Author Topic: Episode 312  (Read 46405 times)

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Xem

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #75 on: February 26, 2010, 11:16:38 PM »
So she brought Isidro home, tended to his injury, changed clothes in front of him (with her back turned), made him food and enthusiastically asked him about the world/his adventures to protect a monster that could have simply not showed up if it felt threatened?

Just because she might want to protect the Sea God, doesn't mean she doesn't want to protect Isidro as well. Like you said, she appears to be a carefree and naive and it's possible she's been isolated by herself for quite some time. She's still probably just a young girl interested in the world, not unlike Isidro himself.

If she is somehow linked to the Sea God that doesn't mean that she herself is evil in nature. The two aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

Quote
And that would make her the incredibly powerful being that transformed every villager on the island (and made sea cucumbers into monsters too)?

How so?

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #76 on: February 26, 2010, 11:34:40 PM »
Just because she might want to protect the Sea God, doesn't mean she doesn't want to protect Isidro as well.

And why would the Sea God need protection from Isidro exactly? Or do you think it's a simple transformed sea cucumber?

She's still probably just a young girl interested in the world

Not "just" a young girl, no. The last panel made that quite obvious.

If she is somehow linked to the Sea God that doesn't mean that she herself is evil in nature. The two aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

The Sea God is said by her to be evil. It was pretty much confirmed by Schierke and by what we saw to be evil. The girl has been shown to be critical and apprehensive of said Sea God, and to be helpful and caring to Isidro. So yeah, it's actually contradictory.

How so?

Why would she want to protect a random monster otherwise? Damn man, there's no point in even discussing this, it just doesn't make sense.

Xem

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #77 on: February 27, 2010, 05:03:55 AM »
Anyway, I was doing some more thinking about Isma and came up with.. brace yourself, some of you may not be able to handle it... another far-fetched idea!

I thought about the correlation between the pirates, the monster, and this magical young and attractive Isma girly and my mind landed on Calypso. Not saying she's a take on Calypso per-se, though she was isolated on an island just as Isma is, but there are some similarities to her and Nereid or sea nymphs.

DISCUSS

Online Walter

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #78 on: February 27, 2010, 05:30:03 AM »
Anyway, I was doing some more thinking about Isma and came up with.. brace yourself, some of you may not be able to handle it... another far-fetched idea!

I thought about the correlation between the pirates, the monster, and this magical young and attractive Isma girly and my mind landed on Calypso. Not saying she's a take on Calypso per-se, though she was isolated on an island just as Isma is, but there are some similarities to her and Nereid or sea nymphs.

DISCUSS
I don't think her being a sea nymph is out of the question, but I really don't see why Calypso particularly is brought up. Isma isn't alone on the island, and even Roderick's crew referred to it as a tiny, out of the way port where they knew they could get supplies.
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Xem

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #79 on: February 27, 2010, 06:10:32 AM »
I don't think her being a sea nymph is out of the question, but I really don't see why Calypso particularly is brought up. Isma isn't alone on the island, and even Roderick's crew referred to it as a tiny, out of the way port where they knew they could get supplies.

Honestly, probably because the last time I was acquainted with a mythological sea creature before this was in the PotC movies, which are obviously waaaaay off from the actual classical mythological depictions of Calypso. It got me thinking a little deeper though! It is interesting that, during the Illiad anyway, Calypso was isolated on an island just as Isma is.... or at least she seems like she has been. Those villagers almost don't seem to count as company imho. Not that I'm claiming that Miura drew inspiration from Calypso specifically.

Sea nymphs though, have been traditionally known to help seamen on their travels... and obviously retain magical abilities. They also have been known to be directly linked to Sea God's... sometimes even THE Sea God. Not that I'm claiming the Sea God Miura is referring to is Poseiden, but this could've been a big inspiration for him...

We'll see!
« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 06:33:41 AM by Deci »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #80 on: February 27, 2010, 09:03:03 AM »
It is interesting that, during the Illiad anyway, Calypso was isolated on an island just as Isma is.... or at least she seems like she has been. Those villagers almost don't seem to count as company imho. Not that I'm claiming that Miura drew inspiration from Calypso specifically.

Why do the villagers not count other than because you don't want them to? It's not like they've been transformed for ages from what we understand (probably only since the worlds merged). Isma's personality and attitude can easily be explained by the fact she's a young person who's never seen the world at large, and whether or not she's had (boring) company matters little in that regard. It's not too different from what motivated Isidro himself to leave his home and family, or what pushed Morgan to venture into the forest. Even Puck justified leaving Elfhelm for that reason.

Besides, given her looks on the last page of this episode, she might not have been on that island for very long (having spent most of her life underwater and/or in the astral world).

They also have been known to be directly linked to Sea God's... sometimes even THE Sea God. Not that I'm claiming the Sea God Miura is referring to is Poseiden, but this could've been a big inspiration for him...

This Sea God is an ancient being that sinks ships and eat humans. Or turns them into its minions. Nothing we've been told about it so far matches the description of Poseidon at all aside from the words "sea" and "god". I mean do you really think it's going to be anthropomorphic after seeing the idol the villagers worship(ped)? And on a side note, the nereids weren't just sometimes related to Poseidon in Greek mythology.

Anyway, I take it your point here is that she could be the sea god's daughter or something equivalent, forced to serve it but good at heart? Seems quite unlikely to me at this point.

Offline everymonday

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #81 on: February 27, 2010, 03:15:27 PM »
Wow! That was good episode.

Did you notice the fish species on the wall - they are all deep-sea inhabitants. It is virtually impossible to catch them near island if only sea-zombies can walk on the bottom of sea.  :ubik:

So could they be caught in the cave? There were smaller versions of Sharkrider's pets and other sea stuff too - so this cave as an "abode of sea god" can be a place like Qliphoth, but inactive or abandoned.

It makes a point why Isma protected the door with ammonite seal, Flora's house was protected from commoners and evil creatures too.

Also it was very cute how Schierke squirted water from her nostril...  :schierke:

P.S.: I think the forum needs Isma's emoticon.
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Offline Shadax

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #82 on: February 27, 2010, 04:54:04 PM »
I really think Isma is an entity of her own apart from the "sea god". We all saw how creatures from legends and stories have been coming into the world and a little island that thrives on sea trade and fishing is bound to have many stories about mermaid creatures and such and a strong belief in them. I think Isma originated from one such sources and she is really enjoying her newfound freedom in the new world. Wether she is good, evil or neutral and she does not seem to be directly asociated with the sea god business.

As for Guts. He is a very practical and aware warrior. Most of the others seem to be quite relaxt and unaware  atm but Guts is on high alert even if he seems relaxt and knows something is up in the inn. If the innkeeper is setting up a trap, the best counter for Guts would be to go in headfirst taking initiative instead of sitting in the inn waiting for something to happen. And also this way he wont have to worry about anyone getting in his way. More of a practical and tactical decision then an emotional one if you ask me.


This part really has a Shadow over Innsmouth feel to it.

It would be cute if Isidro and Schierke develop a sort of romance or friendship.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #83 on: February 27, 2010, 05:58:57 PM »
Did you notice the fish species on the wall - they are all deep-sea inhabitants. It is virtually impossible to catch them near island if only sea-zombies can walk on the bottom of sea.  :ubik:

Really? I'd recognized some, but every single one of them? If so that's pretty interesting indeed.

So could they be caught in the cave? There were smaller versions of Sharkrider's pets and other sea stuff too

We saw the tentacles of one transmuted sea cucumber, that's all. Also, "Captain Shark Rider" is the name of the pirate ship.

so this cave as an "abode of sea god" can be a place like Qliphoth, but inactive or abandoned.

Yeah, the cave might lead to a territory deep within the astral world (the actual lair of the Sea God?), I speculated about that earlier. But it doesn't have to be inactive or abandoned.

It makes a point why Isma protected the door with ammonite seal, Flora's house was protected from commoners and evil creatures too.

That has also already been commented on.

Also it was very cute how Schierke squirted water from her nostril...

Uh, how to say... That was snot.

If the innkeeper is setting up a trap, the best counter for Guts would be to go in headfirst taking initiative instead of sitting in the inn waiting for something to happen. And also this way he wont have to worry about anyone getting in his way. More of a practical and tactical decision then an emotional one if you ask me.

Yeah, that's what we were trying to explain to geo jee earlier.

It would be cute if Isidro and Schierke develop a sort of romance or friendship.

It's bound to happen! :miura:

 

Offline Okin

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #84 on: February 27, 2010, 10:50:51 PM »
Man this is one of those episodes that reminds me that Berserk has everything: violence, monsters, horror, comedy, budding-romance, and boob jokes.  :troll:

My favorite scene is easily the one where Guts is watching the two villagers over his shoulder without so much as blinking. The actual event is completely normal but the scene depicted is so perfectly bizarre! I'm kind of wondering why Serpico hasn't noticed anything though. I understand that Magnifico and even Roderick might not be paying attention. I guess there group must be filling most of inn, so it's easy to miss two people in the corner of the room.
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Offline Triple Life

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #85 on: February 28, 2010, 06:42:38 AM »
She's the one who told Isidro about the Sea God in the first place. They're two different entities no matter what scenario you envision.

I'm of the opinion that Isma and the Sea God are separate entities, but, for the sake of conversation, let's say they're not. There are a ton of reasons to think they have no direct relation other than proximity, but what if it's some kind of dualistic being? Isma is the good, life-giving, nurturing, adventurous, beautiful aspect of the Sea God. And then there is the evil sea, the sea that destroys ships, drowns people and whose waves crush villages. Of course, if true, Isma's half is pretty weak considering the villagers seem to all be zombies of some variety.

There's probably a bunch of holes in that theory too, but I guess I couldn't help but take those words as a challenge to envision a scenario.  :troll:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #86 on: February 28, 2010, 09:32:04 AM »
I'm of the opinion that Isma and the Sea God are separate entities, but, for the sake of conversation, let's say they're not. There are a ton of reasons to think they have no direct relation other than proximity, but what if it's some kind of dualistic being?

But then that wouldn't fit what she or Schierke said about it. So at the very least it means Isma lied, and she and the Sea God she told Isidro about are different entities because it was just a bogeyman she made up to hide her identity. :slan:

Offline Frankontherocks

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #87 on: February 28, 2010, 02:15:49 PM »
"What its like" she says, now I took this two ways. Firstly it could very well be that she inhabits the island and is genuinely wondering what the outside world is like. Secondly she could be talking about the land, that is to say what "outside the ocean" is like. She could be a sea entity( not sea anemone though her hairstyle is a bit indicative of them and seaweed as well) and just comes up to the land to keep travelers or what have you out of the cave. When we first see Isma she's naked, and once Guts and co come up to the island shes magically dressed. Now its possible she just saw other people and got dressed instead of hanging out naked. Then that got me thinking that the "townsfolk" had to be something else, confirmed by this episode as well... wiggly string people.... I believe that shes from the ocean her mannerisms and design hint at that, and certainly Schierke's crazy astral vision can vouch for some kind of oceanic tie in.

everymonday beat me to it, most if not all of those fish are deep sea creatures  :ubik:

sidebar: Really nice site you got here folks, glad to be a part of it  :badbone:

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Offline Triple Life

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #88 on: February 28, 2010, 08:44:36 PM »
But then that wouldn't fit what she or Schierke said about it. So at the very least it means Isma lied, and she and the Sea God she told Isidro about are different entities because it was just a bogeyman she made up to hide her identity. :slan:

Like I said, probably a bunch of holes. :troll:

Offline Sarcomere

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #89 on: February 28, 2010, 11:03:15 PM »
Is it just me, or does the arrangement of ..fish elementals around Isma on the last page look a lot like wings?  Particularly her left side.  Maybe Im just seeing things  :farnese:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #90 on: March 01, 2010, 01:02:47 AM »
Firstly it could very well be that she inhabits the island and is genuinely wondering what the outside world is like. Secondly she could be talking about the land, that is to say what "outside the ocean" is like.

Yeah that's pretty much a given.

She could be a sea entity( not sea anemone though her hairstyle is a bit indicative of them and seaweed as well) and just comes up to the land to keep travelers or what have you out of the cave.

Schierke's vision makes it quite clear that she's astrally related to the sea. Now for details we're going to have to wait. Personally I don't think she's just around to warn people not to enter the cave though. Again, if what she told Isidro is true, the islanders didn't go there in the first place (and they've been transformed into monsters anyway, AND the creature known as the sea god can leave the cave as evidenced by the ghost ship).

When we first see Isma she's naked, and once Guts and co come up to the island shes magically dressed. Now its possible she just saw other people and got dressed instead of hanging out naked.

The first shot of her is as she sees the ship in the horizon. So obviously she got dressed in the large time gap between her introduction and her meeting with Isidro. Nothing special.

Really nice site you got here folks, glad to be a part of it  :badbone:

Welcome aboard! :SK:

Is it just me, or does the arrangement of ..fish elementals around Isma on the last page look a lot like wings?  Particularly her left side.  Maybe Im just seeing things  :farnese:

Unfortunately I think you are indeed seeing things. The fishes form a spiral behind her, but she doesn't have wings. I think it's pretty clear in the picture too.

Offline Sarcomere

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #91 on: March 01, 2010, 02:58:48 AM »
Unfortunately I think you are indeed seeing things. The fishes form a spiral behind her, but she doesn't have wings. I think it's pretty clear in the picture too.

Ah, I didnt mean she has wings, just that it looks like she does.  I understand that is a spiral of fish but the way which Miura drew it just makes me think of wings. 

But then.. I guess that means I am seeing things

Offline Oburi

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #92 on: March 01, 2010, 05:10:26 PM »

It would be cute if Isidro and Schierke develop a sort of romance or friendship.

I think this episode shows it a lot more than we've seen in the past. When Schierke finds the dagger and does the mind telepathy thing she sees that Isidro's staring at boobies, which distracts her and allows those tentacle things to attack her. When she shows up at Isma's place, even Isidro comments on how she seems "more scary" than usual. That comment, along with Schierke's over the top reaction definitely seem to be the results of a romance in the making.

Also there is so much fish in this episode. Even Isidro is eating fish at Isma's and it looks like the signpost for the inn is a jug and a cup on a fish ( which is ironic if it was always there even before the villagers changed into fish eating monsters) . Just a few more to go along with all the other fish references.  :guts:



Offline Bekul

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #93 on: March 01, 2010, 05:14:14 PM »
I think this episode shows it a lot more than we've seen in the past

Heh, all the more-so given how Schierke and Isidro, uhm, first 'met' each other. Dislike at first grope!  :isidro: :schierke:

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #94 on: March 01, 2010, 05:35:37 PM »
Also there is so much fish in this episode. Even Isidro is eating fish at Isma's and it looks like the signpost for the inn is a jug and a cup on a fish
And don't forget Isidro's eyes "swimming".
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Jaccuri

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #95 on: March 01, 2010, 05:51:26 PM »
I was wondering about one thing.  On page 2 and 3, it seemed like Isidro insisted on going into the cave despite Isma's warnings then suddenly a wave splashed out of the water and hit him so he fell and hit his head.  If that is really happened couldn't it have been Isma's doing in order to keep him from entering the cave?

Offline Proj2501

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #96 on: March 01, 2010, 05:55:03 PM »
No doubt Schierke is scarier to Isidro. His thinking with the wrong head almost cost her and he lost the dagger she gave him to boot. While Isma has caught his eye, no way anything is going to come of them IMO.

Miura has really planted the seeds of those two eventually getting together. Their awkward first encounter with one another, Isidro fighting to protect her on the docks (Isi's first time fighting against normal people btw), along with their constant banter. One day he's going to stop being 'The Monkey' and win her over in a serious way. Just watch.

It would be nice to see her act somewhat jealous that Isidro's drooling over Isma but the fact she's just sensed a new Od is going to take center stage next episode.

Here's some quick speculation of Isma's future. She'll turn out to be friendly, maybe get close to the group. Eventually Guts and Co. will have to deal with whatever creature/God is in the cave and she'll wind up dying protecting the band. We already have one full blown witch in Guts' Co. and another in training. Sadly for that reason alone is why I don't think Isma's chances of survival are high. Silly maybe...
Or hell, maybe she'll live and wind up staying on the island. Who knows. I just don't see her joining the band.

Online Walter

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #97 on: March 01, 2010, 06:01:29 PM »
I was wondering about one thing.  On page 2 and 3, it seemed like Isidro insisted on going into the cave despite Isma's warnings then suddenly a wave splashed out of the water and hit him so he fell and hit his head.  If that is really happened couldn't it have been Isma's doing in order to keep him from entering the cave?
You're not alone in that thought:

Anyway, I was thinking back about the wave that sends Isidro down on page 2 yesterday, and I'm wondering if it's not something Isma did herself to prevent him from going further into the cave.

It would be nice to see her act somewhat jealous that Isidro's drooling over Isma but the fact she's just sensed a new Od is going to take center stage next episode.
Schierke seemed a little hurt, to me. She was genuinely worried about him after finding his dagger in the cave, and sought him out... only to find he was boob-gazing. Poor Schierke...

Proj, in response to your speculation about Isma, against all odds I hope she becomes a regular cast member. If she is indeed of the astral world, that could open so many doors for exposition in the future. She'd be a truly unique character.
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Offline Proj2501

Re: Episode 312
« Reply #98 on: March 01, 2010, 06:03:27 PM »
Schierke seemed a little hurt, to me, that she was genuinely worried about him after finding his dagger in the cave, and sought him out... only to find he was boob-gazing. Poor Schierke...

Yeah, true. Well, this might be the catalyst for her to realize she likes The Monkey, much to Ivarella's dismay.
 
:schierke:, "Could it be? I have feelings for...for..."
:iva:, "HIM?!"


:isidro:

I would die laughing if and when they ever kiss that as they are doing so, cartoony Puck goes to grab Ivarella's hand and she subsequently whack's him in the face.  :ganishka:

Proj, in response to your speculation about Isma, against all odds I hope she becomes a regular cast member. If she is indeed of the astral world, that could open so many doors for exposition in the future. She'd be a truly unique character.

While you're totally right in regards to more astral doors being open, my concern is that we might lose focus on some of the other characters. Like Azan was reintroduced and it's been sometime and I feel like he's just kinda there as backdrop. He really hasn't said much. My fears are really unfounded as Miura always delivers anyways. Listen not to me!

Online Walter

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Re: Episode 312
« Reply #99 on: March 01, 2010, 06:05:10 PM »
:schierke:, "Could it be? I have feelings for...for..."
:iva:, "HIM?!"

:isidro:
I think Schierke would deny that up until the moment they kissed  :casca:
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