... and by Fantasia I mean the inhabitants of the stratum that used to be called Rift (according to the translation in here, not sure if it's very accurate) or Hazama (interstice). Since now at this point in the story the realms have merged, these terms have fallen to a certain obsolescence, but to make sure we are on the same page, I mean basically the stratum (or region, or whatever term that suits best) where Unicorns, elves, trolls, dragons and most other creatures belonging to folklore and legends used to inhabit.
I'm particularly curious about their nature, how these beings came to be as well as how they reached the human psyche.
Of course, such a question is very speculative; there is currently no definitive answer to it in the manga as far as I'm aware. When I put some thought into it I reached a couple hypothesis, one in particular based on a few tidbits that I always found interesting for possibly hinting a different interpretation (even if more unlikely)
I will quote the parts I'm referring to elaborate further:
Episode 215 - Qlipoth
Shierke: "Trolls, Ogre, elves and kelpie...
The creatures in the spiritual world are taking form as if they had actually had a physical body...
They are originally in the world within our mind...
They are the ones who reside in our dreams at night or our imagination."
Episode 306 - Fantasia
Puella's translation:
"Those things that people thought might exist have been transmitted by words, and developped and refined (added, expanded, modified...) (from generation to generation).
That which people feared and long for desperately.
Another half of the world that only existed in people's imaginations and that has come down."
More than once, and one time coming from the narrator himself, there's been this concept that these creatures belonged, perhaps originally, to humans imagination.
It couldn't be stressed more in the case of episode 306. One idea that came to mind is what if these legendary beings were, originally and before anything else, constructs in the human collective subconscious that took a form of their own based on the amalgamation of ideas belonging to that being, and started to live independently and self-sufficiently in the astral world?
This whole process wouldn't be so foreign when we take into account the Idea of Evil (assuming the lost episode holds, it hasn't been contradicted so far), which was created in a process somewhat similar. It could set a very big precedent to the theory.
I found this current of thought to be very interesting, it would indicate that the legendary creatures first existed on the human psyche, and then they came to be (in the astral world). Their existence and appearance towards humans would then feed ever so more the concept of the creature on the human imagination, as the tales are passed down.
The other interpretation I had, which is far more simplistic and straightforward, likely the one most people have, is that these folklore creatures were always there, or at least as far as it can be conceived. Meaning that they first existed, and their elusive sightings would feed their concept in the human psyche which would then be propagated as the legends are passed by.
That wouldn't answer the original question per se, but one would imagine that much like the corporeal world, they would be the "wild life" that inhabit that region of the astral world. How they came to be would be a mystery that we may well never know, but the relevant part we would take from it, again, is that they existed before being part of humans imagination (and therefore wouldn't be a product of human mind).
We could perhaps summarize all this talk to a single question: Which came first, the idealized creature or the creature that would become legend?
Another interesting event that may relate to this topic, is how Slan, during volume 26, was seemingly able to create or spawn Ogres and trolls from the surroundings.
I can kind of see how that would work from both perspectives:
1) If trolls and ogres were beings originated from human subconscious, Slan, as a Godhand and having the source of her powers coming from an existance simmilarly created by the collective human consciousness, would then be able to manipulate creatures with a similar nature;
or
2) More simply, trolls and ogres have a certain Od, which would be similar to Slan's (her womb of darkness) or easily susceptible to her control as a higher spiritual being.
In both cases, she would be able to freely manipulate beings with a similar nature or origin.
Well, I think I rambled enough, now you guys can dissect everything I said.
What do you guys think? Any other theories or interpretations I may not have covered?
I'm particularly curious about their nature, how these beings came to be as well as how they reached the human psyche.
Of course, such a question is very speculative; there is currently no definitive answer to it in the manga as far as I'm aware. When I put some thought into it I reached a couple hypothesis, one in particular based on a few tidbits that I always found interesting for possibly hinting a different interpretation (even if more unlikely)
I will quote the parts I'm referring to elaborate further:
Episode 215 - Qlipoth
Shierke: "Trolls, Ogre, elves and kelpie...
The creatures in the spiritual world are taking form as if they had actually had a physical body...
They are originally in the world within our mind...
They are the ones who reside in our dreams at night or our imagination."
Episode 306 - Fantasia
Puella's translation:
"Those things that people thought might exist have been transmitted by words, and developped and refined (added, expanded, modified...) (from generation to generation).
That which people feared and long for desperately.
Another half of the world that only existed in people's imaginations and that has come down."
More than once, and one time coming from the narrator himself, there's been this concept that these creatures belonged, perhaps originally, to humans imagination.
It couldn't be stressed more in the case of episode 306. One idea that came to mind is what if these legendary beings were, originally and before anything else, constructs in the human collective subconscious that took a form of their own based on the amalgamation of ideas belonging to that being, and started to live independently and self-sufficiently in the astral world?
This whole process wouldn't be so foreign when we take into account the Idea of Evil (assuming the lost episode holds, it hasn't been contradicted so far), which was created in a process somewhat similar. It could set a very big precedent to the theory.
I found this current of thought to be very interesting, it would indicate that the legendary creatures first existed on the human psyche, and then they came to be (in the astral world). Their existence and appearance towards humans would then feed ever so more the concept of the creature on the human imagination, as the tales are passed down.
The other interpretation I had, which is far more simplistic and straightforward, likely the one most people have, is that these folklore creatures were always there, or at least as far as it can be conceived. Meaning that they first existed, and their elusive sightings would feed their concept in the human psyche which would then be propagated as the legends are passed by.
That wouldn't answer the original question per se, but one would imagine that much like the corporeal world, they would be the "wild life" that inhabit that region of the astral world. How they came to be would be a mystery that we may well never know, but the relevant part we would take from it, again, is that they existed before being part of humans imagination (and therefore wouldn't be a product of human mind).
We could perhaps summarize all this talk to a single question: Which came first, the idealized creature or the creature that would become legend?
Another interesting event that may relate to this topic, is how Slan, during volume 26, was seemingly able to create or spawn Ogres and trolls from the surroundings.
I can kind of see how that would work from both perspectives:
1) If trolls and ogres were beings originated from human subconscious, Slan, as a Godhand and having the source of her powers coming from an existance simmilarly created by the collective human consciousness, would then be able to manipulate creatures with a similar nature;
or
2) More simply, trolls and ogres have a certain Od, which would be similar to Slan's (her womb of darkness) or easily susceptible to her control as a higher spiritual being.
In both cases, she would be able to freely manipulate beings with a similar nature or origin.
Well, I think I rambled enough, now you guys can dissect everything I said.
What do you guys think? Any other theories or interpretations I may not have covered?
