Uncertainty about Berserk's future

Status
Not open for further replies.
I miss Miura, but even more than that, now I just want to know if his assistants will come out and say they'll complete Berserk, or just release Volume 41, with maybe the lost chapter (God of the Abyss 2). The lack of announcements regarding Berserk's future is literally killing me at this point.
 
Last edited:

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
I do too, but even more than that, now I just want to know if his assistants will come out and say they'll complete Berserk, or just release Volume 41, with maybe the lost chapter (God of the Abyss 2). The lack of announcements regarding Berserk's future is literally killing me at this point.

Volume 41 will be released. There isn't really any doubt about this. But you have to be patient. Everyone was shocked by Miura sensei's sudden disappearance, including the Young Animal staff. Doing anything in that context will take them a long time. The simple act of illustrating the cover will be a challenge.

That aside, volume 41 will definitely NOT include episode 83, and it is preposterous to think otherwise. Miura removed it from the story almost 25 years ago. Not sure what made you think that it could be randomly inserted back, against his will, in the wrong part of the story. As for "the assistants completing Berserk", that's not very likely. You'd best keep your expectations in check.
 

Beelzebud

[...] Into the abyss will I run [...]
I do too, but even more than that, now I just want to know if his assistants will come out and say they'll complete Berserk, or just release Volume 41, with maybe the lost chapter (God of the Abyss 2). The lack of announcements regarding Berserk's future is literally killing me at this point.
My friend, you're not the only one that feels the lack of announcements. I'm pretty sure that almost all the members here almost the same that you feel, including me.

I really want Berserk finished, but i want it the right way and i'm not sure that it will be the case if his assistants complete Berserk. Unfortunately :sad:
 
My friend, you're not the only one that feels the lack of announcements. I'm pretty sure that almost all the members here almost the same that you feel, including me.

I really want Berserk finished, but i want it the right way and i'm not sure that it will be the case if his assistants complete Berserk. Unfortunately :sad:
I feel the same, in my head only way it could be done would have been if by luck miura sensei left very detailed storyboards for the majority of the end of the story but I remember reading somewhere that he let many details come to him in the moment which probably was why his work was so great. I have slowly come to peace with how the story ended and am very grateful for everything he has done for us.
 
While I too have comes to terms with episode 363 being the ending of the series, I remain more hopeful than most that this might not be the case. To me, it's not such a black or white decision as people make it out to be. Some say that it's disrespectful to continue a dead man's work while others say it's disrespectful to leave tens of years of work undone. And while others are concerned with the level of skill of the assistants, others hold them in great regard.

The only thing that is certain, is that the uncertainty will be gone sooner or later. We'll have to wait until then.

https://twitter.com/YoungAnimalHaku/status/1412671296169660423
 
We all want to see the story to the end, that's a fact. But Berserk is Kentarou Miura, so it's done. The end.

Now that we got that unpleasant truth out of the way, if they decide to continue, the artwork won't be the biggest issue in their hands. I don't get some fans that have that as an argument, seriously. The assistants, if they will be involved, are skilled enough for the visual representation, that much we already know from their work on Duranki. So, by his assistants or other artists, the work could continue.

But those fans fail to understand the actual problem it seems. The most important thing will be missing, and that's the mind of the creator. The plot elements, the proper, accurate depiction of the characters and the scenes that they will be in, their reactions to important moments of the story and the environments they will be in, literally everything will be different from what Miura envisioned. In every possible way. These things are the most crucial, and cannot be replicated. Now, some of those fans, and maybe some of you in this forum will be okay will all that, as long as the story continues. I personally won't. I get it to an extent, you love the story, and so do I. But that doesn't mean that I'm going to lower my standards and pretend that Berserk is going to continue, because it won't. Berserk officialy ended with episode 363. That's a fact, and we have to deal with it.

So, a hypothetical continuation will be some sort of official fanfic, a "What If" senario. Berserk GT as I say when I'm asked about my opinion in the matter.

I don't mean it necessarily in a bad way, but even if would be ok or even good, it just wouldn't be Berserk. And for some, myself included, that is the most important thing to take into account.
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
Some say that it's disrespectful to continue a dead man's work while others say it's disrespectful to leave tens of years of work undone.

Those people are missing the point. Miura's ability was godly. Not just for drawing, but paneling, scene composition, character design, characterization, dialogue and most importantly story development. Even if he somehow left a detailed roadmap for the rest of the story, which is anything but guaranteed, it would be an enormous challenge for even a top level mangaka to continue his work without immediately turning it into a travesty. And it's made harder by the fact we're nowhere near the ending. By my estimation there's a good 100 episodes left at least, and if you've paid attention to Berserk, you know each episode is very dense.

So this would be a monumental task, and frankly anyone who thinks otherwise, who disregards the insane difficulty of anyone but Miura being at the helm of Berserk, well this person does not understand the series at all. They don't know why it's good, and their opinion has no value. Really, people who are just clamoring for any continuation as long as they get closure aren't worth considering. Anyway, it's quite distasteful to be having this discussion in the thread announcing Miura's passing, although I guess I shouldn't be surprised. I will have to split it into its own thread.

And while others are concerned with the level of skill of the assistants, others hold them in great regard.

Hold them in high regard based on what? Do they even know what the assistants actually did? Again, the opinion of those who don't know what they're talking about isn't worth considering.
 
It depends on how you see it. Take Blade of the Immortal for en example. There is an official sequel to the manga, but Hiroaki Samura is uninvolved in neither the script nor in drawing the series. The artstyle is fairly simmilar, but still not on the same level as Samura's. I think it would be the same case for an eventual Berserk continuation by his assitant/ another senior mangaka. Part of me still wants to see aclosure to the series, regardless of which form it takes. The Master's insane devotion and work schedule contributed a lot to his untimely death and to see his work without a conclusion as is simply tragic.
 
Hold them in high regard based on what? Do they even know what the assistants actually did? Again, the opinion of those who don't know what they're talking about isn't worth considering.
Wasn't duranki drawn entirely by the assistants? To my knowledge Miura was only dealing with the storyboards and maybe some artwork corrections.
 

Griffith

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
Like Aaz says, the task of completing Berserk in worthy fashion without Miura is monumental at best, but practically impossible on principle. He's the author; it's simply not authentic without his direct, day-to-day involvement.

At best, any such "continuation" would have to be a separate offshoot in my eyes, basically IP at that point, and even still, given the authenticity discussed above, I'm not sure I'd be interested in that at all or if it'd just be more salt in the wound. It'd really need to lean heavily into being a labor of love in his honor, but that rarely works out like we'd want it to either.

I'm not even sure I want the next episode if it ends on a big combat cliffhanger or reveal tease; unless in it the boy reveals himself to be Griffith, who apologizes, is killed by Guts, restoring the boy, so he, Guts and Casca can immediately live happily ever after. Otherwise, I'm not sure we're going to do better than what we got.
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
Wasn't duranki drawn entirely by the assistants? To my knowledge Miura was only dealing with the storyboards and maybe some artwork corrections.

Yes, Miura did the storyboards, meaning he created the story, composed the scenes, did the paneling and wrote the dialogue. Then the assistants did the inking (drew the "final" panels based on the storyboards) and afterwards Miura went over their work to polish it and harmonize their individual styles. To what extent he retouched their work, we don't know.

Miura's objective with Duranki was to make better use of his assistants so that they could eventually take up more of the drawing for Berserk. Until then, they had only been doing the screentones and some background details. Other mangaka typically have their assistants do a lot more stuff, but Miura was always pretty unconventional. However he knew his work capacity was decreasing as he grew older, so that was his plan to be able to hold a viable rhythm that would allow him to finish the series.

We don't know for sure whether it was going well or not, but it's notable that Duranki hadn't been published for over a year. That may be an indication that things weren't progressing as smoothly as expected. Anyway, even if you're not familiar with how manga are created, the steps I listed above should help you realize that there's a huge gap between "doing most of the inking" and "doing everything". The storyboards are actually the crucial part.

Had Miura passed away in 2030, the situation would have likely been very different. His assistants would have been used to sharing more of the workload, and the story would have progressed to a point where taking it over might have been less daunting. But that's not what happened, and so it's a very difficult prospect.

Maybe they will deliver some kind or news during the Exhibition.

That's what I would expect, at least for the release of volume 41.
 

RaffoBaffo

Ex-Newser of the late Berserk Chronicles
They should only continue if Miura left some disposition, and some matrials behind.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Wasn't duranki drawn entirely by the assistants? To my knowledge Miura was only dealing with the storyboards and maybe some artwork corrections.
No, not entirely. As you said, Miura did the storyboarding (called the "names"), which is pretty significant. Studio Gaga finished it from there. But that's not how things were going with Berserk, which he exerted a much tighter grip on in terms of quality control. From an interview about Duranki in 2019:

"For Berserk I do almost everything myself, the characters and the backgrounds. I only give them the toning, buildings, soldiers, backgrounds, etc. These days I let them do the ground too."

Duranki was intended as a project to build up the skill of Studio Gaga, so that they could eventually help out with Berserk.

"My staff is competent but I still draw almost every part myself, so it brings out more and more delays. So I hope my assistants' skills will grow with Duranki, so I get to think "this is good enough". So this can make me consider using them more for Berserk, and then I hope Berserk's publication speed will get faster."

But Duranki eventually ceased. It was released pretty consistently, bi-monthly, from Sept 2019 until May 2020, but hasn't seen a release in more than a year. While we can't know what happened behind the scenes with its production, it's not much of a logical leap to consider that Miura halted it down because it wasn't meeting his expectations. The whole creative exercise was about quality control.

Miura was extremely careful about what went on the pages of Berserk. As of 2019, he didn't trust his assistants to contribute major art to it. So he created a new series to hone their talents, then it stopped. Nothing about that circumstance bodes well for that group inheriting ALL of Berserk's responsibilities, even in the best of circumstances. But we're in the worst possible circumstance—Miura left without any warning, and without a plan in place.

And in his own words, his creative process didn't involve documented plans for how to specifically execute things: "I don't ever write dialogue ahead of time." (Guidebook, 2016). We know that he had a broad outline about Berserk that he had been following since the beginning (referenced in the 2019 Glénat interview). But whether that existed only in his head or in a locked box marked "in case of death, use this" is unknown, and likely will be forever.

Which brings us to another big point — we don't know what Miura's own wishes would be in this scenario. But we can guess them from how he treated Berserk and who contributed. Would he really want the team who he had barely let touch Berserk's primary art to take over not only all the art, but also the storytelling? The dialogue? I genuinely don't think he'd want them touching the legacy he left behind, potentially toward disaster, just for the sake of meandering across a finish line that would never be authoritative.

I'll give you an example for where this would become extremely problematic for fans. I'm sure you remember the Grunbeld light novel, which was awful. One of the main problems fans had with this book was that it was initially unclear how much Miura had contributed, beyond the art (which was great!). Where did it tumble into such a terrible state? Where did Miura's ideas end and Makoto Fukami's (the writer) ideas begin? We can't know, and it is painful. Now, imagine that instead of the low quality being relegated to a light novel which fans can write off as an unfortunate side story, it's the main series. We could never know where Miura's ideas ended and the new staff's ideas began. We'd be forever in limbo of what is authoritative and what is not. And it's a scenario with a high likelihood of ruining the legacy of Berserk.

I remember reading somewhere that he let many details come to him in the moment which probably was why his work was so great.
It's from a variety of interviews, but here's one from 2000 where he says so pretty explicitly (translation was not by Puella, for info):

–Wow… hearing this stuff is really amazing. You say you didn’t really have things clearly planned out at first, and yet every little thing fits so snuggly into place without any plotholes, as if you’d had it all figured out from the start. It’s a great mixture of the intuitive and the logical.

Miura: It’s true, lately I’ve come to trust in my own carelessness. In my experience things often pop nicely into place even without having been planned ahead much. I do think it probably wouldn’t go very smoothly if I were to work with stuff that isn’t me, stuff that I’ve borrowed from elsewhere and simply stuck in, but there’s hardly any of that. Even when I do bring in something from elsewhere, I run it through myself and quality test it before using it.

They should only continue if Miura left some disposition, and some matrials behind.

This is well-wishing without considering the specifics of the execution—the day to day. What constitutes "some materials"? Miura didn't script things out like that, as noted above. And whoever inherited such a task would inevitably have to make hundreds of decisions in each episode, let alone for the remainder of the series, attempting to intuit what Miura would have done. It could never be authoritative.
 

Kompozinaut

Sylph Sword
Honestly, at this point, if the content exists and privacy aside, I'd just prefer a collection of sketches and possible notes Miura had about the trajectory or conclusion of the series. Maybe some musing or comments from Studio Gaga about what he may have discussed with them (if anything).

And that's it.

Perhaps something in Japanese culture might prevent this, but considering Hakusensha is a business, I have a sneaking suspicion Berserk will return for better or for worse.

I'm very apprehensive about Berserk's future.
 
I think Walter put it best. I wouldn't want some cobbled together story. Let it rest where miura stopped. Atleast then the integrity of berserk will remain intact.

Everyone is grasping at straws right now looking for hope but this is unfortunately just one of those very bad moments in life where the only option is to let go.
 
Yes, Miura did the storyboards, meaning he created the story, composed the scenes, did the paneling and wrote the dialogue. Then the assistants did the inking (drew the "final" panels based on the storyboards) and afterwards Miura went over their work to polish it and harmonize their individual styles. To what extent he retouched their work, we don't know.
Anyway, even if you're not familiar with how manga are created, the steps I listed above should help you realize that there's a huge gap between "doing most of the inking" and "doing everything". The storyboards are actually the crucial part.
While I agree with your points Aazeahl, I didn't claim that they could continue the story without the master. What I hoped to highlight is that even though they didn't do everything on their own, their work shows great competence (whether or not It's enough is a different discussion).

But Duranki eventually ceased. It was released pretty consistently, bi-monthly, from Sept 2019 until May 2020, but hasn't seen a release in more than a year. While we can't know what happened behind the scenes with its production, it's not much of a logical leap to consider that Miura halted it down because it wasn't meeting his expectations. The whole creative exercise was about quality control.
I agree, this could be a good explanation. I'm also sure that the slow publication of berserk and the (probably poor) sales of Duranki didn't help.

And in his own words, his creative process didn't involve documented plans for how to specifically execute things: "I don't ever write dialogue ahead of time." (Guidebook, 2016). We know that he had a broad outline about Berserk that he had been following since the beginning (referenced in the 2019 Glénat interview). But whether that existed only in his head or in a locked box marked "in case of death, use this" is unknown, and likely will be forever.
While it's true that he didn't plan most things, I remember him saying in an interview that he had planned the eclipse even before the creation of the band of the hawk. I think it's fair to assume that he had some major events planned beforehand, but didn't know how things would get there.
Which brings us to another big point — we don't know what Miura's own wishes would be in this scenario. But we can guess them from how he treated Berserk and who contributed. Would he really want the team who he had barely let touch Berserk's primary art to take over not only all the art, but also the storytelling? The dialogue? I genuinely don't think he'd want them touching the legacy he left behind, potentially toward disaster, just for the sake of meandering across a finish line that would never be authoritative.
While I agree that Miura was very protective with his work, I believe that it's possible that he had different plans depending on his health. It's not right to assume that he would keep the same stance whether he was healthy or not. It could be possible that he had different plans for the latter scenario. (Of course we can't know that)
I'll give you an example for where this would become extremely problematic for fans. I'm sure you remember the Grunbeld light novel, which was awful. One of the main problems fans had with this book was that it was initially unclear how much Miura had contributed, beyond the art (which was great!). Where did it tumble into such a terrible state? Where did Miura's ideas end and Makoto Fukami's (the writer) ideas begin? We can't know, and it is painful. Now, imagine that instead of the low quality being relegated to a light novel which fans can write off as an unfortunate side story, it's the main series. We could never know where Miura's ideas ended and the new staff's ideas began. We'd be forever in limbo of what is authoritative and what is not. And it's a scenario with a high likelihood of ruining the legacy of Berserk.
Oh come on, I would at least hope that the assistants would have nothing in common with that clown Fukami :magni:. I remember reading that the only contribution of Miura in that novel was the artwork.
 
Oh come on, I would at least hope that the assistants would have nothing in common with that clown Fukami :magni:. I remember reading that the only contribution of Miura in that novel was the artwork.
That's a good point I'm sure miura would not surround himself around a bunch of fukami's lmao
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Oh come on, I would at least hope that the assistants would have nothing in common with that clown Fukami :magni:.
You seem to have missed my point. The novel was an example of how a collaborative project can go poorly, but the purpose of that example was that fans wouldn't know where the intended material ended and the original material began. We'd always be guessing at whether this was the intended vision or not. ("Is that really something Griffith would say?" "Would Schierke really react like that?")

But go beyond the novel, what examples of non-Miura Berserk material would you say is good...? The things that Miura had personally involved himself in are what shines through. The rest ain't great.

I remember reading that the only contribution of Miura in that novel was the artwork.

There's never been clarity. I addressed it in my review of the novel. I would say that Miura probably gave him a framework, along with original characters, and it was left to Fukami to fill in the blanks.
 
You seem to have missed my point. The novel was an example of how a collaborative project can go poorly, but the purpose of that example was that fans wouldn't know where the intended material ended and the original material began. We'd always be guessing at whether this was the intended vision or not.
I did get your point, and I think it's a great one that can't be refuted. I just think that the example wasn't representative because such an atrocity couldn't possibly happen again :serpico:

But go beyond the novel, what examples of non-Miura Berserk material would you say is good...? The things that Miura had personally involved himself in are what shines through. The rest ain't great.
There has been other official berserk work that hasn't been done by Miura? I though the novel was the only such instance. If you are talking about unofficial things then I wouldn't know, not really into fanfic :ganishka:
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
What I hoped to highlight is that even though they didn't do everything on their own, their work shows great competence (whether or not It's enough is a different discussion).

If you've read what I said, you'll realize you haven't seen their work by itself, not being guided through every step by Miura, then retouched by him. Don't get me wrong, I like those guys; I even know their names, unlike literally every one of those saying they could finish Berserk by themselves. But whoever it is that you mentioned as "holding them in great regard" is not speaking from a place of knowledge. It's just a pretense because they want more Berserk, regardless of quality or authorial intent. It's completely transparent, and entirely pathetic.

I'm also sure that the slow publication of berserk and the (probably poor) sales of Duranki didn't help.

Duranki hasn't been sold, so you can't say that its sales have been poor. It was only prepublished in Young Animal Zero, and whether the magazine is meeting the targets Hakusensha set for it is currently unknown and does not depend on Duranki by itself.

While it's true that he didn't plan most things, I remember him saying in an interview that he had planned the eclipse even before the creation of the band of the hawk. I think it's fair to assume that he had some major events planned beforehand, but didn't know how things would get there.

He had the broad outline of the story down for many years, as Walter said in the part you quoted. And the Eclipse is shown in the first few pages of volume 2 of the manga, so you need no interview to know that.

I did get your point, and I think it's a great one that can't be refuted. I just think that the example wasn't representative because such an atrocity couldn't possibly happen again :serpico:

On the contrary, many of the people advocating for Berserk to continue "no matter what" are (knowingly or not) wishing for exactly such an atrocity to occur again.

That's a good point I'm sure miura would not surround himself around a bunch of fukami's lmao

Keep in mind that Fukami may be an awful writer, but he's still a published author and even managed to get himself a gig to write a Berserk light novel. Meanwhile, Miura's assistants were just that: assistants. They did that job because they weren't able to carry a work on their own.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
There has been other official berserk work that hasn't been done by Miura? I though the novel was the only such instance. If you are talking about unofficial things then I wouldn't know, not really into fanfic :ganishka:
No, I'm talking about Berserk Musou, the Golden Age movies, the 2016-2017 series, and on and on... Stack that against the Dreamcast game, where Miura wrote the story and designed all the enemies.
 
While I agree that Miura was very protective with his work, I believe that it's possible that he had different plans depending on his health. It's not right to assume that he would keep the same stance whether he was healthy or not. It could be possible that he had different plans for the latter scenario. (Of course we can't know that)

An assistant said in a tweet that he was in good health mentally and physically though if I remember correctly (?)

The letting go part is always hard, especially in situations like these. Some sort of continuation isn't really a thing that we should be hoping, from a realistic point of view. Berserk = Miura, I think that everyone that considers himself/herself a fan should be adamant about that fact, the mere existence of this forum speaks for itself. I really don't get anyone who wants to see the story to the end with things being as they are. Everyone that asks the company or his assistants online if the story will continue is really immature and disrespectful, and I wouldn't consider them actual fans either. It's only been 2 months, they have stated that it would take time to decide anything definitive.
 
An assistant said in a tweet that he was in good health mentally and physically though if I remember correctly (?)
Indeed, the health issue that took his life was random (stress can play a role, of which I'm sure he had plenty). You don't know about it until it's already late enough to be a great problem.
If you've read what I said, you'll realize you haven't seen their work by itself, not being guided through every step by Miura, then retouched by him. Don't get me wrong, I like those guys; I even know their names, unlike literally every one of those saying they could finish Berserk by themselves. But whoever it is that you mentioned as "holding them in great regard" is not speaking from a place of knowledge. It's just a pretense because they want more Berserk, regardless of quality or authorial intent. It's completely transparent, and entirely pathetic.
Hmm, good point. I guess it depends on the extend of Miura's work which is just impossible to know. In my opinion a great example of their work would be that one panel in episode 359, which in all honesty I didn't like too much. You really think that all these people have such ill will? Casual fans aside, I would believe that most of the others would only want it if it was Miura's wish.

No, I'm talking about Berserk Musou, the Golden Age movies, the 2016-2017 series, and and on... Stack that against the Dreamcast game, where Miura wrote the story and designed all the enemies.
Oh, in that instance I loved the 97' anime which captured a lot of Berserk's essence despite the limited budget. Most of the other work I find mediocre to outright horrid.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom