Breaking Bad

Walter · August 12, 2013

Fantastic episode. Griffith already said everything and more than I planned to, so I'll just be brief.

That garage door closing... man. I waited a long time for that showdown. It was really worth it, and it's all just beginning. So fantastic to see Hank's bulldog resolve: I don't give a fuck about family. Walt: :magni:

Jesse is super boring and obnoxious. Nothing new. Total regression to his state in season 4, before Mike opened his eyes. This is well-worn territory. Why are we back here again? At least his perspective has effectively become the B-side.

The way the episode opens sure is ominous, and says quite a bit already. The jig is up. My first thought upon seeing it confirmed: What will Junior say to Walt?

As for the tracker on Walt's car, remember that before, Hank had to retrieve it and download the data in order to use it. It's not beamed out wirelessly or anything. So presumably Walt isn't going to leave it with him, and reveal the Pinkman visit. Regardless, that reunion is sure to happen soon enough.

As always, looking forward to the next one.

Griffith · August 12, 2013

Walter said:
That garage door closing... man. I waited a long time for that showdown. It was really worth it, and it's all just beginning. So fantastic to see Hank's bulldog resolve: I don't give a fuck about family. Walt:

I couldn't tell if he was saying it of himself or Walt for what he's done, like don't play that card now.

Walter said:
As for the tracker on Walt's car, remember that before, Hank had to retrieve it and download the data in order to use it. It's not beamed out wirelessly or anything. So presumably Walt isn't going to leave it with him, and reveal the Pinkman visit. Regardless, that reunion is sure to happen soon enough.

Oh yeah, but Hank might just physically take it now. Maybe he'd even privately surrender to Walt's logic, be ready to let it go, but then check the tracker and assume that Walt's still involved with Pinkman in the business. :ganishka:

Anyway, only way to rationalize that confrontation for Walt now is ego and missing the action, both wanting it back, and not being sharp. He couldn't even effectively lie to Jesse. This has some insight on that front:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/08/11/breaking-bad-creator-vince-gilligan-spills-on-midseason-season-premiere-s-big-plot-twist.html

So maybe Walter already surrendered some of his edge to retirement. Anyway, that's a lot of info from the creator for a single episode, even the opener of the final season. It's not like he shies away from interviews about the show though.

Walter · August 12, 2013

Griffith said:
I couldn't tell if he was saying it of himself or Walt for what he's done, like don't play that card now.

My bad, I checked the line in subtitles and Hank actually says: Like you ever gave a shit about family.

Anyway, only way to rationalize that confrontation for Walt now is ego and missing the action, both wanting it back, and not being sharp.

It seemed to me that Walt went over to Hank's merely to check on his suspicions—gauge Hank's reaction upon seeing him, but he was caught off guard when Hank had already put everything together.

But of course ego factors in as well (as always).

Walt's cancer line was so weak... so transparently manipulative that even I was surprised he pulled it. Hank has him dead to rights, and he still plays the cancer card.

From that article you linked: "nope, it needs to be in the first one. Because we've got a shitload of story left to tell. And we’ve only got seven more episodes after this one in which to tell it. "

:schierke:

And who decided to split the "final season" into two parts...?

So maybe Walter already surrendered some of his edge to retirement

Sure seems so. But he was juuuuust getting his feet wet in the EMPIRE BUSINESS ... of car wash management. :ganishka:

Griffith · August 12, 2013

Walter said:
It seemed to me that Walt went over to Hank's merely to check on his suspicions—gauge Hank's reaction upon seeing him, but he was caught off guard when Hank had already put everything together.

But of course ego factors in as well (as always).

Yeah, if Walt was really on his game he would have never given up his advantage like that (remember the way he used to firmly lie to Skyler, revealing nothing when confronted, he should apply that times 10 with Hank). I think it galled him and that's why he turned back around and came right out with it even though he was exposing himself to what came next. You're right though that he probably also underestimated how much Hank already knew, and how he'd react. Like Hank would get sheepish or something and falter. Whoops.

Walter said:
From that article you linked: "nope, it needs to be in the first one. Because we've got a shitload of story left to tell. And we’ve only got seven more episodes after this one in which to tell it. "

And who decided to split the "final season" into two parts...?

Maybe I'm being too generous to the creative people, but I put most of that on A&E. The negotiations were a total clusterfuck, among other things (the demands of Mad Men and turmoil with The Walking Dead production) and it was even a question if there would be a season 5 (there was even the talk of shopping it to other networks). As good as the show still is, I do feel cheated out of what should have been. It should have gotten to go out at its own pace. Clearly we should have gotten two full seasons, one of Walt's rise to the top, and one of his fall. With time to slowly set things up and then in motion like in season's past. Instead, out of necessity, we're getting what feels a bit like the abridged version. Sure, it's still great, jam-packed and all, and it's better than nothing, but it still feels like we're losing something in the deal. And now, after treating it like the red-headed stepchild and kicking it down the stairs, AMC is banging the BEST SHOW EVER drum as loud as possible ("and tune in to our new garbage with Breaking Bad previews, wedged between Breaking Bad and our other fake Breaking Bad related talk show"). So, would 10 more episodes of the "BEST SHOW EVER" have been so bad for business, AMC? Anyway, I'm not saying this to complain about the show, and I'm not going to hold it against it in the long run or as far as the ending is concerned (if anything I'll cut it due slack), but I do resent the fact that instead of the people behind the show getting to do what it seems they wanted, they had to be constricted to this bizarre compromise to get something done. All we can hope is that it was for the best.

Handmade_lion · August 12, 2013

Loved the episode. What pacing! Like last year, it's still the fastest hour on television and Next Sunday can't get here quick enough. :ganishka:

Griffith said:
As for next time, well... first I have to sit through a half fucking hour of AMC's so trying to be hard-edged show about cops that commit crimes in their spare time or whatever... fucking eh, after they nickel and dimed the show on the fifth season, do this lame ass "Talking Bad" shit with a new show in the middle, and now this... ugh. Way to give it the shaft and then exploit the hell out of it.

I absolutely cannot stand Chris Hardwick. He sticks out worse in a room full of people who I just want to hear converse with each other more than that sore thumb of a moderator who they always got to inject himself into the middle of my DC Animated Universe special feature interviews (his name eludes me right now). But I watched Hardwick moderate the Comic-con Breaking Bad panel with all his little teenage quips and jokes--and this just after he assured the crowd he wasn't going to be hosting Talking Bad in the same way as Talking Dead-- that put a bad taste on everything anyone said for the next five minutes or until he did it again. That partnered up with Bryan Cranston's talking through a rubber mask for the entire duration of the panel, it was practically unwatchable (but I sat through the whole thing anyway). The Conan O'Brien interview however was fantastic. It was nice though seeing a fan bring up all the Skylar hatred to Anna Gunn, and I thought she defended herself very well if a little textbooky "the writers know exactly what they're doing/some characters are supposed to outshine others". She seemed prepared (or briefed) for the question and fully aware of her character's reputation with the viewer-base.

Walter · August 12, 2013

Griffith said:
Maybe I'm being too generous to the creative people, but I put most of that on A&E. The negotiations were a total clusterfuck, among other things (the demands of Mad Men and turmoil with The Walking Dead production) and it was even a question if there would be a season 5 (there was even the talk of shopping it to other networks).

Yeah, you're probably right. AMC execs have proven themselves to be incompetent fucks. But Gilligan's quote still comes across as disingenuine—"Oh, look at the time!"

Instead, out of necessity, we're getting what feels a bit like the abridged version. Sure, it's still great, jam-packed and all, and it's better than nothing, but it still feels like we're losing something in the deal.

I don't disagree, but so few shows are as good as Breaking Bad, I'm honestly happy with what we have. Could it be better? Certainly. But another season or two might not have been the answer. Look at Mad Men, collapsing on its own weight after four solid seasons and two terrible, TERRIBLE seasons in a grab to milk the show for all it's worth (2 seasons more than was originally intended.)

And now, after treating it like the red-headed stepchild and kicking it down the stairs, A&E is banging the BEST SHOW EVER drum as loud as possible ("and tune in to our new garbage with Breaking Bad previews, wedged between Breaking Bad and our other fake Breaking Bad related talk show").

One of the advantages of watching it the way I am (Amazon the day after) is that I don't have to deal with that garbage OR commercials. :ubik:

All we can hope is that it was for the best.

Yep. I'm reasonably sure that we're in for a treat with the finale.

Speaking of which... Normally I don't like speculating too hard about this show, because I enjoy the surprises. But I couldn't resist this one.

IncantatioN brought up the ricin earlier, asking if maybe Walt was saving it for himself as an easy way out if things go rough. When I first read it, I disregarded it because there are a number of ways to kill yourself. Walt would certainly know a few. And ricin works slow, it's not like cyanide. Its function is that it's not just lethal—it's undetectable. What if that is what he's planning, and he doesn't want his legacy to be tarnished by taking the coward's way out. This way, he gets to beat cancer, beat Hank, and go out on his own terms.

Or he just intends to use it on Jesse and/or Hank...

Lastly:
Someone animated Badger's Star Trek script: http://www.geekosystem.com/animated-badger-trek/

Griffith · August 12, 2013

Walter said:
Yeah, you're probably right. AMC execs have proven themselves to be incompetent fucks. But Gilligan's quote still comes across as disingenuine—"Oh, look at the time!"

I definitely think it's covert bitching on his part, all the better hidden behind his laid back drawl and mock enthusiasm, "I have so little time left to finish my opus... GREAT!"

Walter said:
I don't disagree, but so few shows are as good as Breaking Bad, I'm honestly happy with what we have. Could it be better? Certainly. But another season or two might not have been the answer. Look at Mad Men, collapsing on its own weight after four solid seasons and two terrible, TERRIBLE seasons in a grab to milk the show for all it's worth (2 seasons more than was originally intended.)

Well, I would just want the last season and this one to have the regular compliment of 12 or 13 episodes, then they would have had time to show Walt on top and when he left and all that stuff that was either shortened, skippedm or montaged. There's no doubt in my mind we would have gotten that if they'd had the hours. And funny you should mention Mad Men that since Matthew Weiner's monetary demands were blamed for everyone else at AMC getting squeezed. So, he could be blamed for ruining TWO of the greatest shows ever! And yeah, the irony of Breaking Bad being cut short so he could churn out shitty new Mad Men seasons really hurts.

Johnstantine · August 13, 2013

If you guys want to, you can watch the latest episodes on Netlix UK for free and quasi-legal (you are paying for it).

Just use Hola unblocker for Chrome.

Gobolatula · August 13, 2013

Griffith said:
Lastly:
Someone animated Badger's Star Trek script: http://www.geekosystem.com/animated-badger-trek/

This guy is funny and great. I took part in a by-chance google+ chat with him once with another animator buddy of mine.

Griffith · August 13, 2013

Gobolatula said:
This guy is funny and great. I took part in a by-chance google+ chat with him once with another animator buddy of mine.

Since that video was online by the time I got to work the next morning, I wondered if it was really made that fast or if he was privy to a early critics' copy of the episode via Vulture. I don't know how common that is, though nothing about this season(s) of Breaking Bad has been common considering the instant reaction, analysis, self-analysis, and pop culture relevance of the first episode.

Rodrigo · August 16, 2013

A very informative article from a real-life chemist regarding the scientific veracity of various chemical processes depicted in Breaking Bad

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23710654

seppuku · August 19, 2013

Releasing Breaking Bad in tiny fragments is torturous. Often times I was looking at the clock just anxiously checking how much story I had left before having to wait yet another week. And that was after 11 months of wait.

This was by far the hardest episode for me to watch. Watching Skyler talk with Hank and then not talk with Marie actually felt suffocating.

I know some of you all said that you're tired of Jesse being mopey all the time, but I like that Jesse handles having blood on his hands differently from Walt. The murders just make Walt more psychopathic and hack away at Jesse's resolve until he's a broken husk. I can't think of another character in television whose guilt chips away at him in the long term. I feel more sympathy towards Jesse because he reacts to his crimes in a stupid, self-defeating, but believable way. Not every main character has to be an expert in the face of danger, and it's a nice contrast to those who are.

Griffith · August 19, 2013

All that being said...

Fucking Jesse!

Walter · August 19, 2013

Episode ended so abruptly, I punched the couch :mozgus:

Things really are moving so fast, all these character reactions I didn't expect until the end are all happening up front. And now we're already

to Hank and Jesse teaming up (just wait for it :carcus:

)

PS:

Did anyone catch the conversation between Walt and his car wash guy when he called after leaving Hank's? "Get Skylar on the line... No the phone." Did they write in the guy mistakenly thinking Walt wanted to get his wife to wash cars? I love this show.

PPS:

That lottery ticket memory method definitely won't backfire!

IncantatioN · August 19, 2013

Skylar was pretty good in this episode, felt bad for her when

Marie didn't let go of the baby and the baby began to wail

. Surprised to see

Todd after that shoot-out, he's pretty sinister haha ... calm face and all goody after a bloodbath. But that move by Lydia I didn't expect, desperation maybe? Walt doesn't know of what she's been up to on the side and I think Lydia can be a bigger headache for him than Hank. She's clearly under pressure with Walt stopping production ... tried reaching out to him but was unsuccessful ... no Heisenberg standards of meth anymore. If she decides to take Walt head on, I wonder if Todd will back out.

Opening aerial shot of Jesse was cool. Maybe the

ricin's for him? Not sure if he'll have a normal life again, he's taking it all too hard.

So far both episode ending cliffhangers were awesome!

Rhombaad · August 19, 2013

Groovy Metal Fist said:
Releasing Breaking Bad in tiny fragments is torturous. Often times I was looking at the clock just anxiously checking how much story I had left before having to wait yet another week. And that was after 11 months of wait.

I felt the same way last night. It was the first time in a long time that I yelled out, "No!" when a TV episode ended.

Walter said:
Episode ended so abruptly, I punched the couch

Ugh. Exactly.

Walter said:
PS:

Did anyone catch the conversation between Walt and his car wash guy when he called after leaving Hank's? "Get Skylar on the line... No the phone." Did they write in the guy mistakenly thinking Walt wanted to get his wife to wash cars? I love this show.

I completely missed that. That's great. :ganishka:

Walter said:
PPS:

That lottery ticket memory method definitely won't backfire!

I thought the same thing: "Yeah, this won't come back to bite him in the ass..." Oh, Walt...why not just committ it to memory? Aren't you supposed to be some kind of genius?

Vampire_Hunter_Bob · August 19, 2013

At this point

obviously everyone, except Flynn and Saul (+ his employees), is going to die

.

Walter said:
Episode ended so abruptly, I punched the couch

Same. Same, and same. I've been spoiled with Netflix, no commercials and all the episodes at once. How do you guys do this once a week thing?! :troll:

DirectDK · August 19, 2013

I NEED MORE EPISODES NOW!!!

I thoroughly enjoyed this episode.

The bathroom scene was one of my favorite scenes this ep. I was happy to hear those exchange of words, and I gotta say, Skyler impressed me with her commitment to their scheme and/or their family and/or their marriage. Call me a sap, but I think deep down somewhere beneath all the pain, anger and deceit, Skyler still loves Walt.

As for Jesse... man I really hope he survives this show. If he dies, for any reason or in any fashion, it will be too sad. I'm cheering for him to get his shit together.

Todd... that boy is crazy! He's so calm and collected about everything. His uncle scares me. They kill like it's nothing. And I'm sure they are going to kill a lot more characters before these next 6 eps are up!

I'm also quite happy with the pace. The story is moving fast but the scenes within themselves are paced incredibly well. As someone posted earlier, it's almost suffocating how silent some scenes are, drawing out every second of suspense.

Really happy with these 2 eps so far! Can't wait!

IncantatioN · August 19, 2013

Saul's henchmen and their scene together cracked me up. I would've done the same : p

I feel like the show's pretty open about a few things that could happen. Keeps one guessing (in a good way), good job Gilligan.

Roidrage · August 19, 2013

In the best of worlds Jesse would have been dead long time ago and so would Skyler. I wonder why the authors are trying to make her more likeable all of the sudden and her scene with Walter was not consistent with the character we have witnessed in previous seasons.

As far as Walter - I stopped rooting for him since he destroyed a perfectly organized operation and killed 2 great characters: Mike and Gustavo. Imbecill. To bad he lives on to fight another day.

Hopefully the authors will stay true to some form of kharma and the only ones that survive are the innocent children. The rest ( lawyer included and ofcourse the childmurdering Todd) will end up six feet under. Although Todds uncle and his crew put out a nice show and hopefully there will be more it in the future episodes

Walter · August 20, 2013

DirectDK said:
The bathroom scene was one of my favorite scenes this ep. I was happy to hear those exchange of words, and I gotta say, Skyler impressed me with her commitment to their scheme and/or their family and/or their marriage. Call me a sap, but I think deep down somewhere beneath all the pain, anger and deceit, Skyler still loves Walt.

You are a sap.

Since she accepted Walt's ways, Skylar has been taking into consideration the long-term implications of having a criminal for a husband. She's trying to make things as right as they can be for the sake of their kids, not out of love for Walt. Admittedly, tucking him in a blanket was pretty powerful and unexpected in this episode, but their relationship is so beyond ruined it's cute that you'd even think there's still a chance for happiness between them. As Skylar said this ep: I can't remember the last time I was happy (it's true love!).

Todd... that boy is crazy! He's so calm and collected about everything. His uncle scares me. They kill like it's nothing. And I'm sure they are going to kill a lot more characters before these next 6 eps are up!

It's been made pretty clear those are _actual_ criminals, not of the former high school teacher variety. Todd's just a sociopath that was likely raised in a criminal environment. It's not super surprising given his uncle's state of mind.

Roidrage said:
In the best of worlds Jesse would have been dead long time ago and so would Skyler. I wonder why the authors are trying to make her more likeable all of the sudden and her scene with Walter was not consistent with the character we have witnessed in previous seasons.

As far as Walter - I stopped rooting for him since he destroyed a perfectly organized operation and killed 2 great characters: Mike and Gustavo. Imbecill. To bad he lives on to fight another day.

Hopefully the authors will stay true to some form of kharma and the only ones that survive are the innocent children. The rest ( lawyer included and ofcourse the childmurdering Todd) will end up six feet under. Although Todds uncle and his crew put out a nice show and hopefully there will be more it in the future episodes

Roid, please tag your posts with the spoiler tag in the future or they'll be removed. To answer your question about Skylar:

Hers is the path of least resistance. Without Walt there is no case. With no case, the money has a chance of staying out of the authorities hands. Pure pragmatism.

Gobolatula · August 20, 2013

Todd actually terrifies me. I have yet to see him actually upset and I'm wondering if that's even something he would show. The calm and polite villains are always the craziest.

Great episode. There were a lot of great gifs of

Huell and Kuby on the money pile

on the somethingawful thread haha.

DirectDK · August 20, 2013

Walter said:
You are a sap.

Since she accepted Walt's ways, Skylar has been taking into consideration the long-term implications of having a criminal for a husband. She's trying to make things as right as they can be for the sake of their kids, not out of love for Walt. Admittedly, tucking him in a blanket was pretty powerful and unexpected in this episode, but their relationship is so beyond ruined it's cute that you'd even think there's still a chance for happiness between them. As Skylar said this ep: I can't remember the last time I was happy (it's true love!).

Being happy and still loving someone are two entirely different things. Don't simplify the matter

just because Skylar said she can't remember the last time she was happy therefore all the love is gone. And really is there a need to mock me by saying "it's cute to even think that" or saying "it's true love!" when I didn't say that?

Just like you admitted, tucking him in the blanket was powerful. She's trying her hardest. And of course, it's for the sake of her kids, and for own sake as she doesn't want to go to prison either and leave her kids abandoned. But to absolutely 100% deny that she has no love for Walt whatsoever is a very jaded way of thinking about things. And unrealistic. Yes their relationship is broken, beyond repair. I'm not denying that. And I'm not saying oh they are going to live happily ever after fairy tale ending. But I'm saying, deep down inside, Skylar is holding onto Walt and their family. That she still is painfully aware of Walt's walking down this dangerous road, on top of the cancer. That she was concerned when he fell flat on his face on the bathroom floor and brought him a pillow and blanket and waited by his side to wake up. That she still ultimately has love for him, in some way or another.

That's how I see it. Take it for what it is, debate as you like, but don't belittle my statements.

IncantatioN · August 20, 2013

Didn't strike me about the pillow-blanket until I read the topic, only remember her being concerned and rushing over and waiting for him to wake up.

What do you guys think of Skyler's intentions? ...

During the bathroom scene, Walt said he wanted to turn himself in if she kept the cash for their kids. I don't remember what she said. I think deep down she loves him still and it's not that simple because of what he made her go through and her involvement in his scheme so far.

She's been smart about taking care of herself and her family (IRS and car wash thing). Hard to say she has completely fallen out of love, it's been like ... under 2 years since her world's turned upside down. She could have given up Heisenberg to the police and negotiated a deal for a clean slate because he's that big a catch. She could have in the past and even when Hank came to her with suspicions of his own. She's also gone easy on Walt since he stopped cooking meth and focusing on family/ trying to do right by her.

Walter · August 20, 2013

DirectDK said:
Being happy and still loving someone are two entirely different things. Don't simplify the matter

just because Skylar said she can't remember the last time she was happy therefore all the love is gone. And really is there a need to mock me by saying "it's cute to even think that" or saying "it's true love!" when I didn't say that?

That's how I see it. Take it for what it is, debate as you like, but don't belittle my statements.

Oh come on man, you did ask people up front to call you a sap. My tone was in jest. I figured I could joke with you about such things without raising a stink... If Griff had made the same statements, I'd call him on it just the same, and vice versa.

That being said, I do think you are reading too much meaning into their exchange in that scene. "Love" certainly wasn't what came to mind to me in those moments. Fondness, obligation, habit maybe. I certainly wouldn't qualify anything in that scene as "love."

IncantatioN said:
She could have given up Heisenberg to the police and negotiated a deal for a clean slate because he's that big a catch. She could have in the past and even when Hank came to her with suspicions of his own. She's also gone easy on Walt since he stopped cooking meth and focusing on family/ trying to do right by her.

Fixing this mess is not nearly as simple as you describe.

A call to the DA with all of the evidence she has would utterly ruin the family, bar none. She hasn't made a move yet because she knows what the fallout would be. She is in an untenable situation. Once the authorities come in, their whole family is ruined.

First of all, she's implicated in money laundering for her husband now. That part can't be covered up. Like she said, you can't go to the cops and keep the money. Their laundering operation is transparent once the authorities begin sniffing around. Maybe if she fessed up, she'd be given a clean record—but maybe not. Maybe they'd take her kids away. And even if she was given a meal ticket by the cops, what about rebuilding from the scraps left by Walt? What about her relationship with her sist- well that's already been fucked. What about her relationship with her kids after she has to tell them daddy was a crime kingpin who killed dozens of people so that you could go to college? Even with Walt out of the picture, it's fucked.

Breaking Bad

Administrator

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew

Administrator

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew

Administrator

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew

Skibbidy Boo Bop

praise be to grail!

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew

Administrator

Video Game Time Traveler

Cats are great

Administrator

praise be to grail!

Administrator