My own ideas about Idea of Evil (IOE)

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Alcaudon

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IOE as an Egregore


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The more I think and conceptualize about the Idea of Evil (IOE from now on), I relate it to the so-called "Egregores"1. Eliphas Levi called them "Princes of Souls". Rizardo da Camino in his Dictionary says it is a "mystical body is formed with its own peculiarities, after the opening of the Holy Book, when all minds to unite with the act of creating." An egregore it is a center of devic consciousness2, meaning devic space reactions by any of the states of human consciousness. Despite this, although I have some discussion whether IOE is or not a Divine Form, I disagree with that, because some DFs exist before the human race (as elemental lords), and we know where IOE came from.

   Esoterically, the egregore is defined as an entity composed of a primary group of people in a whole mental or psychological substance. The ancients regarded the egregore as a living entity with strength and will of its own generated from their creators or feeders but independent of each of them. That leads directly to the esoteric "Lost Chapter", in which the IOE talks about its origin and task.

   In the rational plane, we can understand egregores as psychic forms that have to do with states of human consciousness. It is a "psychic being" of a collective nature, a common sphere of influence, is a subtle, invisible, elastic flow that occupies space and transmits energy created by a thinking, feeling or acting of human beings. It is a real, sensible and active, although imponderable, "being", which allows people's hearts tuned, such as a receptor-enhancer-emitter in a closed circuit that feeds itself back, which never lose power, it constantly increases his thanks to a virtuous circle, at least for IOE.

   As a group soul, IOE is an archetype that directs the fate of the community, in "Berserk", community understood as humanity. It is undeniable its power to strengthening ties between the individual and the group, integrating the first record of the collective unconscious, I mean that if some people get together and emit strong and identical vibrations by thoughts of the same nature, being of positive or negative energy, depending on the kind of thoughts being casted, the egregore created with our thoughts, feelings and emotions, and according to them, react upon us... In other words, all vital or substantial momentum that comes from individuals or communities in a reaction that causes the space of a egregore psychic form, which is set around people, homes, temples, institutions, etc. and you can perceive the conditions and character of the same, as when we visited a house or town, and feel its "bad vibes."


   The egregore, as stated before, is fed back to the same emotions that created it, and who bore it, it causes them to repeatedly produce the same emotions. Some are ephemeral, some are permanent. The first impulse due to mental or states of consciousness sporadic and without binding force, whereas the latter are the result of psychic matter accumulation steadily and made permanent by the effect of normal states of consciousness, whether of individuals or groups, called IOE, but might even say that this ties in with some postulates of Quantum Mechanics, in which, some particles were discovered precisely because scientists wanted to find them. But if we take it home with examples, a pessimist will produce a form of power that the law of affinity is fixed around and will link with individuals and sites that have the same vibration. In the case of Berserk, thousands of years and countless generations of men who contributed leaving their hopes, fears and meanness (it'd be noted those should be called "attachment", as Buddhism does, after all, KM is a Japanese guy in a Buddhist cultural context.) IOE is a huge egregore beyond measure, and give them back to mankind the same addictions and suffering, again and again.


   Now, the egregore formed by the power of rites, religious ceremonies and meditations regularly carried out by the various religions, societies and esoteric spiritual training schools of the world determine with great influence the psychological states that affect the environment of such particular communities and also on other consciousnesses, generating a psychological phenomenon experienced as a spiritual awakening. Thus, we see an elevation or dignity of conscience. There desirable Egregores, necessary and lawful to seek as cohesion is illuminated, for example, Santa Claus, but in my opinion, this applies more to christian culture "saints", as many of his stories and "relics" are just an artificial construction and often fraudulent, which leads to the Egregores egate, which were generated by acts of selfishness as the aforementioned and other unmentionables (Caused by the inability to accept the good and reject evil?) These Negatives Egregores are the most numerous and often we will cross our path (Tell to Guts about it).

   The different types of life Egregores qualify individuals and groups that produced the effect of its ordinary and usual jobs and states of consciousness. There are those from the past and still swarm in rites and ceremonies and continue projecting energy. Others, recency can generate very significant in determining the actual life of social, political, cultural, individual nations.

   The egregore, being basically a mental creation-whether in a positive or negative, offers the particularity of being endowed with abilities and embryonic consciousness of action and reaction and a high spirit of surviving. There is capacity to absorb energy and expansion from the group, and resisting forces that trying to destroy it. The Egregores very directly influence human history psychic structuring environments that determine the degree of civilization and culture. Jesus formed the egregore of Christianity and Hitler's Nazism. But in terms of IOE, it has had the power to alter reality, manipulate entire generations of races in order to create specific individuals, like Griffith, we are faced again a egregore which is almost a divine form, and possibly should be called Demiurge.


   As an aside, the term egregore also appears in the twentieth century Russian mysticism, notably displayed in the beautifully intricate prose of "The Rose of the World" Daniil Andreev: "These entities of a material nature emerge from the psychic being large collective.. " I think a study of the apostles should take into account the concept.

In any case I apologize for this article, because it would have been much better if he had used quotes and images from missing chapter in itself, but I think would have been too long, on the other hand, as a postscript in Vedic philosophy, the concept of god created by man (DEVS EX HOMIMI?, I daresay ...) is not unknown, but, even though I looked through my things and my memory, I did not find that Sanskrit or Pali word that named it. 


1 egregore The term derives from a Greek word that means "be aware" or "care of". It can be formed from Latin as well; "ex-gregoris" as "came out from the group".

2 Sanskrit. "Deva" is equivalent to the Japanese word "kami," usually translated as "God", but cultural differences make it inaccurate. Rather, it refers to any non-supernatural entity born of astral or etheric shells left after physical death human. So an "Oni", a "Kitsune" a "Naga" and a "Djinn" would be deva or kami, as well as "Amaterasu" or "Durga".
 

Walter

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Are you of the opinion the egregore was a concept that influenced Miura's creation of The Idea of Evil? Or are you just interested in the concept and thought you saw some connections?
 
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Alcaudon

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[color=black]   I think effectively that Miura was influenced in one way or another by this concept. Miura's work has a lot of symbolism, and the kabbalistic references are a legion, i.e. the 216 years can be read as 6 * 6 * 6, being 6 the number of perfection in material world (Not Number of Beast related...), and so on... I think that kind of symbolism is a key factor in Berserk.[/color]
 
Interesting but also confusing read.

The IOE certainly has a lot of characteristics akin to an Egregore, or at least it seems that way from what I understand of the words meanings. And I'm certainly no expert, since before this thread, I've never even heard of the word.
What I did notice upon reading up on it, is that an egregore is usually in a close symbiotic relationship with its group and results from a conscious collective effort or purpose. The IOE is aware of what it was created from however, human's, especially as a whole, are not aware of the IOE's existence. The examples of Santa Claus, Jesus, etc. They work because they are concepts that the people it affects, are aware of. The IOE is not similar in that regard, humanity as a whole is not aware of it, and did not perform a conscious collective effort to create the IOE. The relationship is like a one way mirror. And Miura has emphasized the depth between the physical, spiritual, and ideal world. The Ideal world is governed by the subconscious.

These are the potential differences I noticed, based on .. well Wikipedia and Babylon dictionary.. unfortunately. >_<;
How would you explain this?
 
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Alcaudon

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Ramen4ever said:
Interesting but also confusing read.

The IOE certainly has a lot of characteristics akin to an Egregore, or at least it seems that way from what I understand of the words meanings. And I'm certainly no expert, since before this thread, I've never even heard of the word.
What I did notice upon reading up on it, is that an egregore is usually in a close symbiotic relationship with its group and results from a conscious collective effort or purpose. The IOE is aware of what it was created from however, human's, especially as a whole, are not aware of the IOE's existence. The examples of Santa Claus, Jesus, etc. They work because they are concepts that the people it affects, are aware of. The IOE is not similar in that regard, humanity as a whole is not aware of it, and did not perform a conscious collective effort to create the IOE. The relationship is like a one way mirror. And Miura has emphasized the depth between the physical, spiritual, and ideal world. The Ideal world is governed by the subconscious.

These are the potential differences I noticed, based on .. well Wikipedia and Babylon dictionary.. unfortunately. >_<;
How would you explain this?


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Ok, I'll explain myself... I mentioned Santa Claus and Jesus, because they were the most recognizeable examples of that, but in our daily life, we have a lot of egregore we're not aware of, and that does not deny their origin from humanity's unconciousness, one example would be the internet itself, and we got awore of that thanks to Matrix films. But talking about Berserk world, people lurked for a savior, and that savior, Griffith, is the egregor-sphere's manifestation, so, they, the people, never need to be aware of IOE, just staying wishing for their Messiah, and their unconciousness and sub-conciousness shape the Ideal World, and we can say that IOE is the conciousness of the Ideal World, becoming in that way the Meta-Conciousness
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First of all, I couldn't help but notice that you've simply translated this piece of, uh, "research" from here or here (both masonic websites, it's been reposted everywhere) with a few (very few) additions, and inserted a bunch of Berserk-related little comments to try and make it look like you wrote it precisely for this reason. I have no way to know if you wrote the original text or not (nor do I care), but I'm just gonna presume that you didn't because you've shown extremely poor knowledge of EVERYTHING by stating that The Fucking Matrix has made us aware of something (whatever it is). And really, I mean, let's be honest for a second, you didn't write the original.

Secondly, your translation is purposedly confusing as a means to try and make you sound like a smart guy (or it's just amateurish, sorry if that's the case, I don't mean to criticize your hard work) and it's very displeasing to read, in my humble opinion.

Here's a good text about Keanu Reeves' The Matrix in case you like that kinda thing:

http://www.ubishops.ca/BaudrillardStudies/vol1_2/genosko.htm

peace
 

Aazealh

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Eluvei said:
First of all, I couldn't help but notice that you've simply translated this piece of, uh, "research" from here or here (both masonic websites, it's been reposted everywhere) with a few (very few) additions

"My own ideas"... :ganishka:

Like Eluvei pointed out, almost none of this stuff is related to Berserk. It makes it hard for me to reply or even care about it, although the imposture kind of guarantees a deletion. It's also terribly hollow if you look past the gibberish, and not particularly factual or substantiated. The cherry on top is that it doesn't even fit what's in the manga besides the vaguest definition. Your thread could have just been a single line: "the general concept of an Egregore kind of resembles that of the Idea of Evil."

Anyway, we've always known what influenced Miura when he created the Idea of Evil. It's in its very name, "idea" being not an English word here but a Greek one. That's right, it's referring to Plato's famous theory.

In conclusion, this egregore thread is just egregious. :badbone:
 
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