I'm just saying that they (the artists at Studio Gaga) probably could've used some more practice before continuing Berserk. I'm not sure if Mori is the one writing the dialogue or not, but it's Miura's assistants doing the actual drawing. I know they worked on Duranki first, but it's become clear Miura was the one keeping that project in-line as well, so functionally they went from being background artists drawing grass to continuing the work of one of the most talented mangaka ever. They have a lot to learn about paneling, pacing, and presentation, as well as how the characters should behave. I just think they were probably a bit hasty in jumping straight in rather than honing their skills with a small "proof of concept" work first. I know for Mori, what they did on 364 was that proof of concept, but it has become clear they had a lot left to learn.
Episode 368
- Thread starter Aazealh
- Start date
The official announcement as well as the comments of everyone involved suggest that he is. And given that he is leading the project it would be flabbergasting if he wasn't.
That was clear pretty quickly after Dur-An-Ki's announcement to be honest. Let's just say that Miura was a very generous man.
Well again, this is where Mori's involvement was supposed to make a difference. He's the one writing those episodes and it's safe to assume he oversees what they do in detail. That's how it was presented to us. He dictates how the story goes. I don't think it's fair to just point fingers at the staff as if he wasn't involved.
That's fair. Ultimately it seems to have landed on his shoulders for if this should even happen or not, and has the final say on how the new episodes turn out. I'm not trying to blame the staff for "ruining" it or anything, I really believe they're doing the best they can, and have done a commendable job so far all things considered. There are just a lot of rough edges and I'm starting to think everyone rushed into this, Mori included as he's the main person in charge now.
Griffith
With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
Man, it's gotten dreary in here. 
There are times when we're analyzing this stuff where I like to take things to their comic extremes, e.g., "The death of the author has a huge, consequential impact on the story!"
That's sort of what it comes down to really, then and now, Berserk DID end, this is something new, and it's why you were ultimately so wise for saying this project should have been made as distinct as possible from the beginning because rather than providing us continuance or closure it's sort of forcing us to deal with the continued ramifications of Miura's death on a monthly basis now.
Yeah, I don't know if it made the cut, but I believe we said on the pod it was basically making a promise you can't literally keep because it's impossible, at least in this format; that he's going to half complete the series based on some notes and conversations without taking any liberties. I think in reality it means he's going to stay on message and execute the story "faithfully" or "in service to" what he recalls Miura telling him. Basically, it just means he isn't going to make up any gratuitous side shit if it doesn't directly serve that goal (like DBZ-style filler episodes where Guts fights the Troll Emperor =), even if it makes the story anemic, or what he does have to use to fill in the blanks isn't that interesting.
It's the latest incarnation of "blame the assistants," but at least now they're drawing all of it so there's some merit to blaming them for the overall quality.
There are times when we're analyzing this stuff where I like to take things to their comic extremes, e.g., "The death of the author has a huge, consequential impact on the story!"
That's sort of what it comes down to really, then and now, Berserk DID end, this is something new, and it's why you were ultimately so wise for saying this project should have been made as distinct as possible from the beginning because rather than providing us continuance or closure it's sort of forcing us to deal with the continued ramifications of Miura's death on a monthly basis now.
Anyway, just to refresh everyone's memory, what Mori specifically said was: "I have a message and promise to everyone. I will recall the details as much as possible and tell the story. Also, I will only write the episodes that Miura talked to me about. I will not flesh it out. I will not write episodes that I don’t remember clearly. I will only write the lines and stories that Miura described to me. Of course, it will not be perfect. Still, I think I can almost tell the story that Miura wanted to tell."
Like I said some days ago, as far as I'm concerned he's already gone back on his word quite a bit. That's the difference between theory and practice.
Yeah, I don't know if it made the cut, but I believe we said on the pod it was basically making a promise you can't literally keep because it's impossible, at least in this format; that he's going to half complete the series based on some notes and conversations without taking any liberties. I think in reality it means he's going to stay on message and execute the story "faithfully" or "in service to" what he recalls Miura telling him. Basically, it just means he isn't going to make up any gratuitous side shit if it doesn't directly serve that goal (like DBZ-style filler episodes where Guts fights the Troll Emperor =), even if it makes the story anemic, or what he does have to use to fill in the blanks isn't that interesting.
It's the latest incarnation of "blame the assistants," but at least now they're drawing all of it so there's some merit to blaming them for the overall quality.
Man, it's gotten dreary in here.
True! And it feels like it's going in circles too, but that's kind of unavoidable as more and more people deal with their feelings. I guess that's how most of these threads will evolve in the months to come.
Anyway, to switch things up a little, I made these comparisons last week to show how Miura's artwork had inspired the couple of color illustrations that have been produced by Studio Gaga. The most obvious one is the classic painting that can be found as a mini-poster in volume 22, which served as a basis for Guts on the cover of volume 41.
The new one is based on volume 15's cover for both the face (seen below) and the crouching position Guts is in. However more of an effort was made to mix things up, so the point of view is from a different angle and the Dragon Slayer's placement has been changed as well. Furthermore the color scheme and atmosphere (aftermath of battle with Puck lighting the scene) seem borrowed from volume 14's cover.
Goat
Foolish king
Even if I agree with most of the criticism related to characters presentation (betraying Miura's work of character building, especially in the Isidro's case), I personally think Guts reaction is authentic and could be totally expected considering how the character changed overtime. But well, for this: let's sit and wait to see how the desperation we've seen in 368 evolves in the next episodes.
Sure, the desolation and desperation might be authentic, but everything that comes before it - not so much. Like Aaz said, the execution just leaves everyting to be desired. But most of all - it is as if Guts is all alone in that pivotal fight, despite having dozens of strong allies on the island, including SK who came here for this exact reason. To instead send SK off to save members of Guts' group who should be plenty capable to not only fend for themselves but to launch a counter offensive along with other island's inhabitants just makes absolutely no sense, and is immensely frustrating.
@Aazealh that's a great comparison, thank you.
@Aazealh that's a great comparison, thank you.
jackson_hurley
even the horses are cut in half!
Maybe the Skull Knight did that pit stop to also protect Danan cause he cares enough for her and she is in a weakened state. Its just depicted in a very slow way. I would have imagine him doing something similar to Albion when he saved Lucas who was at the same time on his path. Cannot wait to see if he's going to do something else other then fight the ooze guys.
Everything happens so fast but at such a weird pace vs how Miura would have done it ...
Everything happens so fast but at such a weird pace vs how Miura would have done it ...
She'd likely get some panel time if that was the case, but it would still reflect really badly on her, since it'd essentially mean she's nothing more but a damsel in distress needing to be rescued. Not something you'd picture someone in her position to be like, at all.
But my main qualm is, as mentioned, that it's portrayed as if Guts is all on his own again - like before the conviction arc. If you remember the scene in Albion where Casca was about to be burned at a stake as a witch and he was equally powerless to help her because of the blobs, she was rescued by Isidro - it was the first time when Guts could rely on others to help him in protecting his loved one (also the look of desperation on his face when she was set on fire was entirely different than the poor art we got in this installment (you can compare the almost identical scenes in episode 181 vs episode 368), and so it makes absolutely no sense to be left entirely on his own vs Griffith, of all enemies, on an island full of allies, to boot. I understand WHY this was the choice they made because it'd mean taking a whole lot of liberty to draw the key fight scenes involving all of the main parties, but what they opted for instead was just so poorly done it makes me want to cry.
Also, I think Rickert will play an important role in Falconia. Or would most likely have if Miura was still at the helm. Everything is pointing out at his likely immense importance in the final arcs - from the time he was saved by the SK to the time he delivered that iconic slap. I'm sure that he'd discovered what fate the band of the hawk suffered at griffith's hands, and would possible have a role to play in Casca's recovery/eventual escape. But we will never know what exactly Miura had planned for him
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jackson_hurley
even the horses are cut in half!
But Rickert knows what happened to the Falcons. Anyways, I was talking about Skullknight and Danan here. The part with Guts I agree.
I'm currently rereading/rewatching the whole saga to jog my memory, but from what I remember, Rickert doesn't know EXACTLY what went down during the Eclipse, does he.
I wanted to post a comparison of Guts' look on his face in the exact same situation in Albion but I cannot find a way to post images I saved on my drive :(.
Check ep 181 in Vol 22.
Thanks, I just did.
I didn't get quite that far in my Berserk marathon rerun yet, but it seems he does know the outline at least of what happened, depending on how detailed the description Guts gave him was.
That said, I'm sure he'd sooner or later come in contact with Casca after Griffith brings her to Falconia, but we can only guess how things would go from there on.
I didn't get quite that far in my Berserk marathon rerun yet, but it seems he does know the outline at least of what happened, depending on how detailed the description Guts gave him was.
That said, I'm sure he'd sooner or later come in contact with Casca after Griffith brings her to Falconia, but we can only guess how things would go from there on.
Not sure if this has been discussed yet, but do you think management at Young Animal made a stipulation here, Berserk can continue but the releases need to be frequent. I mean, someone has to have sales on their mind, right? Without Miura, that must have been an easier topic to broach with Mori at the helm. Just wondering. Aside from the obvious contributing factor, that may also be playing into the quality we're seeing here.
The reason Rickert slapped Griffith in the first place is because he knows what happened during the Eclipse. And he's not in Falconia anymore, if you'll recall. But yes, Miura clearly intended for him to meet Guts and Casca again in the future.
It's possible, yeah. It could also be more of a tacit understanding than something written in a contract. Either way, I think it goes without saying that all parties involved intend for the project to progress at the best speed it can while meeting a minimum quality bar. Miura was not just Young Animal's but Hakusensha's star mangaka, so he did whatever he wanted, but other than him and maybe a few others, authors do have to work within the constraints they're given by the editors.
That aside, Miura could afford to take more time because he was also working on other projects, some public and some not. And it was compounded by the fact he had switched mediums, was getting on in age, and was intransigeant on quality. But even then, he seemed aware that he would have to pick up the pace eventually. All of this to say that I believe it's a natural expectation for this project that it will have frequent releases.
In my opinion it would be nonsensical for it to only have four episodes a year (for example), considering they're just conveying what they know of the author's broad intent for the story. It's really not quite the same as creating your own thing. But do note that they're taking a month between releases at the moment, which isn't "as fast as possible" for Young Animal.
As for the financial aspect, I mean let's not kid ourselves, it's definitely a factor. That being said, I don't think that's necessarily the key reason for the release schedule, nor do I believe the frequency explains the quality problems of the continuation. In theory, Mori and the staff have had over six months to work on the episodes we've seen so far, and I'm pretty sure they'd at least finished the first three before the announcement. I don't think spending more time on them would have helped all that much. Miura's genius isn't something you can replace with mere effort.
Really needed at least a hint as to why no Berserker armor. If he can control himself to this degree infront of Griffith, Zodd, and Casca being kidnapped, then I can’t think of a reason why he’d ever lose control again.
The only explanation would be that the brand is heavily weakening his state because Griffith's is nearby...but that would contradict some of his previous encounters with him.
I mean, in the Black Swordsman Arc he was heavily wounded but at least he tried to slash and hit Griffith with his cannon arm.
At the Hill of Swords he didn't do thing but only because Zodd intervened. Otherwise he would do the same as he did before.
Now he was more physically stable but he's like a chicken, while Griffith is picking his girl in front of him?
It wouldn't make sense...
So it's a very complicated situation.
I don't know if this would be the best or whatever, but if I was Mori right now, I would do a revision ; add Guts "going Berserk" and at least trying to bring Casca back.
Something like the Dog Guts fighting Femto in the Passage of Dreams (building a connection of all the previous episodes).
Wait, what revisions?
They corrected some of the artwork on the parts they finished after Miura passed away. Nothing major. You can check 4M4M's post here for some helpful comparisons.
Goat
Foolish king
Can the ability to control the armor be related to Hanarr and the "hammering" that awakened the memory in 362? It seems kinda unrelated, but...
Not in this context. Frankly, I don't want to discourage you guys, but as far as I'm concerned, it's simply a matter of the team lacking information and executing poorly on what they did know. I wouldn't think on it too hard beyond that, because the very basis for the reflection (the scene as depicted) is flawed.
