Author Topic: Episode 348  (Read 14057 times)

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Offline Walter

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2017, 07:35:42 PM »
Not much to add that others haven't discussed. Casca's relationship with Guts (well, her super-depressing angle on it, anyway) is at the core of this episode, and I look forward to seeing how Miura evolves that as we move forward in this dream journey. Will the representation of the dog change if the characters undergo another transition between dream worlds? Or is this where we'll stay? It's pretty nice being in truly uncharted territory, now that we're (mostly) beyond the guidebook's preview.

I think the representation of the specters as sticks and cloaks blowing in the wind is a pretty smart design choice when you consider that the person we're dealing with hasn't been introduced or oriented to the concept of supernatural beings like the rest of the cast. Instead of perceiving them as they are floating, amorphous, astral blobs she's using the real-world analog of a cloak blowing in the wind.

I'm excited to learn more from the missing 9-10 pages, which could encompass the Elfhelm banquet scenes we saw in the guidebook preview. Speaking of which, with the introduction of these small Casca-like beings, I think we can say with some certainty who that "child" with ratty clothing in the preview was (not the boy...).

Miura's technique is bound to change. Change over time is inevitable. We should all just be glad he's still passionate with his own creation and puts in his absolute best to give us an amazing story. As long as their is more added to the story, I'm glad, regardless of style change.

I don't think Sareth was trying to begrudge Miura for it, merely confirming the details of an art style change.

That being said, I do think it's a tiring subject, because we've been having the same on-again, off-again discussion about Miura's style for the last year, with no end in sight. It's like tuning your HDTV. "Something's not right -- is the image distorted?! Maybe it's the signal..."  :schnoz:

:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2017, 08:04:13 PM »
Speaking of which, with the introduction of these small Casca-like beings, I think we can say with some certainty who that "child" with ratty clothing in the preview was (not the boy...).

I think it's just one being that's hyperactive (hence how it's represented in some panels). I would also say that there was never any real doubt that the entity was Casca.

One thing though is that I wonder if we'll see more of these as they move forward. It's tough to say what's happening in that coffin without having the full episode, but maybe gathering disparate and scattered parts of Casca's ego and then putting them back together inside the broken doll (like puzzle pieces) is what the process of fixing her will look like?

Offline jackson_hurley

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2017, 08:46:30 PM »
but maybe gathering disparate and scattered parts of Casca's ego and then putting them back together inside the broken doll (like puzzle pieces) is what the process of fixing her will look like?

That's a very interesting angle for fixing her and I'm anxious to see it happening in it's entirety. And like Walter said, we are in uncharted territory which makes it the more interesting. Not that I'm good at guessing what's gonna happen in charted territory haha. Makes it more fun for me to discover the story that way.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #28 on: March 21, 2017, 08:51:38 PM »
Some things that can be gathered from the text (courtesy of puella):

Schierke wonders what kind of horrible thing happened to make Casca keep this scenery in her mind. Farnese asks why there is a mountain in the distance, but Schierke answers that for now they can't know, and that their goal is to figure out the meaning of everything they encounter little by little. That journey of understanding in itself is their goal.

When they first see the dog, Schierke notices his front left paw and the emblem on the coffin. Farnese also comments after the fight that the dog doesn't see them as his enemies. And of course they quickly put together that in this world, the dog is Guts.

Upon finding the little sprite, Schierke mentions that she's agitated, just like the Casca they know. She also tells Farnese that it must be deeply related to the current Casca, and so she should be careful to not let it be blown away (we can see that wind is blowing in that panel). Farnese tells the little Casca to please be calm and stay still (as she's placing her within the husk), and that she's sorry but she'll play with her again later (the same way she speaks to Casca in the real world).

EDIT: More specifically, Schierke says "This is in the heart of Casca's mind. If the girl (Casca) is separated from the doll, I think, it might influence Casca in the current world."


Offline Sareth

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #29 on: March 21, 2017, 08:58:46 PM »
Miura's technique is bound to change. Change over time is inevitable. We should all just be glad he's​ still passionate with his own creation and puts in his absolute best to give us an amazing story. As long as their is more added to the story, I'm glad, regardless of style change.

I'm not complaining that the art changed. I know it is constantly shifting, but as an artist I'm just genuinely curious about how it suddenly changed the way it did and now seemingly gone back to how it was a few episodes ago.

Offline Frogacuda

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2017, 09:07:11 PM »
I'm not complaining that the art changed. I know it is constantly shifting, but as an artist I'm just genuinely curious about how it suddenly changed the way it did and now seemingly gone back to how it was a few episodes ago.
Miura has a staff who contribute to the art. Wouldn't surprise me if he has different people with different specialties as well.

Offline bhaal

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2017, 10:29:36 PM »
What happens if Casca don't want to be "fixed"
They will drag her by force back to reality?
SK words from so long ago can be interpreted in so many ways that even this little, unthinkable possibility may happen.   

Offline persiandud

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #32 on: March 22, 2017, 10:41:55 AM »
I'm not complaining that the art changed. I know it is constantly shifting, but as an artist I'm just genuinely curious about how it suddenly changed the way it did and now seemingly gone back to how it was a few episodes ago.

I'm sure this has been discussed to death, but to me the recent shift in art style, in my eyes, reflects the change in setting. Everything seems more..."fantastical"

Offline Mangetsu

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2017, 11:16:15 AM »
Full episode!

http://wasabisyrup.com/archives/le9CSigleXI

There are some changes to the draft from the guidebook  :schnoz:

Offline jackson_hurley

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2017, 12:13:10 PM »
Full episode!

http://wasabisyrup.com/archives/le9CSigleXI

There are some changes to the draft from the guidebook  :schnoz:

Beautiful! But clearly there is a filter of some sort in the Korean scan vs the Japanese preview we got. I like it better without the filter. Either way I am really glad to be able to see it. Thx you very much.

A touching episode and I can't wait to hear your thoughts on it.

PS: The face Schierke and Farnese are doing when they want to open the coffin is priceless. And as I thought they find little Casca Inside the coffin and not outside.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 12:39:47 PM by jackson_hurley »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2017, 01:28:21 PM »
Like I thought, the sprite is a fragment of Casca's ego. I suspect they'll have to find more of these to restore her.

Offline Cyrus Jong

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2017, 01:37:55 PM »
Hm, looks like the scene from the guidebook with Guts and company at the banquet is being saved for down the road. If it hasn't been cut anyway.

After the brisk pace we saw in the last few episodes, it rather surprised me how much slower this one was, acting as more of a general setup than anything. A lot of questions are being raised without any answers in sight. What is the ominous mountain looming in the distance? What would happen to Casca if the little sprite were to be removed from the doll? How can they even begin to piece her back together? And just what else awaits us down the line?

Definitely will be intriguing to see the interplay between Schierke and Farnese during this whole excursion. All their personal one-on-one interactions have been in relative safety so far, but now they have to go on a little adventure by themselves. If Guts' formidable presence wasn't there, then Isidro and/or the elves' comical antics were, and the absence of all those elements is kind of making me feel unsettled.

Didn't expect Farnese to be immediately taken in by the little sprite. It gives me hope that she won't have a hostile relationship with Casca.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #37 on: March 22, 2017, 01:59:37 PM »
I don't think Sareth was trying to begrudge Miura for it, merely confirming the details of an art style change.

That being said, I do think it's a tiring subject, because we've been having the same on-again, off-again discussion about Miura's style for the last year, with no end in sight. It's like tuning your HDTV. "Something's not right -- is the image distorted?! Maybe it's the signal..."  :schnoz:

Yeah, besides noting significant changes in style, like overall design or possible format switch, it's become something of a tick to comment on the state of the artwork every episode even when there's nothing new to say. Those preview images look the same to me as the scans from 10 years ago, with comparable artwork too; it's been pretty consistent to me since Griffith's rebirth, and I feel like Miura's next move, if anything, would be to streamline. But, as jackson_hurley noted, it's only the scans that look like someone went crazy with a photoshop smart blur filter, so I assume it's going to look as good as ever in the volume.

After the brisk pace we saw in the last few episodes, it rather surprised me how much slower this one was, acting as more of a general setup than anything. A lot of questions are being raised without any answers in sight. What is the ominous mountain looming in the distance? What would happen to Casca if the little sprite were to be removed from the doll? How can they even begin to piece her back together? And just what else awaits us down the line?

I actually see it the opposite way, THIS is an eventful episode, the beginning of the payoff, whereas that brisk pace before was just to get here. That was motion, this is the action. I love the whole vibe of this episode, and I think it'll all come through more and benefit from translation. Not to mention the introduction of Guts Dog! I just wish he could actually become Guts' dog, like Superman and Krypto the Superdog; Gutso the Berserkerdog. =) Actually, he reminds more of another famous hero's dog...



In any case, if it wasn't that it would almost certainly be killed, Guts should have a dog.

:troll: :troll: :troll: :troll:     :chomp: :guts:
« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 02:21:13 PM by Griffith »

Offline Cyrus Jong

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #38 on: March 22, 2017, 02:30:42 PM »
Not to mention the introduction of Guts Dog! I just wish he could actually become Guts' dog, like Superman and Krypto the Superdog; Gutso the Berserkerdog. =) Actually, he reminds more of another famous hero's dog...

In any case, if it wasn't that it would almost certainly be killed, Guts should have a dog.

Just as long as it doesn't end up like your Gutsfield. :serpico:

Offline JMP

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2017, 03:01:16 PM »
Like I thought, the sprite is a fragment of Casca's ego. I suspect they'll have to find more of these to restore her.
Looks like you were right. No Casca shrinkage involved! :casca: They just found the sprite in the casket like that. It'll be interesting to see what part she'll play in Casca's healing. I love when Farnese first puts her hand in the casket and the sprite is hesitant and shy at first and then she just jumps right in. I think it shows how important it was for the people who went into the dream to be people Casca feels comfortable and safe with, too.

Definitely will be intriguing to see the interplay between Schierke and Farnese during this whole excursion. All their personal one-on-one interactions have been in relative safety so far, but now they have to go on a little adventure by themselves. If Guts' formidable presence wasn't there, then Isidro and/or the elves' comical antics were, and the absence of all those elements is kind of making me feel unsettled.
It felt natural to me. They've been building their relationship as teacher and student and as friends. I think they are ready for their own adventure as a team. :guts: I can't wait to see what happens!


A good sword, even if it rusts and dulls, has good steel that never rusts left over in the wick. That steel's the ultimate steel. Even if it cracks, if you return it to the fire, it's sure to be reborn. - Godot

Offline Proj2501

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #40 on: March 22, 2017, 04:09:38 PM »
Amazing! Have to agree with Griffith, this is a pretty eventful episode. We've truly waited so long for these very pages and I think the payoff will be something to behold. :casca:

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #41 on: March 22, 2017, 05:02:04 PM »
Hm, looks like the scene from the guidebook with Guts and company at the banquet is being saved for down the road. If it hasn't been cut anyway.

Nah, it's probably from the next episode.

What would happen to Casca if the little sprite were to be removed from the doll?

Casca would be mentally dead. She would not even be in her current state, where she's child-like, but completely catatonic.

Looks like you were right. No Casca shrinkage involved! :casca: They just found the sprite in the casket like that. It'll be interesting to see what part she'll play in Casca's healing.

Yeah, it's funny because I had a feeling the preview was out of order and that the sprite was already in there (and she was putting it back), and it was. This is very interesting and already tells us what's going to happen next. Basically, that small hyperactive Casca is all that's left of the original Casca. It's the only spark of life left in the dead husk, the broken doll. And it has a direct impact on Casca's personality in the real world. Because it's all that's left, it IS effectively her personality right now, instead of being one minor part of it.

To fix her, Schierke and Farnese will have to find her other sparks, more of those little fragments of her self, and put them back into the husk. Until they fix it. Until she's whole again. So I think we'll see Casca as a mom (with the boy), Casca as a warrior (with the Band of the Falcon), Casca as a lover (with Guts), and so on, and of course we'll see Casca dealing with Griffith/Femto, maybe both as an adoring follower and as a rape victim. All of these little scenes, these little parts, will contribute to them understanding her better (setting the shifting group mechanics that will emerge after she returns), and to her recovery. And obviously the climax of this journey will take place near the "spiky mountain" as Farnese calls it. Whatever that will be is the big question... probably not something nice.

After the brisk pace we saw in the last few episodes, it rather surprised me how much slower this one was, acting as more of a general setup than anything. A lot of questions are being raised without any answers in sight. What is the ominous mountain looming in the distance?  How can they even begin to piece her back together? And just what else awaits us down the line?

There's nothing surprising about it. Miura always goes quickly through the elements he doesn't deem important and then slows down for the momentous stuff. And I didn't even find the pace all that brisk. We had a fight upon the group arriving to Skellig, we saw them travel to the witches' village and then to Elfhelm... It's just a matter of perspective.

I also have to disagree with what you're saying. This episode contains a LOT of information and events (as I've been talking about in the thread), and I'm really quite certain that all questions being raised right now will be answered in the coming episodes (and I've already answered some above).

Didn't expect Farnese to be immediately taken in by the little sprite. It gives me hope that she won't have a hostile relationship with Casca.

No reason for them to have a hostile relationship, especially in these circumstances. It'll be hard for Farnese to let go of Guts, but really, the writing's always been on the wall. She's always known, she just hasn't accepted it yet. But she will eventually.

it's become something of a tick to comment on the state of the artwork every episode even when there's nothing new to say

Indeed...

Offline __Bonfire__

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #42 on: March 22, 2017, 07:52:54 PM »
Now I'm feeling like every Puck and Isidro joke was made to counterbalance the painful moments arriving upon us

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #43 on: March 23, 2017, 08:48:53 PM »
Here's a rough version of the dialogue based on those Korean scans, courtesy of puella. As usual in such case there might be inaccuracies.

Episode title: "Crepuscular Wilderness".

Schierke: This is the world that's inside the deeper layer of Casca's mind. A crespuscular wilderness where a black sun shines.
Farnese: A creepy, bloody, dreary scenery.
Schierke (to herself): What on earth made it possible for her to bear this scenery in her mind?
Farnese: What are those flag things planted here and there? What is that spiky mountain in the distance?
Schierke: We can't know, for now our goal is to figure out the meaning of everything we encounter.
Schierke: Anyway, first we should find Casca in this world.
Farnese: How can we do it in this vast environment?
Schierke: In a dream, distances are nothing more than symbols. If you open your eyes wide, you'll find a sign.
Schierke: An impaled dog dragging a coffin?
Farnese: Horrible...
Schierke: The left front paw, the emblem on the coffin...
Farnese: What should we do?
Schierke: We'll help that dog!
Farnese: We did it!
Farnese: Isn't it a bit dangerous to approach closely like this?
Schierke: It's no problem.
Farnese: Are we Ok?
Schierke: I think he knows we're not his enemies
Farnese: Who is this dog?
Schierke: As expected, look at this.
Schierke: In this world, this dog is Guts.
Farnese: Impossible, a dog?
Schierke: Because it's a dream
Schierke: His body's crisscrossed with wounds, he's lost his left front paw, and most importantly, the brand on his neck. All the symbols match.
Schierke: Then it means....
Farnese: I kind of feel guilty, like I'm digging out a tomb.
Schierke: Are you ready? Then I'll open it.
Schierke (to the dog): I'm sorry but it's necessary.
Farnese: A broken doll?
Schierke: No doubt, this is Casca.
Farnese: No, I can't believe... This ragged husk of a doll is...
Farnese: What's wrong?
Schierke: Look here, there's a small thing near her chest.
Farnese: A dwarf? She's even smaller than Puck and Ivalera.
Schierke: It's probably a fragment of Casca's ego.
Farnese: Come on, come on, don't be afraid.
Farnese: So cute!
Schierke: She's agitated, exactly like the Casca we know.
Schierke: Be careful
Schierke: It'll be a big deal if she's blown away. Let's put her back.
Schierke: This is the heart of Casca's mind. If she's separated from the doll, it might influence Casca in the real world in some way.
Farnese: Ah, I see.
Farnese: Please stay calm.
Farnese: I'm sorry. I'll play again with you later.
Farnese: I have a rough understanding of what's going on, but I don't know what we should do now.
Schierke: Let's follow the guiding marks.
Schierke (to the dog): Come on, this is what you also want, right?

Online Grail

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #44 on: March 23, 2017, 10:18:54 PM »
Thanks Puella for your very helpful translations! I know that we can't expect 100% accuracy from these in particular, but it still helps to provide context and give us a general idea of what to expect as things develop.

My first thought about seeing the big "spiky mountain" in the background was that it would eventually show itself to be the enormous hand from the Eclipse. As it has become a recurring symbol within the series, and in many ways represents the crux of Casca's suffering, it seemed like a natural choice. Then again, Miura is pretty good at getting us thinking one thing and then subverts our expectations, so I never know what to predict. :ganishka: Anyone have another theory about it?
« Last Edit: March 23, 2017, 10:31:19 PM by Grail »

Offline Mangetsu

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #45 on: March 23, 2017, 10:33:19 PM »
Thanks Puella for your very helpful translations! I know that we can't expect 100% accuracy from these in particular, but it still helps to provide context and give us a general idea of what to expect as things develop.

My first thought about seeing the big "spiky mountain" in the background was that it would eventually show itself to be the enormous hand from the Eclipse. As it has become a recurring symbol within the series, and in many ways represents the crux of Casca's suffering, it seemed like a natural choice. Then again, Miura is pretty good at getting us thinking one thing and then subverts our expectations, so I never know what to predict. :ganishka: Anyone have another theory about it?

It is most likely the hand, as the extra shading goes hand in hand with the width of it


Offline Walter

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #46 on: March 23, 2017, 10:37:37 PM »
I'm not convinced of that image, but conceptually, it will be surprising if it's NOT the hand. It's the obvious imagery to pair with the Eclipse, which we know is coming.

Here's a rough version of the dialogue based on those Korean scans, courtesy of puella. As usual in such case there might be inaccuracies.

Episode title: "Crepuscular Wilderness".

Thanks Aaz+Puella, always teaching me new words in my native language  :guts:

Quote
Schierke: Look here, there's a small thing near her chest.
Farnese: A dwarf? She's even smaller than Puck and Ivalera.
Schierke: It's probably a fragment of Casca's ego.
...
Schierke: This is the heart of Casca's mind. If she's separated from the doll, it might influence Casca in the real world in some way.

This is my favorite detail of this episode. Some of the specifics are beginning to come into focus about what happened to Casca's mind after the Eclipse, and an explanation about her current state. We've usually used terms like "regression." But Miura is fleshing it out for us here on these pages. Aaz already alluded to it earlier in the thread, and it knocked the wind out of me:

Basically, that small hyperactive Casca is all that's left of the original Casca. It's the only spark of life left in the dead husk, the broken doll. And it has a direct impact on Casca's personality in the real world. Because it's all that's left, it IS effectively her personality right now, instead of being one minor part of it.

This little figure is the remaining essence of Casca -- an innocent, childlike aspect of her ego that was somehow shielded from the trauma of the Eclipse. It's remained hidden inside the shell of what was Casca. And it's of course no coincidence that that sprite is what she resembles now. Though it's always been the case that this "new" Casca is about as un-Casca as you can get, it's amusing to consider that somewhere in what composes her essence, there was a wild, childlike part of her that tumbled around like this. I wonder if this aspect survived because it was so foreign from her life with Griffith. Like an exponentially bad breakup, every part of her life that he had touched became poison, and was uprooted.

Another thing that has impressed me so far, in the fourth of Miura's dreamworlds, is that he's not relying on easy crutches to signify the past. We're inside the mind of a character who hasn't been around since the Golden Age, and yet aside from the Falcon insignia, he's not reaching into his bag of easy references here. It's wholly new, desolate imagery that's still thematically familiar to us.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2017, 12:07:03 AM by Walter »
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Zant

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #47 on: March 23, 2017, 11:51:41 PM »
My guess is the mountain in the distance is a massive pile of corpses who died in the eclipse, that's where we'll see the band of the hawk, at least what remains of them in casca's mind.

Offline Johnny Apples

Re: Episode 348
« Reply #48 on: March 24, 2017, 01:27:26 AM »
 
Thanks Aaz+Puella, always teaching me new words in my native language  :guts:

Well, to be fair, "crepuscular" is hardly a native Anglo-Saxon word.  No, not like these long-lost true gems of the English language  :ganishka:
Because of its old Latin origin, "crepuscular" also appears in numerous Romance languages as well

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/crepuscular


This little figure is the remaining essence of Casca -- an innocent, childlike aspect of her ego that was somehow shielded from the trauma of the Eclipse. It's remained hidden inside the shell of what was Casca. And it's of course no coincidence that that sprite is what she resembles now. Though it's always been the case that this "new" Casca is about as un-Casca as you can get, it's amusing to consider that somewhere in what composes her essence, there was a wild, childlike part of her that tumbled around like this. I wonder if this aspect survived because it was so foreign from her life with Griffith. Like an exponentially bad breakup, every part of her life that he had touched became poison, and was uprooted.

I thought something along those lines too. Perhaps that mini-Casca sprite represents the sweet, playful little girl that Casca used to be, during her early childhood, before she was handed over to that pedophile nobleman? And in turn before she met Griffith. I don't have the volume 6 on hand, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong - didn't Casca tell Guts how not only she had to give up her own dreams, but also forsake her childhood innocence and repress her femininity, all in order to be accepted by Griffith? Basically, she'd suppressed her true nature, her real self, to become one of Griffith's Falcons. I also wonder - is it because that aspect of her personality had remained so thoroughly repressed during her time with the Band of Falcon, ironically, that was precisely why it survived the Eclipse? Perhaps the next couple of episodes will reveal more information about Casca's origins and her past before she joined Griffith? Although Miura gives us a small glimpse of that in volume 6, maybe the future episodes will shed more light about her pre-Falcon life. What do you think Walter?

Offline Gobolatula

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Re: Episode 348
« Reply #49 on: March 24, 2017, 02:33:18 AM »
Puella, you are the best. Thank you so much!