Author Topic: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)  (Read 4875 times)

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Offline Imperator Hanseatic

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #25 on: July 16, 2016, 06:38:14 AM »
You think about yourself as a superior, it definitely shows.You disregard every opinion that is opposing your way of thinking in way that you almost disregard it entirely.

From my own experience viewing this forum for the past three years and my own (admittedly limited) interactions with Aaz, I must reinforce that this is simply not the case. Aaz and I don't necessarily see eye-to-eye on everything, but when we disagree and discuss things he has not disregarded my opinion at all. In fact, when we were talking about the latest anime episode it seemed that he began to see some of what I saw (even though that ultimately did not change his overall opinion), and we ended amicably with a better understanding of each other's views, and dare I say the anime itself. Amazing what happens when you don't take criticism of your ideas personally and then resort to personal attacks.

I know that and I like Griffith for this otherwordly feeling but at the same time it seems lazy. I mean, he is the antagonist of this series and he is reduced now to a character that we have to imagine ourselves. Him being too abstract is a good thing if you get something else in return but we dont get anything really. Thats the whole point, we are meant to be far from him but we dont get anything for that. Also we got some (not much)insight into other God Hand members.

As for Griffith, I can see how one might see him as uninteresting, but only if they don't look at the bigger picture. Miura does indeed make mistakes, but I would hardly say such a mistake is present at the core of the series in the portrayal of our main antagonist. People throughout this thread have given examples of what we've got with Griffith/Femto, yet you still say we've got nothing. What insight have we got into the other God Hand members that in any way comes close to the entire Arc that was essentially backstory for Griffith/Femto (and everyone else but that's not the point here). I wouldn't even call him abstract. What he is is clear as day, even though some details are intentionally left murky for now. If anything, the "little" we've got of Griffith just makes me more excited to see what more (if anything) is going on in his head when it's inevitably revealed.

Well, there are definitely different viewpoints on this character. If you like him as a being who is so godly that we cant understand what the fuck is going on, he is interesting, compelling even. But this is where you have failed, because you said that my viewpoint sucks. I dont think the same about you.

Indeed there are many viewpoints of the character. Most of them however are grounded in the facts. Non sequitur: You like this, so it is interesting/compelling. That does not follow at all, and that's before even touching on the fact that we actually do understand what is going on with Griffith. We've been told multiple times.

Finally I fail to see how "you said my viewpoint sucks therefore I win" even makes sense; You've made it abundantly clear what you think thus far.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #26 on: July 16, 2016, 08:12:51 AM »
What do you think is a measure of greatness then, because it seems you value knowledge very much, at least when its related to Berserk.

Are you my biographer or something? This is just irrelevant to the topic at hands.

I know that and I like Griffith for this otherwordly feeling but at the same time it seems lazy. I mean, he is the antagonist of this series and he is reduced now to a character that we have to imagine ourselves. Him being too abstract is a good thing if you get something else in return but we dont get anything really. Thats the whole point, we are meant to be far from him but we dont get anything for that. Also we got some (not much)insight into other God Hand members.

Oh aren't you exaggerating a tiny bit here? Griffith isn't abstract at all, he's a very well defined character. We just don't know what his plans are. And you say we get nothing in return for that, but's it's not true. Griffith is at the core of everything that's happened in the Millennium Falcon arc, and those events were only possible because of what he is now. The entire world of Berserk has changed, I think that counts for something. Moreover, seeing those events happen as they did (and don't tell me they were predictable because it's not true) was a great reward for all that mystery. Volume 34 was amazingly mind-boggling to everyone. And it's far from over, much more is coming. Including insight about the God Hand (and please don't tell me we know less about Femto than about the others).

Well, there are definitely different viewpoints on this character. If you like him as a being who is so godly that we cant understand what the fuck is going on, he is interesting, compelling even. But this is where you have failed, because you said that my viewpoint sucks. I dont think the same about you.

I understand what's going on perfectly myself and I'll be happy to explain anything you don't get, if you want me to.
Also, your viewpoint is that the main antagonist of the series sucks. As someone who has a high opinion of Berserk, including its main antagonist, I think your viewpoint sucks. I don't see where the failure is in that. I'm just being honest.

Offline Abbrà84

Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #27 on: July 16, 2016, 08:38:57 AM »
hello!
just one question:

why do you think at the end of chapter 303 it says:
"is griffith really femto?"
my opinion is that in miura's mind femto is only a part of griffith personality.


Offline Aazealh

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #28 on: July 16, 2016, 08:46:12 AM »
hello!
just one question:

why do you think at the end of chapter 303 it says:
"is griffith really femto?"
my opinion is that in miura's mind femto is only a part of griffith personality.

Hello,

1) You should purchase the manga and support the author financially instead of reading online scans.

2) There always is some meaningless commentary at the end of each episode in Young Animal, added by the staff to "thrill the audience" until the next issue. This is what the text you're referring to is. It's not actually part of the story, it's not in the volume and it's not written by Miura. Episode 303 makes it abundantly clear that Griffith is Femto, but it's not like we didn't know that for 15 years beforehand anyway.

3) No, like I explained in this thread, the new Griffith is just Femto disguised as a human. There is nothing else to it.

Offline Abbrà84

Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #29 on: July 16, 2016, 09:13:15 AM »
Ok, But if is like you say, why Griffith save Casca in Godot's mine in episode 179?

Offline Aazealh

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2016, 09:21:51 AM »
Ok, But if is like you say, why Griffith save Casca in Godot's mine in episode 179?

Femto was incarnated in the corporeal world in a body that was originally that of Guts and Casca's child. The boy was swallowed by the Beherit Apostle, and his body was transformed into a new Griffith that Femto now inhabits. But the boy's consciousness did not disappear. He still exists within Griffith. On the Hill of Swords, when Griffith was watching Guts and Zodd fight, he felt the boy's feelings for his father. Then, when Casca was threatened by the falling rocks, the boy actually made him protect her, he took over the body. This is all pretty clearly shown in the episode if you read it carefully.

Offline Abbrà84

Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #31 on: July 16, 2016, 09:31:02 AM »
Femto was incarnated in the corporeal world in a body that was originally that of Guts and Casca's child. The boy was swallowed by the Beherit Apostle, and his body was transformed into a new Griffith that Femto now inhabits. But the boy's consciousness did not disappear. He still exists within Griffith. On the Hill of Swords, when Griffith was watching Guts and Zodd fight, he felt the boy's feelings for his father. Then, when Casca was threatened by the falling rocks, the boy actually made him protect her, he took over the body. This is all pretty clearly shown in the episode if you read it carefully.

I have nothing to argue about what you just said and I also agree that it is so . But precisely because of this , I believe we cannot say that griffith = femto . This is because griffith is femto + the child , so not all of the personality of griffith coincides with femto.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #32 on: July 16, 2016, 10:01:29 AM »
I believe we cannot say that griffith = femto . This is because griffith is femto + the child , so not all of the personality of griffith coincides with femto.

Well sure, the boy exists within Griffith. But it's not like he and Femto form a single, coherent entity. From what we know, they're more like two distinct minds cohabiting into one body. So unless specified otherwise, when we see Griffith in the story, it's Femto who's piloting. The idea that the boy could influence him subtly in his daily life and even change his personality is unsupported by the story right now. More information about how this whole coexistence works will come eventually, but for now we have to be patient.

Offline MrFlibble

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #33 on: July 16, 2016, 10:57:19 AM »
As a God Hand member, he has to fulfill the desires of mankind and the IOE, his ambition to rule a kingdom still remains. In all probability he has become the idealized version of himself, his ambition untainted by puny friendship  :guts: or maybe not, how he feels personally about his living Falcons hasn't been revealed yet, we haven't seen an unsettled Griffith, but we do know about the God Hand.

Its inaccurate to say demons lose their emotions, they certainly become more desensitized to evil, and live without repercussions due to their immense power, the God Hand are no exception, but their scope is far broader because of their nature as semi omniscient,immortal, incorporeal beings, they gaze at humanity from a larger perspective,  they have concepts of beauty and reverence that are morbid to ordinary humans, because they are concerned about the larger picture, not individual mortal humans. If anyone is familiar with Watchmen, a good comparison is Dr Manhattan, a being who experiences time from a non linear perspective and can dissect and perceive existence to the smallest form of matter, how can anyone retain their humanity after that? How can Griffith remain a relatable human when he perceives everything in the physical world, and acts out his predestined path like he's following a script?

Going back to Griffith, he certainly feels a kinship with mankind, but the platonic relationships are either gone or suppressed. As the Falcon of Light/ Femto his priority is the fulfillment of his human dream to rule a kingdom, which by causality is also mankind's desire, so it all works out for him.


I really hope that Miura will show him more as an independent person and not just a being driven by a grand scheme without his own personality.

I agree, Griffiths informal personality has been kept ambiguous for a very long time, I was hoping something about Griffiths nature would be revealed during Slapgate, but alas all we got was  :rickert: .



I know that and I like Griffith for this otherwordly feeling but at the same time it seems lazy. I mean, he is the antagonist of this series and he is reduced now to a character that we have to imagine ourselves. Him being too abstract is a good thing if you get something else in return but we dont get anything really. Thats the whole point, we are meant to be far from him but we dont get anything for that. Also we got some (not much)insight into other God Hand members.

He's not just the antagonist of the series, he's the second most important character. His rise, fall and resurrection are crucial parts of the Berserk universe, so is his current development. We don't have to imagine anything, we know what he wants.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2016, 11:09:44 AM by Wenliinvictus »

Offline Oburi

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Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #34 on: July 16, 2016, 06:12:20 PM »

I know that and I like Griffith for this otherwordly feeling but at the same time it seems lazy.

That damn Miura is just so lazy! He's been pumping out this series for over 25 years, writing the same characters, developing them, making them grow, while also consistently retaining the highest standard in his illustrations and making sure his artwork is incredibly detailed far above and beyond average.

But when it comes to writing one of the most important characters ... he just phones it in. Ain't nobody got time for that. LAZY!
« Last Edit: July 16, 2016, 10:43:23 PM by Oburi »

Offline Tass

Re: How does Griffith's mind look after being reborn (human form)
« Reply #35 on: August 31, 2016, 05:04:21 PM »
Kinda late to the argument but...

Griffith is supposed to be this unapproachable cold figure with a distant look in his eyes. I think it really needs to hit you just what Guts up against: his best bro has ascended reality and become a god. I think everyone here can relate to knowing a person who is just so perfect and charismatic and unforgettable, they just have it, their voice and intonations and appearance and mannerisms and everything about them makes you feel low.

and then not only are they light years above the rest of humanity struggling down here in the mud with taxes and 9-5 jobs but causality itself is conspiring with them. they're no longer an individual but a principle, a force. and that force has incarnated in the flesh of your deformed child. it's like God itself saying "yeah you're right, he IS better than you, he'll always be better than you, tough shit."

if you can't appreciate griffith's character in this way you're lost, man