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Berserk => Current Episodes => Topic started by: m on February 19, 2018, 08:24:48 PM

Title: Episode 354
Post by: m on February 19, 2018, 08:24:48 PM

Not much to say other than the countdown begins:

http://www.younganimal.com/magazine/next.html

I canít wait for the episode to come out!  :daiba:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 20, 2018, 03:26:27 AM
So that ain't the pre-order right? :femto:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Sareth on February 20, 2018, 04:21:33 AM
Hereís the preorder.
http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOBK-2196891?s_ssid=e3452f5a8baf7b2668
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 20, 2018, 12:02:10 PM
Thx! Preorder done.  :guts: (still waiting for the January issue  :ganishka: )
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: IncantatioN on February 20, 2018, 05:51:41 PM
Thanks for the link, Sareth.

Thx! Preorder done.  :guts: (still waiting for the January issue  :ganishka: )

It's pretty weird I didn't get the issue carrying episode 352 yet but I received the one with 353.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 20, 2018, 05:54:21 PM
Thanks for the link, Sareth.

It's pretty weird I didn't get the issue carrying episode 352 yet but I received the one with 353.

HUmm weird indeed. But they do warn us (well at least in my e-mail) that it can take up from 2 to 6 weeks to get here and in extreme cases up to 3 months. I received ep352 a week or so after pre-ordering ep353. (I hope for you that it did not get lost in the mail. I know I would be pissed about that, and tbh I was starting to be a bit scared when it got to 6 weeks of waiting.)

Where do you live?
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: IncantatioN on February 20, 2018, 06:20:04 PM
HUmm weird indeed. But they do warn us (well at least in my e-mail) that it can take up from 2 to 6 weeks to get here and in extreme cases up to 3 months. I received ep352 a week or so after pre-ordering ep353. (I hope for you that it did not get lost in the mail. I know I would be pissed about that, and tbh I was starting to be a bit scared when it got to 6 weeks of waiting.)

Where do you live?

New York. I used to hit up the local Kinokuniya before but I've been tied up with work and I traveled a bit in the last quarter of 2017 resulting in not being able to order a copy from em. I've been checking YJA to see if I can buy it but it's a bit of a hassle. So I'd rather buy from CDJapan and spend a little more for the convenience.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 20, 2018, 06:26:56 PM
New York. I used to hit up the local Kinokuniya before but I've been tied up with work and I traveled a bit in the last quarter of 2017 resulting in not being able to order a copy from em. I've been checking YJA to see if I can buy it but it's a bit of a hassle. So I'd rather buy from CDJapan and spend a little more for the convenience.

yeah pretty much what I do here. I don't really have any specialized place where I could order them from. So I got into the cdjapan ship to get my copies now that my budget allows me to buy the single issues. It's Worth my 20$ I'd say.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: JMP on February 21, 2018, 02:42:25 AM
I can't believe it's already been a month since the last episode. I lost track of time. It was a nice surprise to check the forum and see that the new episode is coming soon! :guts: Thanks, y'all!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 21, 2018, 11:00:34 AM
The episode title is "Awakening", with a connotation of one being stimulated to wake.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 21, 2018, 11:38:58 AM

A few pages, very massive spoilers.

Yeah I recommend people wait until the full thing. This gives away the last page without much context.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Mangetsu on February 21, 2018, 01:33:39 PM

Absolutely amazing man
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 21, 2018, 01:43:06 PM
Haha, damn, what a motherload.

The symbolism of having the memories of the Eclipse spiral down into a heart with thorns... Overpowering connection to the Brand and the Idea of Evil.

And then there's everything else! I'm surprised, and also kind of relieved, that Miura didn't dwell on the actual traumatic event Ėthe rapeĖ more than he did. I guess he did not want to make it the focus instead of the restoration process. I do find that panel of Farnese's eyes where she's "absorbing" it all to be pretty amazing (and appropriately sinister) though. And of course we do get to see that shot of Guts when he's pinned down. I'm a big fan of how Miura depicted Casca's breakdown too: literally being broken into pieces, reduced to that empty shell.

Not much to say about the struggle between the dog and the falcon (who cares, basically), but I liked how it all went away the moment they put the fragment back. I also liked that Farnese's own experience with her insecurities (lovely callback to her as a child under her blanket) helped convinced the Sprite to go for it. And her running to the Brand and opening it like a little door has got to be one of the cutest moments ever in the series. The symbolism of having the dog emerge from the darkness, himself being restored (notice his leg), and howl to announce the completion of the ritual is also very potent (helped by the light and cherry blossoms, which I guess also signify that they're being called back to the waking world).
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Gobolatula on February 21, 2018, 01:56:07 PM
That was incredible.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 21, 2018, 01:59:54 PM
Jesus fucking christ! Sorry my languauge but I'm at work and must contain my emotion. That one is a biiiig one. Going back again at it while waiting for your surprised comments!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: DANGERDOOOOM on February 21, 2018, 02:18:36 PM
Jesus fucking christ! Sorry my languauge but I'm at work and must contain my emotion. That one is a biiiig one. Going back again at it while waiting for your surprised comments!

No apologies needed my friend. Fucking goosebumps, man. Fucking goosebumps. What a terrific episode. Can't wait to actually read it.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 21, 2018, 02:22:09 PM
Man, what an episode. The best visuals Miura has accomplished in years. Savor this moment, folks.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 21, 2018, 02:41:47 PM
Man, what an episode. The best visuals Miura has accomplished in years. Savor this moment, folks.

I'm already at my third time "reading it" (for obviously I can't actually read it but you get what I mean) Incredible beautifull visuals indeed.

These moments make me realize that I'm very very glad to follow this serie and how gratefull I am that it exist!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Kaladin on February 21, 2018, 02:42:57 PM
Incredible and emotional episode, and that's without reading a single dialog bubble, Miura is such a genius
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Delta Phi on February 21, 2018, 03:25:14 PM
Absolutely amazing and executed superbly (as if there was any doubt :slan:). This was everything I could have possibly hoped for.

I just can't believe it, after all these years, we're finally here. We're in a restored Casca era (with still so much healing left to be done, I'm sure). If someone were to start reading Berserk today, we could definitively tell them when/where in the story Casca's malady comes to an end, and that's just incredible to me.

Also, thank you to whoever spoiler tagged my post! I can't believe it slipped my mind!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: pupuce on February 21, 2018, 03:51:34 PM
14 years since the episode 237.... Damn...
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Cyrus Jong on February 21, 2018, 03:55:02 PM
That page where Casca opens her eyes, and we see they aren't huge, round, childish, and empty, but older, mature, and intelligent...

...I waited 14 years to see that page. It's so unreal to see it happen after such a long wait. But it was worth it. I can't imaging how grueling the wait must've been for those anticipating this moment longer, especially those who've been doing it the full 21 years, but for them, I hope it was worth it too.

And huge props to Farnese for staying calm amidst the attack by the Femto manifestation to gently goad the sprite back into her body. Casca wouldn't have made it far without you, and without you, she probably wouldn't have found it in herself to take this last step.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: poirot on February 21, 2018, 04:28:13 PM
Hi everyone, this is my first post. I've been reading in silence for years all of your ideas, discussions, and of course the manga.

That being said, I'm speechless about this episode. So awesome.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Grail on February 21, 2018, 05:01:26 PM
Hi everyone, this is my first post. I've been reading in silence for years all of your ideas, discussions, and of course the manga.

That being said, I'm speechless about this episode. So awesome.

Damn, what better time for your first post than on the biggest event of the series so far? Welcome! :guts:

It's truly a surreal feeling. I've pictured this episode in my mind so many times, but to say that I've experienced it is hard to believe. Looking back, I think the pacing for this entire dream sequence was very deliberate. The focus on Casca's experiences and recovery was clearly top priority - I'm grateful to Miura for not letting other characters' experiences take precedence. Even Farnese, who was definitely still growing and learning a lot from the ordeal, was focused entirely on her companion's recovery. The thorns around the heart and the double-helix were so sinister, and suggest that there's a lot of work left still to be done, but the brief glimpse at Casca's face at the end filled me with hope. It looks like we'll have our hands full for the remaining string of episodes (and the batch after that as well!  :ganishka: ). But I'm so glad to say this: welcome back, Casca! :casca:

Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 21, 2018, 05:10:59 PM
Preliminary translation courtesy of Puella. Because it's based on the Korean text (the quality of which we can't vouch for), there might be inaccuracies.

Page 01

Farnese: That is the last fragment ...A monster?
Schierke: Itís like a baby.

Schierke: ...I don't know why the last fragment has such a shape.
Schierke: However, prepare yourself.
Farnese: What?

Schierke: When I was almost swallowed by the Berserk's armor before, I had a glimpse of...
Schierke: Guts' memories...
Schierke: I never wanted to see it again if possible but...

Schierke: What weíre going to witness now is
Schierke: Probably the feast of madness!
Schierke: Be alert!

Page 04

Farnese: This is what broke Casca down...
Schierke: The main culprit.

Page 05

Farnese: No!

Schierke: You shouldn't get swept up! Donít lose yourself!

Farnese: It's flowing in...! Casca's scream!

Farnese: I can't express it in words...
Farnese: I feel like my mind is riven (torn into pieces)...!

Page 09

Farnese: This is...

Page 10

Schierke: ...The last fragment is the heart.
Farnese: Then once we put it back in the doll in the coffin...

Schierke: Wait...
Farnese: Hmm?

Farnese: What's wrong with you?

Schierke: This shape...
Schierke: It probably has a curse.

Farnese: A curse... an incantation.

Farnese: What do you mean?
Farnese: You mean if we put it back in the doll, something bad will happen?
Schierke: Then...

Schierke: ...I was careless, it's unlike me...
Schierke: Because restoring Cascaís sanity was on my mind, I forgot this...

Page 11

Schierke: If she keeps her sanity while having memories of such a horrible experience
Schierke: It will bring her an enormous pain that we can't imagine.
Schierke: ...Precisely speaking, she rather broke down because she couldn't endure it.

Skull Knight: What you wish for may not be what she wishes for.
Schierke: ...I guess this is what he implied.

Page 12

Schierke: Be careful!

Page 13

Farnese: Guts...!

Page 15

Farnese: But...!
Schierke: We'll have no more chances if we miss now!

Farnese: ...You're scared.

Farnese: Sometimes, even though you're aware of that you're in gloomy darkness, you just huddle and can't move.
Farnese: You don't know what to do by yourself...

Page 16

Farnese: ...So, as he did for me at that time
Farnese: This time I myself, of my own, will blow away your darkness.

Schierke: Farnese

Farnese: Because I don't want to think those days I've had on the journey with Casca and you, teacher, and them are meaningless.

Page 17

Schierke: ...I see. Because, from the beginning... this itself is the goal of the corridor of dreams... no, of our journey.

Schierke: Come on, hurry up! This nightmare will be over with it!

Page 20

Farnese: A door...?

Farnese: You will be surely able to meet him.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: bhaal on February 21, 2018, 05:13:24 PM
I want to cry, all those years waiting for this ... 2 times I tough I was a goner for good and one of my regrets was to haven't lived long enough to see this and now   :ubik:
May the Idea of Evil/God hand bless us with the chance to see next episode.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Gobolatula on February 21, 2018, 05:34:05 PM
Thank you so much, Puella, for the translation.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Grail on February 21, 2018, 05:46:54 PM
Thank you Puella for the speedy translation!


Page 11

Schierke: If she keeps her sanity while having such horrible memories
Schierke: It will bring her an enormous pain that we can't imagine.
Schierke: ...Precisely speaking, she rather broke down because she couldn't endure it.

....

Page 20

Farnese: You will be surely able to meet him.

Dammit... anybody got that old emoji of Guts sobbing? The Judos just aren't going to cut it. :judo: :judo: :judo:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Cyrus Jong on February 21, 2018, 06:00:29 PM
That was fast work, Puella. Thanks a bunch!

So Schierke remembered Skull Knight's foreboding words on the beach and reached the same conclusion to their meaning as Guts. And it was enough to give her pause and wonder if this was really the correct course of action. Which makes Farnese's speech to the sprite, and by extension to Casca herself, that much more powerful. She may not have suffered to the extent that Casca has, but she understands how it feels to be so afraid that all you can do is cower and hide. And more than that, she also knows that's not the right course of action. Sooner or later, you have to come out of hiding and confront that which you fear.

The student has much to teach the mentor. And Guts has inadvertently been serving as a mentor himself.

Dammit... anybody got that old emoji of Guts sobbing? The Judos just aren't going to cut it. :judo: :judo: :judo:

Well, there's always this one: :sad:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 21, 2018, 06:12:28 PM
Schierke: If she keeps her sanity while having memories of such a horrible experience
Schierke: It will bring her an enormous pain that we can't imagine.
Schierke: ...Precisely speaking, she rather broke down because she couldn't endure it.

Skull Knight: What you wish for may not be what she wishes for.
Schierke: ...I guess this is what he implied.

Thanks so much, Puella. Wow, I wasn't even thinking of this being addressed in this episode! The source of the trauma has been verbalized, we have an indication of Casca's condition upon waking, and we have a possible answer to SK's warning, all on one page. I wish we had a bit more on it, since it's such a huge part of Casca's internal conflict. But this is probably just opening the door to the conflict to come.

I've read through the ep 4 times now, and I can't get over how evocative and powerful the imagery of the heart is. The scene of the Eclipse being sucked into it, covered in thorns, and then thrust back into her chest, as the group hopes for the best upon waking up. Good luck, folks!  :sad:

Which makes Farnese's speech to the sprite, and by extension to Casca herself, that much more powerful. She may not have suffered to the extent that Casca has, but she understands how it feels to be so afraid that all you can do is cower and hide. And more than that, she also knows that's not the right course of action. Sooner or later, you have to come out of hiding and confront that which you fear.

More than that, it's setting up Farnese to be Casca's confidant, guide, and probably the bridge to rejoin her with Guts.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: MrFlibble on February 21, 2018, 06:32:55 PM
Amazing stuff, I like it when Miura revisits classic Berserk scenes with his new artstyle, I'm especially fond of his new take on the interstice face landscape, I also have to sing praises to the double page spread of Casca losing her sanity, it's an intense and heartbreaking metaphor of her sense of self shattering into pieces, as well as the final page of Casca opening her eyes, we've had a lot of amazing cliffhangers from this corridor of dreams sequence, but this has to be one of my favourites of all time.

 I would have preferred a lot more from the rape flashback itself, considering we've seen a lot of versions of the apostle slaughter flashback already, and only ever Femto from Guts perspective. And it must have been extremely hard for Schierke and Farnese to experience second hand, but in my opinion it gets brushed aside far too brazenly. Not good.

I had an image of Casca coming to terms with her trauma and wasting away the apparitions, but I wasn't expecting the dream to just vanish, however, nightmares tend to just switch off when they end, instead of exploding, so in retrospect I think this was more appropriate an end. I'm also glad it wasn't Bladewolf Guts who killed the Femto apparition off, since having the creature alive keeps the stakes high for Schierke and Farnese who have to contend with an unbeatable foe, it also serves the overall story by keeping the result of the real confrontation between Guts and Griffith ambiguous.

It's been said before, but I am excited for what comes next, not only for the character drama but because Casca is a pivotal character who's desires at this time have to potential to change the whole trajectory of the story, Guts has no real reason to leave Elfhelm at this point, he's got everything he wants, and he lives in the complete safety of a land immune to evil spirits. Something must come next, whatever that something is, I'll look forward to it.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Jaze1618 on February 21, 2018, 07:06:11 PM

 I would have preferred a lot more from the rape flashback itself, considering we've seen a lot of versions of the apostle slaughter flashback already, and only ever Femto from Guts perspective. And it must have been extremely hard for Schierke and Farnese to experience second hand, but in my opinion it gets brushed aside far too brazenly. Not good.


The panel in this episode of Casca's perspective where Guts has been pinned down by the apostles also has a shot of Femto from Casca's perspective. Its the panel immediately before Casca shatters. We see Femto's chin nose and eyes above her looking down at her as shes being held and raped while forced to watch Guts in that scene ...
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: MiyamotoPuck on February 21, 2018, 07:16:25 PM
What a thrill, this episode is fantastic! :isidro: Thank you so much for the translation!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: MrFlibble on February 21, 2018, 07:29:31 PM
The panel in this episode of Casca's perspective where Guts has been pinned down by the apostles also has a shot of Femto from Casca's perspective. Its the panel immediately before Casca shatters. We see Femto's chin nose and eyes above her looking down at her as shes being held and raped while forced to watch Guts in that scene ...

One panel that doesn't even dominate the page, like I said I would have liked to have seen more, even vol 17 has a better version of that scene.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 21, 2018, 07:45:55 PM
One panel that doesn't even dominate the page, like I said I would have liked to have seen more, even vol 17 has a better version of that scene.

I'm with Flibble on this. I was a bit thrown off by how quickly the rape itself was dealt with. Instead of making the physical rape the brutal, visceral experience I thought it would be, Miura emphasized the atmosphere of the Eclipse and the trauma of it. He was economical about it, and gave more weight to the new elements here (Casca's breaking, the heart, and the body's restoration). But looking over everything, I do think the act of the rape itself was de-emphasized as a result. I also think part of my reaction was based on expectation for what the Eclipse would do to Farnese and Schierke (nothing, really). Miura chose to focus on what mattered: The breaking and the reunification of Casca in the same episode.

The more I think about it, the more I love it  :casca:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: MockingEntropy on February 21, 2018, 07:47:25 PM
What a strong psychological build-up (kinda reversal, that is) through that already memorable "corridor of dreams" sub-arc. The whole thing was an anthology of symbolism. Once again, I'm simply flabbergasted.

I still can't realize what I was seeing in front of that last panel. 1997. Since that year, how many guys have been waiting for Casca; for that awakened face.

But yet, we should not fall in a rejoicing fest. That kind of situation is obviously fitting to call up a sinister hunch. Berserk.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: m on February 21, 2018, 08:20:26 PM
I'm with Flibble on this. I was a bit thrown off by how quickly the rape itself was dealt with. Instead of making the physical rape the brutal, visceral experience I thought it would be, Miura emphasized the atmosphere of the Eclipse and the trauma of it. He was economical about it, and gave more weight to the new elements here (Casca's breaking, the heart, and the body's restoration). But looking over everything, I do think the act of the rape itself was de-emphasized as a result. I also think part of my reaction was based on expectation for what the Eclipse would do to Farnese and Schierke (nothing, really). Miura chose to focus on what mattered: The breaking and the reunification of Casca in the same episode.

The more I think about it, the more I love it  :casca:

I couldnít agree more. I think it makes perfect sense that the focus was completely on Casca, but I wonder whether what we saw was it for Schierke and Farnese, in terms of the impact of what they experienced, or if there will be ramifications which will be presented to us at a later stage (where it wouldnít take anything away from Cascaís restoration).
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Gummyskull on February 21, 2018, 08:23:54 PM
I'm so full of emotions right now. I teared up at that last page!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 21, 2018, 08:49:33 PM
This episode was really jam-packed with content, and not all of it is obvious.

For instance, the Demon Child. As I had mentioned when the previous episode was released, I didn't see how the child could be featured in the memories in a way that made sense, and so I wasn't surprised by his absence. He was a great symbol for what went down during the Eclipse, but that didn't mean he would be in there. However, Miura didn't just draw him as a placeholder. I believe seeing the Demon Child in this context has brought Schierke and Farnese much closer to learning about Guts and Casca's son, who I think we all know will be central to much of the story going forward. It will fit with the other puzzle pieces they've gathered, like the Moonlight Boy's strange power and his affection for Casca (and Guts).

I also think what went down between Farnese and the Sprite has all but put an end to her crush on Guts. I had noted this earlier on in the dream sequence, and I think her resolve to help Casca get over her trauma further solidifies it. We will most likely get one last scene where she reflects on it, but it's pretty much done. On that topic, I find it amazing that Farnese and Schierke can have that much character development while this part of the story isn't about them specifically. It's the kind of dense but coherent storytelling you can only find in Berserk.

Obviously, the biggest development of them all occurs at the end, when Farnese draws from her own experience, from her personal journey, and resolves that she will help Casca through her trauma like Guts (and the others) helped her through hers. Very powerful memory (a bit reminiscent of Guts in volume 17), and it both establishes Farnese as Casca's soon-to-be confidante (a rearranging of group dynamics I had predicted years ago), but also as the group's future therapist of sorts. That might include helping Guts and Casca find each other again, but it could be more as well. Isidro, Serpico and Schierke all have issues they could use some help with...

The memories contained in the last fragment were what we expected: what broke Casca, meaning the Eclipse and more specifically her rape by Femto. It lasts only four pages, which is shorter than I had figured it would be. I feel that a full page of Femto looming over her and a bigger shot of Guts being pinned down would have better underlined the horror and despair of the situation. That being said I can see why Miura chose to focus on Casca's feelings, on her inner eye, and like I said earlier today I really like how he depicted the shattering of her mind. Schierke and Farnese's dialog also lends it much more weight, what with Schierke warning Farnese in advance and that incredible shot of Farnese's eyes as she experiences Casca's unspeakable pain.

The falcon's attack was also expected, and while I can't say it served a deep purpose, it was effective at adding the necessary tension to the scene. I really like how it is depicted in this episode, and I like that it has the upper hand on the dog, even with Farnese's little armor boost. The way it simply ceases to exist, along with the rest, as soon as the last fragment is inserted in the doll was what I wanted to see and I like how it was done. That, along with how the dog returns at the end, fully healed, and howls to complete the ritual, also validates what I posited when we were introduced to the nightmare. All elements were parts of Casca: the dog was her fighting-spirit, the part of her that struggled and didn't want to give up. The Sprite represented her true self, her ego. The broken doll was her broken mind, and the falcon and assorted monsters were her dark emotions, resulting from the Eclipse, the parts of her that prevented her to return. Those were dominant, which is why she couldn't regain herself without outside intervention.

Side note: Farnese still clearly refers to Guts when she tells the Sprite she'll soon meet the one she longs for. Time will tell who the Sprite actually referred to, but the fact it literally goes into the Brand feels like it could be a reference to Casca's love for her son (who she can feel... through her Brand). It's not necessarily the case, but I could see it happening. Speaking of the Sprite, am I the only one sad to see her go? She's just so cute. :judo: Who knows, though, maybe she's not gone forever. After all, Casca won't have a "Beast of Darkness" per se, but Miura might choose to personify her trauma like he does for Guts.

One thing I did not expect was for Casca's trauma to not be addressed at all. They simply restore her there and then... but with the caveat that the trauma will have to be dealt with afterwards. It makes complete sense of course, as it will allow the issue to be dealt with progressively and over a long period of time. Now the big question is what will this new Casca be like? How will that darkness affect her? Can't wait to find out.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Sareth on February 21, 2018, 09:27:06 PM
I wish I could be as excited about this moment as everyone else, I never really liked Cascaís character so Iím not feeling cathartic about her returning to the story. Episode still looks awesome though.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: MockingEntropy on February 21, 2018, 09:37:03 PM
I wish I could be as excited about this moment as everyone else, I never really liked Cascaís character so Iím not feeling cathartic about her returning to the story. Episode still looks awesome though.

This is not about liking a character or not. Take picture of the journey until that momentum; what it could mean for the story itself... and for Guts, out of the bunch.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Lord Leith on February 21, 2018, 11:17:24 PM
I guess my timing is pretty great cause I just started rereading Berserk from the beginning after a 2 year break and now I wake up to this episode ending with the suggestion that Casca, one of my favorite characters will return back to normal, hopefully by the time Im done my reread, it'll be March, a new episode will be out and we'll know for sure. Haven't been this excited for future episodes in a loooonnnngg time.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Truder on February 22, 2018, 02:17:12 AM
Bravo!  :judo:

This is exactly what I've been waiting for. Beautiful episode. This episode really touched me.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Fallen97 on February 22, 2018, 02:36:16 AM
Hi everyone, this is my first post. I've been reading in silence for years all of your ideas, discussions, and of course the manga.

That being said, I'm speechless about this episode. So awesome.

Same here, and such a great moment! It still amazes me how Miura manages to make me feel so much with his illustrations while similar "scenes" in big budget productions feel shallow in comparison.

I wish I could be as excited about this moment as everyone else, I never really liked Cascaís character so Iím not feeling cathartic about her returning to the story. Episode still looks awesome though.

Meaning you are not able to feel empathetic or that you outright dislike Casca as a character in the story? I suppose this is a whole different thread, but still... I'm just curious.  :???: In a way I also think many people are excited because Casca became a symbol for the struggle, a person's ability to heal and move on (much like Guts in his own action-packed way), despite the character itself not being the most likeable to everyone.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on February 22, 2018, 04:28:07 AM
Wow, we made it! I feel like we're the one's that have been on the journey to restore Casca's sanity all these years (Schierke and Farnese are Johnny-come-latelys =). Thanks first and foremost to puella and Aaz for the insta-translation, and everyone else on this journey with us, especially Wally for being our gracious host (this feels like a lifetime achievement award speech or something =). Anyway, I'm actually happy I got on late tonight so there were no spoiler page temptations and it's already translated!

I'm going to commemorate this momentous occasion a little differently now. This is an odd way to start a compliment, but I don't think this was Miura's best work or anything, just exactly the high quality execution we expect in the series' biggest moments, but which we pretty much always get in any and every moment, so it seems kind if normal! That is to say, Miura tries just as hard on the little things in the buildup on the way as in the big payoffs. We don't have to suffer through tons of shit being shoveled to us before we get rewarded, he makes it all rewarding along the way, which is why we're even still here after so long. Anyway, I just wanted to point out that despite this being the nost special of moments, it's also completely in line with what we've come to expect from the latest episode of Berserk, and that's fantastic.

I'm obviously very happy with how it was all done, from the focus on Casca to relief at not making her, and us, relive the rape. It looms so large we need not dwell on the particulars anymore, though it will inevitably come up again, but the devastation it wrought and the recovery are more important now. I also think it's a different time and if Miura did it over again he'd probably handle the scene differently; not that he did anything wrong the first time, but he'd do it just as different now than if he'd drawn it 20 years earlier, it's just how times, tastes and styles evolve as clearly as the artwork. I also liked the sparing use of the child and the way things just... ended, that was lowkey my favorite moment, the surreal transition between those two panels of the Femto-dragon and *poof* gone. It basically addressed all of our questions and concerns perfectly in the process (even Aaz's =). On that note...

Schierke: If she keeps her sanity while having memories of such a horrible experience
Schierke: It will bring her an enormous pain that we can't imagine.
Schierke: ...Precisely speaking, she rather broke down because she couldn't endure it.

Skull Knight: What you wish for may not be what she wishes for.
Schierke: ...I guess this is what he implied.

So the simplest explanation turns out correct, they wanted her back, but she was gone for a reason, and now they'll have to deal with that and what they did. I'm so excited and yet anxious with expectations, and the unexpected, because for the first time in a long time I don't really know what to expect out of a character in Berserk. Just "hearing" Casca talk again will be surreal, no matter what she says, and like Griffith after his return I don't necessarily expect her to be like her old self but something new, another iteration. A new phase, and a brave new world and phase of the story too, even moreso than Fantasia or Griffith's incarnation, and speaking if which, that last page...

(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/berserk/images/d/db/GriffithNewFace.png/revision/latest/thumbnail-down/width/732/height/1156?cb=20150326222658)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Theozilla on February 22, 2018, 04:44:43 AM
I'm so excited and yet anxious with expectations, and the unexpected, because for the first time in a long time I don't really know what to expect out of a character in Berserk. Just "hearing" Casca talk again will be surreal, no matter what she says, and like Griffith after his return I don't necessarily expect her to be like her old self but something new, another iteration.

Yeah that's one of the biggest things for me this event heralds, that we're really going into uncharted waters in terms of what to expect for the characters next. Like prior to this, Casca's awakening was a general plot destination/goal one could mold their suppositions around in terms of predicability. But beyond Casca be able to lucidly process her trauma now (and later revelations regarding the Moonlight Boy later down the line) there is so much unknown potential to the "what comes next" for the characters and the story.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Vixen Comics on February 22, 2018, 05:48:36 AM
I'm blown away! I am literally speechless right now, I was squirming in my seat like a little kid going through this. I honestly have not been this excited about something in a very long time. I was so excited that I had to go back and look over the episode two or three more times because in my excitement I was missing details.

 My goodness that last panel with the close up of Casca's face with that lucid expression on it...I've missed sane Casca's character design for her face, how she always had such a decided expression on her face, I just saw it. It's almost weird seeing her look like that with her long hair, it almost seems misplaced on Casca with long hair because I have grown so accustomed to her vapid wide eyed childish facial expressions with that physical feature.

I'm not sure how I feel about the rape thing, I honestly thought it was going to be longer but I guess not getting into too many graphic details on it is for the best. I like that schirke had the intutition to realize that something additional needed to be done before throwing the last memory fragment into the doll like the others and the tie in to what skull Knight said linked to this. And what a nice character moment for Farnese to give that last speech to the sprite and showing empathy for Casca's trauma. It was a great moment of understanding on her part because back on the boat Farnese lost her patients with Casca and lashed out at her a bit due her frustration of how Casca was acting. But now Farnese has seen first hand why she became infantile and sympathized with her, I feel it all came full circle in this moment and honestly it was beautiful. I hope that to those who have hated on Casca for going insane can finally appreciate the magnitude that the eclipse and her rape had on her and that it wasn't some any person regardless of how tough they are could just "get over it"without outside help.

But best of all in the end it was Casca's choice to come back to her self and it wasn't forced on her. I was kind of worried that how this would play out.





Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Sareth on February 22, 2018, 06:57:01 AM
Meaning you are not able to feel empathetic or that you outright dislike Casca as a character in the story? I suppose this is a whole different thread, but still... I'm just curious.  :???:

I mostly found her to be annoying in the Golden Age and then the long development stagnation afterward just made me apathetic towards her.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Death May Die on February 22, 2018, 07:34:54 PM
Amazing.

EDIT:

I was posting from work and I has tight on time, and simply wanted to state even just one word that was in the moment of me experiencing the episode.

Amazing episode. Like many have stated before, I too have waited years to see this moment. I never really have much to add that hasn't been said before when it comes to the latest episodes. I do keep up with the discussion without really ever posting much. Most of the time folks on here, put things I feel into better words than I can myself.

Casca has always been undoubtedly my favorite character, and through all the chapters, arcs, close calls, cute moments, I have waited for this "AWAKING" pretty much most of my life. So many times I felt for Guts with a heavy heart. I'm so eager to see how Casca processes the world and everyone. Again, simply a amazing episode.

Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Scorpio on February 22, 2018, 11:15:09 PM
And heres to another watershed moment! The upcoming character interactions and subsequent development have me chomping at the bit. I won't even speculate on how the next handful of episodes will play out, really I'm happy to just hop on and enjoy the ride. The various emotions and drama to come may not be quite as intense as what we just witnessed but it's going to be bubbly.

Hopefully I don't need to encase the rest of this in black, but spoiler warning to anyone reading further!

Jumping right into the debate at hand... I think how the rape was handled in this episode was just about spot on. We've already experienced it when it happened, we've reflected on it with Guts and his right eye's last sight, and now I think the way we see it from Casca's perspective fits in well with how we've been experiencing her memories in the dream so far- where nothing has been overly dwelled on. Making it far enough to even trigger the memory was a traumatic battle in itself and then you have Schierke's warnings as the memory opens with a stark picture of the eclipse. As with the other memories we, again, get right to the point as all the terrors and violence swirl in a horrifying, disorienting vortex with only the rape scene piercing through all that confusion, emphasizing it's importance before the gorgeous two-page spread of Casca shattering into pieces of a broken doll- highlighting both the critical moment as well as finally revealing the knowledge Schierke and Farnese were chasing all this time. I also don't think Miura necessarily needed to show more as in my opinion he already made us do the work for him...  we've been remembering/debating that harrowing scene for literally months, even casual readers were worried about how it would be broached. Having it be the only clear moment in a sea of other horrors told me enough. It's also important to remember that while she may be sane now, her trauma is far from cured. We'll just have to see how that's dealt with in the future.


It's been such a long time, but man, it's good to have her back.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: DirtiestM on February 23, 2018, 12:50:19 AM
Wow this was an amazing episode! I loved Schierke's recollection of SK's words on the beach and I wonder how Casca will react to Schierke and Farnese being inside her dream. It will be interesting to see how the old Casca will be merged with a lucid, post traumatic Casca and what her immediate reactions in the real world will be. I wonder if she will be confused or immediately frightened, haunted with flashbacks from the physical and emotional trauma experienced from the eclipse. I can't wait to see where the story goes from here! Also pumped for this upcoming podcast :guts:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Rodericus on February 23, 2018, 12:53:05 AM
Such a beautiful episode   :judo:
This is the moment that we've all been waiting for. Almost 22 years and over 260 episodes later, it finally happened - Casca is back!!  :guts: :casca:

And I love how Miura makes it clear that while Casca's sanity (and memories) may have been restored, her pain and psychological trauma are still there. And they are raw as ever. I really like how this episode reminds us there are some things that no amount of magic can make go away and that there will be no easy fixes. Even Danan's formidable magic is no silver bullet for Casca's condition.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Fancypantaloons on February 23, 2018, 03:59:54 AM
What a great episode. I cannot say more than what you guys already said. I'm happy right now.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Truder on February 23, 2018, 05:26:44 AM
And I love how Miura makes it clear that while Casca's sanity (and memories) may have been restored, her pain and psychological trauma are still there. And they are raw as ever. I really like how this episode reminds us there are some things that no amount of magic can make go away and that there will be no easy fixes. Even Danan's formidable magic is no silver bullet for Casca's condition.

Agreed. They put a heart covered in thorns back in the vessel. That could only mean her feelings and trust will be locked away from people. I really hope Guts gets what he wants though :sad:.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: BiQ-- on February 23, 2018, 09:47:12 AM
WHOA. It's done?? We have lucid Casca in the story again!!  Thank you for the translation, Puella & Aaz!

...but, what should we expect her to remember now, about the eclipse and everything afterwards? From Schierke's words I'm getting the vibes "not much", and I can fully understand why. But how will it even begin to get processed then? Will Guts get to tell her about it, and would it resurface her own memories, causing her problems or would it stay in some kind of "third-person" view then? Because if it stays in some kind of locked in state, it would surely cause all kinds of painful things for her emotionally. (Not that having those memories wouldn't be immensely painful in their own, but then she would actually have better chance to point the source of her pain.)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Menosgade on February 23, 2018, 09:51:28 AM
This left me wordless. I teared all the way through this episode. Thanks, Puella.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Esper on February 23, 2018, 09:53:56 AM
I don't want to be a Debbie Downer, seeing so many people rejoice at this episode, but I gotta tell you my thoughts, and if it gets a conversation going, that's a good thing, right?

It's about the portrayal of Farnese's & Schierke's reaction to the trauma, not the actual way trauma was shown, I'm happy with that.

I'd like you to recall the recurring scene in the first Black Swordsman ark, where Puck taps into Guts's mind the first several times. It visibly hurts Puck, or maybe just makes him uncomfortable, but re-read upon re-read I thought to myself: if someone connects to eclipse survivor's mind, it got to be like this but on steroids. The counter-argument I thought of was: well, by the time Puck and Guts meet, Puck is new to Guts's life, all the terrible things he experiences and experienced (that's actually the plot! =) ). But by the time we get to the corridor of dreams, both Farnese and Schierke been through a lot already.

Still, to me [v1p52-53, v2p95-98] was(is) the series' establishment of how painful can the memory be when one character mentally connects with another. Now, when we go to this new episode, yes, Farnese & Schierke look surprised, hand to the mouth motion, but then immediatly go to "look! a heart!". Not even a finger-to-the-bridge-of-a-nose, give-me-a-minute, this-was-too-much, just boom, boom, boom, scene into the next one, clear mind to speak of curses and repercussions.

Another thing I noticed is, on the last page, when Casca opens her eyes, we see glowy things around, which are spores, and we're back to the "bed of magic mushrooms", to the real world already, this episode! I realize this may be obvious and it's just me not realizing this immediately, but what I'm trying to get at is - this feels rushed.
I liked the pacing of all of the last episodes, basically since group's arrival to elfhelm, because I thought we were rushing to a specific event (events of this episode!). But now this was dealt with so quickly... what's the rush?
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 23, 2018, 11:18:24 AM
The various emotions and drama to come may not be quite as intense as what we just witnessed but it's going to be bubbly.

Oh I wouldn't be so sure, man. I think we're in for some very strong emotional moments going forward.

I think how the rape was handled in this episode was just about spot on. We've already experienced it when it happened, we've reflected on it with Guts and his right eye's last sight, and now I think the way we see it from Casca's perspective fits in well with how we've been experiencing her memories in the dream so far- where nothing has been overly dwelled on.

I agree, though I also stand by my first impression (that I would have liked that bottom panel to at least be a full page). One thing that also bears reminding is that the previous three episodes, which make up half of the sequence inside Casca's nightmare, have shown us Farnese and Schierke ascending a hill of horrors that is literally filled to the brim with penis monsters. It's all very explicit. And it culminated with them facing the king of the monsters, a dark falcon whose design is also deliberately penis-like. So I'm guessing Miura might have felt that he had hammered it in enough already.

As with the other memories we, again, get right to the point as all the terrors and violence swirl in a horrifying, disorienting vortex with only the rape scene piercing through all that confusion, emphasizing it's importance before the gorgeous two-page spread of Casca shattering into pieces of a broken doll- highlighting both the critical moment as well as finally revealing the knowledge Schierke and Farnese were chasing all this time.

Seeing her break at the midsection is another subtle cue that I appreciated.
On that note, nobody's talking about the Demon Child being the symbol for that last fragment anymore, but I'm still looking forward to how Miura will address the connection between the rape and the boy (and his corruption) in Casca's mind.

I really hope Guts gets what he wants though :sad:.

What happens next is anyone's guess, but you probably shouldn't expect a quick and simple conclusion. Guts and Casca's situation/relationship is complex in many ways. I have no doubt they will find each other again eventually, but the keyword here is "eventually". This episode showed Farnese and Schierke basically bringing Casca back without addressing her trauma at all, which means it will have to be dealt with going forward. On top of that, Casca now lives in a completely different world with different rules, she's in a strange place surrounded by strangers, and not only is Guts a pretty different person from who he was the last time she saw him, she herself is very different. And that's without even getting into the biggest deal of all: their son.

Now, when we go to this new episode, yes, Farnese & Schierke look surprised, hand to the mouth motion, but then immediatly go to "look! a heart!". Not even a finger-to-the-bridge-of-a-nose, give-me-a-minute, this-was-too-much, just boom, boom, boom, scene into the next one, clear mind to speak of curses and repercussions.

It's true, we don't see them dealing with the aftershock. I would have appreciated a page or a few panels showing them to be more affected by the event. However, Schierke warns Farnese to steel herself before they initiate the memory, and that might have mitigated the effect. We also do get that fantastic shot of Farnese's eyes as the memory rushes inside her, and her comments there, even more than the picture, are very telling. That brings me to what I think is an important detail: much like Casca's trauma has yet to be addressed, it's possible that Farnese and Schierke will feel the toll of what they experienced beyond the Corridor of Dreams. I wouldn't be surprised if they were haunted by what they've seen.

Another thing I noticed is, on the last page, when Casca opens her eyes, we see glowy things around, which are spores, and we're back to the "bed of magic mushrooms", to the real world already, this episode! I realize this may be obvious

Haha, I'm surprised that not everyone noticed it immediately. I mean, regardless of the spores, she's wearing her robes and all. And if you look at the penultimate page, they're clearly being "called back" to the waking world by Danan.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on February 23, 2018, 01:35:23 PM

Haha, I'm surprised that not everyone noticed it immediately. I mean, regardless of the spores, she's wearing her robes and all. And if you look at the penultimate page, they're clearly being "called back" to the waking world by Danan.

I've noticed it on the first read but I didn't think it was necessary to mention it since it was (for me at least) pretty clear that it was the spores from the mushrooms. Plus like you said, the robe....

But to come back to Esper's post, i did not feel the last episode to be that rushed. I was very satisfied with the pacing of the events and I would not be surprised if indeed Schierke and FarnŤse are in fact somehow affected by that trip Inside Casca's mind. Like it or not, they sure saw some fucked up scenery there and even though they knew they were just in a dream, it can mess you up.

I've never had anything that traumatising in my life and some of my nightmares mess me up so I can't even imagined how this nightmare can affect Schierke and FarnŤse at some level.

One thing for sure ; they deserve a well rest! After all, the others are partying while waiting. It's their turn to relax.

March... where are you?!?!?!
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on February 23, 2018, 01:50:01 PM
I don't want to be a Debbie Downer, seeing so many people rejoice at this episode, but I gotta tell you my thoughts, and if it gets a conversation going, that's a good thing, right?

Right.

(http://vevmo.com/sites/default/files/styles/adaptive/public/debbie-downer.gif?itok=AiBhTJbz)

Quote
I'd like you to recall the recurring scene in the first Black Swordsman ark, where Puck taps into Guts's mind the first several times. It visibly hurts Puck, or maybe just makes him uncomfortable, but re-read upon re-read I thought to myself: if someone connects to eclipse survivor's mind, it got to be like this but on steroids. The counter-argument I thought of was: well, by the time Puck and Guts meet, Puck is new to Guts's life, all the terrible things he experiences and experienced (that's actually the plot! =) ). But by the time we get to the corridor of dreams, both Farnese and Schierke been through a lot already.

Another pretty big factor is that Puck is an Elf and experiences and empathizes differently and deeply. We can debate how similarly Schierke and Farnese are being exposed to these memories and feelings in the state they're in and how strongly they should react in any case, but this definitely bolsters that Puck's experiences are unique. Another variable is it was Guts' memories/emotions too, and on top of the memory he was already consciously burdened by the trauma and anger that awaits Casca if that makes you feel better, Debbie Downer. =)

Quote
Another thing I noticed is, on the last page, when Casca opens her eyes, we see glowy things around, which are spores, and we're back to the "bed of magic mushrooms", to the real world already, this episode! I realize this may be obvious and it's just me not realizing this immediately, but what I'm trying to get at is - this feels rushed.
I liked the pacing of all of the last episodes, basically since group's arrival to elfhelm, because I thought we were rushing to a specific event (events of this episode!). But now this was dealt with so quickly... what's the rush?

Was it? I mean, it has been 20 years. :griffnotevil:

And despite this technically being THE EPISODE we see Casca restored, it's not like this event was all contained in this single episode unto itself rather than the last half dozen, a half volume, in addition to their physical journey and preparation for this on top of, again, 20 years. There was a possibility the dream corridor wouldn't even exist at all anymore once their mission was complete, so that confirmation in Casca's mind transitioning to the waking world was actually a nice touch. What else would you have done? Have Schierke and Casca talk about what just happened more, to talk with some mental representation of Casca? They've already been there and the former is what the real world is for. Also, making that last page of Casca the last of this episode or the first of the next makes no difference in the long run, but it provides a tremendously rewarding throughline and payoff of the completion of the ritual and its immediate real world consequences within the episode itself, and our experience as up-to-date readers, without stepping on the milestones to come such as her addressing the group, and Guts most of all.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Headless Death on February 23, 2018, 03:20:15 PM
What a fantastic Episode.  Thank you Aaz and Puella for the translation.  I caught back up with the series just in time to get to see the event I've been waiting for since I started reading the series back in 2004.  With the pace these last couple episodes have had, I get the feeling that Miura is getting a refreshed excitement of getting to do something that he has been thinking about how to do for 20 years.  And hopefully that means that this writing high may mean a period with fewer or at least shorter hiatuses. 
As far as the depection of the rape and the events of the eclipse from Casca's view, I feel like it was handled well.  To not emphasis on the details of the eclipse, and to focus on the emotional effect of the characters fit for this portion, because I get the feeling that now that Casca is awake, she will now be having flashes back to details of the eclipse during other parts of the story.  Much like how when the horse "Mounts" Farnese, Guts has his flash back to the Eclipse that reignites his anger/rage.  Casca may, for an example, see Farnese Pinned down to the floor, and get a flashback of Guts being pinned down reigniting her feelings of helplessness/despair of being able to do anything about it and may succumb to these feelings or fight them.
I'm excited to see her talk to Guts again for the first time.  I suppose I'm just excited about the phase of the story we are now entering, where we don't know the next goals of the characters yet.  I suppose I'm just excited about all of it. :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Esper on February 23, 2018, 04:55:30 PM
Oh, oh, thank you Puella and Aazealh for a quick translation so we can already discuss the latest events!
(Didn't thank you in the first post, what am I doing  :schnoz:)

Right.

Haha, yeah! Well, when after 5 years (for me) of waiting for this moment, I go at it like "Guuys, it's not the way I want it to be! Like the author has his own vision!", I think I can laugh at myself.

...and I would not be surprised if indeed Schierke and FarnŤse are in fact somehow affected by that trip Inside Casca's mind. Like it or not, they sure saw some fucked up scenery there and even though they knew they were just in a dream, it can mess you up.
That brings me to what I think is an important detail: much like Casca's trauma has yet to be addressed, it's possible that Farnese and Schierke will feel the toll of what they experienced beyond the Corridor of Dreams. I wouldn't be surprised if they were haunted by what they've seen.

Probably this then. Could be an emphasis placed shortly after waking up or just afterwards. This, Casca meeting Guts, recalling all that happened, the topic of their child, the fact that a bunch of the group is now to varying extent familiar with the Band of the Falcon history... Whew, that's a snowball of themes and topics.

Another pretty big factor is that Puck is an Elf and experiences and empathizes differently and deeply. We can debate how similarly Schierke and Farnese are being exposed to these memories and feelings in the state they're in and how strongly they should react in any case, but this definitely bolsters that Puck's experiences are unique. Another variable is it was Guts' memories/emotions too, and on top of the memory he was already consciously burdened by the trauma and anger that awaits Casca if that makes you feel better, Debbie Downer. =)

Sure, personally not the first time with the series when I went to analyze it "as 1s and 0s", this equals that, "the established rules of magic". It's a different and more correct thing to look at the corridor of dreams as a whole experiense, the fragments' visions AND Farnese&Schierke's journey through the dream, and when you do, it's incomparable with what Puck did and weighs more than just the visions, let alone separate ones.

Also yes, Guts was a walking boiling cauldron of emotions, heated by the eclipse, while Casca's dream sequence was of a broken mind containing... a rupture? If we switch and compare, Puck wasn't getting anything from Casca, while he even got images from Guts, and I don't even want to think what Guts's corridor of dreams would be.
I think I got too far with this.

I mean, regardless of the spores, she's wearing her robes and all. And if you look at the penultimate page, they're clearly being "called back" to the waking world by Danan.
Also, making that last page of Casca the last of this episode or the first of the next makes no difference in the long run, but it provides a tremendously rewarding throughline and payoff of the completion of the ritual and its immediate real world consequences within the episode itself, and our experience as up-to-date readers, without stepping on the milestones to come such as her addressing the group, and Guts most of all.

What I'm saying is, this page made me realize two things: first, we're done with the dream, even though I could use more of it, and second, the pacing is not stopping, we're still moving forward like this!

I can't wait for what happens next in the story.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Headless Death on February 23, 2018, 06:43:17 PM
Next episode is going to be heavy. Guts and Casca reunion accompanied by the latter's realization that the Eclipse wasn't just a bad dream. I don't think I've ever been this excited for a new Berserk episode.
Agreed.
As for what their next goals are, I've been thinking back to the scene on the boat after the Sea God section where Guts looks out the window and begins to inwardly declare what he will do after his current journey is over.

This could easily be taken as Guts deciding to go after revenge again (and I've seen a lot of people come to this conclusion). But I've also been wondering if this isn't him resigning himself to staying on Elfhelm with Casca for her sake. Since he comes to this decision after thinking to himself that Casca became insane because she couldn't cope with the trauma. Maybe he is deciding here that he doesn't repeat his previous mistake and leave her behind for revenge while she is in such a critical state. And the look in his eyes is one of frustration because he knows this means keeping himself away from what he wants.Of course things obviously wouldn't go that way or at least continue that way forever for the sake of the narrative. Just a thought.
That is a good scene.  I took this scene as a reminder that Guts wants revenge, even though he knows he should not pursue it.  I see his reflections at other times of missing the opportunities to be with what matters as important to this part as well.  Where he declared he would never leave Casca again, or his reflecting that no matter how much you force something it will never be what it once was, or Godo's talk with him to remind him that hatred consumes a person, and that hatred is the place people go when they cannot handle their own sorrow.  I agree that he had resigned himself to staying on the Island with Casca, since when reflecting he also mentioned that he would only need to use the berserker armor until he gets there, hoping by doing so he would be able to retain his remaining senses.  As for next goals, I almost see a SK intervention, Moonchild, or something to convince Guts to return.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 23, 2018, 10:17:00 PM
I don't even want to think what Guts's corridor of dreams would be.

I'd actually like to see that, as unlikely as it is. Casca and Puck venturing into that that tortured mind... that'd be quite a sight!

This could easily be taken as Guts deciding to go after revenge again (and I've seen a lot of people come to this conclusion). But I've also been wondering if this isn't him resigning himself to staying on Elfhelm with Casca for her sake. Since he comes to this decision after thinking to himself that Casca became insane because she couldn't cope with the trauma. Maybe he is deciding here that he doesn't repeat his previous mistake and leave her behind for revenge while she is in such a critical state. And the look in his eyes is one of frustration because he knows this means keeping himself away from what he wants.Of course things obviously wouldn't go that way or at least continue that way forever for the sake of the narrative. Just a thought.

Episode 331 acted in many ways as a reminder of various characters' state of mind, goals and current development. So there actually isn't much that is new in that scene with Guts. He still wants revenge for what Griffith did, but Casca's well-being is also still his top priority above everything else. Nothing has changed in that regard. Of course they'll have to get off the island eventually (and not just that, but head to Falconia for the final confrontation), but it's not going to come from Guts just being bloodthirsty. Circumstances that are out of their control will push them to do it. The real question is: what will these be?

We already have some clues, the most obvious one being that the flow of time in Skellig is different from what it is in the rest of the world. That means they can't stay too long. That also means anyone left behind is likely not to be seen again.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Zurth on February 24, 2018, 03:50:32 PM
I have no words. I started reading this series when I was a little kid, and now 14-15 years later we're getting something of a closure of events which occurred while I still couldn't ride a fucking bike. I've grown through puberty and into adulthood waiting for this moment, and now when I have it in front of me I can't contain myself. :judo:

The art.. THE ART!! oh my god! Miura has made some terrific panels and spreads since Guts and co. got off the boat, but this chapter was a damn treasure trove of magnificent and poignant pages and panels..

During one the long(er) hiatuses I made peace with the fact that I might never see the end of the story, I've gotten more from this unfinished story than I have from 99.99% of the media I've consumed in my life already, so letting myself get distraught over a distant possibility when I've already gotten this much didn't make sense to me. However, there was always this itching thing in the back of my mind, one last request for Miura if you will.. All I wanted was to see Casca's face again.

And now I gotta go and do something about my teary eyes before the family dinner..

Peace. :casca:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: The Perenium Falcon on February 24, 2018, 06:23:20 PM
Oh boy, what a time to be alive. After all these long years of struggle, itís finally happened. I never thought Iíd see this moment, and now that itís finally here.... I donít know what to say.
It does put me in a reminiscent mood. Like many of you have said before me, Iíve been on this wild ride for many years. My entire adult life, actually. How long has it been exactly? 18 years, I think, or close to. In the time that I first discovered Berserk, and longed for Cascaís sanity, I graduated high school, and college, my career has changed several times, I got married, had a kid, and separated. My interest waxed and waned over the years, partially due to the hiatuses, to Life, and also because I just never thought theyíd get off that fucking boat. In that time I have read and reread the series from first to last, and Iím in the middle of it again. The timing couldnít be better, as Iíve just come to Episode 82.
But here it is! Itís beautiful. Itís wonderful. And itís heartbreaking. For so long Cascaís kept herself locked away from those horrific events, the death of all those she held dear, and the betrayal of the one she saw as her Savior. It broke her, and her madness was the last line of defense. Now sheís been forced to confront it, to relive those most painful moments, by those who thought they had her best interest in mind. Will she be thankful? Can she handle the harsh realities? Will she be able to come to terms with the truth, to accept the world she now finds herself in?
I really donít have any insight to share. Itís been years since Iíve said anything here, or discussed Berserk at length, so youíll have to forgive me. Iím happy to see this forum is still living and breathing, and welcoming new strugglers! I really just wanted to peek my head in for once and share in this momentous occasion.
(Apologies if I overshared there  :farnese: or didnít share enough   :carcus::casca: )
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Lord Leith on February 24, 2018, 08:17:16 PM
I really donít have any insight to share. Itís been years since Iíve said anything here, or discussed Berserk at length, so youíll have to forgive me. Iím happy to see this forum is still living and breathing, and welcoming new strugglers! I really just wanted to peek my head in for once and share in this momentous occasion.

(Apologies if I overshared there  :farnese: or didnít share enough   :carcus::casca: )

No need to apologize man, we get it, this is truly a new benchmark in Berserk's story, I'm still in disbelief and feeling sentimental over this and I've only been into Berserk for about 7 years, I can't imagine what you and the others who've read it for nearly (or over) 2 decades must be feeling. Oh and welcome back to the forum :)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 24, 2018, 09:39:11 PM
Oh boy, what a time to be alive. After all these long years of struggle, itís finally happened. I never thought Iíd see this moment, and now that itís finally here.... I donít know what to say.
It does put me in a reminiscent mood. Like many of you have said before me, Iíve been on this wild ride for many years. My entire adult life, actually. How long has it been exactly? 18 years, I think, or close to.

Hey man, welcome back! Good to hear from you. Once you get "caught up" you should come on our podcast :guts:

Quote
and also because I just never thought theyíd get off that fucking boat.

Oh no have "the boat people" infected you too? You've been away too long, and you've become irradiated. They weren't on a boat for very long. From the Sea Horse to the shoreline of Skellig lasted a few panels at most.  :griffnotevil:

Latest podcast should be up tonight or tomorrow, folks. It's a good, long one.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Lord Leith on February 24, 2018, 10:05:53 PM
Seven years? Wow. Iíve only been a Berserk fan for four years, and this still feels like a long-awaited moment for me. This is another turning point for the series, perhaps even exceeding Gutsí epiphany in the Conviction Arc in force of impact. Itís an exciting time for Berserk fans in general. I can only imagine how you guys who have been reading the series the longest are feeling.

I can only speak for myself with this but in all honesty I think the long waits between episodes and volumes is actually a factor in what makes Berserk so appealing to me, I understand that for a lot of fans the monthly release schedule and hiatuses can kill their hype and stagnate their overall interest in the series (I was the same way a couple years ago) but as I've gotten older I feel like I'm growing with the story and characters, it makes it more epic to me, knowing that the series began years before I was born, that I got into it in high school and that by the time it ends I very well may have a child or two to share it with. (albeit once they're old enough to handle it of course  :ganishka:)

Casca being awakened like this totally caught me off guard, I was expecting and willing to wait another 4+ years for it to happen so the day that I woke up and saw the episode, it didn't just make my day or week, its made my entire month. Its moments like this that let me know I can have faith in Miura because no matter how long it takes, he always delivers!

Latest podcast should be up tonight or tomorrow, folks. It's a good, long one.

Awesome, looking forward to it Walter. You, Aazealh, and Griffith (among others like Grail depending on the episode) always offer great insight so I'm sure the duration will be warranted.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on February 24, 2018, 10:46:45 PM
Iím happy to see this forum is still living and breathing, and welcoming new strugglers! I really just wanted to peek my head in for once and share in this momentous occasion.

Nice to see you, old man. :SK:

P.S. The sea journey was awesome, don't make me fight you! :mozgus:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on February 25, 2018, 12:54:40 AM
I would've been the first to roll up the welcome wagon for our old friend, translator and creator of the board's most popular thread (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=7078.0), but why aren't you using your old account, Ranemaka (not that I'm one to talk =)?

Would be cool to have you back though, even for only once in a series occasions, and your write up was lovely. For us old timers, Berserk is a truly unique yet viable way to mark the passage of time in one's life. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: stein on February 25, 2018, 07:18:08 AM
Ah, it's too much.  No story has ever impacted me like Berserk does.  I was hoping the sequence would end in a final panel with Casca opening her eyes, and Miura delivered!  :casca:  I started reading in 2003, so not quite as long as some others here, but it sure was a long journey to this point.  :judo:  I don' think I've ever as enthusiastically thought, "What happens next?" as I have now.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Judo on February 25, 2018, 12:28:10 PM
This episode sent shivers down my spine. I was literally stunned by the last page.
Never before has it been more clear how an elaborate narration can pay off over time.
I feel kinda privileged to be able to witness this story grow since I discovered the Manga 2001.

And a big thanks to SK.net for being a constant beacon of high-quality Berserk-fandom.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Kaladin on February 25, 2018, 09:46:32 PM

Farnese: You will be surely able to meet him.

Forgot to say but thanks for the speedy summary! I was wondering if the Japanese text matches the quote above, or is it something along the lines of "We will surely meet again" or something else.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 25, 2018, 10:08:30 PM
Forgot to say but thanks for the speedy summary! I was wondering if the Japanese text matches the quote above, or is it something along the lines of "We will surely meet again" or something else.

What you read was from the Korean source, and Aaz said it could contain errors as a result. We don't have access to the Japanese pages yet, but we will in a few days.

In other news, podcast is up: http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=15463


 (http://skullknight.net/podcast/podcast93.png) (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=15463)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: GTZ on February 26, 2018, 01:22:03 PM
It's my first post since almost 10 years.

I suscribed in this communauty to be the most closer to the real information and comment about Berserk and during all this years i never be disapointed by the communauty.

Like a lot here, i began reading Berserk in 2004, and wait fort 14 years this moment.

The same as everyone, i am atonished by this episode, it's a sentiment i can't really express, accomplissement ? Free of a huge burden ? Something i wait during so long, that it became a part of myself. And now a new step for me and for the manga and the Berserk Communauty.

I am happy to see good comment too, in some poor place we can read some curious comment about the retrieval of Casca and a weird course of action of her (like join Griffith/Femto...).

I will not repeat that everyone has said, but a little, this arc was very good, very well maid. Some complain about the representation of the rape, but i join Aaz about it (in a post earler), the precedent episode with the ascension of the montain of corps, express it i think. With the Penis Monster representation.

However, i think by this episode that Casca see a lot of the Falcon troup die. We didn't expect it really during the eclypse, because during this time, in the manga, we are concentrate on Guts. But it's normal that the eclypse memory for Casca concentrate a lot about it. Because, Guts was'nt here ton see it, but Casca see all the member of Hawk die.

A course of action i alway considerate after the awakening of Casca, it's the role of Casca. She is the real leader of the Falcon Troup, and like Ricket say it to Griffith he is in the old one, the real one, no the falcon of light. What i mean, is Casca will maybe, lead a new troup of Falcon, lead all the person who oppose the new world created by Femto.

It's difficult to express it very well in english.

Thanks a lot everyone and please pardon me for every writing mistake i made in my post.

See ya.

Edit : I listen the postcast. Nice work, the first one i listen.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on February 27, 2018, 02:11:26 PM
I wish I'd mentioned it on the podcast, but it seems to me that an immediate crisis for a restored Casca could be that she'll be suicidal. She might even be placed on a suicide watch kind of situation, with Danan and others trying to help her cope. And I  can only really imagine one cure for that scenario ó her child (presuming she doesn't remember it immediately). Whether his existence is revealed to her directly by SK or Danan (not a great option), or if like in the past, the child appears before her to stop her from serious injury ó to herself.

It's also possible that my mind is too hasty in leaping to the next likely story milestone, and not being open to the other possibilities of what will happen with Casca/the group in the interim.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Smith on February 27, 2018, 02:34:34 PM
My concern would be if she remember what happen during the period while she was insane. For eg Farnese and schierke.

Or if she remember that back in vol 23, Guts did accidentally tries to harm her.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: BiQ-- on February 27, 2018, 04:21:15 PM
Regardless if she remembers the time when Guts was possessed and assaulted her, and even if she doesn't bear conscious ill will towards him if she does, she might still have quite uncontrollable feelings of fear of him.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 01, 2018, 09:01:46 PM
Forgot to say but thanks for the speedy summary! I was wondering if the Japanese text matches the quote above, or is it something along the lines of "We will surely meet again" or something else.

There is no subject in the Japanese sentence. However, given the context, it is pretty obviously referring to their previous exchange in episode 350 (where the Sprite says there's someone she wants to meet, and Farnese says she'll definitely help her meet him). So the version I posted is correct.

Or if she remember that back in vol 23, Guts did accidentally tries to harm her.

I've often seen people put a lot of emphasis on those events, which makes me think they don't understand their purpose. When Guts gets possessed and strangles Casca, it makes her afraid of him. It also shows he can't protect her perfectly by himself. It underlines how having to protect someone instead of fighting alone wears him down. Later, when he loses it and assaults her again, the point is that he can't even trust himself anymore. That's what tips the scales and makes him accept the company of Isidro, Farnese and Serpico. That's why he reluctantly lets people in: so they can look after Casca.

The point I'm making here is that those scenes have already served their purpose. Will they be referenced again? Probably. And it might even be Guts that tells her about it, out of guilt. But will it be a huge, pivotal plot point? I don't think so. Casca has been through much worse, and Guts himself arguably wronged her more when he left her alone for over two years to go hunt down apostles. They also have much more important things to care about. Like their son. Or Femto, the one who ruined their lives.

Not even Puck, who has been with Guts longer than anyone in the party  knows the real reason Casca is afraid of Guts.

You're mistaken. The sexual assault isn't the "real" reason Casca feared Guts. She became afraid of Guts after he strangled her. This is very clearly depicted in the manga and we see Guts reflect on it. That's why he then tied her up (which made her hate him more). The fact he forcefully kissed her and bit her breast several days or weeks later didn't help with the situation, but she had already stopped trusting him at that time (which is why she fled while he dozed off and stumbled into the brigands' camp). And we never see that second assault as making a difference in her behavior.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on March 01, 2018, 10:47:25 PM
The point I'm making here is that those scenes have already served their purpose. Will they be referenced again? Probably. And it might even be Guts that tells her about it, out of guilt. But will it be a huge, pivotal plot point? I don't think so.

Sorry, #TimesUp, Guts!

The scandal of the accusations will be so great Guts will have to leave the series. Meaning the main character will fittingly become Cas.. GRIFFITH! Who conveniently denies any wrongdoing in the pursuit of his dream(s). :griffnotevil:

Kidding aside,  it would be interesting if she didn't remember and he was put in a position of whether or not to confess it. Maybe HE won't be comfortable with her out of guilt as you said.

Casca has been through much worse, and Guts himself arguably wronged her more when he left her alone for over two years to go hunt down apostles. They also have much more important things to care about. Like their son. Or Femto, the one who ruined their lives.

I agree that there's a lot of over-interpretation of those scenes, much like the Skull Knight's infamous warning about Casca's wishes, and you put their straightforward purpose very succinctly. But I'm still tantalized by their future potential for drama; I think they, along with the aforementioned abandonment, could contribute to a chilly reunion and long reconciliation between them, even if they're naturally relieved and happy to see each other initially (Guts might also have unreasonable expectations now that she's "back").

What really makes those scenes still relevant to me is exactly what you said about Guts not being able to trust even himself in the end. I think that realization can go for Casca too, especially given the nature and cause of her trauma, her re-victimization, and Guts tragically becoming a part of it himself. He was an exception before that, earned her trust as a man and differentiated himself from most others she encountered as a trusty protector, and those attacks, particularly the latter, obviously put him on the other side of the equation and I wonder if the betrayal of that won't carry over a bit in her pain.

In short, the heartbreaking thing about it to me isn't how bad it was relative to Casca's other experiences or whether or not it ultimately changes how they'll feel about each other (I don't think it will), it's that it made Guts "one of them" instead of the one she could trust, which is almost the worst trespass. I kind of hope it's an issue just so they can work it out and have some catharsis.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Theozilla on March 02, 2018, 06:03:51 AM
Just wanted to echo Griffithís sentiments regarding Gutsí sexual assault of Casca and how its potential consequence may/should be adressed. Like Griffith said it may not have been the worst trauma Casca has experienced relative to all the other stuff she has suffered, but itís still significant enough, and uniquely to Cascaís and Gutsí relationship, that it warrants specific direct narrative addressment.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 02, 2018, 08:59:18 AM
Miura's comment for this issue: I went to the exhibition of Noriyoshi Ohrai. A great part of our current drawing style resulted from the influence we received from him in our high school days.


What really makes those scenes still relevant to me is exactly what you said about Guts not being able to trust even himself in the end. I think that realization can go for Casca too, especially given the nature and cause of her trauma, her re-victimization, and Guts tragically becoming a part of it himself.

Well sure, but let's not forget what Guts & Casca's relationship was like to begin with. For example how she stabbed him with a sword before they first made love, or how he strangled her (then broke down crying) during the act. Like I said, it's not that those scenes are unimportant, but we have to remember who the real Casca was. A warrior who could fend for herself. A military leader who stood up to Guts when it was needed. That's the Casca we're getting back.

And of course, things are very different now, but that's also kind of the point. They both went through the Eclipse, and it has left a trauma that has dwarfed everything else. Guts is still completely haunted by it, and we've already been warned that Casca will be as well. I think everything else will be secondary to that, and to their objectives going forward (i.e. their son). Which is why it seems to me that people who focus too much on those two scenes from volume 23 are missing the big picture.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: RaffoBaffo on March 02, 2018, 09:34:31 AM
The Digital Edition of YA is out:
https://www.hakusensha-e.net/top?id=14991
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 02, 2018, 09:53:45 AM
The Digital Edition of YA is out:
https://www.hakusensha-e.net/top?id=14991

Thanks for the reminder Raffo. Something I'm just now realizing, but the online editions of YA don't include the pin-up pages anymore, which means they also have a different cover. I like them better this way to be honest.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: jackson_hurley on March 02, 2018, 12:46:53 PM
Thanks for the reminder Raffo. Something I'm just now realizing, but the online editions of YA don't include the pin-up pages anymore, which means they also have a different cover. I like them better this way to be honest.

What kind of cover are offering for these release if I may ask? You got me curious.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on March 02, 2018, 01:00:28 PM
What kind of cover are offering for these release if I may ask? You got me curious.

It's shown on the link that Raffo posted. Instead of the regular bikini-clad woman (http://www.younganimal.com/img/magazine.jpg), it shows Futari-H with a few other characters, including Guts.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on March 02, 2018, 04:35:31 PM
Well sure, but let's not forget what Guts & Casca's relationship was like to begin with. For example how she stabbed him with a sword before they first made love, or how he strangled her (then broke down crying) during the act. Like I said, it's not that those scenes are unimportant, but we have to remember who the real Casca was. A warrior who could fend for herself. A military leader who stood up to Guts when it was needed. That's the Casca we're getting back.

And of course, things are very different now, but that's also kind of the point. They both went through the Eclipse, and it has left a trauma that has dwarfed everything else. Guts is still completely haunted by it, and we've already been warned that Casca will be as well. I think everything else will be secondary to that, and to their objectives going forward (i.e. their son). Which is why it seems to me that people who focus too much on those two scenes from volume 23 are missing the big picture.

Good points all, and like I said, while it's not going to ultimately make or break anything I don't think that particular incident is necessarily baked in to the inherent violence of their lives and relationship either. It's also been part of the big picture since it happened, so I sympathize with people extrapolating that forward, because whether it will remain relevant or not is part of the BIG question of what the awakened Casca will actually be like. She'll still have her trauma from the Eclipse, and, if she remembers it, the subsequent hurt that resulted in their relationship cooling since 23, but obviously regaining their history and understanding of circumstances can mitigate that, perhaps fully. I don't know, I feel like you and I are discussing possible points of emphasis on two adjacent shades of gray here. I guess I wouldn't be surprised either way, and you feel more strongly it won't be a big deal. I definitely think it'll be relevant to the conversation with those two, but as you point out, Casca ultimately has much bigger fish to fry.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 02, 2018, 05:22:50 PM
I don't know, I feel like you and I are discussing possible points of emphasis on two adjacent shades of gray here.

Yeah pretty much. Like I said, I do expect it to come up at some point, just not to be its own pivotal plot element that will make or break their relationship.
And I also think things that are never mentioned, like Guts' reaction to the Demon Child's birth or his subsequent treatment of him, have potential to be big points of contention.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on March 02, 2018, 05:54:50 PM
Yeah pretty much. Like I said, I do expect it to come up at some point, just not to be its own pivotal plot element that will make or break their relationship.

Yeah, and as you pointed out, it already served to break their relationship so that could very well be taken for granted at this point and so we continue from there (they don't need to break it again before mending, just deal with it).

Farnese, future amateur therapist, will work on their couples' counseling and present the findings in a chapter of her upcoming book, Burning the Witch Inside.

And I also think things that are never mentioned, like Guts' reaction to the Demon Child's birth or his subsequent treatment of him, have potential to be big points of contention.

Definitely, and that could very well be two-sided. I still don't think Guts is going to be crazy about the Demon Child re-entering their lives in whatever form that takes. He finally softened on it a bit, but I think it's going to take a while for him to come around on the idea that he has a "legitimate" offspring that may not be a complete monster. Ultimately, I think the idea of taking their son, and their lives, back is what turns things for both of them though.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 02, 2018, 07:30:06 PM
Yeah, and as you pointed out, it already served to break their relationship so that could very well be taken for granted at this point and so we continue from there (they don't need to break it again before mending, just deal with it).

Yep!

Definitely, and that could very well be two-sided. I still don't think Guts is going to be crazy about the Demon Child re-entering their lives in whatever form that takes. He finally softened on it a bit, but I think it's going to take a while for him to come around on the idea that he has a "legitimate" offspring that may not be a complete monster. Ultimately, I think the idea of taking their son, and their lives, back is what turns things for both of them though.

I think Guts will feel bad about his past behavior (he really was an asshole to the child). I've never forgotten the two pages at the end of episode 238 where he thinks about him. I think they're indicative of what's to come. There's tons of ways this could go, of course, but to me the real deal down the line will be facing the fact the boy is essentially fused with Femto. That could lead to an impossible choice: should they try to kill Griffith and kill their son in the process? It's easy to see how Guts and Casca could fall on opposite sides of the issue (though I would hope that all would end well eventually).
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on March 02, 2018, 07:49:51 PM
Chiming in here from the peanut gallery. I just wanted to say that it's pretty amazing that we're having these conversations now, when it's no longer a distant hypothetical for when these issues will actually be addressed in the story. We really made it!  :ubik:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on March 02, 2018, 09:48:42 PM
I think Guts will feel bad about his past behavior (he really was an asshole to the child). I've never forgotten the two pages at the end of episode 238 where he thinks about him. I think they're indicative of what's to come.

Yeah, that whole episode was fantastic and he was waxing pretty nostalgic and certainly treating the subject with more thoughtfulness and regard than ever before. When he learns the truth he'll be pissed too; it's like adding injury to insult to injury. I think he'll come around fittingly to the Rob Roy point of view, "It's not the child that needs killing."

Quote
There's tons of ways this could go, of course, but to me the real deal down the line will be facing the fact the boy is essentially fused with Femto. That could lead to an impossible choice: should they try to kill Griffith and kill their son in the process? It's easy to see how Guts and Casca could fall on opposite sides of the issue (though I would hope that all would end well eventually).

Well, the mega-convenient feel good option is that they can somehow be separated and/or Griffith destroyed and the child spared, maybe even in the same fell swoop! Hallelujah! As cheap and impossible as that sounds, it actually makes a bit of sense when you think a bit bigger: if the whole Idea/God Hand power structure were to be somehow destroyed or destabilized, perhaps all traces could be removed, leaving behind a relatively human child and de-branded parents (despite the kid oweing its current existence to that power in the first place; yeah, cheating =). That's some mega happy ending stuff though.

Similarly, but more in the bittersweet direction, the boy could live on as some sort of etheral spirit or at least be said to be saved and cleansed of evil ala Anakin Skywalker, or at least better off dead than damned as Griffith's thrall. This would work well with the child somehow rebelling as his vessel  and sacrificing himself to destroy Griffith/save his parents in a bit of a switch.

Or, yeah, they just have to kill their kid to Griffith for the greater good and it'll be as bad as that sounds. I'd be surprised though if there's not going to be some crazy yet hard won magical solution because that's completely consistent with how we got here (magic ceremonies), so it's a fair game solution as well (and we just went through a fantastic ritual to save/restore a character =). It's almost too perfect a motivation for Griffith's destruction, and the effort that would take, to coincide with the child's salvation, as well as our heroes and the world.

Chiming in here from the peanut gallery. I just wanted to say that it's pretty amazing that we're having these conversations now, when it's no longer a distant hypothetical for when these issues will actually be addressed in the story. We really made it!  :ubik:

I had a similar moment replying to Aaz earlier where I had to correct myself talking about Casca's return like it was still coming. She's already back!  :guts: :casca:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 03, 2018, 10:35:02 AM
Or, yeah, they just have to kill their kid to Griffith for the greater good and it'll be as bad as that sounds. I'd be surprised though if there's not going to be some crazy yet hard won magical solution because that's completely consistent with how we got here (magic ceremonies), so it's a fair game solution as well (and we just went through a fantastic ritual to save/restore a character =). It's almost too perfect a motivation for Griffith's destruction, and the effort that would take, to coincide with the child's salvation, as well as our heroes and the world.

Yep, all good scenarios you listed and I think it'll fall somewhere in-between all those lines. They will be compelled to face Griffith to save the world, and their connection to him will be both a blessing and a curse. Their son will act as a unique Achilles' heel, but at the same time they will be torn over his potential fate. Casca will want to save him above all, while Guts will struggle to get past his overwhelming desire for revenge. And ultimately they'll manage Ė in extremis Ė to achieve the perfect result of killing Femto while saving the boy... but at what cost to themselves?

But the point of that particular comment of mine was really that it was a personal moment between Guts and Casca that will be need to be dealt with between the two of them.

Sure, although I don't think anyone was saying otherwise (well, except you in the previous episode thread) (http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=15437.msg250509#msg250509).

As Griffith said, I don't think the assault is necessarily removed from the big picture.

Well I also didn't say it is "removed" from the big picture, just that it's a detail in it among many others, and not the most important one.

I don't think the assault will be a new pivotal plot point that will cause a rift between them either, because there already is a rift between them. And just like Casca dealing with her trauma, I think this is something that shouldn't be healed away with magic. It should be something that they work through and deal with the consequences of together.

I disagree. Casca was afraid of Guts (and of all men in general) in her previous state, but that person is gone. In fact it wasn't so much a person as an absence of one. Guts and Casca's relationship is effectively getting a reset here. If there has to be a chill between them, I don't think it will simply be inherited from the time she was insane. I don't think she'll wake up and instinctively be distrustful of Guts. Because even if she keeps her memories from that period or has flashes of them from time to time (I quite like that idea), her personality will make a big difference in how she processes them.

I think Episode 238 shows that he may have more ambivalent feelings towards him if nothing else. He doesn't feel anger or hatred when thinking of the child. Instead he seems more sad when he thinks that he may still be wandering around alone in the night.

Yeah that's what I was talking about.

But on the topic of the child being fused with Griffith's vessel (and the two of them probably sharing a body as well)

Just to be clear, the term "vessel" here refers specifically to the body. The child's corporeal body was overtaken by Femto during the Incarnation ceremony (where Femto "took flesh"), but his ego somehow survived the procedure.

I think the thought of exploiting his son's connection to Griffith would make his desire for revenge (and maybe even his dissatisfaction with prioritizing Casca) grow even stronger.

I'm sure the Beast of Darkness would find the idea delectable, but I doubt Guts as a whole would be fine with the boy's death. Also, there is no need to prioritize Casca's protection anymore, since she's cured.

She has shown a strong motherly instinct towards her son while her mind was regressed, but with the knowledge of him sharing a body with Femto, the man who raped her and sacrificed her comrades/subordinates to be slaughtered, I could easily see her contemplating or even making the decision that killing him would be for the best.

I have a hard time imagining Casca being Ok with killing her son.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 03, 2018, 02:22:57 PM
This ritual in the Corridor of Dreams has just been the beginning of Casca's healing process. It didn't heal away her trauma and it won't automatically settle any issues she might have with Guts.

You're confusing two different things. It's true Casca's trauma wasn't healed by the ritual and that she'll have to deal with it going forward. I was the first to say it. But that doesn't mean she'll show the same symptoms. Otherwise the Corridor of Dreams would have all been for nothing. The reflexive fear she had of men went along with her insanity. Now that it's cured, there's no reason to assume it will remain. And her "issues with Guts" that you are referring to were a subset of that general fear of men. It wasn't specific to him. She was afraid of him like of every other guy, then he managed to gain her trust, then lost it. I feel like I'm repeating myself here, but if they are to have issues to sort through, I would expect them to be of a higher order.

Yeah, it was what you were talking about.  :slan:

Yes... Which makes me wonder why you felt the need to reiterate it.

Not sure why you're drawing a distinction here.

You're not sure why I'm drawing a distinction between the Beast of Darkness and Guts generally? OK... Well there is more to Guts than just the Beast of Darkness. Miura created that character to show Guts' internal struggle. What the Beast wants isn't what Guts himself really wants. It's just a part of him, not the whole. That's why I distinguish the two.

I could even see him making the decision to exploit the child's connection in some way in order to get revenge (whether that be killing him, or using that connection to "control" or "influence" Griffith in some way, but that's too far ahead).

They will necessarily have to exploit that connection to defeat Griffith in any case, as I'm sure you've read me say in the past.

As for Casca, I don't know if her need for protection is necessarily over just yet, seeing as she still has to deal with the trauma of the Eclipse. She may not even want to fight at first and decide to hide away from everything on Skellig.

This is obviously not the same thing as her not being able to take care of herself because of her madness... That time has come to an end.

I do believe that Casca's feelings towards the child will be a bit complicated however (which almost goes without saying).

Sure. Most of my interventions are to point out that things are more complicated and nuanced than people think. Everything we've been talking about here is guaranteed to involve complex emotions and circumstances.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on March 03, 2018, 10:33:53 PM
If it is frowned upon, I'll try to refrain from doing so in the future.

No, I was just puzzled because it seemed unnecessary.

I always saw the way Casca treats Guts after the choking and assault to be a bit more specific and personal than her usual fear of other men.

Yeah, there are regular reminders of her dislike of him after those incidents from volume 23.

Related to this, I'm also having trouble remembering any times she has shown a real fear of men outside of times involving attempted rape or sexual intent besides her initial meeting with Guts after the Eclipse (which could also just be explained by his excited and desperate approach and Casca being more timid shortly after the event), which makes me think it is less a general fear of men and more of sexual situations involving men (I'm uncertain, so please correct me here if I'm mistaken).

It's true, talking about "fear" is too extreme. That being said, she is shown to be more comfortable around women in general. For example, Rickert tells Guts that she only trusts Erika in volume 13. Later, when the group is formed, she immediately takes after Farnese. And when Farnese leaves for a while in Vritannis, it's Schierke who looks after her. It's a consistent pattern.

I think it's a bit debatable whether many of these symptoms can be attributed to the trauma itself or the state of insanity she was in. For example, her phobia of men/sex is something that I don't expect to just disappear after she regains her memories of the Eclipse.

Well yes, I had gathered as much. Fortunately for us that matter will be settled soon.

But as I said in an earlier post, the assault is just one of several things that Casca could likely be upset with him about, including his abandonment of her, disagreements involving their child, and perhaps even taking her to Elfhelm to restore her mental health without her consent

Yeah, I actually said that myself before you did.

This is sort of what I meant when I said there would still be a rift between them after she was healed. Even if the specific reasons as to why they have grown apart aren't the same, there are still quite a bit of issues they will have to work through.

But you said there is already a rift and that it would continue. That's very different. No one's disagreeing that Guts and Casca might have points of contention or even just that their relationship will need to be rebuilt. There's a ton of reasons why that would be the case (that's what I've been saying all along). The problem to me is you were saying the previous issues she had while insane would carry over, as opposed to the new Casca having her own set of issues.

Of course, I just wasn't sure why you were making the distinction in response to my point in particular when I said in the same sentence that he would be conflicted over the idea.

Because the way you worded the sentence I quoted didn't feel true to Guts' character to me. Even though you said he would be conflicted.

Although I would say that it is a bit misleading to say that "what the Beast wants isn't what Guts himself wants." [...] That doesn't mean it represents what Guts most wants, mind you. But that's a bit of a tangent and a whole other can of worms to get into.

There is nothing misleading about what I said. The Beast of Darkness is one facet of Guts and does not represent the whole of his persona. What it advocates for within Guts' mind doesn't represent Guts' true desires. It's only partial, like a pulsion. You essentially say the same thing here in bold, albeit less elegantly, so I guess you agree with me anyway.

Fair enough, but the point of what I was saying was that I expect Guts' struggle between Casca's needs and desires and his own desire for revenge to still be a continued conflict for him going forward.

I know what you're trying to say, but I don't think it's the proper way to frame it.
Guts' dilemma was between protecting Casca or going for revenge because he couldn't do both. He made that choice a long time ago, and now it has borne its fruit.
What comes next are new choices. And fundamentally, they will not be between revenge and "Casca's needs and desires". They will be between Guts' own various desires. This is an important distinction to make.
Needless to say, Casca will have her own choices to make, and as will each member of the group. I expect it to be a rich time for character development.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Kaladin on March 16, 2018, 10:52:00 PM
The preview of the next YA issue has a griffith image, I'm curious as to why they chose griffith instead of the usual guts, could we be switching plots next episode or is it just YA gibberish
(http://www.younganimal.com/magazine/img/mag_next02.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on March 16, 2018, 11:10:44 PM
The preview of the next YA issue has a griffith image, I'm curious as to why they chose griffith instead of the usual guts, could we be switching plots next episode or is it just YA gibberish


You probably shouldn't read too much into that. The publisher chooses those seemingly at random. And the text mentions Guts and Casca.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Kaladin on March 17, 2018, 02:33:51 AM
If Miura decides to switch I'm sure he'd know how to handle it well but yeah I would rather have the crew finish their business at elfhelm and then we see how the outside world changed. It would be pretty impactful that way.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on March 17, 2018, 03:03:43 AM
Switching back to Falconia or Rickert right now would be a really bad move.
If Miura decides to switch I'm sure he'd know how to handle it well
I just donít see any way he could do a location switch right now and make it work.


Seriously guys, calm down.  :schierke: We're at 6 posts now over an advertisement that means absolutely nothing other than Berserk is coming back next week. That image of Griff is from the cover of Vol 33. Those images aren't chosen by people intending to preview the contents of the next episode. Go back and look at the previous ones. They just use what they have on hand.

I could see the story cutting back to Falconia in a few episodes after Cascaís initial reactions and interactions with Guts and the rest of the party upon waking up. Then we could cut back to Falconia to witness Griffithís wedding to Charlotte and coronation followed perhaps by a declaration to his new subjects about what his future plans are. That would be the perfect way to end Griffithís story before a timskip IMO.

Some time should already have passed. They've only been on Skellig for a day, but that could be weeks, or months in the outside world. I agree that seeing the coronation next makes the most sense, but it could also water down the effect of a dramatic passage of time if Miura chooses to lift the veil a bit early. Furthermore, there has to be something more than the coronation and a declaration from Griffith. It wouldn't be Miura's style to switch perspectives just for that formality, I don't think.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on March 17, 2018, 04:47:43 AM
I don't think Miura would be foolish enough to further delay the biggest moment of the series to date, one we've literally waited over a decade for, the most anticipated event since the eclipse and what will be so satisfying for many of us after all these years to finally see the coronation. Maybe we could see Casca's reaction or something.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Oburi on April 01, 2018, 12:39:45 AM
Oh boy, what a time to be alive. After all these long years of struggle, itís finally happened. I never thought Iíd see this moment, and now that itís finally here.... I donít know what to say.
It does put me in a reminiscent mood. Like many of you have said before me, Iíve been on this wild ride for many years. My entire adult life, actually. How long has it been exactly? 18 years, I think, or close to. In the time that I first discovered Berserk, and longed for Cascaís sanity, I graduated high school, and college, my career has changed several times, I got married, had a kid, and separated. My interest waxed and waned over the years, partially due to the hiatuses, to Life, and also because I just never thought theyíd get off that fucking boat. In that time I have read and reread the series from first to last, and Iím in the middle of it again. The timing couldnít be better, as Iíve just come to Episode 82.
But here it is! Itís beautiful. Itís wonderful. And itís heartbreaking. For so long Cascaís kept herself locked away from those horrific events, the death of all those she held dear, and the betrayal of the one she saw as her Savior. It broke her, and her madness was the last line of defense. Now sheís been forced to confront it, to relive those most painful moments, by those who thought they had her best interest in mind. Will she be thankful? Can she handle the harsh realities? Will she be able to come to terms with the truth, to accept the world she now finds herself in?
I really donít have any insight to share. Itís been years since Iíve said anything here, or discussed Berserk at length, so youíll have to forgive me. Iím happy to see this forum is still living and breathing, and welcoming new strugglers! I really just wanted to peek my head in for once and share in this momentous occasion.
(Apologies if I overshared there  :farnese: or didnít share enough   :carcus::casca: )


DUDE, I swear to god the other day I was actually thinking that with all these crazy new developments I wonder if some old timers ( specifically Slightly Green, as I first knew you) would pop up. I'm so glad that's the case. Welcome back friend!

PS - Fuck you the boat trip was awesome.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Aazealh on October 14, 2018, 07:36:30 PM
I'm reviving this thread because it just dawned on me that the final segment of Schierke and Farnese's journey into Casca's mind was inspired by the tale of Sleeping Beauty. Think about it: a 'princess' asleep because of a curse, lying in the midst of a forest of brambles, guarded over by a black dragon. It's only superficial obviously (and there's no prince or magic kiss or anything), but I feel like it's too on point to just be a coincidence, especially since Miura does like to work folklore into the story. To be honest I can't believe I didn't think of it earlier.

What got me thinking was coming across this awesome concept art by Eyvind Earle for the 1959 Disney movie.

(http://www.aazealh.net/Divers/Disney-SleepingBeauty.jpg)

(http://www.aazealh.net/Divers/Disney-SleepingBeauty2.jpg)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: ApostleBob on October 14, 2018, 10:09:37 PM
That's a pretty solid connection. I like that Miura makes it his own by also incorporating the monsters, and memory shards.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Griffith on October 14, 2018, 10:44:45 PM
Yeah, it's impossible to unsee it once you make the connection, especially with the artwork (Guts-Dog is visually knight and horse in one =).
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Grail on October 14, 2018, 11:27:32 PM
Nice catch, Aaz! Between the visual and narrative similarities, the inspiration is pretty obvious when you think about it. Now, all Berserk needs is one of these... :troll:

(https://i.imgur.com/qRinKX4.png)
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Walter on October 15, 2018, 01:33:41 AM
I feel blindsided, because Sleeping Beauty is one of those films I never paid any attention to. I doubt I've ever even seen the full thing. Oh well, great catch Aazealh.
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: Truder on October 15, 2018, 04:49:14 AM
Wow, thats pretty neat that you caught that. Easy Karma point. :ganishka:
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: IncantatioN on October 15, 2018, 02:32:38 PM
Brilliant Aaz, the link is a safe bet *thumbs up*
Title: Re: Episode 354
Post by: SleepersWake on October 15, 2018, 11:42:25 PM
Nice catch, Aaz! Between the visual and narrative similarities, the inspiration is pretty obvious when you think about it. Now, all Berserk needs is one of these... :troll:

(https://i.imgur.com/qRinKX4.png)

*long sigh*