Guts as the Falcon of Darkness

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Silver Devil

Dreams define character
Throughout Berserk there have been constant references to the Falcon of LIght which with the Millenium Falcon arc is Griffith. But what exactly is the Falcon of Darkness? It has been hinted although not actually said that it's Guts (which he more than likely its). But in essence what does that mean? Is Guts going to go through a rebirth like Griffith did or what? If Guts is in fact the Falcon of Darkness then his bond with Griffith is something very deep that trancends all notions of mere friendship and betrayal right?
 

nir085

Horse and Armor
It's also been hinted that Gutts is the Falcon/Hawk of Light. The only verbal plot hint of this was when Isidro told Gutts that he is kind of like a "white swordsman". And I don't think Gutts becoming a little like a "white swordsman" after putting on his armor was a coincidence. Perhaps because of Gutts willpower to protect Caska despite the armor's evil power, he took a big step in becoming good. Either way, the Millenium Falcon Arc is probably going to end with Griffith being revealed as the Hawk of Darkness and Gutts as the Hawk of Light, showing the theme that appearances are skin deep. In the beginning of the M.F. arc, Gutts showed his dark side by raping Caska and Griffith showed his light side by saving a Midland place. But as time progressed, Griffith showed the true evil of his army and Gutts showed his inner good. Besides, how the hell can such a bastard be the real Hawk of Light?

I don't remember the exact details of the "Hawk of Light dream" (neither the Zodd one or the Midland one) but perhaps one of them, if not both, was either hinting something else or was just one big lie by Godhand.
Speaking of Zodd...I remember him pledging to Griffith solely because he was the strongest one, the Hawk of Light, who chopped off his horn. If Gutts somehow proves that he is stronger than Griffith or that he is the Hawk of Light...will that result in Zodd having a change of heart? It's a huge, huge stretch, but a twist like that would be interesting. Yeah Zodd is hated by Gutts, but they also fight for the same values: strength in battle, protection of another (Griffith/Caska), and both are the strongest of their own group. And there has been several examples of characters switching allegiances in the past.
 

Herald of Yama

"It is pure Potential"
Yeah Zodd is hated by Guts, but they also fight for the same values: strength in battle, protection of another (Griffith/Caska), and both are the strongest of their own group. And there has been several examples of characters switching allegiances in the past.

That would sort of require Guts handing Griffith his ass for a hat after hacking off all of Zodd's limbs so that he couldn't interfere. At that point, what use would Zodd be to Guts, and what would be left for the rest of the story?
 

Legend

Unaffected by fate in a world governed by it...
Yeah i myself have always thought of Guts as the hawk of light/ the savior and griffith as the hawk of darkness. Though they may look like they play the parts in the end it might be a different story. I think with the newer chapters the line is sort of blurred. Guts has changed so much since the first time we saw him. He has values now and fights for something he cares about, not just for revenge. Also Griffith's return is merging the two worlds, that to me makes him the dark side of the spectrum.
 

The_Fetus_Ninja

Lets go, bub!
In the beginning of the M.F. arc, Gutts showed his dark side by raping Caska and Griffith showed his light side by saving a Midland place. But as time progressed, Griffith showed the true evil of his army and Gutts showed his inner good. Besides, how the hell can such a bastard be the real Hawk of Light?

Good point. This unmasking, so to speak, of the characters true intentions also reflects back to before the first eclipse. Guts was originally seen as the loaner who didn't want to have anything to do with other people, he was kind of a dick in some ways. Griffith was scene as the glorious leader respected by his men and so forth.
By the end of the eclipse (and before when Guts states he cares for his men) everything is revealed. Such as how much Guts cared for his commrades and Caska and just how little thier lives meant to Griffith.

This is sort of a peeling back of all the bravado. A revelation of true intentions. The previous events seem to parallel the more recent chapters. In my opinion this will happen again to reveal Guts is the Hawk of Light and his true good intentions.
 

Begemot

STOP UNDRESSING ME WITH YOUR EYES!
I don't think Guts necessarily "hates" Zodd.
I don't mean he likes him or anything, but Guts seems tolerant of his existence.

As for being the Hawk of Light, well, I'm wondering how the speculation will turn when Caska regains her sanity. And there is the idea of Griffith being dualistic.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Griffith can't be both, as inferred by Schierke in 186? (Don't bother looking at the trans on sk.net of this passage, it's inaccurate. I'll hit up The Hague for a relevant one).
 

Legend

Unaffected by fate in a world governed by it...
Woland said:
As for being the Hawk of Light, well, I'm wondering how the speculation will turn when Caska regains her sanity. And there is the idea of Griffith being dualistic.

Yeah i dont believe you can be both anyway, makes no sence really... the Destroyer AND Savior?
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Legend said:
Yeah i dont believe you can be both anyway, makes no sence really... the Destroyer AND Savior?
Yeah, too crazy a concept. Unlike the anti-christ, who appears to be the savior of humanity and ends up leading them to destruction. Makes no sense!
 

DarkBlademaster

Jesus cries when he looks at me.
Legend said:
Yeah i dont believe you can be both anyway, makes no sence really... the Destroyer AND Savior?

Well its starting to look like Griff is just the Savior. The destroyer would be guts, or should I say gut's beast. His hate spawn the beast, which wants to kill griffith, even though gutts his good. Even though i have a point, i doubt you people will make sense of what im saying :(.
 
This may connect here but in the missing chapter, i think it was 83 or somesuch, the idea is talking to griffiths and basically says do what you want, because your desires are mine as well. so whether you do things for the damnation or salvation of the people doesn't matter to the idea. he's just giving griffiths the power to do what he wants to. This would imply that he could either be the hawk of light or darkness. does it have to be that two separate entities are the hawks? or could it be an internal battle within griffiths? i wonder if the idea is so evil after all, or maybe it just so happened that the people label it evil because the god hand has been corrupted by the power? take zodd for example, he was rather amoral in the series, just searching for a strong enough person to serve. had this person been a good person he would have been a good guy. i remember another reference to the "do what you will" occurring when the god hand told one of the apostles that they were given power to do what they wanted to. just because they chose to abuse this power doesn't mean it necessarily corrupted them does it?
 
Has anobody yet tried to see it from the common people point of view? As for them Griffith seems to be the Falcon of Light because he fights the Kushan's and stuff...
So for them Guts has to be the Falcon of Darknes, because he fights (at least he tries) Griffith...
Well, it's just some Idea... ::)
 
Griff is the Falcon of Darkness.
Scherkie said it quite directly b4. And if anything, Griff is posing as the Falcon of Light
 

Herald of Yama

"It is pure Potential"
Has anobody yet tried to see it from the common people point of view?
Has anyone tried to see it from Idea's p.o.v.? Its trying its best to do what it was created for, give people what they intrinsically believed to be truth, and here comes this spawning-salmon-of-a-man interfering, killing off its servants in the physical world, attempting to cut off its Hand at the Nexus, and basically being a pain in the ass. I'm sure Idea thinks of Guts as the Hawk of Darkness. In which case, I'm rooting for the Hawk of Darkness.
 
I'm really not too caught up in the Darkness/Light question because Guts is the hero of the story, not Griffith. Even if there's a bit of playing with words, or if the prophecy has a twist to it, in the end Guts will prevail and Griffith will not.

But I also would expect Guts and Griffith to do some crossing back and forth between "light and dark."

No matter how dark he's been in the past, Guts never stopped being the hero. As for Griffith, I don't think he's good, but I don't think he'll be a two-dimensional evil villain, either.
 
You can't really judge any of the characters actions as "good" or "evil" because it's all a matter of perspective. I mean, sure, Griffith sacrificed his army to attain godhood, but in the bigger scheme of things, as Griffith reborn, he potentinally could save alot more lives by saving midland...
 
not judge griffith's actions as good or evil?

he did sacrifice many of his own people on his race to the castle,in his own selfishness,

killing people because your selfish, isnt that evil?

now he is reborn as a member of Godhand, isnt Godhand technically evil?

now you say he has a potential to save the lives of the poeple in Midland, you mean the same people his apostles kill for food or what not because they want to, isnt that evil?

in my opinion i judge Griffiths actions in the story as evil, thats why hes the "badguy"

just from those actions alone, pretty much anyone could say he was evil,

i really dont understand your point of view as describing none of the actions of the characters as good or evil,

what would be the point of the story if there was no evil for good to overcome?

if you wish, please explain so i could understand the point you are trying to make, maybe you just didnt state your actuall point right,

anyways,

talk to you later

- c
 

The_Fetus_Ninja

Lets go, bub!
10-4 said:
killing people because your selfish, isnt that evil?

yes exactly. the whole "evil" is subjective argument doesn't hold water because evil can be defined without using religion and interjecting personal beliefs. Just because a person doesn't believe what they're doing is bad doesn't make it any less bad.

Yeah, too crazy a concept. Unlike the anti-christ, who appears to be the savior of humanity and ends up leading them to destruction. Makes no sense!

lol. sometimes I think people don't pick up on Walters sarcasm. ;D
 

Opie

The Sex Icon
I don't think I ever saw Griffith kill someone who wasn't a soldier or had tried to kill him first. If what Griffith was doing was evil, then the rest of the Hawks were just as evil.
 
Opie said:
I don't think I ever saw Griffith kill someone who wasn't a soldier or had tried to kill him first. If what Griffith was doing was evil, then the rest of the Hawks were just as evil.

Griffith wasnt evil initially, he was just ambitious... Thing things took a turn after he became Femto
 

Opie

The Sex Icon
Ya, thats the way I see it.

On topic, a part of me wishes that maybe Guts IS the Hawk of Darkness after all, and Griffith is the savior in some odd way...but thats just me as I'm a Griffith fan boy.
 
the only way i can see that happen is if guts finally lets everything go and just starts killing EVERYTHING,

then griffith kinda snaps out of his godhand slouch and says

"oh shit!, what have i done!!, runaway!!!!!!"

then he tries to figure a way to save himself and the world coincidentaly,

thus making griffith the "savior"..........

..........if he beats guts,


yeah right     :-X,

an interesting thought though  ;D

- c
 

Opie

The Sex Icon
Well I was thinking that maybe Guts would be a wild card and not a Hawk of anything.

Maybe the Kushan king would be the Hawk of Darkness and Griffith really would be the Hawk of light. The war heats up so much that the entire victory rests on one decisive battle that Griffith has to win.

Then Guts, being has badass self gets close enough to Griffith to beat him. His rage would build up so much that he has to over come it to let Griffith live and lead the Band of the Hawk to victory and save everyone.

In my dreams... :'(
 
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