2014, 02:34:23 PM
Don't forget that everything is within the flow of causality. There are always higher forces (or is it forces, hi-ya!) at play. :griffnotevil: I'm open to other characters showing up if I relax the constraints on what it necessarily means if they do so.

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 11, 2014, 02:45:03 PM
For all the talk of former characters popping up out of the woodwork, I hope (and trust) this won't become a regular event. I trust Miura enough that we won't be seeing anyone else appear for the sake of 'Ohai gaiz remember me?' It would make the Berserk world look small and not jive with the crapsack milieu that we've become accustomed to... which was BEFORE the place was swarming with astral monsters.
Unwarranted skepticism.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Sankari on April 11, 2014, 03:34:06 PM
I keep thinking one possibility is that Silat and Daiba might join forces with guts against griffith.
Maybe some of the apostles retook human form under Griffith's orders?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Griffith on April 11, 2014, 05:30:17 PM
I wonder...

Could it be that Dhaiva might be a serious threat to Griffith in the future? He is a sorcerer after all.
I like Daiba a lot (really, quite a lot) but uh... he's a second-class sorcerer next to someone like Schierke.

 :daiba: "Say that to my face."

I don't think we should overestimate (I doubt Griff is sweating him) or underestimate Daiba (whose resourcefulness continues to impress). If I remember correctly, Schierke wasn't unimpressed either, and it took quite an effort by the entire group to subdue him when he had his full mojo working (yes, he had Ganishka and his familiars backing him, but Schierke also calls on greater powers to augment her own, albeit in different ways). I think his bigger problem than his ability as a sorcerer, however quantifiable or comparable that is, is that he's a second class character, born to pose a challenge but ultimately lose to likes of Schierke and Guts. By the same token it's not his place to pose a meaningful threat to Griffith.

The fact that Daiba's living in Falconia is interesting because it either means Griffith is less aware of the goings on in his city/world than Ganishka was (a little counter-intuitive), or he really doesn't care. Though, even if Griffith wasn't threatened , I wouldn't put it past him to eliminate Daiba simply for being on the same plane, though perhaps that's a moot distinction in Fantasia (but it's not like everyone knows how to take advantage of it). One thing Daiba has over Ganishka in the potential threat department is free will, rather than an elaborate death wish.

For all the talk of former characters popping up out of the woodwork, I hope (and trust) this won't become a regular event. I trust Miura enough that we won't be seeing anyone else appear for the sake of 'Ohai gaiz remember me?' It would make the Berserk world look small and not jive with the crapsack milieu that we've become accustomed to... which was BEFORE the place was swarming with astral monsters.

I think that's more a fan issue; the immediate clamoring for eveyone's favorite supporting characters to make cameos for no reason because Luca has reemerged. That mentality kind of undermines what legitimate role she has to play. I only wonder if Miura has always wanted/intended to bring her back, or if needed a character like this to welcome them etc and realized he could just use her for it with the added potential for a lot more.

On the other hand, speaking of that, "We're getting the band back together!" mentality, it can sometimes be intuitive in unintended ways. After all, it's not necessarily right to assume the former supporting characters in various chapters or arcs wouldn't or shouldn't return as part of the bigger picture just because they're pigeonholed into specific parts of the story in our minds. It actually makes all the sense in the (new) world that they'd all be in Falconia now if they're in fact alive, and a case could be made that their introduction before was all building towards this, whether that was the original intent or not. We'll see.

It's probably so they can give Guts their energy when he and Schierke are forming the giant Genki Dama to destroy Griffith. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rhombaad on April 11, 2014, 05:49:53 PM
Don't mean to be crude, but damn Miura is good a drawing tits.

Speaking of which, I love the two panels with Luca holding Erica close to her, especially the second one. It's very cute.

For all the talk of former characters popping up out of the woodwork, I hope (and trust) this won't become a regular event. I trust Miura enough that we won't be seeing anyone else appear for the sake of 'Ohai gaiz remember me?' It would make the Berserk world look small and not jive with the crapsack milieu that we've become accustomed to... which was BEFORE the place was swarming with astral monsters.

I don't think you need to worry about Berserk becoming something generic or cliche because we're seeing some familiar faces in Falconia. Miura hasn't let us down yet, in terms of story (and I don't think he will).

As for Daiba, I'm hoping he and Silat will join up with Guts and company when they arrive. Of course, Miura could have other plans in store for him that we haven't even thought of yet. I love that he's keeping the garuda in the barn, by the way.

It's so nice having Berserk back.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Delta Phi on April 11, 2014, 06:07:59 PM
Ah, this is fantastic! Thanks for posting! I love the detail of the city. The statues along the city walls are so imposing. The grandiosity of the entire city is incomparable to anything else we've seen in the series. It's no wonder people flocked to Falconia (not including the horrors of the outside world). Everyone seems very happy and content…so far.

And I absolutely cannot wait for Rickert to meet with Griffith. It'll be the first time we've seen the new king since Falconia's appearance, right?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 11, 2014, 06:29:33 PM
I don't think we should overestimate (I doubt Griff is sweating him) or underestimate Daiba (whose resourcefulness continues to impress).

My reply was in context of Daiba being a "serious threat" to Griffith, which he's simply not. The real question is why is he hiding at all. Garuda aside, I see Daiba as being wary of Falconia--somewhat in the same way Silat was, but obviously for different reasons. Remember how skeptical he was when he saw humans and apostles working together? Well, now they have a city together, and it's the only place that's safe. Pretty terrifying, if you're in the know like he is.

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If I remember correctly, Schierke wasn't unimpressed either, and it took quite an effort by the entire group to subdue him when he had his full mojo working (yes, he had Ganishka and his familiars backing him)

Initially she was floored at the quickness of his casting, but upon realizing he was relying on pishacha, she almost seemed disappointed in him.  :schierke: Maybe that's just my memory of it though.

That being said, by his own admission, Daiba was reliant on Ganishka supplying him with pishacha. Things have changed, though. Daiba's talents in wrangling magical creatures could put him on a whole new level in a world now replete with them.

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By the same token it's not his place to pose a meaningful threat to Griffith.

Naturally. He's no Flora. Which was my point. Although the nature of that threat is still quite nebulous, even though it's been more than 10 years since her death. It's beyond the scope of this thread, but I've always tended to think it was her knowledge of the world, and Femto's role in it, not some magical feat that could damage him. Metaphorically speaking, she could see backstage while he was putting on a show.

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The fact that Daiba's living in Falconia is interesting because it either means Griffith is less aware of the goings on in his city/world than Ganishka was (a little counter-intuitive), or he really doesn't care.

There's ample room for either possibility, but I don't think either informs us of the limitations of Griffith's powers. Falconia is teeming with people, new arrivals everyday. Even if he's not aware of Daiba specifically, I'm sure he's considered the possibility of a magic user being among them.

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I only wonder if Miura has always wanted/intended to bring her back, or if needed a character like this to welcome them etc and realized he could just use her for it with the added potential for a lot more.

I think Miura always had an additional role for her to play. Among all the subcharacters, her story makes the most sense to transplant into Falconia. Though sure, there's room for other re-introductions as well. Rita, maybe?  :ganishka:

And I absolutely cannot wait for Rickert to meet with Griffith. It'll be the first time we've seen the new king since Falconia's appearance, right?

Of course. But we aren't totally sure that there's been a coronation yet. It is highly likely though--the chain of command and tasks for soldiers are already in place. I just hope we see a panel-flashback of the coronation, since it's such a long-awaited moment.  :griffnotevil:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Deci on April 11, 2014, 08:25:08 PM
I only wonder if Miura has always wanted/intended to bring her back, or if needed a character like this to welcome them etc and realized he could just use her for it with the added potential for a lot more.

Right after I saw that she was back I went back and flipped through the episodes where she was with Skull Knight and the Egg Apostle. Reading it with the knowledge that she returns and meets Rickert, of all people, it seemed to me that Miura had it planned all along. The parallels between the mock Eclipse/Eclipse are pretty remarkable.

......

Are we 100% sure that Rickert is safe to meet Griffith? I mean Rickert is surely no threat, but he does know about some skeletons in the King's closet, if that's something he cares about... not totally super great for his reputation.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 11, 2014, 09:06:02 PM

Are we 100% sure that Rickert is safe to meet Griffith? I mean Rickert is surely no threat, but he does know about some skeletons in the King's closet, if that's something he cares about... not totally super great for his reputation.
You should review what Griffith's parting words to Rickert were in volume 22.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Griffith on April 11, 2014, 09:58:23 PM
My reply was in context of Daiba being a "serious threat" to Griffith, which he's simply not.

I know, but calling him "second class" could give the impression he's some kind of phony, when we don't really know his place in the world among mortal magic users. For all we do know he's the second best alive now.

That being said, by his own admission, Daiba was reliant on Ganishka supplying him with pishacha. Things have changed, though. Daiba's talents in wrangling magical creatures could put him on a whole new level in a world now replete with them.
Well, and his knowledge of magical creatures and the astral world.

What's interesting about all that is that we now know the relationship between him an Ganishka and magic was likely circular in the sense that they're knowledge and power grew from one other. It's a question of the chicken or the egg (of the conqueror) with those two.

I think Miura always had an additional role for her to play. Among all the subcharacters, her story makes the most sense to transplant into Falconia.

Well, the last time we saw her she literally was sitting around waiting. :guts:

Of course. But we aren't totally sure that there's been a coronation yet. It is highly likely though--the chain of command and tasks for soldiers are already in place. I just hope we see a panel-flashback of the coronation, since it's such a long-awaited moment.  :griffnotevil:
Are we 100% sure that Rickert is safe to meet Griffith? I mean Rickert is surely no threat, but he does know about some skeletons in the King's closet, if that's something he cares about... not totally super great for his reputation.

"Not Griffith, dear Rickert... MAGIC EMPEROR GRIFFITH!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anp4lD6E5NU)

Are we 100% sure that Rickert is safe to meet Griffith? I mean Rickert is surely no threat, but he does know about some skeletons in the King's closet, if that's something he cares about... not totally super great for his reputation.
You should review what Griffith's parting words to Rickert were in volume 22.

Yeah, I doubt Griffith is going to be hostile now, even though Rickert didn't take him up on his offer. Of course, that was before Guts explained the situation to him, and we'll see if Rickert has the stones to bring that up. So, who knows, perhaps the door for Rickert to be a part of this dream has closed, "That's unfortunate. :griffnotevil:" It would be interesting for Rickert to be a voice of dissent to Griffith, to point out this isn't exactly the dream they chased years ago. Not even in a negative way, just point out this is so ludicrously beyond the human accomplishment they were striving for. I wouldn't expect it to phase Griffith of course (not human!), but there's certainly nobody else there in a position to offer that perspective. In any case, it's going to be a great barometer for where Griffith's mind is at. I certainly hope he'll drop the mask like he did at the Hill of Swords and speak freely with Rickert about these things, particularly how he'll address the Eclipse, instead of just saying how wonderful everything is blah blah blah the greater good blah blah the end justifies means blah while Rickert looks on in growing concern for his and Erica's lives if he doesn't take a knee for the new king.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Deci on April 12, 2014, 12:20:26 AM
You should review what Griffith's parting words to Rickert were in volume 22.

I considered it. Griffith doesn't mention anything about how he might respond (if at all) if Rickert doesn't join him, but most of all if Rickert is actively anti-Griffith. His wording "I'll have no cause to refuse you", isn't exactly super inviting in my opinion either. Well, there's really no undertone there at all I gather. So I wonder, if Rickert is just mega upset with him and starts being really loud and accusatory etc etc, I wonder, if Griffith might think it best to sweep the dissent under the rug somehow.

I imagine the meeting will be particularly emotional for Rickert if the past is brought up. Then again, it's entirely possible Rickert (or Griffith) will avoid the topic altogether. I'm very curious about the whole thing really. ^_^x
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 12, 2014, 01:06:19 AM
What's interesting about all that is that we now know the relationship between him an Ganishka and magic was likely circular in the sense that they're knowledge and power grew from one other. It's a question of the chicken or the egg (of the conqueror) with those two.

Well, we know who gave Ganishka the Beherit. Whether Daiba knew its true nature at that time or not is unknown. But I can't imagine it's coincidence that Daiba happened to be the one to deliver it, AND be someone who later exhibits deep knowledge of the astral world.

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Yeah, I doubt Griffith is going to be hostile now, even though Rickert didn't take him up on his offer. Of course, that was before Guts explained the situation to him, and we'll see if Rickert has the stones to bring that up.

I don't think Griffith expected Rickert to jump on Zodd right then. The way that scene in volume 22 plays out, Griffith's offer comes with the knowledge that Rickert would likely learn of what happened during the Eclipse.  But the offer stands.

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It would be interesting for Rickert to be a voice of dissent to Griffith, to point out this isn't exactly the dream they chased years ago. Not even in a negative way, just point out this is so ludicrously beyond the human accomplishment they were striving for. I wouldn't expect it to phase Griffith of course (not human!), but there's certainly nobody else there in a position to offer that perspective. In any case, it's going to be a great barometer for where Griffith's mind is at. I certainly hope he'll drop the mask like he did at the Hill of Swords and speak freely with Rickert about these things, particularly how he'll address the Eclipse, instead of just saying how wonderful everything is blah blah blah the greater good blah blah the end justifies means blah while Rickert looks on in growing concern for his and Erica's lives if he doesn't take a knee for the new king.

Indeed, it's a rare opportunity for readers to learn just a little bit more about Femto--how will he treat a subordinate in such a delicate situation as this? But I don't actually expect him to give Rickert any special treatment. He'll probably be his same old perfect self. Still, the possibilities are enticing.


I considered it. Griffith doesn't mention anything about how he might respond (if at all) if Rickert doesn't join him,
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His wording "I'll have no cause to refuse you", isn't exactly super inviting in my opinion either.

Really? This is bordering on a bad faith argument on your part. If Rickert chose to hate Griffith, then in his own words, Griffith's response would be: "so be it." Not: "I KILL U." Griffith goes out of his way to tell Rickert that he would still accept him if he wants to continue in his service--and given how he looks at Erica at the end of this episode, it's pretty much a foregone conclusion what his decision will be. It's unlikely Griffith did that so that when Rickert later appeared in front of him that he can turn him down and perhaps give him a wedgie.

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So I wonder, if Rickert is just mega upset with him and starts being really loud and accusatory etc etc, I wonder, if Griffith might think it best to sweep the dissent under the rug somehow.

Is that really the impression you get from Rickert in these past 2 episodes, as he considers the thought of confronting Griffith? Do you detect a boiling rage, just waiting to overflow? He's pensive, conflicted, possibly afraid. He doesn't give any indication that he's about to walk into that lion's den and spit on the throne. Remember that Rickert dealt with the deaths of his comrades differently than Guts. His relationship with Griffith is fundamentally different.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Jaze1618 on April 12, 2014, 01:10:36 AM

"Not Griffith, dear Rickert... MAGIC EMPEROR GRIFFITH!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anp4lD6E5NU)

YESSS!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: NeaR on April 12, 2014, 03:46:00 AM
I know, but calling him "second class" could give the impression he's some kind of phony, when we don't really know his place in world among mortal magic users. For all we do know he's the second best alive

I agree with Griffith. Although I like to think of Daiba as being more powerful than Schierke. Even if not in raw power, his age gives him an advantage in my opinion.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 12, 2014, 04:14:09 AM
I like to think of Daiba as being more powerful than Schierke.

On what basis? The versatility of Schierke's abilities (casting Blaze Wheel on Guts) is what gave the group the upper hand in combat. But I guess if it came to like ... A quick draw competition, Daiba would take home the gold. Actually though, he'd have to award the medal to the Kundalini--hence my point.

I can't believe my well-intentioned jab at Daiba has turned into a WHO WOULD WIN discussion. Debunking him in this way brings me great pains, since I really like the character, and Miura's portrayal of a different form of magic. But I guess I brought this on myself...

Before this gets deeper, my second-class comment comes from the differences in the two schools of magic. Daiba's usage of magic is superficial in that he's directing other creatures to do amazing feats. Schierke relies on similar contracts with astral beings/astral phenomena that she summons by diving into the astral world, but their powers are channeled through her. It's a much more comprehensive process. Consider how she found and utilized the Blaze Wheel--an entity subsisting off the fire innate to a war-torn area. Versus... a water snake. Daiba hasn't exhibited the kind of mastery of the elements Schierke has (her deducing Daiba's power, Ganishka's weakness). It's more like he's merely borrowing their powers, and how it works is inconsequential as long as he has a creature around. If anything, his prowess is a physical one. But that all sounds second-rate to me. *shrug*

As for who would win in a magic arm wrestling match, we'll never know because Daiba seems poised to be among the anti-Falconians.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: RanShi on April 12, 2014, 02:18:10 PM
Introducing us to an amazing Falconia, and then an amazing Elfhelm? The more awesome Falconia seems to me, the more it feels like Miura might just fuck us over when we get to Elfhelm.. and if they're both awesome, we're in for a real treat in the series this year  :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 12, 2014, 02:43:42 PM
Introducing us to an amazing Falconia, and then an amazing Elfhelm? The more awesome Falconia seems to me, the more it feels like Miura might just fuck us over when we get to Elfhelm.. and if they're both awesome, we're in for a real treat in the series this year  :ganishka:

I'm no physicist, but I'm fairly sure there's not a finite amount of awesome in the universe. It's not beholden to the law of conservation of mass and energy.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gurifisu on April 12, 2014, 04:51:28 PM
You know looking back at the early episodes it's amazing how much the art has improved and continues to improve.  I also liked how they denied that their were no scary monsters in the city when pages before were introduced to one.  It's an entrancing wrongness.  A city so perfect it can't possibly be right.

It was worth the wait, but god was the wait long.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: RanShi on April 12, 2014, 06:05:36 PM
Don't mean to be crude, but damn Miura is good a drawing tits. I am very interested to see what Griffiths grand plan is.

That comment.  :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on April 12, 2014, 09:07:14 PM
Unwarranted skepticism.

Just so. It was meant to be taken more as a critique of people wanting old characters to reappear.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: NeaR on April 12, 2014, 09:14:28 PM
Consider how she found and utilized the Blaze Wheel--an entity subsisting off the fire innate to a war-torn area. Versus... a water snake.

I don't think you give Daiba enough credit. He's controlling the Kundalini, a being whose power is strong enough to be called a God in polytheistic religion. That seems pretty impressive to me. Aside from the fact that Daiba is literally levitating almost every time we've seen him, he's had other feats that I think place him above Schierke. Daiba was able to identify the Berserker armor and had a general idea of what it did. He also made the artificial Beherit contraption, which makes me believe that he has a pretty large understanding of the astral world as well.  :daiba:

I agree that Daiba has shown to have a much more physical prowess as compared to Schierke's astral-like abilities, along with pretty much everything else you said. The two use very different types of magic, which Daiba even says himself. I think that Daiba's knowledge and ability could even become very helpful to Schierke if they ever joined together, but who knows.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 12, 2014, 09:44:37 PM
He's controlling the Kundalini, a being whose power is strong enough to be called a God in polytheistic religion.

Yet not nearly as powerful as any of the spirits Schierke's ever called upon. Furthermore, the Kundalini was given to him by Ganishka.

Aside from the fact that Daiba is literally levitating almost every time we've seen him, he's had other feats that I think place him above Schierke.

Like what feats? Daiba's skills were on the contrary rather limited compared to hers. Practically all of his tricks relied on the Kundalini or the Pishacha. Meanwhile, Schierke, a little girl, has more knowledge of the astral world than he does, and could see through his magic while he certainly couldn't see through hers. And that's while he had the advantage. Their encounter was completely rigged in his favor, yet he still lost. Furthermore, she's shown to be a lot more adaptable than he has been so far, and her skills exceed his as well. So Daiba can control horses? So can she, and she can mesmerize humans too. And transfer her spirit to animals. And create various wards. Transfer energy to other people. Detect Od. Interfere with the way the Berserk's armor works. And so on.

I'm not saying Daiba sucks, in fact I'm rather fond of the old man and of his tricks, but to say that his skills are superior to Schierke seems aberrant to me.

I agree that Daiba has shown to have a much more physical prowess as compared to Schierke's astral-like abilities, along with pretty much everything else you said.

It's not really more physical, just more limited.

The two use very different types of magic, which Daiba even says himself.

That's because he doesn't understand what she does. Whereas she understands what he does. The underlying principles are the same.

I think that Daiba's knowledge and ability could even become very helpful to Schierke if they ever joined together, but who knows.

That's not very likely to happen. The one area where he does have knowledge that surpasses hers though is when it comes to apostles, thanks to Ganishka. On that note, it'll be interesting to see what he can do without him.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: NeaR on April 12, 2014, 10:43:16 PM
Meanwhile, Schierke, a little girl, has more knowledge of the astral world than he does, and could see through his magic while he certainly couldn't see through hers. And that's while he had the advantage. Their encounter was completely rigged in his favor, yet he still lost. Furthermore, she's shown to be a lot more adaptable than he has been so far, and her skills exceed his as well.
To say Daiba didn't see through her magic is a bit unfair, though. Daiba had no idea Schierke was assisting Guts during the battle because Schierke was in astral form the entire time, so he couldn't see her, but Schierke could see everything. She wasn't in danger at all, she could completely concentrate on decoding Daiba's magic, whereas Daiba was battling and actually in danger. I think if Daiba actually saw Schierke calling upon the spirits he could figure out her magic.

I'm not saying Daiba sucks, in fact I'm rather fond of the old man and of his tricks, but to say that his skills are superior to Schierke seems aberrant to me.
I know. :P I don't think anyone in this thread meant to say that Daiba sucks.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Griffith on April 12, 2014, 11:49:51 PM
To say Daiba didn't see through her magic is a bit unfair, though. Daiba had no idea Schierke was assisting Guts during the battle because Schierke was in astral form the entire time, so he couldn't see her, but Schierke could see everything. She wasn't in danger at all, she could completely concentrate on decoding Daiba's magic, whereas Daiba was battling and actually in danger. I think if Daiba actually saw Schierke calling upon the spirits he could figure out her magic.

If he could have he likely would have though. Her magic was still being employed, and if he could see and understand the astral realm as deeply as she can, he would have sensed it and her presence as well. Since we're giving him the benefit of the doubt, I don't think Daiba would put himself at such a disadvantage if he could help it simply because he was being pressed (not concentrating or understanding the methods being employed against him would be far more dangerous). Also, to be fair, Schierke was in danger, on two fronts, physically and ethereally.  She was just as involved in that fight as Daiba, if not more. My point was simply that we don't know the extent of Daiba's abilities, but from what we've seen, and basic story logic (the same reason Guts is like the best swordsman EVER :guts:), I doubt he's a better magic user than Schierke. I just didn't like the comparison in the first place for the purposes of this episode and Daiba's role in Falconia.

To that point, if Rickert and Erica need to beat a quick retreat because he calls Griffith an asshole or something, they're going to need their horses, or something better... :daiba:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Bender on April 13, 2014, 04:03:41 AM
I have not received my YA yet but saw these on Yahoo Auctions.  looks like we get more than one, pretty cool.

(http://i.imgur.com/Rw4q2ew.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/4TObG9q.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on April 13, 2014, 06:06:50 AM
My my, it has been quite a bit of time since the last episode. As others have mentioned, its interesting how normal everything looks but I can't help but feel giddy knowing that there will be the inevitable "chow down" that happens .  :ubik:

I know it was mentioned, as a joke, that Daiba was here as an infiltrator but would if he actually was? Maybe he has some plan in trying to revive Ganishka?   :daiba:

Anyways, its good to see Berserk back up and running along with some familiar faces. I am wondering who else will be making a return. Also i wonder how many of the previous organizations/powers will be presented and how much "power" if at all, they still have.

Berserk makes me happy in the pants!  :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 13, 2014, 08:33:31 AM
To say Daiba didn't see through her magic is a bit unfair, though. Daiba had no idea Schierke was assisting Guts during the battle because Schierke was in astral form the entire time, so he couldn't see her, but Schierke could see everything.

He was perched up high and had an overview of everything. If he couldn't see her it's because he can't see astral bodies, and that's again a sign of how limited his skills are compared to Schierke. Anyway, all this talk of magic makes me eager to see some of the heavy hitters from Elfhelm. I have a feeling it's going to be volume 24 all over again.

To that point, if Rickert and Erica need to beat a quick retreat because he calls Griffith an asshole or something, they're going to need their horses, or something better... :daiba:

*Jumping out a castle window*
"He's crazy!"

(http://aazealh.net/Divers/Garuda.jpg)
"To the rescue... here I am!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pBDVarvFqYI#t=27)

I have not received my YA yet but saw these on Yahoo Auctions.  looks like we get more than one, pretty cool.

Yup. I like the Chich one, super cute.

I know it was mentioned, as a joke, that Daiba was here as an infiltrator but would if he actually was? Maybe he has some plan in trying to revive Ganishka?   :daiba:

Hehe, I don't think reviving Ganishka is a possibility, however I do believe he's there to observe how things go.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 13, 2014, 10:29:23 AM
Hi, everybody! What a better way to entering the forum that with the return of our favorite series? :guts:

About the episode... Nothing that hasn't been said already: gorgeous (gorgeous, gorgeous) art and big things in the horizon. I cannot wait to see the face to face between Griffith and Rickert.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Uriel on April 13, 2014, 02:13:59 PM
I have not received my YA yet but saw these on Yahoo Auctions.  looks like we get more than one, pretty cool.

(http://i.imgur.com/Rw4q2ew.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/4TObG9q.jpg)

Just picked up my copy from my local bookstore. They're really cool!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gurifisu on April 13, 2014, 03:17:37 PM
Is it possible that Daiba really is just a horse tender now?  Are even Griffith's enemies being molded to fit Griffith's dream?  I was wondering if anyone thought their minds were slowly being warped by Griffith's influence? 

Though it could just be that the rest of the world has become a fantastical hell, and this is the last safe place.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 13, 2014, 03:42:57 PM
Hi, everybody! What a better way to entering the forum that with the return of our favorite series? :guts:

Hi Tripas, welcome!

Is it possible that Daiba really is just a horse tender now?  Are even Griffith's enemies being molded to fit Griffith's dream?  I was wondering if anyone thought their minds were slowly being warped by Griffith's influence? 

Though it could just be that the rest of the world has become a fantastical hell, and this is the last safe place.

I don't think direct mind-control is at work, but between the prophetic dreams, Griffith's supernatural charisma, power and accomplishments, the combination of Falconia being some sort of idyllic city and the rest of the world teeming with monsters... There's not much of a choice.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gummyskull on April 13, 2014, 08:10:20 PM
What a beautiful return! Miura's drawings seem to be getting more and more detailed as the series progresses. I was blown away by the cityscapes.

Griffith is finally living his dream! I am really anxious to see how he rules over his kingdom. As many have said: right now Falconia seems too perfect. Maybe Rickert will find out about the inner workings once he meets Griffith.

Also bad news for anyone in the PDX area: the Beaverton Kinokuniya does not carry Young Animal.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 14, 2014, 12:48:08 PM
As mentioned on our latest podcast:  (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=14253)


(http://skullknight.net/images/empire1.jpg)
Old and busted

(http://skullknight.net/images/empire2.jpg)
New hotness

 :SK:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 14, 2014, 01:43:41 PM
Seeing this is extremely excting but feels also frightning to me mainly because we expected and waited for that moment for so long. We may not know how it's gonna be shown but we know relatively what's coming.

Even if the city was modified to Griffith's will, what kind of revelations on Gaiseric, do you expect (others than subtle references) ? Do you think Griffith could have knowingly kept some important elements (physical or not) related to Gaiseric/SK ?

Again, Miura is a evil meticulous man. Miura's capacity to distill information, little by little always amazed me.
Anyway, like Aaz said in the podcast, all things starts to converge nicely.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 14, 2014, 01:59:14 PM
Seeing this is extremely excting but feels also frightning to me mainly because we expected and waited for that moment for so long. We may not know how it's gonna be shown but we know relatively what's coming.

I presume you mean the city's destruction? It might not end that way. We don't know much about what happened 1000 years ago, but I can't imagine the circumstances were exactly like they are now. I think what's happening in the Berserk world now is unique in its history, because of just how special Griffith is. But... yeah, I imagine all those Falcon motifs will have to come down or be shattered by the end of the story somehow...  :guts:

Quote
Even if the city was modified to Griffith's will, what kind of revelations on Gaiseric, do you expect (others than subtle references) ? Do you think Griffith could have knowingly kept some important elements (physical or not) related to Gaiseric/SK ?

From the city itself? Nope. I'd guess most of that stuff was scrubbed away in favor of the Falcon imagery. Maybe there will be something in the Tower of Rebirth though...? But perhaps Skull Knight will now finally shed light on his story, now that his former city has emerged. He'll be drunk on elf wine, wallowing in sadness after the events in Volume 34, and in that moment of weakness, Guts will make him spill it all.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 14, 2014, 04:32:18 PM
I presume you mean the city's destruction? It might not end that way.
We don't know much about what happened 1000 years ago, but I can't imagine the circumstances were exactly like they are now. I think what's happening in the Berserk world now is unique in its history, because of just how special Griffith is.But... yeah, I imagine all those Falcon motifs will have to come down or be shattered by the end of the story somehow...  :guts:

That's exactly what i meant. I was wondering, even when we don't know yet how Gaiseric managed to unified different factions within one empire and then disappeared, even with the significant change of the world, the existence of Griffith, Guts being an anomaly on its own, can Falconia rise and fall could reveal/mirror some events which occured in the ancient city ? Again, I know the circumstances and people involved are extremely different (from what we know right now) but that idea is attractive.


From the city itself? Nope. I'd guess most of that stuff was scrubbed away in favor of the Falcon imagery. Maybe there will be something in the Tower of Rebirth though...? But perhaps Skull Knight will now finally shed light on his story, now that his former city has emerged.

And we can finally get that ineluctable Gaiseric >> Skullknight flashback :SK:
I really hope this part fulfill the equivalent of a entire volume.
 

He'll be drunk on elf wine, wallowing in sadness after the events in Volume 34, and in that moment of weakness, Guts will make him spill it all.

Please can someone draw this :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 14, 2014, 05:09:51 PM
can Falconia's rise and fall reveal/mirror some events which occured in the ancient city ? Again, I know the circumstances and people involved are extremely different (from what we know right now) but that idea is attractive.

I'm kind of torn on it, honestly. On the one hand, it would make sense as you say that events of that magnitude would mirror themselves (but causality is a spiral, not a circle). On the other hand, there's no precedent that says the God Hand were in complete control back then, as they are now. There likely wasn't even a God Hand at that time, or that was the birth of the first. And that's a big factor to consider.

Quote
And we can finally get that ineluctable Gaiseric >> Skullknight flashback :SK:
I really hope this part fulfill the equivalent of a entire volume.

If Ganishka got a half-episode, and Farnese and Serpico got 2 episodes, I think it's feasible to think that SK's will be at least as long  :badbone:. I'd be happy with a 2 or 3-part episode. That would be fair. I just hope it's more than a few pages. It's a culminating moment for the series, and something I've been dying to know since I started reading. After waiting so long, I would like it to be quite elaborate.
 
Quote
Please can someone draw this :ubik:

From old forum member Anchella back in 2000:

(http://skullknight.net/images/happyimage.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gummyskull on April 14, 2014, 05:20:01 PM
Please can someone draw this :ubik:
I'm on it.

EDIT: Skull Knight prefers box wine.  :badbone:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2hoigk4.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 14, 2014, 06:34:50 PM
I'm kind of torn on it, honestly. On the one hand, it would make sense as you say that events of that magnitude would mirror themselves (but causality is a spiral, not a circle).

Causality being a spiral remains without no doubt a essential notion and the main reason why i'm also not completely sold on this. Agreed about the God hand's presence. Although, i can't wait to see their own domain.

Btw, I really like what you said about Zodd being highly pleased to now have the possibility to challenge a variety of powerful creatures. Plus Dragon's wrestling sounds fun ! :zodd:

From old forum member Anchella back in 2000:

Thanks ! This drawing is cool/cute but it doesn't exactly convey my idea of SK being completely drunk and sad. Somehow, i'd like to see a melodramatic SK.

Like Aaz (said in the latest podcast), when I saw the last page, the way Rickert looks, staring (through a decent wooden window) at the elegant palace entrance, this ideal and pure design, i also found strongly reminiscent of a young Griffith and his ideal castle.

Gummyskull, i can't wait to see your drawing :serpico:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gurifisu on April 14, 2014, 06:53:47 PM
Quote
I'm kind of torn on it, honestly. On the one hand, it would make sense as you say that events of that magnitude would mirror themselves (but causality is a spiral, not a circle). On the other hand, there's no precedent that says the God Hand were in complete control back then, as they are now. There likely wasn't even a God Hand at that time, or that was the birth of the first. And that's a big factor to consider.

Well, the legends do say that 4-5(?) angels descended.  If the angels are indeed the Godhand then I have my doubts that they were all created on that day.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 14, 2014, 07:16:55 PM
Well, the legends do say that 4-5(?) angels descended.  If the angels are indeed the Godhand then I have my doubts that they were all created on that day.

yeah but the thing is, we don't know if the 4/5 angels were god hand or not. And considering the explanation in the eclipse on how every member of the godhand appears at 216 years. I don't think they were all created that day. We'd be missing a few members if that was the case.

I'm more on Walter's side with being probably the birth of the first one... or something in the likes.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 14, 2014, 07:30:16 PM
I'm on it.

EDIT: Skull Knight prefers box wine.  :badbone:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2hoigk4.jpg)

Awesome !  :ganishka:  :ganishka: :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 14, 2014, 08:15:57 PM
yeah but the thing is, we don't know if the 4/5 angels were god hand or not. And considering the explanation in the eclipse on how every member of the godhand appears at 216 years. I don't think they were all created that day. We'd be missing a few members if that was the case.

Missing all of them, actually.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IcePuck on April 14, 2014, 08:30:17 PM
Someone's probably mentioned this before, but Falconia draws some heavy inspiration from New Jerusalem, God's supercity in the book of revelation. There are similar numeorological motifs, the way the city appears, the tree of life, etc. Reading that fever dream of a book with Berserk in mind offers some pretty tantalizing ideas of what kind of things COULD happen, although nothing so obvious you could instantly draw a snappy theory from it: http://biblehub.com/niv/revelation/1.htm (not the first chapters so much, it gets better the further you read)

To give an idea, Satan brands people on the arm or forehead. God also brands people on the forehead. :ganishka: (and the bible ends with the promise that these people will live happily ever after in God's supercity)
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IronBerserk on April 14, 2014, 08:34:29 PM
I always wondered if Miura was going to tackle the theme of nations? We know that people from all over the world are coming to join Falconia being that it is the one and only safe haven from monsters. People are being ejected from their homes and lives to go live in the big city. Not everyone is going to like this...or at least I think they won't? What if Griffith is trying to control everyone by simply making everyone immigrate to his massive kingdom. Using the monsters as an excuse. Heck, he might even be controlling some of those monsters to attack villages and cities in order to force them to take refuge in Falconia. Falconia might simply be a very nice place that keeps the population blind and in check. People are happy and do not ask questions.

Guts and his crew might eventually become part of a rebel alliance brought together by a bunch of other nations who do not wish to leave their homes in order to live in some other far off land. A bunch of nations coming together in order to fight back the monsters and Griffith's all encompassing empire.

This to me seems possible because as we all know, Guts and his small gang cannot defeat Griffith as he is now. They will need an alliance of some sort. Elf Island being that first alliance, then moving on to other places in the world and rallying those who wish to fight for their independence, land, and country. Guts has become a leader and role model, and I could imagine him becoming that figurehead that everyone follows...kind of like how Griffith was back in the Golden Age Arc.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 14, 2014, 09:11:49 PM
Missing all of them, actually.

I meant that if there was 4 godhand at that time (which I'm not supporting that theory at all) we would have 4 members of the godhand that we were not introduced already. (which would be pointless)

but yes you're right indeed.

Edit : on further reading of your answer, you're saying exactly what I was trying to say. Stop reading your answers too fast Mr Hurley!  :serpico:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 14, 2014, 09:42:41 PM
Someone's probably mentioned this before, but Falconia draws some heavy inspiration from New Jerusalem, God's supercity in the book of revelation. There are similar numeorological motifs, the way the city appears, the tree of life, etc.

Do you have any specific examples you could cite, by any chance? I'm not big on numerology.

To give an idea, Satan brands people on the arm or forehead. God also brands people on the forehead.

Nothing of the sort has happened in Falconia so far though.

I always wondered if Miura was going to tackle the theme of nations? We know that people from all over the world are coming to join Falconia being that it is the one and only safe haven from monsters.

People from all over the country (Midland) as far as we know, not all over the world. Neighboring countries might also come around to some extent, but the entire world population? I think that'd be a bit much, even for Falconia.

What if Griffith is trying to control everyone by simply making everyone immigrate to his massive kingdom. Using the monsters as an excuse.

That certainly seems to be part of the plan, although Falconia is a massive city, not a kingdom. At this point I wonder if "Midland" really means anything anymore, or if it's all becoming a wilderness.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 14, 2014, 09:53:54 PM
I always wondered if Miura was going to tackle the theme of nations? We know that people from all over the world are coming to join Falconia being that it is the one and only safe haven from monsters. People are being ejected from their homes and lives to go live in the big city. Not everyone is going to like this...or at least I think they won't? What if Griffith is trying to control everyone by simply making everyone immigrate to his massive kingdom. Using the monsters as an excuse. Heck, he might even be controlling some of those monsters to attack villages and cities in order to force them to take refuge in Falconia. Falconia might simply be a very nice place that keeps the population blind and in check. People are happy and do not ask questions.

I don't think Griffith is controlling in any way what is happening in the world. However, this was ultimately his goal. You know: an utopia is an utopia because there is already the opposite. Humanity wanted that utopia, so Griffith has given it to them by unleashing the apocalypse on Earth. Ironic, don't you think? Besides, I'm almost sure that this is only the beggining of Griffith's kingdom. Falconia can be seen as the capital of his new world. Of course many people and nations won't like the idea of leaving their homes... But what if paradise knocks your door? :griffnotevil:

Guts and his crew might eventually become part of a rebel alliance brought together by a bunch of other nations who do not wish to leave their homes in order to live in some other far off land. A bunch of nations coming together in order to fight back the monsters and Griffith's all encompassing empire.

This to me seems possible because as we all know, Guts and his small gang cannot defeat Griffith as he is now. They will need an alliance of some sort. Elf Island being that first alliance, then moving on to other places in the world and rallying those who wish to fight for their independence, land, and country. Guts has become a leader and role model, and I could imagine him becoming that figurehead that everyone follows...kind of like how Griffith was back in the Golden Age Arc.

I can hardly imagine an alliance against Falconia in the sort term. Honestly, the whole concept is almost perfect: an idillic city where the social status has no mean anymore (or that is what it seems for now) and where people can be totally safe against the madness out there. But, what about the apostles? What about not training and teaching people about the world? Sure, people like Guts' party, Elfhelm, even Rickert... people who know Griffith's true nature will oppose to him. But I think we will have to wait long time before we see a Free Will Revolution.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IronBerserk on April 14, 2014, 10:42:07 PM
I don't think Griffith is controlling in any way what is happening in the world. However, this was ultimately his goal. You know: an utopia is an utopia because there is already the opposite. Humanity wanted that utopia, so Griffith has given it to them by unleashing the apocalypse on Earth. Ironic, don't you think? Besides, I'm almost sure that this is only the beggining of Griffith's kingdom. Falconia can be seen as the capital of his new world. Of course many people and nations won't like the idea of leaving their homes... But what if paradise knocks your door? :griffnotevil:

Oh yes definitely won't be easy to refuse a paradise looking Falconia. That's all part of the indoctrination Griffith is implementing. He ain't gonna make it easy :P

I can hardly imagine an alliance against Falconia in the sort term. Honestly, the whole concept is almost perfect: an idillic city where the social status has no mean anymore (or that is what it seems for now) and where people can be totally safe against the madness out there. But, what about the apostles? What about not training and teaching people about the world? Sure, people like Guts' party, Elfhelm, even Rickert... people who know Griffith's true nature will oppose to him. But I think we will have to wait long time before we see a Free Will Revolution.

Those who have not seen Griffith's actions of so called "miracles" will not easily be swayed to join Griffith's Falconia city. There is still a chance and possibility of Guts rallying those people. I'm also pretty sure that some others aren't as easily swayed to follow the popular consciousness. Remember the people who survived the second Eclipse because they didn't rely on Mozgus? Something similar might happen here. Refusing to rely on Griffith and fighting for their homes.

Quote
People from all over the country (Midland) as far as we know, not all over the world. Neighboring countries might also come around to some extent, but the entire world population? I think that'd be a bit much, even for Falconia.

Not sure but are the Kushan people part of the country/kingdom of Midland? If not then that's two countries in this world that we know of that are now in Falconia, not just Midland
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on April 14, 2014, 11:12:10 PM
I can't wait to see what dark secret lies at the heart of Falconia and how Griffith keeps his horde of demons in check during 'peacetime'. Will Rickert have a similar revelation to Silat when he witnessed Ganishka's artificial Beherit? Everything is building up to some ungodly horror behind the idyllic facade of Griffith's perfect world. Unless, it turns out to be something decidedly insidious than the kind of stuff Ganishka was into.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 15, 2014, 12:45:28 AM
I'm on it.

EDIT: Skull Knight prefers box wine.  :badbone:

Thanks so much for this  :ubik:

Well, the legends do say that 4-5(?) angels descended.  If the angels are indeed the Godhand then I have my doubts that they were all created on that day.

Yes, I'm quite familiar with the legend... But considering the possibility of a previous set of God Hand members opens a can of worms that doesn't align with anything else in the series. This whole debacle has been the source of countless debates on this forum over the past 15 years, and I'm familiar with all variations of it. Including the possibility that the Four Kings were protecting the city in vain as it was being destroyed and its inhabitants branded, which was interpreted differently by observers. A previous God Hand is among the hypotheses that makes the least sense to me.

But nothing I've read or even considered myself is truly convincing, and I'm sure that's by design. The legend is likely misleading (does Gaiseric/The Skull Knight really strike you as the kind of ruler who would live in decadence and work his people to death, as the legend says?), and we're missing critical components to complete the puzzle. Even with all the revelations since Volume 10, we're still in limbo on this one. And that likely won't change until SK talks.

Reading that fever dream of a book with Berserk in mind offers some pretty tantalizing ideas of what kind of things COULD happen,

But even if you can identify similar elements, Miura never borrows something whole cloth. He takes different elements of different things and stitches them together to support his own unique creations. It's a fool's errand to try and isolate one source and extrapolate the future from it.

I always wondered if Miura was going to tackle the theme of nations? We know that people from all over the world are coming to join Falconia being that it is the one and only safe haven from monsters. People are being ejected from their homes and lives to go live in the big city. Not everyone is going to like this...or at least I think they won't?

I don't think nations really matter anymore. The sudden appearance of dangerous magical creatures, with no realistic defenses against them, would disrupt all societies across the planet. That being said, I do foresee alternative civilizations cropping up (Silat would be a good leader, for example), and it will be interesting to see how they're able to survive in this new world. But people clinging to the heritage of their nations? I sincerely doubt it.

That certainly seems to be part of the plan, although Falconia is a massive city, not a kingdom. At this point I wonder if "Midland" really means anything anymore, or if it's all becoming a wilderness.

It's a different scenario, but I'm reminded of what Guts was thinking when he first heard of the Kushan invasion: "Midland is... disappearing?"

Not sure but are the Kushan people part of the country/kingdom of Midland? If not then that's two countries in this world that we know of that are now in Falconia, not just Midland

Kushans aren't Midlanders, no. The occupying force led by Ganishka came from the eastern lands, far beyond Midland's borders.  And only some remaining Kushan forces are living in Falconia, not the entire empire.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 15, 2014, 01:08:27 AM
"

Kushans aren't Midlanders, no. The occupying force led by Ganishka came from the eastern lands, far beyond Midland's borders.  And only some remaining Kushan forces are living in Falconia, not the entire empire.

speaking of the empire of the kushan, I wonder if we're gonna see more of that country/area. not that I see any purpose for the story but I'm curious about it now.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IronBerserk on April 15, 2014, 01:15:05 AM
Quote
Kushans aren't Midlanders, no. The occupying force led by Ganishka came from the eastern lands, far beyond Midland's borders.  And only some remaining Kushan forces are living in Falconia, not the entire empire.

Yeah perfect, that's what I thought. And I meant two countries in the sense that we know of two countries in the world of Berserk that have some of there people residing in Falconia, obviously not the entire population/empire of the Kushan is there...well not yet anyways :P Should be interesting to see in what kind of way people on the outside of Falconia try to survive. Falconia can't possibly accommodate everyone? The city would have to be massive. Eventual expansion is a possibility though. So many questions...CAN'T...HOLD...IN...THE...EXCITEMENT! :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 15, 2014, 01:30:31 AM
I meant two countries in the sense that we know of two countries in the world of Berserk that have some of there people residing in Falconia

You're forgetting that the Falconian landing party was a grab bag of people consisting of nearly every country on the continent, so it's pretty futile to start counting on your hands the number of countries represented inside the walls. Probably someone from everywhere. Remember, the army Griffith led to Wyndham consisted of his own forces, which were amassed from their campaign travels, in addition to Holy See Alliance troops gathered at Vritannis.

Quote
Falconia can't possibly accommodate everyone? The city would have to be massive.

Everyone? No. Only the chosen.  :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tama on April 15, 2014, 01:35:09 AM
I'm on it.

EDIT: Skull Knight prefers box wine.  :badbone:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2hoigk4.jpg)

Thats great XD
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IncantatioN on April 15, 2014, 02:03:31 AM
That's great, Gummyskull, especially a drunk Puck and the tissue box design.

Just picked up my YA issue, gonna read up and listen to the podcast after. Love the bonus insert.

I forgot to mention this before but if anyone would like me to pick up an extra copy of YA and ship it to them, I wouldn't mind helping out. Send me a PM and we can discuss logistics so we do not flood this thread.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IronBerserk on April 15, 2014, 02:06:51 AM
You're forgetting that the Falconian landing party was a grab bag of people consisting of nearly every country on the continent, so it's pretty futile to start counting on your hands the number of countries represented inside the walls. Probably someone from everywhere. Remember, the army Griffith led to Wyndham consisted of his own forces, which were amassed from their campaign travels, in addition to Holy See Alliance troops gathered at Vritannis.

Yes your right, thanks for reminding me. Though it would still be nice to know of other countries that aren't Midland and the Kushan Empire :P

Everyone? No. Only the chosen.  :femto:

 :magni:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 15, 2014, 02:29:50 AM
Yes your right, thanks for reminding me. Though it would still be nice to know of other countries that aren't Midland and the Kushan Empire :P

You mean other than all these countries that we've known about since volume 28 and beyond?

(http://skullknight.net/encyclopedia/glossary/images/holyseealliance.jpg)

You can read a little more on each in the Berserk Encyclopedia's Glossary (http://skullknight.net/encyclopedia/glossary/glossary.php). Or just flip to Episode 245.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IcePuck on April 15, 2014, 05:20:01 AM
Do you have any specific examples you could cite, by any chance? I'm not big on numerology.

Me neither. I haven't counted all the pillars in Falconia, or anything. :ganishka: (I doubt(/hope for the sake of Miura's sanity) that they would match anything)

The twelve gates in Falconia are the obvious one, which I feel safe to say is not a coincidence:

(http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091002164700/berserk/images/e/e3/Berserk_c307_007.jpg)

New Jerusalem likewise has 12 gates, although not placed in the same way. Back when I looked into it, I'm sure there was more, but I might have been grasping since I can't seem to think of anything now. I also thought the 12 wings on the orb thingy was significant, but then in the latest episode, the orb thingies only have 10 wings. Busted!

The old capital (Gaiseric's Wyndham/Jerusalem) is replaced by a new, similar but much more massive capital (Falconia/New Jerusalem).

The Ganishka tree is the tree of life, and double-trunked like described in the BOR. More than specifics, though, it's just the size, grandeur, and role of the place as refuge for the faithful.

Quote
Nothing of the sort has happened in Falconia so far though.

It's just eerily similar to the branding process of Berserk, and I figured the first part might correspond to Gaiseric's capital, 1000 years ago; hence the corpses with brands on their foreheads. (Satan is mentioned as getting sealed for 1000 years, so the timeline would make sense too)

I meant to say it's interesting to note the similarities and refrain from speculating, but goddammit, I can't resist: The people living in Falconia will eventually have to get branded, or banished from the city. Meanwhile, the other members of the godhand will actively seek to make the outside world as miserable a place as possible. (like the horsemen of the apocalypse, who are each given a portion of the earth to destroy)

But even if you can identify similar elements, Miura never borrows something whole cloth. He takes different elements of different things and stitches them together to support his own unique creations. It's a fool's errand to try and isolate one source and extrapolate the future from it.

I whole-heartedly agree. Spiritual beliefs are close to the heart of Berserk, and the biblical connections seem pretty thick at the moment, though, so I think there's a fair chance of actually being able to guess broad events correctly, or at least get an idea. Specifics, though, never.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gurifisu on April 15, 2014, 02:22:05 PM
Quote
yeah but the thing is, we don't know if the 4/5 angels were god hand or not. And considering the explanation in the eclipse on how every member of the godhand appears at 216 years. I don't think they were all created that day. We'd be missing a few members if that was the case.

Well, I'm assuming the godhand are either killed, or cannibalized by their peers.  I never assumed the godhand never died.  It's also possible that they reincarnate by attracting similar vessels.

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 15, 2014, 06:40:23 PM
Me neither. I haven't counted all the pillars in Falconia, or anything. :ganishka: (I doubt(/hope for the sake of Miura's sanity) that they would match anything)

The twelve gates in Falconia are the obvious one, which I feel safe to say is not a coincidence:

You mean the archs in the distance on the stairs that go up to the inner wall, also counting the outer wall gate and the one we see in the middle? I think it's a stretch, since that picture is just an overhead shot, and there's most likely at least one other "gate" beyond that inner wall anyway (since there's a second inner wall). Plus you like said it doesn't fit the description of the gates of New Jerusalem anyway.

The old capital (Gaiseric's Wyndham/Jerusalem) is replaced by a new, similar but much more massive capital (Falconia/New Jerusalem).

Yeah only that's not really how it works. The old city was destroyed, then a new one was built. Then the new one, having become old, was destroyed and the original one was restored, but changed. That's quite a bit more complicated than just "Old city > New city". Furthermore, given that the city's architecture is very clearly of Greco-Roman influence, I'm not sure a comparison to Jerusalem is appropriate.

The Ganishka tree is the tree of life, and double-trunked like described in the BOR.

The concept of a world-tree is common in a lot of myths from all around the world though.

It's just eerily similar to the branding process of Berserk

Is it really? I'd still like to see the precise text for that, especially how it relates to sacrifice like it does in Berserk. Anyway, the two most iconic brands in Berserk are Guts' and Casca's and they're on the neck and breast, respectively.

(Satan is mentioned as getting sealed for 1000 years, so the timeline would make sense too)

Actually I'm not sure how that would make sense, given that no one was bound and cast in the pit in this case, at least as far as we know. A city was destroyed, and around a thousand years later it was brought back under a new master.

I meant to say it's interesting to note the similarities and refrain from speculating, but goddammit, I can't resist: The people living in Falconia will eventually have to get branded, or banished from the city. Meanwhile, the other members of the godhand will actively seek to make the outside world as miserable a place as possible. (like the horsemen of the apocalypse, who are each given a portion of the earth to destroy)

That's not too outlandish. I'm just curious though: what purpose would their branding serve?

Spiritual beliefs are close to the heart of Berserk

I wouldn't say that. Religion is touched upon as a way to add depth to the world, and spirituality does have an important place, but in the literal sense that the world of Berserk has actual spirits in it as well as other magical beings.

Well, I'm assuming the godhand are either killed, or cannibalized by their peers.  I never assumed the godhand never died.  It's also possible that they reincarnate by attracting similar vessels.

Wasn't the case when Femto was born, though.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 15, 2014, 07:40:54 PM
The Miura comment this time was congratulating fellow mangaka and pal Chika Umino (author of March Comes Like a Lion) on reaching 100 episodes and winning the Tezuka Cultural Prize last month. Their works are both featured on the bookmarks included in the latest Young Animal (as promised, click for an image of them) (http://skullknight.net/images/berserk-bookmarks.jpg).

Here's the image of the comment which had a surprise color image of Griffith in it. Quality is bad because it's printed small and not in color. But this could be from an upcoming color page in the next episode perhaps.

(http://skullknight.net/images/miura-comment YA082014.jpg)

So stern. Makes me even more excited about his meeting with Rickert.  :magni:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Patou244 on April 15, 2014, 08:46:34 PM
Quote
Great to see Luca and her sistas, again. She was one of my favourite minor characters to the point that part of me wishes that she had accompanied Guts & co on their quest at the expense of say... Farnese, who hasn't grown on me.

I enjoyed Luca so much. She is probably the most positively potrayed character in that whole arc. Maybe the manga. I would have loved for her to have joined Guts party (but not at the expense of Farnese, as an addition).

In any of those panels was Nina present at all? I am wondering if she had succumbed to her ailment. From what I remember she was suffering from some kind of sexually transmitted desease wasn't she, and she was worried she was going to die soon?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 15, 2014, 09:00:35 PM
In any of those panels was Nina present at all? I am wondering if she had succumbed to her ailment. From what I remember she was suffering from some kind of sexually transmitted desease wasn't she, and she was worried she was going to die soon?

yes last time we saw her she was leaving Lucas's group with Joachim. They both were sick if I'm not wrong. (well at least Nina was) whether they are alive or dead we don't know for the moment. I don't think she will be in Falconia.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 16, 2014, 12:15:54 AM
What are your expectations for that giant, mysterious dome that's in the palace region?

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-dome3.jpg)

Of course, we first saw it back in 307, and thanks to some cleverly placed clouds, I'm pretty sure it's actually translucent as I explained in this post from 2009 (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg176527#msg176527).

Since it's presumably in the palace area, where Griffith likely makes his throne room, I think it'd be exciting if the dome actually IS the shell of his throne room. Consider, it's the highest and most visible point in the city, and to look up at any time and know that Griffith is in there, watching over everything LIKE A FALCON, would be quite cool and eerie. Plus, imagine the view he'd (and potentially we'd) have of the great city from that perspective.

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-orb.jpg)

I also believe this motif, seen around the whole city, is related to the dome/orb.

All will be answered soon, so no need to go too hardcore. What do you guys think is inside that huge thing?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Chaos on April 16, 2014, 01:28:22 AM
What are your expectations for that giant, mysterious dome that's in the palace region?

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-dome3.jpg)

Of course, we first saw it back in 307, and thanks to some cleverly placed clouds, I'm pretty sure it's actually translucent as I explained in this post from 2009 (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg176527#msg176527).

Since it's presumably in the palace area, where Griffith likely makes his throne room, I think it'd be exciting if the dome actually IS the shell of his throne room. Consider, it's the highest and most visible point in the city, and to look up at any time and know that Griffith is in there, watching over everything LIKE A FALCON, would be quite cool and eerie. Plus, imagine the view he'd (and potentially we'd) have of the great city from that perspective.

All will be answered soon, so no need to go too hardcore. What do you guys think is inside that huge thing?

I think it's like you said, it's probably the throne room, or at the very least houses the throne room/his royal chamber/what-have you. To piggy back off of this topic, I'm curious as to exactly WHAT that dome actually is. What is it made of? Does it serve as more than an amazing look-out for Griffith? Does it maybe have supernatural properties to it, similar to Flora's Mansion? 

And I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but what I'm hoping for once we make it to where Griffith is, is to see the god-hand members in human form with him. I'm not sure if that's likely, but that doesn't change the fact that I'd love to see it  :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: NeaR on April 16, 2014, 01:29:04 AM
What are your expectations for that giant, mysterious dome that's in the palace region?
That's no palace, that's Voids brain :O

Jokes aside, it's going to be undoubtedly elegant and marvelous, but I do believe we're going to see something very sinister there. Falconia's just too perfect on the outside I feel. We're going to learn a lot in that place, that's for sure.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Mammon on April 16, 2014, 04:15:39 AM
I'm on it.

EDIT: Skull Knight prefers box wine.  :badbone:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2hoigk4.jpg)

I'm dying  :ganishka: Thanks you so much.

That's great, Gummyskull, especially a drunk Puck and the tissue box design.

The tissue box design? What are you...  :???: oh! That's a box of wine (not sure how you call it in English, "box wine" I guess like Gummyskull said). But now that you mention it, the... thing you use to get the wine out (or "robinet" in French. When I tried to google trans it, it gave me "cock". So since I'm not sure if it's the right translation, I'm gonna phrase it that way ) sort off looks like a tissue.

And to make sure my post is not a total waste:
From Walter's post:
Quote
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-orb.jpg)
I also believe this motif, seen around the whole city, is related to the dome/orb.
Well when I saw this motif, I immediately counted the pairs of wings, 5, like the god hands, or "angels from the legend" (they look more like angel wings than... say Slan's, or Dragons, etc... ), so yay for that theory?
I'm probably reaching...
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on April 16, 2014, 10:05:50 AM
Haha, you all are expecting for Skullknight to spill the beans? Have you all forgotten that when he made his getaway that he had a stowaway?  :rakshas:

If anything he will try to spill the beans and then get whacked by Rahkshas!  :casca:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 16, 2014, 11:31:49 AM
Haha, you all are expecting for Skullknight to spill the beans? Have you all forgotten that when he made his getaway that he had a stowaway?  :rakshas:

For the uninitiated, here's Griff's original thread on that possibility: http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=12073.0

But I'm hoping the certainty in your wording is part of your jest, because it's far from a sure thing.. As an apostle, how would SK not detect him? Aaz postulated maybe Rakshas jumps through the dimensional rift after SK, not needing to cling to him. Sounds more plausible. But I personally maintain he was there, as a Kushan himself, to witness firsthand the end of Ganishka, who he may have had dealings with in the past, given his scene with Silat in volume 27. Something we may learn more about later.

Quote
If anything he will try to spill the beans and then get whacked by Rahkshas!  :casca:

Skull Knight killed by Rakshas...? "I lived for 1,000 years but this blow dart did me in? ARGH!!"
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 16, 2014, 11:37:20 AM
And I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but what I'm hoping for once we make it to where Griffith is, is to see the god-hand members in human form with him. I'm not sure if that's likely, but that doesn't change the fact that I'd love to see it  :guts:

Well, the World Transformation caused the physical manifestation of almost all astral creatures, including the God Hand. So I think they don't need human form to walk the earth at this point. Anyways, what would be the point in them to be with Griffith, in Falconia? This would lead us to another big question: what's in God Hand's agenda? Each of them have their own plans, like Griffith? Or Griffith's dream was since the beginning the main focus?

Jokes aside, it's going to be undoubtedly elegant and marvelous, but I do believe we're going to see something very sinister there. Falconia's just too perfect on the outside I feel. We're going to learn a lot in that place, that's for sure.

I see a tendency (including myself) in trying to scratch Falconia's shit. But, what if there isn't anything bad or evil? What if Griffith is actually searching for the greater good? I think the problem with his new world won't be with the 'what' but with the 'how'.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 16, 2014, 11:45:15 AM

Skull Knight killed by Rakshas...? "I lived for 1,000 years but this blow dart did me in? ARGH!!"

haha if that happens, Theresia will come back and kill Guts.  :serpico:

But to take a guess on the dome thingy, maybe it have an access to a weird part of the astral world... the abyss maybe? Griffith :"hold that thought I'm gonna go check my ocean of souls..."

The throne room there could be really nice too.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Thesaurus_Rex on April 16, 2014, 06:55:56 PM
It might be a reach, but...

...The dome could be housing our friend The Idea of Evil. Or at least contain some sort of entry into the abyss, as mentioned by someone else. Whatever it is, IT'S IMPORTANT.

I think the symbol at the gate of the 5 wings surrounding the orb also gives credence to this theory.

I didn't even notice the dome until this thread pointed it out. Hopefully it actually IS a structure, and not just the sun/moon with a trick of background imagery.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 16, 2014, 07:12:23 PM
What are your expectations for that giant, mysterious dome that's in the palace region?

I think few things could be more awesome than the sphere housing a gate to the God Hand's place in the depths of the Astral world. That being said, I don't think Charlotte would enjoy staying there very much, so the palace itself would have to be separate for that to work at all. Besides, as awesome as this idea is, I don't doubt that Miura could top it.

Since it's presumably in the palace area, where Griffith likely makes his throne room, I think it'd be exciting if the dome actually IS the shell of his throne room. Consider, it's the highest and most visible point in the city, and to look up at any time and know that Griffith is in there, watching over everything LIKE A FALCON, would be quite cool and eerie. Plus, imagine the view he'd (and potentially we'd) have of the great city from that perspective.

It would be both awesome and fitting, but the sphere is way too big to just contain the throne room, so I wonder how it'd be arranged.

I also believe this motif, seen around the whole city, is related to the dome/orb.

Yep, I'm certain of it too.

This would lead us to another big question: what's in God Hand's agenda? Each of them have their own plans, like Griffith? Or Griffith's dream was since the beginning the main focus?

They all have their own agenda, but because the Idea of Evil is good at what it does, it turns out their personal agendas all fit together nicely to form a global, common one. Hence why in the process of obtaining his "kingdom", Femto happened to bring his brethren into the world.

I see a tendency (including myself) in trying to scratch Falconia's shit. But, what if there isn't anything bad or evil? What if Griffith is actually searching for the greater good?

We know better. Femto, the Wings of Darkness, fifth member of the God Hand, is not searching for the greater good.

I didn't even notice the dome until this thread pointed it out. Hopefully it actually IS a structure, and not just the sun/moon with a trick of background imagery.

It definitely is a special structure and not the sun or anything like that, you can be sure of it.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 16, 2014, 08:36:21 PM
Well, the World Transformation caused the physical manifestation of almost all astral creatures, including the God Hand. So I think they don't need human form to walk the earth at this point. Anyways, what would be the point in them to be with Griffith, in Falconia?

I agree. I think they're probably in their own domains at this point, stirring up their own brand of chaos in the world. But given the placement of the world-spiral tree, I imagine there's some special significance to Falconia in the grand scheme.

Quote
I see a tendency (including myself) in trying to scratch Falconia's shit. But, what if there isn't anything bad or evil? What if Griffith is actually searching for the greater good? I think the problem with his new world won't be with the 'what' but with the 'how'.

The demon king that brought hell onto earth is actually trying to do good, huh? Could you unpack that idea?

From Walter's post:Well when I saw this motif, I immediately counted the pairs of wings, 5, like the god hands, or "angels from the legend" (they look more like angel wings than... say Slan's, or Dragons, etc... ), so yay for that theory?
I'm probably reaching...

No, it makes some sense, and I love the possibility of it.  Great observation  :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IcePuck on April 16, 2014, 09:34:34 PM
You mean the archs in the distance on the stairs that go up to the inner wall, also counting the outer wall gate and the one we see in the middle? I think it's a stretch, since that picture is just an overhead shot, and there's most likely at least one other "gate" beyond that inner wall anyway (since there's a second inner wall). Plus you like said it doesn't fit the description of the gates of New Jerusalem anyway.
Fair enough. I still think it works on a symbolic level, but this numerology stuff is secondary, in any case; something I went looking for after noticing that Falconia is similar to what happens in the Book of Revelation.

Quote
Yeah only that's not really how it works. The old city was destroyed, then a new one was built. Then the new one, having become old, was destroyed and the original one was restored, but changed. That's quite a bit more complicated than just "Old city > New city". Furthermore, given that the city's architecture is very clearly of Greco-Roman influence, I'm not sure a comparison to Jerusalem is appropriate.
That's pretty much like Jerusalem- it's trashed and rebuilt multiple times during the timeline of the bible. I initially didn't consider that the connection to Jerusalem would go beyond the fact of Falconia being a great otherworldly city that suddenly appears, but actually, it not might be too far-fetched. Jerusalem would have been under Roman control during Jesus' time, and later again under Christians during the middle ages. This also happens to be the most important religious site in the city:

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-OMFWd1F0Rxo/UazfjkNbfuI/AAAAAAAAFpM/lkhxbbu6tAw/s1600/dome_of_the_rock1323557019006.jpg)

Also, quotes from Wikipedia:
Quote from: Wikipedia
The Foundation Stone (Hebrew: אבן השתייה, translit. Even haShetiya) or Rock (Arabic: صخرة translit. Sakhrah, Hebrew: סלע translit.: Sela) is the name of the rock at the heart of the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem. It is also known as the Pierced Stone because it has a small hole on the southeastern corner that enters a cavern beneath the rock, known as the Well of Souls.
Quote
The Well of Souls (Arabic: Bir el- Arweh, Bir el- Arwah or Bir al- Arwah‎) — sometimes translated Pit of Souls, Cave of Spirits, or Well of Spirits — is a partly natural/partly man-made cave located inside the Foundation Stone under the Dome of the Rock shrine in Jerusalem. The name derives from a medieval Islamic legend that at this place the spirits of the dead can be heard awaiting Judgment Day at which time the Ka'aba in Mecca will come here and God's throne will be established on the Stone.
:ubik:

Hardly anything that exactly matches, but c'mon. Can you say the huge sphere in Berserk might very well not be inspired by the Dome of the Rock? It's the same deal with the other things I mentioned- tantalizing similarities, but it's also easy to see that they're not 1-on-1 matches. Still, in my opinion, it goes way beyond only being stuff that's vaguely similar to Berserk.

I'd recommend anyone to just read the Book of Revelation. It's short, only taking 20 or so minutes to read, and it's interesting. This is about the coming of New Jerusalem, for example:

Quote
A New Heaven and a New Earth

Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 17, 2014, 08:12:07 AM
That's pretty much like Jerusalem- it's trashed and rebuilt multiple times during the timeline of the bible.

Cities have been destroyed and rebuilt all over the world and in a ton of stories, but that's not enough. Here you're telling us there's a definite inspiration, so "pretty much like" doesn't cut it. That's why I asked you for precise details and not vague assertions. I'm not trying to pick on you here, but I'm pretty skeptical of the parallels you're drawing, both in nature and in scale.

Jerusalem would have been under Roman control during Jesus' time

Its architecture is what I was talking about, and it doesn't fit.

Hardly anything that exactly matches, but c'mon. Can you say the huge sphere in Berserk might very well not be inspired by the Dome of the Rock?

Can I say that? Sure. I don't think the spherical structure (which, as far as we know, is probably not a dome atop a building) in Falconia is inspired by that particular building. And I don't see any element that could hint at the contrary. Domed buildings are all over the place, and this doesn't look like what's in the manga to me.

It's the same deal with the other things I mentioned- tantalizing similarities, but it's also easy to see that they're not 1-on-1 matches. Still, in my opinion, it goes way beyond only being stuff that's vaguely similar to Berserk.

That's the problem though, so far "being vaguely similar" is all it's been.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 17, 2014, 01:01:52 PM
The demon king that brought hell onto earth is actually trying to do good, huh? Could you unpack that idea?

If I had to say it in one phrase: Griffith/Femto is trying to do good, but he's doing it in the bad way. I mean, if you want paradise there has to be hell, so paradise can be paradise. I think that's Griffith's philosophy at this point. He is acting like a dictator: he thinks he's doing good when he doesn't.

In general, this can be applied to the IoE and the God Hand. If Miura hasn't changed too much his mind about this concept, IoE's purpose is to fulfil humanity's desires, no matter what. And that's the problem. It would be funny if the IoE reachs to the conclusion that humanity is definitely a danger to itself and takes a "Skynet like" mind. :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 17, 2014, 01:11:23 PM
If I had to say it in one phrase: Griffith/Femto is trying to do good

What makes you believe he's trying to do good?

In general, this can be applied to the IoE and the God Hand.

The Idea of Evil's goal is not to achieve goodness in the world.

If Miura hasn't changed too much his mind about this concept, IoE's purpose is to fulfil humanity's desires, no matter what.

That's never been the case.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IncantatioN on April 17, 2014, 01:39:10 PM
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-orb.jpg)

I also believe this motif, seen around the whole city, is related to the dome/orb.

All will be answered soon, so no need to go too hardcore. What do you guys think is inside that huge thing?

Speaking of the motif, when we see Falconia for the first time in episode 307, the design of the motif has 6 pair of wings consistently through various pages of the episode. Yet, now we see 5 pair of wings. May impact Mammon's suggestion of it being tied to the 5 members of the God Hand?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 17, 2014, 01:47:17 PM
Speaking of the motif, when we see Falconia for the first time in episode 307, the design of the motif has 6 pair of wings consistently through various pages of the episode. Yet, now we see 5 pair of wings. May impact Mammon's suggestion of it being tied to the 5 members of the God Hand?

Yep, it was mentioned by IcePuck on Page 5. Just another fix Miura's made since its initial depiction in 2009.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: IncantatioN on April 17, 2014, 01:56:15 PM
Thanks for clarifying and sorry about that, reading back I missed it in Ice Puck's post.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 17, 2014, 02:03:54 PM
What makes you believe he's trying to do good?

Well, he never said that his dream was to conquer the world and make people suffer. His dream (at least when he was human, and he said that hadn't changed) was to trascend the rules and the social status imposed by men, to leave that circle. And for that, he wanted to become a king. Of course, he never stated if he was going to be a tyrannic king or not, but I don't think so. The problem is that Griffith is a "end justify the means" person.

That's never been the case.

Maybe I interpreted its conversation with Griffith wrong. The Idea of Evil was born from all negative human feelings, and it is fueled by them, am I right? And its "objective" is to give humans the power they yearn for so deeply (the God Hand and the apostles). This is, in summary, what I understood from their conversation. Anyway, I haven't reread that episode since too long and, given the possibility that Miura finally will decide to leave it out from the canon, I try to not support myself too much in it. So, where am I lost?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 17, 2014, 02:13:26 PM
Well, he never said that his dream was to conquer the world and make people suffer. His dream (at least when he was human, and he said that hadn't changed) was to trascend the rules and the social status imposed by men, to leave that circle. And for that, he wanted to become a king.

The problem is that you stick to what Griffith wanted as a human while he's not human anymore. Since he is a member of the God Hand, it's very naive to assume that his intentions are good.

Maybe I interpreted its conversation with Griffith wrong. The Idea of Evil was born from all negative human feelings, and it is fueled by them, am I right? And its "objective" is to give humans the power they yearn for so deeply (the God Hand and the apostles). This is, in summary, what I understood from their conversation. Anyway, I haven't reread that episode since too long and, given the possibility that Miura finally will decide to leave it out from the canon, I try to not support myself too much in it. So, where am I lost?

When it says it was born to give humans what they desire, it refers to "reasons for their suffering". It produces those. Gives them reasons for their misery, where before it was a matter of chance. So to say that its purpose is to "fulfil humanity's desires, no matter what" is misleading. It is called the "Idea of Evil" for a reason. But anyway, like you say, that's not part of the canon.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 17, 2014, 04:39:30 PM
If I had to say it in one phrase: Griffith/Femto is trying to do good, but he's doing it in the bad way. I mean, if you want paradise there has to be hell, so paradise can be paradise. I think that's Griffith's philosophy at this point. He is acting like a dictator: he thinks he's doing good when he doesn't.

There's a reason the prophesy calls the normal humans following Griffith blind white sheep, I guess it can apply to the readers as well.  Reread the Black Swordsman arc and try and tell me Femto or the God Hand give a shit about doing good.  But hey, Mozgus thought he was doing the lord's work so maybe that guy wasn't so bad after all either!  :troll:  And if you want to see the God Hand/Apostle's version of what paradise is just reread the Lost Children chapter. 

Well, he never said that his dream was to conquer the world and make people suffer. His dream (at least when he was human, and he said that hadn't changed) was to trascend the rules and the social status imposed by men, to leave that circle. And for that, he wanted to become a king. Of course, he never stated if he was going to be a tyrannic king or not, but I don't think so. The problem is that Griffith is a "end justify the means" person.

But we haven't heard him talk about his dream now that he's a member of the God Hand.  As far as him saying that nothing has changed; he is saying that while being carried off by Zodd, so I think that statement should be taken with a grain of salt.  Just like it should be for all of the bad guys warped philosophies that only serve as glorified excuses for the evil they're doing.  Even though Miura plays around with these ideas throughout the series, he keeps it pretty clear who the bad guys and the good guys really are in the long run.  Griffith is the antagonist.  Enough said.  Plus we've only been inside of Falconia for one episode!  Miura has the rest of the series to show us what's really going on, and it's clear if you're reading the series that it's not good.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 17, 2014, 06:54:29 PM
When it says it was born to give humans what they desire, it refers to "reasons for their suffering". It produces those. Gives them reasons for their misery, where before it was a matter of chance. So to say that its purpose is to "fulfil humanity's desires, no matter what" is misleading. It is called the "Idea of Evil" for a reason. But anyway, like you say, that's not part of the canon.

Ah, right! Yes, I completely lost that. It's funny, because I actually understood everything at the time. Thanks!

There's a reason the prophesy calls the normal humans following Griffith blind white sheep, I guess it can apply to the readers as well.  Reread the Black Swordsman arc and try and tell me Femto or the God Hand give a shit about doing good.  But hey, Mozgus thought he was doing the lord's work so maybe that guy wasn't so bad after all either!  :troll:

Maybe I didn't explain myself well. I don't think Griffith is a good guy. Hell, no! In every arc of the series he makes too much shit (shit that makes you want see him impaled by the Dragonslayer). But, for example I don't see Griffith agreeing with Mozgus in any way.

But we haven't heard him talk about his dream now that he's a member of the God Hand.  As far as him saying that nothing has changed; he is saying that while being carried off by Zodd, so I think that statement should be taken with a grain of salt.  Just like it should be for all of the bad guys warped philosophies that only serve as glorified excuses for the evil they're doing.  Even though Miura plays around with these ideas throughout the series, he keeps it pretty clear who the bad guys and the good guys really are in the long run.  Griffith is the antagonist.  Enough said.  Plus we've only been inside of Falconia for one episode!  Miura has the rest of the series to show us what's really going on, and it's clear if you're reading the series that it's not good.

"Just like it should be for all of the bad guys warped philosophies that only serve as glorified excuses for the evil they're doing" That's it! That's the whole point! Like I said in my previous post, right now Griffith is acting like a dictator. He is capable of anything if something puts in danger his dream. He already did that when he was human, and that's actually what led him becoming a God Hand member. Sure he's the antagonist. But being an antagonist doesn't make you a villain. And I see Miura playing too much with the concept that Griffith is both the Falcon of Light and Darkness. Of course we just have began to see Griffith's rulership, but I don't see too hurried trying to see his role in the series.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on April 17, 2014, 07:12:09 PM
But, for example I don't see Griffith agreeing with Mozgus in any way.

Agreeing about what? Mozgus could probably be considered a nice guy compared to Femto, the Wing of Darkness.

Like I said in my previous post, right now Griffith is acting like a dictator. He is capable of anything if something puts in danger his dream. He already did that when he was human, and that's actually what led him becoming a God Hand member. Sure he's the antagonist. But being an antagonist doesn't make you a villain. And I see Miura playing too much with the concept that Griffith is both the Falcon of Light and Darkness. Of course we just have began to see Griffith's rulership, but I don't see too hurried trying to see his role in the series.

Dude, don't you see? The "Falcon of Light" is a sham. Griffith/Femto is a villain. He's just been playing a good guy act so far. The whole thing is a foregone conclusion.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 18, 2014, 12:29:12 AM

 

(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-orb.jpg)




if you look on page 18 the panel where they enter the bath house. you see the shape again with the orb, only this time the orb his kinda shaped like an oval. reminds me of some of the broderie Charlotte was doing while imprisoned... "falcon of light" style...
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 18, 2014, 12:41:06 AM
if you look on page 18 the panel where they enter the bath house. you see the shape again with the orb, only this time the orb his kinda shaped like an oval.

Yep. Doesn't lend any additional info to us though, and its symbolism remains the same.

Quote
reminds me of some of the broderie Charlotte was doing while imprisoned

The fact that it's an oval or the fact that it's covered in feathers?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on April 18, 2014, 12:48:01 AM
Yep. Doesn't lend any additional info to us though, and its symbolism remains the same.

The fact that it's an oval or the fact that it's covered in feathers?

a little bit of both. As if it was unconsciously saying to me : "it's griffiiith" in a whisper.  :griffnotevil:

But yes sadly it doesn't add any thing. I felt like pointing it out.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 18, 2014, 01:29:24 AM
But being an antagonist doesn't make you a villain.

It usually does...

Anyway, between what Aazealh and I have already said I don't know how else to argue that what Femto and the God Hand are doing isn't for the good of the people.  Good isn't even in their vocabulary.  They ultimately serve the Idea of Evil, who is... evil.  Pretty much the embodiment of evil itself.  Evil = bad.  Not good.  People are no more than squirming little bugs to them, or at best pawns to play a part until they aren't necessary anymore.  We've already seen the kind of pseudo-paradise we get from apostles and the God Hand when Rochine takes Jill into the Misty Valley.  That part of the story alone should raise some red flags for readers when we see how idyllic it is in Falconia, we know better.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 18, 2014, 01:46:52 AM
People are no more than squirming little bugs to them, or at best pawns to play a part until they aren't necessary anymore.

It certainly doesn't detract from your point, but the God Hand actually use a specific term when referring to humans: lambs (小羊). As in, the kind of thoughtless creature easily led to slaughter  :void: Also implying they're being shepherded. The usage also coincides with the Prophecy of the Falcon of Light/Darkness, which includes blind sheep (people), and sinful sheep (apostles).
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 18, 2014, 02:01:30 AM
It certainly doesn't detract from your point, but the God Hand actually use a specific term when referring to humans: lambs (小羊). As in, the kind of thoughtless creature easily led to slaughter  :void: Also implying they're being shepherded. The usage also coincides with the Prophecy of the Falcon of Light/Darkness, which includes blind sheep (people), and sinful sheep (apostles).

Cool, thanks!  I actually made a reference to the prophecy and blind white sheep in one of my posts earlier and made a joke that it seemed to apply to some readers as well.   :ganishka:

On another note this made me think of something I thought I had noticed before: we don't see any livestock outside of Falconia nor inside (as of yet), and from what little we see of the market there doesn't seem to be any meat.  Of course it could just be that it isn't shown in those particular shots.  Otherwise, Falconia is either a vegan society or there's something sinister afoot indeed.
Edit: Having thought about it, of course it's like that.  Hearding livestock around and into Falconia is probably difficult while being constantly attacked by astral creatures.  I feel dumb now for pointing it out...  :farnese:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on April 18, 2014, 02:14:25 PM
Well, it's arguable that Griffith has already enacted his diabolical plan, since the entire world is now subservient to him, or inevitably so. I don't imagine there are very many other safe havens from the astral creatures roaming the land. And even if there were, they wouldn't last when the rest of civilization has gone to hell in a handcart, possessing neither infinite resources or the 'Wing Stones' to survive long-term. Griffith's essentially robbed the people of their freedoms when the worlds were merged, herding them like sheep into his false utopia. Over time, the denizens of Falconia will become completely brainwashed and lose all ability to think for themselves. There's definitely a totalitarian/NWO subtext to the whole concept of Falconia, intended or otherwise. That said, I'm not ruling out anything a little more 'on the nose'.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 18, 2014, 07:15:25 PM
Having thought about it, of course it's like that.  Hearding livestock around and into Falconia is probably difficult while being constantly attacked by astral creatures.  I feel dumb now for pointing it out...  :farnese:

Not so fast. Remember Falconia is protected by those wing stones, so it wouldn't be a problem having some livestock. Maybe Falconia's society is vegan, but I see this mentality too advanced, even for Griffith's "utopia".

There's definitely a totalitarian/NWO subtext to the whole concept of Falconia, intended or otherwise.

In his current position, Griffith surely consider himself a kind of Messiah. This probably have been discussed before, but I don't discard the idea that sooner or later, Griffith will attack the other safe places in the world (like Elfhelm) in order to maintain his kingdom's hegemony.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 18, 2014, 07:24:15 PM
This probably have been discussed before, but I don't discard the idea that sooner or later, Griffith will attack the other safe places in the world (like Elfhelm) in order to maintain his kingdom's hegemony.

Because of where it's situated, Elfhelm isn't exactly a viable alternative to Falconia to anyone but those already there.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 18, 2014, 07:56:42 PM
Not so fast. Remember Falconia is protected by those wing stones, so it wouldn't be a problem having some livestock.

My logic was that livestock would still have to be brought in from the outside world, unless the World Spiral Tree can sprout baby cows too...
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Tripas on April 18, 2014, 08:13:29 PM
Because of where it's situated, Elfhelm isn't exactly a viable alternative to Falconia to anyone but those already there.

Obviously, Elfhelm is not a problem right now. But considering that it's the home of the elfs and of numerous (some of them, powerful) magicians and that Griffith will probably try to expand his power, I don't see it too strange in the long term.

My logic was that livestock would still have to be brought in from the outside world, unless the World Spiral Tree can sprout baby cows too...

Well, maybe in their rescue expeditions some soldiers achieved to save some farmers and a little amount of livestock (like pigs or chickens). Besides, there is the option of hunting astral creatures :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 18, 2014, 08:21:21 PM
Obviously, Elfhelm is not a problem right now. But considering that it's the home of the elfs and of numerous (some of them, powerful) magicians and that Griffith will probably try to expand his power, I don't see it too strange in the long term.

Well, you initially said he'd attack Elfhelm to secure his reign, because it's another safe place. But humans won't consider Elfhelm a safe place if they a) don't know it exists b) have to traverse the Western Sea to get there. As for the good old "Elfhelm is threat #1" theory, we'll see.

Changing subjects, I was reminded of something I honestly forgot from years ago, back in the episode 307 thread. (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739)

From Volume 10:
(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon1.jpg)(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon2.jpg)

And in Episode 307:
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-halfmoon1.jpg)

We had a discussion earlier in the thread about whether any particular iconography would be replaced. Well... the answer appears to be yep.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rhombaad on April 18, 2014, 11:03:32 PM
Great catch, Walter. Miura's attention to detail continues to astound me.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Skeleton on April 18, 2014, 11:10:14 PM
a vegan society

So it really is hell on earth!  :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Rupert Sinclair on April 19, 2014, 01:37:56 AM
Changing subjects, I was reminded of something I honestly forgot from years ago, back in the episode 307 thread. (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739)

We had a discussion earlier in the thread about whether any particular iconography would be replaced. Well... the answer appears to be yep.

Really cool stuff.  Skully's gotta be pissed.   :SK:  :griffnotevil:

So it really is hell on earth!  :troll:

 :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ryOtoha on April 19, 2014, 01:34:42 PM
We had a discussion earlier in the thread about whether any particular iconography would be replaced. Well... the answer appears to be yep.

Neat !

I also believe this motif, seen around the whole city, is related to the dome/orb.
All will be answered soon, so no need to go too hardcore. What do you guys think is inside that huge thing?

Is it possible that the common/remaining symbol between Gaiseric/Griffith is the Orb ?  It would obviously mean that the Orb was already in the ancient city, probably used by Gaiseric like Aaz said, as gate/bridge connected to the Astral World :SK:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: ApostleBob on April 19, 2014, 05:18:49 PM
Changing subjects, I was reminded of something I honestly forgot from years ago, back in the episode 307 thread. (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739)

From Volume 10:
(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon1.jpg)(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon2.jpg)


We had a discussion earlier in the thread about whether any particular iconography would be replaced. Well... the answer appears to be yep.

I had always thought that Gaiseric's sigil represented an Eclipse.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 19, 2014, 05:26:08 PM
I had always thought that Gaiseric's sigil represented an Eclipse.

Yeah, same. It still might have represented that. And this is Griffith's iteration on it, which represents something else.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: kapsi on April 22, 2014, 02:54:09 PM
What are your expectations for that giant, mysterious dome that's in the palace region?
I think it may be a power source/generator. Or a water reservoir. Maybe a grain silo?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on April 22, 2014, 04:35:16 PM
I think it may be a power source/generator. Or a water reservoir. Maybe a grain silo?

Can't tell if serious...  :???:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: RaffoBaffo on April 22, 2014, 04:53:32 PM
They're clearly hiding Nuclear Weapons in that dome  :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Irvine on April 23, 2014, 01:09:35 AM
I think it may be a power source/generator. Or a water reservoir. Maybe a grain silo?

It's the Thunderdome! Mystery solved.

Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Lithrael on April 23, 2014, 02:56:20 AM
it's the lens of a massive eye just you wait and see
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: MrMehawk on April 23, 2014, 04:37:58 AM
it's the lens of a massive eye just you wait and see

Massive eye of a massive Beherit?  :carcus:  :troll:
Personally I don't think it's anything so obviously magical (the people of Falconia might not be happy with a gigantic eyeball in their midst). More like a gigantic building to me.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: renderz on April 26, 2014, 06:35:24 PM
I've been following this forum for years and now with this new episode I decided to finally make a account too, although registering here was a pain, anyway nice to meet you all.
As for the episode itself it was worth the wait, nice to see some old characters, the ending felt like something dark is about to happen so I'm looking forward to it. :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: asic on May 01, 2014, 02:13:57 PM
The shot where we see the city from above reminded me a lot of this

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/40/Bundesarchiv_Bild_146III-373%2C_Modell_der_Neugestaltung_Berlins_%28%22Germania%22%29.jpg

And in case you didn't know what it is, it was Hitlers future plans for Berlin and the huge dome building was to be the biggest dome ever created. I see some similarities there.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 01, 2014, 02:22:57 PM
The shot where we see the city from above reminded me a lot of this

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/40/Bundesarchiv_Bild_146III-373%2C_Modell_der_Neugestaltung_Berlins_%28%22Germania%22%29.jpg

And in case you didn't know what it is, it was Hitlers future plans for Berlin and the huge dome building was to be the biggest dome ever created. I see some similarities there.

Indeed, I think I actually mentioned this in the 307 (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175756#msg175756), thread back in the day. The big, grand structures are definitely reminiscent of it. And you bring up a good point about how striking the central road leading to the capitol is. Afterall, Hitler was the guy who dreamed of the Tausendjähriges Reich (THOUSAND YEAR EMPIRE). He was a monster, but man... I'd have liked to see that city, from a purely architectural perspective.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Alucroas on May 02, 2014, 02:13:03 PM
So would it be safe to assume Femto plans on sacrificing the people of Falconia as a sort of last-ditch effort to save himself in the hypothetical event that Guts does manage to find a way to run him through with the Dragonslayer?

I'm referencing the crescent moon and eclipse moon its half-consuming.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 02, 2014, 06:52:47 PM
So would it be safe to assume Femto plans on sacrificing the people of Falconia as a sort of last-ditch effort to save himself in the hypothetical event that Guts does manage to find a way to run him through with the Dragonslayer?

I'm referencing the crescent moon and eclipse moon its half-consuming.

I dunno if I'd say that's likely. As a member of the God Hand, he shouldn't have anything left to sacrifice. Remember, the Count's double-sacrifice was to correct the error that had been made before in letting Theresia survive, and really a result of Guts' interference in bringing the beherit to him inadvertantly. That scenario also presumes that Griffith cares so deeply for every vagrant that piles into his city.

It is tempting to tie Falconia's destruction to a ceremony we're already so familiar with, and it does make sense that with all the focus on demonic ceremonies that we'd see at least one more again. But I personally get the feeling that the city's (nation's?) destruction will be something unforeseen, something cataclysmic. Afterall, Gaiseric's city was swallowed up by the earth. I don't think we've seen anything that parallels that kind of phenomena.

As to the symbolism of that eclipse insignia, keep in mind that symbol has changed. But for Gaiseric, it could be a number of things, but it certainly doesn't seem logical to me that it's foreshadowing. Rather, it makes more sense it was created to represent something that occurred in the past.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on May 04, 2014, 09:48:27 AM
While technically Griffith shouldn't have anything left to sacrifice, since his mortal ties were severed during the Eclipse, Miura has already shown he's willing to bend the rules for plot purposes, namely the Beherit-Apostle. You could argue he was one of a kind, but then Griffith/Femto is an even greater exception. It would be profoundly poetic if Guts forced Griffith to sacrifice his 'dream' once again. Not that I expect the author to go down this route, at least not in such simplistic terms.

I'm keen to find out if the mechanics of Beherits/Apostles has been affected on some level by the world merger. Will the nature of the ceremonies change now that the God Hand inhabit the physical realm? What will happen if Griffith's demon army dwindles before the fantasy creatures (and unrelated parties :guts:)? Will he have a back-up plan to harvest Apostles in a similar way to Ganishka? Questions, questions, questions!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 04, 2014, 10:56:11 AM
While technically Griffith shouldn't have anything left to sacrifice, since his mortal ties were severed during the Eclipse

It's beyond that. He'd sacrifice people he doesn't care about, and in what circumstance? A special ceremony presided by himself and his buddies? And in order to gain what? There are multiple problems with that idea.

Miura has already shown he's willing to bend the rules for plot purposes, namely the Beherit-Apostle.

The Beherit-Apostle is a pretty specific case in many regards, but I wouldn't say it's really bending the rules since whatever rules there are have always been relatively loose in how they could be interpreted. Another unusual case is Ganishka, specifically his foggy apostle form, but again nothing ever said such things weren't possible.

I'm keen to find out if the mechanics of Beherits/Apostles has been affected on some level by the world merger. Will the nature of the ceremonies change now that the God Hand inhabit the physical realm?

I wonder if there are even going to be new ceremonies at all. There might exist a simpler process now.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on May 04, 2014, 01:24:43 PM
It's beyond that. He'd sacrifice people he doesn't care about, and in what circumstance? A special ceremony presided by himself and his buddies? And in order to gain what? There are multiple problems with that idea.

Perhaps not necessarily the denizens themselves, but Falconia and its personal significance to Griffith. It's not like everyone in Albion was cherished by the Beherit-Apostle when he sacrificed the "world" around him, on the contrary if anything. As for what might bring about such an action, I was building on the original proposition: that Guts somehow develops a means of destroying Griffith with the Dragonslayer.

The Beherit-Apostle is a pretty specific case in many regards, but I wouldn't say it's really bending the rules since whatever rules there are have always been relatively loose in how they could be interpreted. Another unusual case is Ganishka, specifically his foggy apostle form, but again nothing ever said such things weren't possible.

It was certainly a departure from what we had hitherto gleaned about Apostles & sacrifice in the Berserk universe. In hindsight, sure, the rules can be loosely defined but it was fairly black and white how the process worked before the Beherit-Apostle entered the equation.  After all, what if anything was the Beherit-Apostle, if not causality's loophole for having Griffith incarnated?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 04, 2014, 03:05:14 PM
Perhaps not necessarily the denizens themselves, but Falconia and its personal significance to Griffith. [...] As for what might bring about such an action, I was building on the original proposition: that Guts somehow develops a means of destroying Griffith with the Dragonslayer.

But the problem remains of the circumstances of such a ceremony. Do you picture Femto using a beherit (and which one? The crimson one?) to call upon his kindred while he's in the throes of death? That seems terribly unlikely to me. I think such an occurrence would be far beyond "bending rules", but then again, how do we define what rules apply to the God Hand themselves? Especially now, in this new world?

On a separate note, sorry to nitpick, but "Dragon Slayer" isn't a single word. Same for "God Hand" or "Black Swordsman". I often see people writing them as one word for some reason.

It was certainly a departure from what we had hitherto gleaned about Apostles & sacrifice in the Berserk universe. In hindsight, sure, the rules can be loosely defined but it was fairly black and white how the process worked before the Beherit-Apostle entered the equation.  After all, what if anything was the Beherit-Apostle, if not causality's loophole for having Femto incarnated?

Well, the first and only apostle ceremony we ever saw was already completely extraordinary: a second sacrifice by an apostle, one that was actually a failure as he refused to sacrifice, and that also included a former sacrifice and an elf intruding into the ceremony and attacking the God Hand. That doesn't really establish a strict setting to me. That being said, there's no denying the Beherit-Apostle was a special case, fittingly so in the face of what happened at Albion. And I believe that answers your last question: that event was a thousand years in the making, and I think we can assume that the peculiar situation of the Beherit-Apostle was possible because he was such a key part of it.

Then again, we have how varied these things can be, so who knows... Maybe the circumstances of the sacrifices of Zodd, Irvine, Locus, Rakshas or Grunbeld will be revealed to have been quite special as well. Not to mention Slan, Ubik, Conrad or Void.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Selwyn on May 06, 2014, 05:32:57 PM
I liked the architecture of Falconia and it was cool to see bestgirl again. Too bad Jerome won't come back, or will he?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 06, 2014, 06:21:15 PM
I liked the architecture of Falconia and it was cool to see bestgirl again. Too bad Jerome won't come back, or will he?

Just checking... "Bestgirl" is Luca, right? As for Jerome, I'm sure he's around. Aazealh suggested on our podcast that perhaps he was away at the front lines, since he does have experience with the Holy Iron Chain Knights.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on May 07, 2014, 09:09:03 AM
Well, you initially said he'd attack Elfhelm to secure his reign, because it's another safe place. But humans won't consider Elfhelm a safe place if they a) don't know it exists b) have to traverse the Western Sea to get there. As for the good old "Elfhelm is threat #1" theory, we'll see.

Changing subjects, I was reminded of something I honestly forgot from years ago, back in the episode 307 thread. (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=10790.msg175739#msg175739)

From Volume 10:
(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon1.jpg)(http://skullknight.net/images/gaiseric-halfmoon2.jpg)

And in Episode 307:
(http://skullknight.net/images/falconia-halfmoon1.jpg)

We had a discussion earlier in the thread about whether any particular iconography would be replaced. Well... the answer appears to be yep.

So with this...

Original City = Gaiseric's Dream Kingdom

Falconia = Griffiths Dream Kingdom

Gaiseric (SK) = Griffith/Femto ?

If fate is a spiral and somethings are different, should this possibility not be considered? I know it seems far fetched and we all have our assumptions that Gaisric = SK but without Miura telling us with out a doubt, anything could happen until he does. Just throwing it out there in any case. Stupid? Far fetched? "How about no, Scott?"  :???:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 07, 2014, 10:05:33 AM
It's already been established that Gaiseric and Griffith share similarities in a variety of ways. Guts muses to himself about it in Vol 10. As for how far the connection goes and what its significance is, unknown. Could be that Gaiseric was the model for Griffith's creation.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 07, 2014, 11:11:08 AM
So with this...

Original City = Gaiseric's Dream Kingdom
Falconia = Griffiths Dream Kingdom
Gaiseric (SK) = Griffith/Femto ?

If fate is a spiral and somethings are different, should this possibility not be considered? I know it seems far fetched and we all have our assumptions that Gaisric = SK but without Miura telling us with out a doubt, anything could happen until he does. Just throwing it out there in any case. Stupid? Far fetched?

That Gaiseric can be equated to a mix of Guts and Griffith's characters and circumstances isn't really far-fetched, it's rather obvious to me. I must have first mentioned this about 10 years ago on this forum, and even then it wasn't anything new. In truth it's merely a constatation of the facts and Falconia's appearance was not even needed for it, though it can be interpreted as cementing the conclusion I guess. And of course, "the causality is a spiral" bit from Flora only reinforces the whole thing.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on May 07, 2014, 01:33:38 PM
Umm, I actually think SaiyajinNoOuji (and please correct me if I'm wrong) was implying that Gaiseric & Griffith are literally one and the same. At least that's how I read his post. Kind of along the lines how some fans posit the Guts = SK/time loop theory.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 07, 2014, 02:15:24 PM
Umm, I actually think SaiyajinNoOuji (and please correct me if I'm wrong) was implying that Gaiseric & Griffith are literally one and the same. At least that's how I read his post. Kind of along the lines how some fans posit the Guts = SK/time loop theory.

That's not what I got from reading his post, but if that's the question, then no...

It's beyond reasonable doubts that SK was once Gaiseric. There have been numerous indications of this, namely Slan calling him "king," and of course the fucking skull helmet. The lack of a 100% certainty is likely a result of Miura waiting for the right time to bring up the name Gaiseric again. Anyway, this is a long way to say that Gaiseric/SK exhibits traits of Guts as well. So it's not as if Griffith is exactly like Gaiseric, and thus a time traveler or whatever nonsense we're discussing. They're men who accomplished similar feats, and were likely both guided by causality.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Doc on May 07, 2014, 05:21:15 PM
That's not what I got from reading his post, but if that's the question, then no...

It's beyond reasonable doubts that SK was once Gaiseric. There have been numerous indications of this, namely Slan calling him "king," and of course the fucking skull helmet. The lack of a 100% certainty is likely a result of Miura waiting for the right time to bring up the name Gaiseric again. Anyway, this is a long way to say that Gaiseric/SK exhibits traits of Guts as well. So it's not as if Griffith is exactly like Gaiseric, and thus a time traveler or whatever nonsense we're discussing. They're men who accomplished similar feats, and were likely both guided by causality.

I agree it's a crackpot theory. Hence why the OP was worried about it being 'far-fetched'. I don't think drawing a comparison between Gaiseric & Griffith is in itself particularly outlandish, for reasons already explained by yourself and Aaz. 
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: SaiyajinNoOuji on May 07, 2014, 09:53:10 PM
Yea no, I am not saying that Griffith and SK/Gaisric are the same person. Just the similarities... also the really far fetched thought, will there be an event that makes Griffith take up a similar or literal mantle of SK?  :troll:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 07, 2014, 10:32:44 PM
also the really far fetched thought, will there be an event that makes Griffith take up a similar or literal mantle of SK?  :troll:

Completely impossible no matter what scenario you envision.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Mangetsu on May 09, 2014, 03:27:03 PM
I found an Site where the german speaking fans could order the Magazine
http://www.ocs-de.com/de/order.php pretty simple, if you have any questions you can e-mail them
btw the magazine costs 9 €, if you are ordering it from the site
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Benin on May 13, 2014, 11:15:07 PM
I have a feeling implementing the look of Falconia in similarity to Gaiserics Kingdom that it may appear to those who know the tales of that past that Griffith will try to be the saviour and attempt unify all countries in the humans eyes and of course cementing he is truly all powerful in their eyes and much more so than Gaiseric was. Apologies for the little rant.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 14, 2014, 03:04:18 AM
I have a feeling implementing the look of Falconia in similarity to Gaiserics Kingdom that it may appear to those who know the tales of that past that Griffith will try to be the saviour and attempt unify all countries in the humans eyes and of course cementing he is truly all powerful in their eyes and much more so than Gaiseric was. Apologies for the little rant.

He already is absurdly powerful in their eyes, though. And uniting countries is folly in this new world.



In the latest Young Animal (May 9 -- No. 10), Miura drew a tribute for March Comes Like a Lion's 100th episode. As fans may know, he's good friends with that series' author, Chika Umino. Needless to say, Miura's tribute was by far the most impressive.

(http://skullknight.net/images/march100-1.jpg)

Obviously, it's depicting that series' characters in Berserk's Fantasia. Aaaaand there's a dwarf! Berserk's first true dwarf designs, confirmed? :badbone: The girl on the far right also has a Falconian wing crest on her hat... Interesting.

(http://skullknight.net/images/march100-2.jpg)

Also of note in the issue was this, which was associated with March's 100th episode. Either one or all three of these guys are Miura. Different sides of the same guy? Different guys altogether? Dunno. But his name is definitely there in the top right.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on May 14, 2014, 03:34:28 AM
I really like the artwork he did! thanks walter.

And now you implanted the thought of maybe the group meeting/befriending a dwarf! it'd be nice.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Delta Phi on May 14, 2014, 03:45:50 AM
Oh wow, thanks for sharing this Walter! I really like that tribute.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gummyskull on May 14, 2014, 03:50:39 AM
AHH THAT IS SO CUTE!! Might this be Miura giving us a secret preview of life in Elfhelm?  :troll:
Thanks for posting Walter!


My Japanese is so rusty I can't translate the bottom drawing that well. But it is showing more than one side of Miura. The top is him as a Go player , the bottom is him as a mangaka.  He is saying "いつのまにかネタになって光栄" which google translates as "Honored to become a story all too soon". Totally makes sense!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Sammoniac on May 14, 2014, 04:00:41 AM
The dwarf is so awesome.. just look at his face! The beard and mustache are just perfect. We definitely need one for Berserk too! Let's hope that elves and dwarves coexist in Elfhelm.  :iva:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Maxwell on May 14, 2014, 05:13:11 AM
Wow that's awesome! It's the Band of The Bunny! That attire that the Falconian wings are on looks almost pope-like.

I can't get over the Dwarf's expression, he just looks so jazzed and ready to go.  :ganishka:

Thanks Walter!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 14, 2014, 11:46:01 AM
Obviously, it's depicting that series' characters in Berserk's Fantasia. Aaaaand there's a dwarf! Berserk's first true dwarf designs, confirmed? :badbone: The girl on the far right also has a Falconian wing crest on her hat... Interesting.

I think all the characters' designs are meant to be variations of Berserk equivalents, it's pretty cute. And I guess that does mean we might get some similar-looking dwarves! No doubt they'll find a kindred spirit in Azan's stout self. :azan:

Also of note in the issue was this, which was associated with March's 100th episode. Either one or all three of these guys are Miura. Different sides of the same guy? Different guys altogether? Dunno. But his name is definitely there in the top right.

The guy in the forefront is called Dobashi Kenji (土橋健司). He's a character from March comes in like a Lion, a level 9 shôgi player. He says his models are two people named Miura. In the lower right corner is Miura Kentarou (三浦建太郎), the mangaka we know and love. On the top right is Miura Hiroyuki (三浦弘行), a professional go player.

In the little blurb Kentarou Miura's character says something akin to "it's an honor for me to be featured here without noticing it."
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Walter on May 14, 2014, 12:40:21 PM
I think all the characters' designs are meant to be variations of Berserk equivalents, it's pretty cute. And I guess that does mean we might get some similar-looking dwarves! No doubt they'll find a kindred spirit in Azan's stout self. :azan:

Indeed, I don't necessarily expect the designs shown in this little tribute to translate directlyinto the series or anything, but I do think it gives us a good idea of where his headspace is at, in terms of populating Fantasia.

Regarding Azan, it was my first thought as well, hehe.  :azan: : "MY BROTHERS!"


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The guy in the forefront is called Dobashi Kenji (土橋健司). He's a character from March comes in like a Lion, a level 9 shôgi player. He says his models are two people named Miura. In the lower right corner is Miura Kentarou (三浦建太郎), the mangaka we know and love. On the top right is Miura Hiroyuki (三浦弘行), a professional go player.

Thanks for clarifying. Always cool to see other people's interpretations of Miura.

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In the little blurb Kentarou Miura's character says something akin to "it's an honor for me to be featured here without noticing it."

He's way too humble... Later on in YA, there's an interview with another of his friends, the guy who made Cestus. There's been a series of these the past 2-3 issues. Would be great if Miura did that kind of thing from time to time.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gummyskull on May 14, 2014, 02:03:50 PM
Thanks for the translation and clarification Aaz.
I can't stop looking back at Miura's illustration and imagining what we'll be seeing in upcoming episodes. I'm stating the obvious here, but he really has a knack for depicting the fantastical. He is very versatile with his drawing style as well.
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Aazealh on May 14, 2014, 07:01:01 PM
I think the real issue is being overlooked here, which is the renewed notion that Miura and Chica might be getting it on. :carcus:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: jackson_hurley on May 14, 2014, 07:09:35 PM
I think the real issue is being overlooked here, which is the renewed notion that Miura and Chica might be getting it on. :carcus:

I'd be glad for him if it's the case!
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Grail on May 14, 2014, 08:48:14 PM
Perhaps it's time for Skullknight.net to open a Chica Umino subforum to match the subforum Miura has created for her in his heart. ♥

Really psyched about that whole illustration, though. And with only one week until the next episode!  :beast:
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Gummyskull on May 15, 2014, 01:38:51 AM
Perhaps it's time for Skullknight.net to open a Chica Umino subforum to match the subforum Miura has created for her in his heart. ♥
I am in full support of this.  :carcus:
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Really psyched about that whole illustration, though. And with only one week until the next episode!  :beast:

Is it really just one week away? The excitement is killing me! What kind of breathetaking art will Miura surprise us with next? Maybe some images from inside the palace?
Title: Re: Episode 334
Post by: Devilwoman on May 17, 2014, 01:54:31 AM
That piece of artwork is so lovely. As much as I like Miura's detailed art, it would be so refreshing to get these kind of illustrations from time to time.