What are you watching? (television thread)
- Thread starter Oburi
- Start date
Griffith
With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
Yeah, I was naturally skeptical, the first episode feels very nostalgia-driven like something that could be mindlessly exploitative, but even all that material turned out to have a purpose and overall this was clearly made with a lot of authenticity and love for the comics.
I thought it was basically state-mandated for all parents with children under 13!? Yeah, they got me back with one of those $2 a month for three months deals and by the end of that my daughter had discovered Bluey and it was all over, so I subscribed to the $9 ad bundle with Hulu, which at least gives you some variety for your buck. The wife and I re-watched Buffy and it had the added bonus of keeping our daughter scared away from our bedroom and into bed at night.
nomad
"Bring the light of day"
Indeed. I'm in the same boat as you. I'm taken by surprise of how good they really made it. Back then they were loyal to the comics and I dare say one of the few that did specially back then. Now they seem to not only have the support but to also add a more mature take on it. Stuff that you couldn't do at FOX network back then. If you know the comics you know damn well where they are going... And I look forward to it.
Season 2 gladly has been already been written by the same showrunner. Despite his termination, I truly hope that he is brought back for more.
Griffith
With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
X-Men '97 - So, not surprisingly, they didn't just stick the landing with aplomb, like this was as epic as could be and more than I expected frankly, but then did a pirouette into a surprise encore routine that just so happened to fulfill my one lingering desire for this season while setting up season 2. Bravo.
I hope I'm not overselling it, it's still Saturday morning cartoon X-Men, that's part of the charm, but it's at about as high a level as you can do that without it becoming something else. It actually uses that to its advantage to touch or brush on events and themes much darker than it, or seemingly any mainstream X-Men adaptation, effectively could if it had to really deal with them outside this format where they can plumb the depths without getting bogged down in them. They can just hit the high notes and move on to the next thing without lingering too long. In no particular order here's some of the shit it meaningfully references, sometimes briefly so don't assume all of these are big spoilers (I'll still tag them since SOME technically are, but it's all things you've likely heard of if you're an X-Fan =):
Prejudice (duh)
Mojo
Master Mold
Sentinels
January 6th
The Shi'ar
The Phoenix Force
Goblin Queen
Mr. Sinister
Magneto was right
Terrorism
Slavery
Genocide
Forge
Adversary
Apocalypse
Nimrod
Cable
The Askani
Asteroid M
Genosha
Spider-Man '94
Marvel heroes
The future
The past
The Alpha (not Flight)
The Omega (Red)
There's one name I specifically didn't mention because it was the surprise of the season and very effectively tied it all together. I hope they can surprise me as much with whatever direction they turn next season as well.
I hope I'm not overselling it, it's still Saturday morning cartoon X-Men, that's part of the charm, but it's at about as high a level as you can do that without it becoming something else. It actually uses that to its advantage to touch or brush on events and themes much darker than it, or seemingly any mainstream X-Men adaptation, effectively could if it had to really deal with them outside this format where they can plumb the depths without getting bogged down in them. They can just hit the high notes and move on to the next thing without lingering too long. In no particular order here's some of the shit it meaningfully references, sometimes briefly so don't assume all of these are big spoilers (I'll still tag them since SOME technically are, but it's all things you've likely heard of if you're an X-Fan =):
Prejudice (duh)
Mojo
Master Mold
Sentinels
January 6th
The Shi'ar
The Phoenix Force
Goblin Queen
Mr. Sinister
Magneto was right
Terrorism
Slavery
Genocide
Forge
Adversary
Apocalypse
Nimrod
Cable
The Askani
Asteroid M
Genosha
Spider-Man '94
Marvel heroes
The future
The past
The Alpha (not Flight)
The Omega (Red)
There's one name I specifically didn't mention because it was the surprise of the season and very effectively tied it all together. I hope they can surprise me as much with whatever direction they turn next season as well.
Well one thing I apparently won't be watching is Scavengers Reign Season 2, since it just got canceled. This is a bummer... Season 1 was very promising, doing cool shit with sci-fi in a way that's just not done anymore. Check it out if you're at all interested in the genre.
Just finished X-Men '97. First off, I really appreciate that Griff and @nomad let us all know that this was worth checking out afterall, because I watched the trailer and it looked like nostalgia garbage. But the truth is, it’s nostalgia junk food!
This show feels like it came from the heart of a fan who really loved and understood the 1990s X-Men comics, and Disney/Marvel offered them a blank check for how to best digest some of that series' biggest milestones. It's kind of incredible just how many of the BIG DEAL story arcs they successfully crammed into 10 episodes. You can honestly watch this Saturday Morning version of X-Men and NOT have to read about a decade's worth of comics.
I did feel that it starts super strong but kind of lost steam toward the end. The cost of turning these massive story arcs into bite-sized ones was that it sacrificed a lot of the character development, team-building, and overall camaraderie that would naturally happen in the margins of the comics. Instead, a lot of that is supplanted with quippy dialogue each episode, and that tone overstayed its welcome in a Whedon-esque way, for me. My other gripe is that the voice actors got on my nerves quite a bit, in particular Rogue, who now sounds like a grandma instead of a smoky Southern belle. But it's also incredible how many of the actors sound spot-on from the original cartoon. Was that the RIGHT decision, though?
Anyway, I'm still amazed it's as good as it is, given that as @Griffith said, is essentially a modern Saturday Morning Cartoon that hits all the right notes for '90s X-Men. I do hope they can maintain this quality going forward, because I'd really like to see where they take things, and ultimately which arcs they'll embrace or discard.
Just finished X-Men '97. First off, I really appreciate that Griff and @nomad let us all know that this was worth checking out afterall, because I watched the trailer and it looked like nostalgia garbage. But the truth is, it’s nostalgia junk food!
This show feels like it came from the heart of a fan who really loved and understood the 1990s X-Men comics, and Disney/Marvel offered them a blank check for how to best digest some of that series' biggest milestones. It's kind of incredible just how many of the BIG DEAL story arcs they successfully crammed into 10 episodes. You can honestly watch this Saturday Morning version of X-Men and NOT have to read about a decade's worth of comics.
I did feel that it starts super strong but kind of lost steam toward the end. The cost of turning these massive story arcs into bite-sized ones was that it sacrificed a lot of the character development, team-building, and overall camaraderie that would naturally happen in the margins of the comics. Instead, a lot of that is supplanted with quippy dialogue each episode, and that tone overstayed its welcome in a Whedon-esque way, for me. My other gripe is that the voice actors got on my nerves quite a bit, in particular Rogue, who now sounds like a grandma instead of a smoky Southern belle. But it's also incredible how many of the actors sound spot-on from the original cartoon. Was that the RIGHT decision, though?
Anyway, I'm still amazed it's as good as it is, given that as @Griffith said, is essentially a modern Saturday Morning Cartoon that hits all the right notes for '90s X-Men. I do hope they can maintain this quality going forward, because I'd really like to see where they take things, and ultimately which arcs they'll embrace or discard.
Griffith
With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
I forgot if we discussed this, but did you ever watch Raised by Wolves, the show ostensibly about androids raising human children on another planet as a solution to a catastrophic religious war? First couple of episodes are directed by Ridley Scott and make for a nice little sci-fi movie. I never finished season 2 and it's apparently been removed from Max because the entertainment industry is an absurd sham.
Glad you ate up the greasy-but-delicious fast food X-burgers as well!
My wife is a fan of the original show but not the comics, so while she appreciated it does the original series justice she couldn't appreciate how much crazy lore they, cohesively for the most part, crammed in there. As a matter of fact, there was a bit too much for her taste as an objective viewer. Episode 3 for example, a LOT happens! I actually felt like it got stronger as it went along and its full form emerged, particularly how ambitious yet true to the theme of the original series it was. Because in the beginning it seemed like it might just be nostalgia bait: episodes 1, 3 and the first half of 4 for callbacks to seasons 1, 2, etc, mixed with some modern sensibilities in episode 2 and 4's second half, but then it REALLY took a couple huge swings and turns with episodes 5 & 6 and after a brief lull in 7 never looked back.
Also, I felt like what they lacked in time for long term development they made up for by directly approaching topics and conversations between characters they couldn't have in the original animated series. Particularly Scott and Jean, Rogue for better or worse, and Magneto and... anybody; his speech to the UN, his moment(s) with the boy, or the "pep talk" to the team in the penultimate episode. =) Same for the antagonist; it was all very direct and on point, and it didn't beat around the bush.
How dare you!
Well, as far as Buffy is concerned, Marvel, etc... yeeeeah.
Yeah, we joked how frail Rogue suddenly sounded, and I was sure they recast Wolverine and that Cyclops was exactly the same, except Wolvie was the same actor and the OG Cyclops was, um, dead. I thought Magneto was great considering the original actor died as well, and the elective recasting of his foil was a good choice since he was very one note in the original and needed more range here. They had the original Jean play the woman from the UN as she dropped a few octaves (no more wailing, fainting "Scott!"s for her), and Gambit was clearly recast, yet the original voice actor still appeared in an important role (maybe he just couldn't do his bullshit Cajun accent anymore =).
Yeah, the showrunner had already plotted out season 2 and finished a lot of the scripts, so hopefully it'll maintain the same story density and quality whatever direction the production takes. Or they could screw it up and remove it all from the platform in a money-saving scheme! You never know anymore.
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Haven't had much time for TV shows ... I'm in the middle of Shrinking (S2), Time Bandits, Silo (S2 - episode 1 just aired and I fell asleep cos it was the end of the day but also hella slow), The Diplomat (S2 - halfway through and it isn't hitting as effectively as S1), What We Do In The Shadows (S6 - heartbreaking to learn this's their final season, 3 episodes in and the writing on S5 was much better, still funny though).
Slow Horses continues to be top notch in every aspect, and my only complaint was not seeing more of Lamb this past season.
Slow Horses continues to be top notch in every aspect, and my only complaint was not seeing more of Lamb this past season.
About 6 years ago, I started watching Star Trek TOS. Slowly but steadily, I somehow worked my way up to Star Trek Enterprise (currently at the first season). It’s been such a fun ride and I can’t for the life of me understand how Star Trek ever got a stigma of being boring.
Anyway, since I haven’t seen one in a long time, here’s my current ranking:
TNG
TOS
DS9
Voyager
I suspect Enterprise will top Voyager, but we’ll see.
Anyway, since I haven’t seen one in a long time, here’s my current ranking:
TNG
TOS
DS9
Voyager
I suspect Enterprise will top Voyager, but we’ll see.
I also started watching Star Trek: The Original Series a few months ago, after reading that Harlan Ellison had written one of its best episodes. I grew up on The Next Generation, and because of the endless parodies and jokes that surrounded TOS (special effects were cheesy, Kirk being merely a womanizer/jock and Spock being a science drone) when I was growing up, I never bothered with it. It looked pretty bad.
Boy, what a mistake I made... Even loving TNG, I can't deny that TOS does everything so much better. First and foremost—Kirk is an incredible lead character. He's clever, interesting, conflicted, and in the 18 or so episodes I watched (using a guide), I don't think he even slept with a single woman (why did that even become a stereotype?). Picard is one of my favorite characters, but he feels like a genetically spliced Kirk, having inherited only his command ability but none of the personality (where did it go? who was the inheritor?). And Spock is multifaceted. Whoever saw TOS and assumed the flat personality that he projects was all there was, well... I suppose they never saw the show?
But beyond the characters, the spirit of the original Enterprise is so much more fun. TNG's Enterprise feels like a corporate office that just happens to be traveling through space, where TOS' Enterprise is a sea-faring adventure into deep space.
Anyway, long story short, if you ever ignored Star Trek: The Original Series, please do give it a chance. It really deserves better than the nerdy crust of a legacy that has accumulated around it. And if you want to know how to start, I'll bet @Aazealh could be bothered to post an episode guide if you asked nicely enough
Boy, what a mistake I made... Even loving TNG, I can't deny that TOS does everything so much better. First and foremost—Kirk is an incredible lead character. He's clever, interesting, conflicted, and in the 18 or so episodes I watched (using a guide), I don't think he even slept with a single woman (why did that even become a stereotype?). Picard is one of my favorite characters, but he feels like a genetically spliced Kirk, having inherited only his command ability but none of the personality (where did it go? who was the inheritor?). And Spock is multifaceted. Whoever saw TOS and assumed the flat personality that he projects was all there was, well... I suppose they never saw the show?
But beyond the characters, the spirit of the original Enterprise is so much more fun. TNG's Enterprise feels like a corporate office that just happens to be traveling through space, where TOS' Enterprise is a sea-faring adventure into deep space.
Anyway, long story short, if you ever ignored Star Trek: The Original Series, please do give it a chance. It really deserves better than the nerdy crust of a legacy that has accumulated around it. And if you want to know how to start, I'll bet @Aazealh could be bothered to post an episode guide if you asked nicely enough
My introduction to Star Trek was with The Next Generation since that's what I had access to growing up/ was on TV and I was totally hooked because of my love for sci-fi. Loved every minute of those early seasons, and the network would play them on a loop for years (licensing magic!). I didn't get to watch The Original Series until much later, as an adult and dude, it hit so differently. I prefer it over The Next Generation, but it's been a few years since I watched everything back to back/ together. Reading through these posts has reignited that Trek flame!
Aaz, any chance you could help to share that episode guide with us please
, we can make sure it's forever etched into the hallowed halls of this board and in Spock's words ... live long and prosper 
Aaz, any chance you could help to share that episode guide with us please
, we can make sure it's forever etched into the hallowed halls of this board and in Spock's words ... live long and prosper 
Aaz, any chance you could help to share that episode guide with us please
Sure, if you want. This is the list I gave Walter, it's in chronological order.
- Where No Man Has Gone Before (Season 1, episode 3)
- The Corbomite Maneuver (Season 1, episode 10)
- The Ménagerie (Season 1, episode 11)
- Balance of Terror (Season 1, episode 14)
- The Galileo Seven (Season 1, Episode 16)
- Arena (Season 1, episode 18)
- Space Seed (Season 1, episode 22)
- A Taste of Armageddon (Season 1, Episode 23)
- The Devil in the Dark (Season 1, Episode 25)
- The City on the Edge of Forever (Season 1, episode 28)
- Amok Time (Season 2, Episode 1)
- Mirror, Mirror (Season 2, episode 4)
- The Doomsday Machine (Season 2, episode 6)
- Journey to Babel (Season 2, Episode 10)
- The Trouble with Tribbles (Season 2, episode 15)
That's great, I went on a similar journey myself a long time ago (
). Enterprise is much maligned but it's got its moments. Seasons 3 and 4 in particular are great, each for a different reason. You can look forward to them!Thanks for sharing that extensive list Aaz, and charting the course for my next adventure in space.
My ranking is basically this but DS9 on the top.
And you're right. Star Trek isn't boring. It just isn't action heavy but that doesn't make it less exciting.
I am! Too bad the journey is almost over though. Did you watch any of the modern Star Trek shows and if so, what did you think of them?That's great, I went on a similar journey myself a long time ago (
As a matter of fact, I rewatched the 2009 Star Trek movie a couple weeks ago. Now that was action heavy AND boring
I watched the first two seasons of Discovery and the first and third season of Picard. I can't really recommend either of them.
Discovery felt like such a waste to me. It had great production value and genuinely good actors, but was beset by bad writing and a showrunner (the accursed Alex Kurtzman) who clearly doesn't understand what Star Trek is and why people like it. I really tried sticking with it but I dropped off one or two episodes into season 3.
Picard is an aberration. It made me relativize Discovery's bad writing, as if Kurtzman unleashed his true power. It's pretty much a violation of TNG, and after all of its three seasons, it ends with the characters basically in the same place they were during TNG's great finale. It's worthless, and while Patrick Stewart is starring in it, he never really feels like the Jean-Luc Picard we got to know in TNG. The third season felt like an apology for the first two (that's why I made the effort to watch it), but it doesn't redeem them.
I didn't bother with Strange New Worlds after that, even though people say it's better and more like classic Trek.
Guess who co-wrote that movie? That's right... Kurtzman!
