Prometheus

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Just finished watching it. Spoilers and impressions, ahoy.

So, that was a movie for morons, right? People that don't understand subtlety? It goes out of its way to bluntly state its themes and character motivations throughout, all of which are terrifyingly obvious well before the actors are forced to move their big dumb lips by strings pulled by a large-fisted Ridley Scott, whose desperate shadow looms over the movie throughout. Many scenes come across as insultingly stupid. The camera and cinematography even think we're idiots. And then after treating us like idiots, has to reiterate shit, and then treat us to a dramatic reveal.

My biggest trouble with this movie was expectations. And I don't mean to say that I was excited for it. I went in cold. What I mean is that they truly cannot divorce themselves from what it is: a prequel to the Aliens franchise. And on that note I found it quite stale. It bumbles around in a childlike imitation of its parents, the function of all of which was ... what exactly? The connection of this movie to the Alien franchise became akin to an annoying song playing in the background throughout, always there nagging at me, making it impossible for me to truly enjoy it for what it was. And all I remember of that tune is the chorus, which goes something like this: "Me tooooo!"

The first time anyone who has seen Alien/s sees the navigation room on board the 'engineers' ship, it's quite clear to any fucking idiot what it is. But no, we need to have some convenient holograms teach us what it is (that's some truly advanced exposition technology), and then for there to be a massive reveal to make sure every idiot in the theater realizes that this is THE SAME KIND as the one in Alien. Whoa! Who saw that coming?!

There are dozens of examples of the soft touch employed by Scott to convey key plot and character elements. Here are a few that stuck out to me as almost laughable:

Charlize Theron spelling out "father" to us. Gee, yeah, didn't pick up on that one.

The dramatic, bassy sound effect and close-up shot when David dips his finger in Holloway's drink. What?! Wh-what'd he do?!

Stringer Bell spelling it out for us in a very poorly placed scene that this was a biological weapons depot approximately 20 minutes after it was already strikingly obvious. Oh, snap!

"Hey robot guy. Fuck you. You're just a dumb robot made by humans." -- "Oh? Well what if aliens made you and you're a dumb robot too? Just with flesh?" -- "I never thought of it like that..!" UNTAPPED SCIFI POTENTIAL!

The final scene of the xenomorph chewing its way out of the engineer. Xenomorphs?! Here?! (I had a great audience by the way! after this scene, the guy next to me whispered to his girlfriend: "It's an Alien from Aliens vs. Predator." On the walk out, guys behind me: "So that was a prequel to Aliens vs Predator? Whoa!")

Need I even go into the absurdity of the 5 minute c-section after which she's able to run around the ship? Oh, right, that's covered by the fact that it's a super-expensive laboratory pod.

*Sigh* ... So, final impressions. Was it terrible? No, not really. Would have been a pretty standard movie if it were a standalone scifi. But it's not. It is inevitably going to be compared and contrasted with the quality of the rest of the franchise. So then, was it embarrassing, and a letdown for any Alien fans expecting something significant enough to warrant a return to the franchise? Yes.

Oh yeah, and spoiling the climax of the film in your movie poster? Nice fucking job.
 
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hellrasinbrasin

Guest
...While I respect people's opinion I also can disagree. And within the endless cycle of agreement and disagreement I can say Prometheus while not a great film it was a good film and it might just end up becoming a cult classic.

Now the only 2 that haven't handed in their opinion's are Griffith, and Aaz.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
hellrasinbrasin said:
...While I respect people's opinion I also can disagree.
I have no intention of arguing about this movie. I don't care enough. I've said my piece.

hellrasinbrasin said:
I can say Prometheus while not a great film it was a good film and it might just end up becoming a cult classic.
Reach for the stars! Why would this movie be remembered? It's utterly derivative. Alien was a cult movie, and deserving of its status. Whereas this movie's spine was ripped from Alien. Anyway, I never said it was a bad film movie. Subtract my rant about how hamfisted it was, and what I said was that it was pretty standard in terms of scifi, but disappointing in terms of an Alien movie.

Now the only 2 that haven't handed in their opinion's are Griffith, and Aaz.
Well, I know them pretty well, and I don't think you have to guess too hard how they're going to respond to it.
 

NightCrawler

Aeons gone, vast, mad and deathless
Some pretty shitty complaints Walter. I was expecting more bravado from you.

One thing that i disagree a lot, is Scotts direction of shots. It is so unobtrusive. You can complain about the lack of subtlety from the characters, but from the camera, i don't agree at all.

But i guess, the crying all over this movie boils down to this:

So then, was it embarrassing, and a letdown for any Alien fans expecting something significant enough to warrant a return to the franchise? Yes.

Forget Alien, forget Aliens. Don't compare masterpieces to this. Enjoy it for what it is. There is plenty to enjoy in Prometheus.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
NightCrawler said:
Some pretty shitty complaints Walter. I was expecting more bravado from you.
I thought I included some pretty colorful bravado, personally!

NightCrawler said:
You can complain about the lack of subtlety from the characters, but from the camera, i don't agree at all.
Well, in terms of directing, I think the two go hand in hand. The actors do as they're told. As do the props.

NightCrawler said:
Forget Alien, forget Aliens. Don't compare masterpieces to this. Enjoy it for what it is.
How can I? The movie goes out of its way to make these comparisons, using carbon copy scenarios from its predecessors, as if to say: "Hey, remember that time?"
A ragtag team awakes from hypersleep and eats together before the mission. An android gets its head ripped off, and finds a way to help out. An infected man wants on board the ship, but the commanding officer won't allow it. And on, and on.
These are all in-your-face throwbacks that tell me that Scott likely wanted us to keep the earlier movies in mind.

Second of all, why should I give it a pass just because it can't match up to its predecessors? Scott's the one who returned here. He shouldn't be able to have it both ways. If he's going to reach back into the well of his past greatness, I expect greatness.
 
I enjoyed the ride.

I don't think the movie really tried to say that it was a prequel to Alien and beat people over the head with it. Now the religious parallels and what not, yeah it was a bit much but I thought it was hilarious. Also,
abortion-in-a-box.

Prometheus is a sci-fi movie that expands an existing universe, which is ultimately the best way to do it to me. On one hand you see an aspect of the universe you never completely expected. It adds some threads to the lore,
how the Xenomorphs came about and the like
- meanwhile adding another place for the story to gravitate towards. Not a bad thing, I think.

The plot made no real sense most of the time, most of the characters suddenly just threw in two cents about what was happening and it happened. Pretty convenient but who cares? My only question was,
Did Stringer Bell tap that?! :daiba:
Black goo was a plot device to rival ALL PLOT DEVICES. It created some great moments and made speculate what it was all about.

I haven't seen Alien in quite some time but I do look forward to rewatching it soon because of this movie. It is unsurprising that many people have never seen it - it was released in 1979 which is an eternity for the general movie-goer that sees movies now.
 
So, the Engineer gets a
giant Proto-Facehugger deep throating?
I'm fine with that.

The remaining
members of the Prometheus crew escape in another Engineer ship
. Fine.

All I had to see was the Engineer wake up and stumble back to the crashed ship in a bit of a daze.

Why?

So below would make sense!

SpaceJockey.jpg


Guess they'll be saving that for the sequel. I hope no one tries to tell me ^THAT^ Engineer is the same one at the end of Prometheus, 'cause yea, he ISN'T.
 

SlimeBeherit

[FIGHT][SPELL] [SACRIFICE][ITEM]
Isn't that easily explained by David when he says
"it's not the only ship" so that scene could have a happened on an unseen ship
 
IncantatioN said:
The Derelict did not crash on LV-426 - RC said in an interview that if you looked at it close it appears to be 'parked' there. It may/ may not be a Derelict from LV-223.
Therein lies the problem with most of the movie.
From interviews it may or not be the same Derelict. That may or may not be earth from the beginning of the film. The director doesn't even fucking know.
Whats the point of it all again?? Total liquidation?
 

NightCrawler

Aeons gone, vast, mad and deathless
Some news (new short Weyland viral video, and a date 10-11-12)

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=61317
 
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hellrasinbrasin

Guest
I think that what most miss with the point of Prometheus is that aside from it being an Origin film with echoes of 2001 a Space Odyssey , Blade Runner , and Event Horizon it was very much At the Mountains of Madness. Prometheus is like a circuit that courses throughout the whole of this Alien Universe. It is for a lack of a better word "The Beginning of all Things".
 
What bothered me.

1) The briefing scene onboard the Prometheus. I suppose that was really meant more for the audience, it just felt out of place. All the characters wake up after a 2 year cryo sleep and have NO clue why they're there? C'mon.

2) So, they break atmosphere over LV-223 (Why not LV-426?! WHY?) and after a few minutes of flying around, "Oh hey! There! God doesn't build in straight lines!" C'mon. They happened upon the site way too fast for my liking. Take a moment to flesh out some of the 17 person crew as Prometheus does a planetary scan or some bullshit.

3) Weyland's and Holloway's dismissive remarks to David lacked sorely needed subtlety. "He has no soul." "We made you 'cuz we can." Ugh. Subtlety!!! Having things childishly spelled out for me in these areas and NOT in other areas really got under my skin. I get David doesn't appreciate being looked down upon. That's easy to understand. The point was driven home multiple times. Even at the end, when his head is being put in a bag "You're just a robot!" Seriously?

4) The black ooze. Upon ingestion it, what, breaks down a lifeform to rebuild new life? Ok.

Get a face full of it and you become an alien-zombie?

OR if you're a worm (those things that were in the footprint as they entered the Big Face Chamber), you become an alien-cobra (Hammerpede is the official name...)?

ORRR, if you ingestion some and happen to get it on with an unfortunate partner, your semen produces GIANT PROTO-FACEHUGGIN' OCTOPI.

The black ooze needed some...MAJOR CLARIFICATION.

It was going to be used on Earth? Right? There were thousands of canisters. Why? Were they going to be rained on cities and turn people in more alien-zombies?!

5) The reanimation of the Engineer's severed head. What the fuck was that? It was biologically 'tricked' to think it was alive? Then it's head exploded. Um, why did it explode?
As stated in the movie, there was an outbreak in the Engineer facility. All the Engineers in the pile had things explode from within. So the Engineer who got his head chopped off by the door was infected. By the black ooze? It affects everything differently? But the Engineer drank some at the start and disintegrated, he didn't explode!

6) Weyland being on the ship. *eyeroll* His prime motivation is to cheat death. Please. So fucking unoriginal and a cry back to the Aliens vs Predator movie. That Weyland funded an expedition to find aliens and got killed by 'em. Man...

That's the plot twist you shoe horned in?! That?!

7) "Father......." Yeah, I figured that one out. But thanks for spelling it for me...

8 ) Too many throw away characters. 17 person crew. Upon my second viewing, I think a decent amount got taken out when the Prometheus kamikaze'd the Engineer ship. That and when the Zombie Geologist goes on a rampage. Waste.

The characters felt really shallow here. In Alien, they felt like real people. What happened here? Too many players and not enough focus.

9) THE ENDING...

Elizabeth and David escape from LV-223. Fine. As I said in an earlier post, I really wanted to see the Engineer wake up, go back to his crashed ship and have the Proto-Alien be born there. Then it would be simple and plausible to say, "Well, the shady company just called LV-223, LV-426 to keep a lid on things. Cuz they have trillions of dollars and can probably pull something like that off."

Well, no. Was the Prometheus' trip a big top secret endeavor? That would actually explain why the crew had no clue why they were there. But then, the rescue pod and the captain's line "You got two years of life" line. But it took two years in cryo sleep to get there. SOME USELESS ESCAPE POD!!!!! Would rescue even be an option? I always was under the impression the Company was NEVER in possession of any alien specimen. Well given Bishop 2's line in Alien 3 "THINK OF ALL WE CAN LEARN FROM IT! IT'S THE CHANCE OF A LIFETIME!" They weren't in possession. Right? WTF?!
:judo:

Need to do real world work, will add to this later.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
After a day of processing, what I liked:

-Michael Fassbender, who portrayed the only truly interesting character in the movie, whose motivations and actions are always surprising. He's also of course given the most attention to detail. The writers grant him almost the entire opening scene (minus the alien acid bath).

-Visuals were pretty incredible at times. The practical sets certainly helped, and I hope this makes an impact on production companies' perspectives on the use of them. Though the visuals were also cheapened by some of the technology on display, including super-advanced computers (retconning the MS-DOS-esque tech seen in Alien, which takes place almost 100 years later) and of course the hologram/exposition tech. Still, the visuals strike the right chords when they need to.

-Idris Elba, who gave me the the only laugh of the movie in his plain-faced attempt to fuck Charlize Theron.

-I appreciate the scope this movie is reaching for, even if it falls short of its intentions. Unfortunately, I already knew the big story beats for this, and I think every other Alien fan did as well.

Like I've told Aaz and Griff: Every scifi fan should see this movie, whether they end up liking it or not.
 
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hellrasinbrasin

Guest
01.What I've come to accept is that the Liquid sealed within the Urns in that Chamber are devices to Manifesting Desire. The Greatest Forbidden Fruit since The Garden of Eden.

- The Engineer's pure and uncorrupted sought only to create life.
- Man Desired Knowledge of its creation. It was granted
- Man Desired to experience creation without knowing the ramifications of
what it was they were creating through malicious intent

- Shaw's greatest Desire was to have what she would never have a child
and in a twisted way gave birth to a child

- The Child born from Shaw and Holloway opens The Door to the birth if
you will -- of The Demon Queen Lilith from whom all monsters come from.

02.The Characters I didn't really dwell on as the character's in Alien and Aliens acted out no better or worse there than here anyway. Again I had no problems with the characters

03.Peter Weyland doing what he did by having David ask the Engineer about Immortality is no different than what Roy Batty does in Blade Runner by asking his creator for more life.
 

NightCrawler

Aeons gone, vast, mad and deathless
Interesting thoughts hellrasinbrasin. I think we can conclude that the black goo is the plot device to end all plot devices!
After we acknowledge all the flaws (my first thought was a big fuck you to Lindelof), there's tons of good ideas in this movie, even if not executed in the best way (i think trying to cater to all audiences was a shot in the foot, jack of all trades master of none type of stuff).
We need more movies like this, i can't believe shit like Madagascar 3 took the top spot from Prometheus...
Go see it and bring your gramma along.
 
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hellrasinbrasin

Guest
Exactly. Spaihts and Lindelof did a good job with Prometheus I'm interested in seeing what film 2 will look like. And unlike their 1st outing which was running in 2 directions at once they won't have to worry about prequel chains rattling around in the writers room the 2nd time on the race track.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
hellrasinbrasin said:
01.What I've come to accept is that the Liquid sealed within the Urns in that Chamber are devices to Manifesting Desire. The Greatest Forbidden Fruit since The Garden of Eden.

- The Engineer's pure and uncorrupted sought only to create life.
- Man Desired Knowledge of its creation. It was granted
- Man Desired to experience creation without knowing the ramifications of
what it was they were creating through malicious intent

- Shaw's greatest Desire was to have what she would never have a child
and in a twisted way gave birth to a child

- The Child born from Shaw and Holloway opens The Door to the birth if
you will -- of The Demon Queen Lilith from whom all monsters come from.

02.The Characters I didn't really dwell on as the character's in Alien and Aliens acted out no better or worse there than here anyway. Again I had no problems with the characters

03.Peter Weyland doing what he did by having David ask the Engineer about Immortality is no different than what Roy Batty does in Blade Runner by asking his creator for more life.
That's uh... well, that certainly does sound idealistic. And also like a bunch of hogwash, what with your comparing Shaw to Lillith. While We're At It Let's Capitalize Some More Words For Added Emphasis and Bullshittery. :troll:

It seems to me that the black goo is more like a weaponized evolutionary compound. It turns things into violent creatures, the function of which I presume is to wipe out a race. It's certainly not as simple as "granting desire," because there's obviously a common physiology that links all of the creatures. We saw earthworms turned into proto-facehuggers, for example. Shaw's "pregnancy" also wasn't terribly different from the incubation period that xenomorphs undergo during their gestational phase.
 

NightCrawler

Aeons gone, vast, mad and deathless
Proj2501 said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x1YuvUQFJ0&feature=player_embedded


Yup

Geez, really?
I just want to wedgie those guys.
Most of those questions are so easily answered. I think from all the bitching, i've only read a couple of good genuine thoughtful complaints about the movie.
The top comment is amusing though.
 
NightCrawler said:
Most of those questions are so easily answered.

You mean explained by groundless theories? Like everything hellrasinbrasin has been pulling out of the air? Prometheus is like your imaginary friend, its whatever you want it to be. That's how vague the movie is.
 

NightCrawler

Aeons gone, vast, mad and deathless
frankencowx said:
You mean explained by groundless theories? Like everything hellrasinbrasin has been pulling out of the air? Prometheus is like your imaginary friend, its whatever you want it to be. That's how vague the movie is.

Like why David put the goo in Holloway's glass? Why Holloway removed the helmet?
Really, do you think those questions provide outlandish theories?

The review on their site is more productive than that stupid video.
 
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hellrasinbrasin

Guest
frankencowx said:
You mean explained by groundless theories? Like everything hellrasinbrasin has been pulling out of the air? Prometheus is like your imaginary friend, its whatever you want it to be. That's how vague the movie is.

I'd gather you would say the same thing about the 4 Rebuild ~ Neon Genesis Evangelion Films or Tv Series. But let's keep on topic shall we.

If you pay attention to what is shown and what is not shown with what is said and not said and knowing what film and literary influences are in the film you will find the well that many are forming their theories at.
 
NightCrawler said:
Most of those questions are so easily answered.

They are?

It can't be a case of sloppy story telling? Unless the studio's hiding a sequel card up their sleeve, I'm not interested in trying to justify this story by looking at various theories spreading like mad online.

Tons of people are searching for answers to this. Just like, wait, life itself... OMFG, RIDLEY SCOTT IS A GENIUS. :schierke:
 
The number of questions that can't be answered by anything more than mere conjecture far outweigh those that can be.


hellrasinbrasin said:
I'd gather you would say the same thing about the 4 Rebuild ~ Neon Genesis Evangelion Films or Tv Series. But let's keep on topic shall we.

I don't believe a 130 million dollar production can afford to take the same liberties as Evangelion.
 
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