Author Topic: Episode 234  (Read 62560 times)

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Offline Griffith

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #175 on: January 28, 2004, 10:00:23 PM »
Also being the hawk of light might also mean something as far as the shadow power of Guts Dragonslayer. But this is mystique :)

It's specialized for the supernatural, but I think the Shadow thing was rough translating early on. Translators?

About gravity, I disagree: controlling gravity couldn't parry Guts' sword the way it happened neither dispace cannon balls trajetory that drastically it did.

Well, I don't like gravity either, or anything else for that matter. Like I said, trying to physically (as in actual physics) explain Femto's powers or Griffith's is a little silly. Also, I believe Femto exploded the charge before it hit him, I don't remember him deflecting it (unless you mean the same thing, like a protective field of sorts), but I don't have volume 3 in front of me to check.

Anyway, Griff has fate on his said. Like Wally said, arrows may go through Ganishka, but they can't even touch Griffith.

-Griffith
« Last Edit: January 28, 2004, 10:01:54 PM by Griffith »

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #176 on: January 28, 2004, 10:08:25 PM »
Well, I don't like gravity either, or anything else for that matter. Like I said, trying to physically (as in actual physics) explain Femto's powers or Griffith's is a little silly. Also, I believe Femto exploded the charge before it hit him, I don't remember him deflecting it (unless you mean the same thing, like a protective field of sorts), but I don't have volume 3 in front of me to check.
I think it deviated, not exploded. But then what difference would it make? ;D
Anyway, Griff has fate on his said. Like Wally said, arrows may go through Ganishka, but they can't even touch Griffith.

-Griffith

Still, if it was protected from all fate's misfortuned like Achilles was for example(not considering his ankle), what could it possibly oposse him? Why follow the manga if Griffith can control fate and knows what he is about more or less.
Wouldn't it all depend on his will?
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Offline Walter

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #177 on: January 28, 2004, 10:13:00 PM »
Griffith doesn't control fate. We're talking about Causality.  Griffith is just riding the wave created by "God" (Griffith is lowercase "god").  Griffith's will to conquer is also part of causality.  

Have you read the series called Berserk?
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline *Gyom*

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #178 on: January 28, 2004, 10:13:21 PM »
isn't Griffith's ankle his demon-baby-heart ? as Flora roughly said, fate, theories dont make it all...
Guil

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #179 on: January 28, 2004, 10:31:45 PM »
Griffith doesn't control fate.
I never disagreed with that.
We're talking about Causality.  Griffith is just riding the wave created by "God" (Griffith is lowercase "god").  Griffith's will to conquer is also part of causality.  
I am confused.
Is Griffith's will subjective to causality or causality subjective to Griffith's will?
Have you read the series called Berserk?
No
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline Griffith

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #180 on: January 28, 2004, 10:33:00 PM »
No

This is the truest statement you've ever made.

-Griffith

Offline Walter

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #181 on: January 28, 2004, 10:33:27 PM »
Is Griffith's will subjective to causality or causality subjective to Griffith's will?
Read my post again. I will not repeat myself.
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Schwabe

Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #182 on: January 28, 2004, 10:38:00 PM »
It's spelled causality. And I don't mean that god goes in and changes around events to his whim... Events shape themselves around him. Surely this has already been evident to you in the series.

For example, in this arrow shooting instance.  It is unlikely, however, possible that the arrows will all miss him.  Griffith appears in the exact instance for all the archers to be on a really bad day, causing them to all miss at once. Why? Causality. Pre-determined conditions warp themselves for god's desires.

Reminds me of how before griffith became femento an assasins arrow missed him (well, struck him without inflicting a wound)

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #183 on: January 28, 2004, 10:40:06 PM »
Read my post again. I will not repeat myself.
Well, I am not sure I understood what it is trying to say then.
You made an example with the arrows and that I got what you wanted to mean. But I am not sure where your final post is getting at.
You are talking about God's wave. And Griffith has a power on surfing amongst the widths of the wave: is that what you are trying to say?

If so, I allready replied that Griffith being an excellent strategist, it would be very hard to go against his will. This doesn't mean that I exclude it. Just expanding your theory.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2004, 10:48:54 PM by xechnao »
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #184 on: January 28, 2004, 10:41:01 PM »
Reminds me of how before griffith became femento an assasins arrow missed him (well, struck him without inflicting a wound)
Well in that case Beherit=fate saved him. The same happened with Zodd
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #185 on: January 28, 2004, 11:13:36 PM »
isn't Griffith's ankle his demon-baby-heart ? as Flora roughly said, fate, theories dont make it all...
Guil
Good call
Honestly, if indeed Griffith is that powerfull-invincible as Walter's theory is sugesting, then maybe that would be the only hope.
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline Griffith

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #186 on: January 28, 2004, 11:30:04 PM »
You never considered that even if Griffith's will controls everything, it wouldn't be interesting too see what that might be in time?

-Griffith

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #187 on: January 28, 2004, 11:39:53 PM »
You never considered that even if Griffith's will controls everything, it wouldn't be interesting too see what that might be in time?

-Griffith
In my point of view, will is something subjective to one's nature. It depends to what you are what you want. Being God (all-powerfull) and having a will are not compatible to me.
So I don't think this logic would be possible to exist as you are suggesting it.
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline Griffith

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #188 on: January 29, 2004, 12:08:37 AM »
Let's say for the sake of argument, Miura's story will be interesting and Griffith has a will (remember all that hill of swords stuff, kiddos!?). Also, we need to drop our personal definitions of a God when talking of Griffith, all that matters is Miura's definition in the story.

-Griffith

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #189 on: January 29, 2004, 12:24:27 AM »
Let's say for the sake of argument, Miura's story will be interesting and Griffith has a will (remember all that hill of swords stuff, kiddos!?). Also, we need to drop our personal definitions of a God when talking of Griffith, all that matters is Miura's definition in the story.

-Griffith
Yes, but this doesn't say something about Griffith's will, independetly from the rest of the world-story. So it's like asking if we like to see the story -what happens eventually in the story. Yeas, it's like just asking if we would like to see Miura's interesting story.
Well, certainly yes, but I don't see any doupt or logical question needed to be answered.
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline SaiyajinNoOuji

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #190 on: January 29, 2004, 12:29:55 AM »
Alright guys I know I have contributed to this as well, but lets move back on the disscussion of 234 and move the speculation stuff about Griffith's powers and his relation to fate and Casulity to the speculation section  ;)
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Offline Smith

Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #191 on: January 29, 2004, 03:40:18 AM »
Would it be surprising if that person in front of Charlotte is not Griffith?  :o



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Offline Swordsman in Sable

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #192 on: January 29, 2004, 04:54:31 AM »
It is certainly possible that this is emperor G's true form, but it seems strange to play up his monstrous appearance that we saw in previous chapters, only to have one different form than visually foreshadowed (though this did happen with Rosine). With the Kushans using sorcery as it is, I don't doubt that he has some personal magical ability, such as the attacks he used to decimate the apostle strike team, so maybe this fog form is solely because of sorcery.

On the other hand, if he is using magic, he seems to be using it in a way that hasn't been seen/explained yet (all the elemental spirtual stuff doesn't seem to apply here), so it could just be him using apostle abilities, or the Kushan variety of sorcery, or maybe a combination of the two. And, of course it could just be that the previous beastly shots of him were just to make him seem scarier, and his fog form has been foreshadowed as much as his nasty face, just in a different way.

At any rate, the chapter is another great, edge of your seat chapter, with a beautiful (and perfectly scanned) 2 page spread! :P I'm sure the next chapter will answer some questions and create a slew of new ones.
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Offline Bill

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #193 on: January 29, 2004, 05:30:30 AM »
It is certainly possible that this is emperor G's true form, but it seems strange to play up his monstrous appearance that we saw in previous chapters, only to have one different form than visually foreshadowed (though this did happen with Rosine). With the Kushans using sorcery as it is, I don't doubt that he has some personal magical ability, such as the attacks he used to decimate the apostle strike team, so maybe this fog form is solely because of sorcery.

I believe I stated this in my recent post.

On the other hand, if he is using magic, he seems to be using it in a way that hasn't been seen/explained yet (all the elemental spirtual stuff doesn't seem to apply here)

His fog form is quite similar to Flora's fire form in chapter 229 (also mentioned previously in my post). While it may be his apostle powers in play, I'm willing to safely bet that he has yet to reveal his true form.

I believe that in an earlier chapter he mentioned that everything in the fog he can control/sense, this likely an attribute of his sorceror powers and thus his connected to his ability to turn into fog.
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Offline LordofMasks

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #194 on: January 29, 2004, 10:03:25 AM »
Well I think he is an Apostel with some kind of Magic powers...because the Fog form like Floras Fire form looks but in the Chapter where he is with Charllotte he has a few Face changes that really point to an Apotel form... ;D

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Offline Mizar

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #195 on: January 29, 2004, 11:06:04 AM »
It's specialized for the supernatural, but I think the Shadow thing was rough translating early on. Translators?

I think the translation was fine, only people's interpretation of it is not. Schierke mentioned some kind of shadow/silhouette clinging to Guts' sword. It didn't sound like a shadow with a capital "S", though.

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #196 on: January 29, 2004, 11:51:14 AM »
How about what Sk told Guts about Dragonslayer to hurt Slann? What about the fact that evil spirits vanish with light and gain activity with shadow?
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!

Offline LordofMasks

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #197 on: January 29, 2004, 12:18:37 PM »
Well Dragonslayers has become Specialized like told by Skull through the Slaying of people and Apostels for sure...but I think that maybe it is like a Shadow energy that has powered the Sword...like a possession or something in that direction...
 8)

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Offline Mizar

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #198 on: January 29, 2004, 12:25:05 PM »
How about what Sk told Guts about Dragonslayer to hurt Slann?

What about it? His sword could hurt Slan because it was strenghtened through the killing of thousands of evil spirits. I didn't see the word 'Shadow' mentioned there, though.

Quote
What about the fact that evil spirits vanish with light and gain activity with shadow?

Yeah, obviously this is all possible because of the awesome power of the Shadow! ::)

Offline xechnao

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Re:Episode 234~~~WarcraftIII..:)
« Reply #199 on: January 29, 2004, 12:30:25 PM »
What about it? His sword could hurt Slan because it was strenghtened through the killing of thousands of evil spirits. I didn't see the word 'Shadow' mentioned there, though.Yeah, obviously this is all possible because of the awesome power of the Shadow! ::)
Exactly. Those evil spirits dwell in the shadow. And the sword touching them gained, as Sielke said, an aspect of shadow. What's there to laugh about?
And nobody said "the Shadow" as if it was a superhero.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2004, 12:35:01 PM by xechnao »
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
Pay attention people. Watch your back!