Author Topic: Episode 316  (Read 31073 times)

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Offline IncantatioN

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #25 on: October 19, 2010, 08:49:27 PM »
Pretty cool episode, can't wait to read it all. I hope the battle is drawn out longer for Guts' mind to be sort of taken over by the Beast Of Darkness or for a temporary shift in who controls who in their unique bond.
At the end of time, a moment will come when just one man remains. Then the moment will pass. Man will be gone. There will be nothing to show that we were ever here... but stardust.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #26 on: October 19, 2010, 09:06:52 PM »
Afraid not, sorry.

-I normally don't skip over posts, sorry Aaz.

:judo:

Checked episodes 90-92 and it seems Guts and Casca's child was born during a full moon.

Yeah, while not shown in too much detail it does seem to be full. That sets a pretty cool motif for the character.

I hope the battle is drawn out longer for Guts' mind to be sort of taken over by the Beast Of Darkness or for a temporary shift in who controls who in their unique bond.

Your wording doesn't make it sound like you know what the Beast of Darkness is, nor what the effects of the Berserk's armor are on its wearer.

Offline Rhombaad

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #27 on: October 19, 2010, 09:26:01 PM »
Pretty cool episode, can't wait to read it all. I hope the battle is drawn out longer for Guts' mind to be sort of taken over by the Beast Of Darkness or for a temporary shift in who controls who in their unique bond.

Just to clarify, the Beast is Guts. They don't have a bond because they're the same person/entity, not two separate beings joined together. That's what makes Guts so interesting. His urge to kill Casca, for example, isn't brought on by some outside force. A part of him wishes he could be rid of her in order to pursue Griffith and get his revenge. Miura has chosen to give this side of him an image and voice so that we can better understand Guts' own internal struggle.

In the current situation, what's taken over Guts' mind isn't the Beast, but the Berserk's armor.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #28 on: October 19, 2010, 09:56:33 PM »
The relationship of Guts/the Beast/the armor is so incestuously nuanced that it's dangerous to define or compartmentalize it in any one set of terms concerning each without risking misinterpretation one way or another. Whether that be the easy mistake of looking at Guts and the Beast as separate adversarial entities, which isn't completely false figuratively speaking (like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde); or, dismissing the Beast as merely figurative itself when it's spiritually, and physically, manifested a number of times outside Guts' inner psyche, including no less than the shape of the Berserk's armor if the connection there wasn't strong enough. Anyway, since the Beast's introduction in volume 16, it's been a fluid situation that continues to evolve, and there's at least two ways, literally and figuratively, of interpreting the Beast at any given time, and multiple levels when you add the logistics of the Berserk's armor into the mix.

Anyway, can't wait for the return of the Moonlight Boy, it's interesting how much of even what we "know" about him is technically still speculation.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2010, 10:53:44 AM »
dismissing the Beast as merely figurative itself when it's spiritually, and physically, manifested a number of times outside Guts' inner psyche

Those manifestations are all directly linked to his psyche though, from the spectres in volume 16 to the armor in volume 26. And while there are certainly appropriate parallels and associations to be made on the symbolic and thematic levels, I can't say I've seen many people make them over the years.



Anyway, back to the episode, it's kid tentacles attacking Schierke & Isidro, presumably like those (or even the same) that had grabbed Schierke and pulled her in the water when she was following Isidro's trail. Just like Lith suspected a while back. :slan:

And it's nice to see Schierke using the hair trick again!

Offline Skeleton

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #30 on: October 20, 2010, 11:45:41 AM »
Man, that image of those two kids before they transform... That's such a creepy/disturbing image.  :sad:

And, telling by Isma's reaction, is it safe to assume she won't be using some sort of magic to help fight the sea god?  I don't know Japanese so I apologize for not knowing what they're saying, but does it appear like she's bewildered by the magic of Schierke and Isidro's dagger?  Or is she reacting to the creatures themselves?

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #31 on: October 20, 2010, 12:11:41 PM »
Man, that image of those two kids before they transform... That's such a creepy/disturbing image.  :sad:

Haha yeah, not any better than the adults. The kids recognize Isma and want to make her one of them.

And, telling by Isma's reaction, is it safe to assume she won't be using some sort of magic to help fight the sea god?  I don't know Japanese so I apologize for not knowing what they're saying, but does it appear like she's bewildered by the magic of Schierke and Isidro's dagger?  Or is she reacting to the creatures themselves?

You know, Isma's just a fisherwoman, she's not a warrior or a witch. At first she's just excited to see monsters ("like Isidro said"), and when Schierke mentions that the charms protecting her house must be very powerful, she replies that she didn't know. I think she'll play a key role in whatever events are yet to come, but you shouldn't expect her to skillfully unleash a devastating spell like Schierke does.

Anyway, Schierke warns them that getting close to the battle is now very dangerous because of Guts' state, and she remarks that the power of the armor has become a lot more powerful than before and that it emits a very strong Od. The Beast of Darkness is just giving its usual speech: "Enemy. No. Fear. Madness. Violence. Battle. Cut. Protect. Kill..." Notice the little "protect" that found its way in there, though. :slan:

Offline Skeleton

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #32 on: October 20, 2010, 01:00:38 PM »
You know, Isma's just a fisherwoman, she's not a warrior or a witch. At first she's just excited to see monsters ("like Isidro said"), and when Schierke mentions that the charms protecting her house must be very powerful, she replies that she didn't know. I think she'll play a key role in whatever events are yet to come, but you shouldn't expect her to skillfully unleash a devastating spell like Schierke does.

That's what I thought.  I just wanted to help bury the theory that she'd have some sort of powers (that she'd use consciously, at least) for good.  I can debunk most theories using my own observations, but if there's someone here who is infinitely more knowledgeable than myself, why not ask him to make sure there's an airtight seal on that coffin?  I hope I'm not too much of a bother in that regard. :)

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #33 on: October 20, 2010, 01:17:40 PM »
I can debunk most theories using my own observations, but if there's someone here who is infinitely more knowledgeable than myself, why not ask him to make sure there's an airtight seal on that coffin?  I hope I'm not too much of a bother in that regard. :)

Not at all, don't worry. That's what the forum is for.

To speculate a bit, I think the coming ordeal with the Sea God might reveal a part of Isma's merrow heritage she didn't know about. Don't ask me the details of what that will entail though. :iva:

Schierke's comment about the armor also makes me curious. Is it just the full moon, or an after-effect of the fusion of the worlds?

Online Walter

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #34 on: October 20, 2010, 01:27:44 PM »
Wow! So, Guts chases Casca, who ran after feeling some [maternal] instinct. She holds the boy, who then turns and touches Guts... this episode is going to be amazing.

To speculate a bit, I think the coming ordeal with the Sea God might reveal a part of Isma's merrow heritage she didn't know about. Don't ask me the details of what that will entail though. :iva:
Maybe her heritage will be recognized by the Sea God itself somehow.

Quote
Schierke's comment about the armor also makes me curious. Is it just the full moon, or an after-effect of the fusion of the worlds?
Well, she's had to deal with the armor on a full moon before. Which makes me think this a result of the merging. However, possibly a combination of both?
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Eluvei

Re: Episode 316
« Reply #35 on: October 20, 2010, 01:37:12 PM »
Holy shit, this is gonna be awesome. We're not 10 episodes into the chapter and it's already on FIRE!

Where are the jerks that were all "ohh this is gonna be just a sidequest before they reach Skellig" now? :schierke:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #36 on: October 20, 2010, 01:50:57 PM »
Wow! So, Guts chases Casca

I'm not sure he does: first she runs to the boy, and then Guts intervenes to cut down a slug that was about to attack her. Then it looks like the Beast of Darkness tries to convince him to "entrust himself" in the usual fashion, and the boy interferes at that time.

Where are the jerks that were all "ohh this is gonna be just a sidequest before they reach Skellig" now? :schierke:

Not buried in my backyard, that's for sure. :griffnotevil:

Offline Draculoid

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #37 on: October 20, 2010, 02:13:17 PM »
Looks like an awesome episode and can't wait to see the whole thing :D guess its safe to say this isn't the moment The Beast of Darkness was biding his time for and that Guts will most likely have control for the rest of this fight/sea god?
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Offline Rhombaad

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #38 on: October 20, 2010, 02:42:30 PM »
I guess we'll have to wait until the next episode to see whether or not the Moonlight Boy sticks around. I hate and love it when Miura leaves us with these cliff hangers.

However, possibly a combination of both?

While I think the armor's increase in power and amplified od is mainly due to the merging of the worlds, I'm sure that the moon's influence on magic and fetishes has been amplified by the merge, as well.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 05:21:53 PM by Rhombaad »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #39 on: October 20, 2010, 02:48:25 PM »
guess its safe to say this isn't the moment The Beast of Darkness was biding his time for and that Guts will most likely have control for the rest of this fight/sea god?

Well since the event the Beast referred to in episode 290 is the death of Guts' friends, I think there's a good chance it'll never really happen. Anyway yeah, from the preview it looks like the situation with the armor is going to be dealt with. For now we can't tell whether that means Guts will fight under control or the armor will be deactivated. As for the Sea God I'd say we're not there quite yet.

Offline Jaze1618

Re: Episode 316
« Reply #40 on: October 20, 2010, 03:01:52 PM »
Well, she's had to deal with the armor on a full moon before. Which makes me think this a result of the merging. However, possibly a combination of both?

Forgive my lapse of memory but is that really true?

The only time I remember the Armor mixing with a full moon was in volume 28, when the moonlight child first stopped guts from killing his friends, not Schierke.

Maybe I am forgetting something.

Offline Draculoid

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #41 on: October 20, 2010, 03:08:30 PM »
Well since the event the Beast referred to in episode 290 is the death of Guts' friends, I think there's a good chance it'll never really happen. Anyway yeah, from the preview it looks like the situation with the armor is going to be dealt with. For now we can't tell whether that means Guts will fight under control or the armor will be deactivated. As for the Sea God I'd say we're not there quite yet.

I got that he was referring to the death of his friends, but i interpretted from the last page of that segment to mean that the Beast (when he talks of conserving his strength and waiting) was going to unleash a more powerful mental attack then the usual to try and force the former to occur, not necessarily that it would.
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Offline Rhombaad

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #42 on: October 20, 2010, 03:10:33 PM »
Forgive my lapse of memory but is that really true?

The only time I remember the Armor mixing with a full moon was in volume 28, when the moonlight child first stopped guts from killing his friends, not Schierke.

Maybe I am forgetting something.

Schierke was very involved in that situation. Once the Moonlight Boy freed Guts from the armor's influence, Schierke was able to pull him out the rest of the way. She didn't sense anything different about the armor during that incident, either.

Offline Uriel

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #43 on: October 20, 2010, 03:40:59 PM »
Holy crap. Important episode incoming!

Online Walter

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #44 on: October 20, 2010, 04:49:29 PM »
Not really, first she runs to the boy, and then Guts intervenes to cut down a slug that was about to attack her.
Ah, my bad. It's hard to tell from just the small preview.

Once the Moonlight Boy freed Guts from the armor's influence, Schierke was able to pull him out the rest of the way. She didn't sense anything different about the armor during that incident, either.
Yeah, and that was my only point. If there was some special new od about the armor as a result of the full moon alone, she probably would have commented on it then.

:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Ramen4ever

Re: Episode 316
« Reply #45 on: October 20, 2010, 04:56:11 PM »
Well since the event the Beast referred to in episode 290 is the death of Guts' friends, I think there's a good chance it'll never really happen. Anyway yeah, from the preview it looks like the situation with the armor is going to be dealt with. For now we can't tell whether that means Guts will fight under control or the armor will be deactivated. As for the Sea God I'd say we're not there quite yet.

Was that "protect" that you mentioned a few posts before suggesting "protect others" or "protect self" If it's the former, that would indeed be incredibly interesting as far as what direction the BoD could be going in. Or maybe just how much Guts has learned to control the powers of the armor, even when he's seemingly over taken by its powers.

Though, if the moonlight boy is Griffith/demon child. Than the armor might not help Guts in the long run, even if he learns to control it.

I'm gonna stray off on a tangent here.. If that "protect" has any meaning in regards to Guts' darkside, that would be quite the development. That is, if Guts becomes a little less conflicted, and even the Beast comes to place value and importance on his companions (and not just as a means to an end) that could give Guts a resolution that he hasn't had for a long time. A resolution he lost when he broke Casca's trust.


Offline Rhombaad

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #46 on: October 20, 2010, 05:27:46 PM »
Yeah, and that was my only point. If there was some special new od about the armor as a result of the full moon alone, she probably would have commented on it then.

I agree. She's not one to hold out on the group. Unlike a certain elf I know... :puck:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #47 on: October 20, 2010, 05:30:32 PM »
I got that he was referring to the death of his friends, but i interpretted from the last page of that segment to mean that the Beast (when he talks of conserving his strength and waiting) was going to unleash a more powerful mental attack then the usual to try and force the former to occur, not necessarily that it would.

I don't think it can be taken that way. What the Beast of Darkness says is that by staying close to Guts, his friends would die eventually (because danger has a way of finding him), just like what happened during the Occultation ceremony, and that then it would engulf Guts completely.

The chains represent his feelings for his friends, and they are what prevents him from losing his mind. In the preview you can see that the Beast actually breaks one of the chains it has in its mouth, possibly under the strengthened influence of the armor (and it's possible that Flora's talisman is weakening as well). But then the boy shows him Casca.

I assume that when he sees and recognizes her, Guts will be able to bring the Beast back into "submission" (not sure what that would mean in regard to the armor, being more "in control" or not). In short it represents his inner struggle to remain himself while the Od of the Berserk's armor eats at his sanity. This takes us back to Schierke's comment in volume 27, about how Flora's talisman was preventing his ego from crumbling.

Well, she's had to deal with the armor on a full moon before. Which makes me think this a result of the merging. However, possibly a combination of both?

My only objection here is that while she didn't comment on it, she still couldn't get to him before the boy's intervention at the time.

Was that "protect" that you mentioned a few posts before suggesting "protect others" or "protect self" If it's the former, that would indeed be incredibly interesting as far as what direction the BoD could be going in.

It's just one word, so don't ask me for details. However I'm certain that it means to protect his friends, and specifically Casca. And it's not a first time thing either, as it was also mentioned in episode 290.

Or maybe just how much Guts has learned to control the powers of the armor, even when he's seemingly over taken by its powers.

Nah, I really wouldn't say that. From what Schierke says and seeing how the Beast of Darkness is empowered, he's clearly not controling anything.

I'm gonna stray off on a tangent here.. If that "protect" has any meaning in regards to Guts' darkside, that would be quite the development. That is, if Guts becomes a little less conflicted, and even the Beast comes to place value and importance on his companions (and not just as a means to an end) that could give Guts a resolution that he hasn't had for a long time. A resolution he lost when he broke Casca's trust.

See episode 290. His friends and his duty as far as protecting them goes is represented by those chains that hold the Beast back.

Offline Draculoid

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #48 on: October 20, 2010, 05:34:18 PM »
Any guesses on the number of episodes until the Sea Gods appearance or the next big thing Guts will fight? (maybe a further Pirate transformation?) Also guesses on how large the Sea God might be? I would assume smaller than Ganishkas final form but since its underwater you never know....Also what sort of powerup/ combination attack Guts will use, if any, to defeat it?
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Offline Jesterhead

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Re: Episode 316
« Reply #49 on: October 20, 2010, 05:39:05 PM »
Also what sort of powerup/ combination attack Guts will use, if any, to defeat it?

Honestly, I don't think Guts will be the one to defeat it. Or that he even has the power too.

I get the feeling that this is a foe beyond any humans ability. It's call the Sea God for a reason. I think Guts and his companions will have to rely on forces greater than their own to defeat this upcoming threat.