Author Topic: Art  (Read 8032 times)

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Offline trapped_soul

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Art
« on: July 30, 2002, 04:42:20 AM »
What do you guys think of Art?

I going to reappear in this topic with my opinion, in case some members decide to post their thoughts.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Art
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2002, 04:54:49 AM »
Uhm.. try something more specific.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2002, 07:32:39 AM »
Quote
Uhm.. try something more specific.

that's exactly what i am not intending to do.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Art
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2002, 10:10:12 AM »
>:(

Bitch.

Nice reply though.  ;D

I can't really give an opinion because the subject is too general, and I can't be arsed to write my opinion on all the kinds of it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2002, 11:15:05 AM »
...define art!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2002, 04:08:18 AM »
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...define art!

that's what i want you guys to do...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Art
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2002, 05:44:06 AM »
Lazy ass.

Do it yaself.  ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2002, 06:12:06 AM »
Quote
Lazy ass.

Do it yaself.  ;)


think before you post.     ;)

i wrote in my first message that I was going to do that, in case some member decide to post their personal thoughts on "Art".
But it seems like that won't happen...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline *Gyom*

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Re: Art
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2002, 06:18:54 AM »
uh... art is cool.^^
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2002, 06:37:09 AM »
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uh... art is cool.^^

why is it cool?
is every kind of art cool?

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline puella

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Re: Art
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2002, 06:59:22 AM »
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...define art!

impossible! definitely!

-----> it's art that no one can define.

*** got a question, which character do you think has an artistic talent? methinks, as I said many times before, Judeau!
he is like a poet or singer.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2002, 07:10:09 AM »
Quote

impossible! definitely!

-----> it's art that no one can define.



I'll give you a definition that is absolutely cogent, and that you won't be able to confute:

"Art is a Word."

what do you say now?    ;)

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline *Gyom*

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Re: Art
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2002, 08:22:48 AM »
Quote


I'll give you a definition that is absolutely cogent, and that you won't be able to confute:

"Art is a Word."

what do you say now?    ;)


it can be several words, actually ^^ ( i'm thinking of the vb to be with the pronoun thou )

and ... why is art cool ? well, first of all, i hate contemporary art ( i've seen some things, it's like you put a shit wit strawberris, two forks and a hat and you're rich !! ) as well as 'contemporary' music, such as guys playing piano with as a mess, or free jazz ...
well ...! art is esthetic, or the lack of, it is beautiful, or the lack of : art is cool, ok ?^^
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Art
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2002, 10:06:49 AM »
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think before you post. ;)


Good idea. I'll have to try that sometime.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2002, 02:10:00 PM »
actually art can be or mean everything!

but as far as i m concerned i d say that art is just the expression or the result of creative work!
creativity would be than a result of an idea that appears or developes out of any impuls!
so this impuls might be everything and nothing at the same time...
means:maybe a thought,a memory, something u face ,watch or whatever...i guess u got the point!
well ok this impuls triggers imagination(fantasy required)that finally leads to an idea if u want to!

so in short i think that art is an expression of urself, ur personal thoughts, wishes or whatever...
it is an expression of whatever u want it to be like and it contains always this very unique sign or style that is representative for ur individual character!

"ART is YOU!"
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline *Gyom*

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Re: Art
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2002, 05:45:24 AM »
i agree ... art is a spark of some one's life
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2002, 06:24:25 AM »
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i agree ... art is a spark of some one's life

i like the word "spark" in this connection!
good call!

i tell u, godo couldn t have said it better!^^


"Don't be afraid of the dark"

Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2002, 06:57:08 AM »
heheh, do you want paradise_losts definition of art. it was a coincidence i found this in an older topic.

CnC told paradise_lost that he turned annoyance into an art form.
and this was his answer:

Quote

...ah, what's a discovery! Do you know what is art, Cnc? Do you REALLY know what is it? I'm shocked...

...I really believed you were not able to understand the reason why an animal is diffent by you...

 

...please, take this rose by me like a present...

-------------------------(---(---@

 

...you could believe to be much more sexy, boy...



heheheheh... i almost forgot how funny the guys was.

Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2002, 07:49:37 AM »
Quote
heheh, do you want paradise_losts definition of art. it was a coincidence i found this in an older topic.

CnC told paradise_lost that he turned annoyance into an art form.
and this was his answer:


heheheheh... i almost forgot how funny the guys was.

*g*
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #19 on: August 05, 2002, 02:29:31 AM »
Art is a way to explain feelings, truths and verities that lie within life, without using a common language.
therefore it is for me a more advanced form of communication. the artist creates a piece of art, maybe a canvas, a movie, a book, or a piece of music in order to express his feelings towards a certain subject or probably just his feelings in general. the artist doesn t think about what he does, at least not at a higher level of art. he uses intuition and imagination in their very purest form in order to express his thoughts and feelings. once he masters to use those abilities in the most efficient way, he might be able to accomplish something really exceptional.
Art may be able to reflect the creators soul and it will at the same time trigger intense emotions in the beholder of the Art, in case the beholder identifies himself with the artists emotion it will be some kind of a unique compound between their souls.
I, personally, think that music is the highest of all forms of art, since it does not use a language, as we know it, anymore. music is pure esthetic for its own sake. it is for sure the most abstract of all arts and it is thus capable of triggering a wide variety of emotions in the beholders soul (i am using the word soul intentionally, if you want to you can exchange it with another term). the song (not the ones in the charts but f.E. |"Suteki da ne" from FFX) is an interesting specific kind of music, because it gives you something to feel and something to think about.
Film is also a very interesting medium, and it can as we all know be a medium for art as well. film combines different arts, such as the art of story-telling, the art of putting emotion into an image and music into one intriguing fusion.

At this point i want to thank Kentaro Miura again, in my humble opinion he mentioned to master the art of storytelling as well as the art of drawing to a level of perfection, and his creation called berserk added a lot to my life. Lately when I had a very deepgoing discussion about life and dreams with a close friend of mine, we often illustrated our views on certain things with the story of berserk. This was quite a magical momentum for me, thus i realized again what one man can be accomplish through art. And it just fascinates me.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #20 on: August 05, 2002, 04:21:29 AM »
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Art is a way to explain feelings, truths and verities that lie within life, without using a common language.

because it just expresses something of urself in a language that u wanna use...
Quote

therefore it is for me a more advanced form of communication. the artist creates a piece of art, maybe a canvas, a movie, a book, or a piece of music in order to express his feelings towards a certain subject or probably just his feelings in general. the artist doesn t think about what he does, at least not at a higher level of art. he uses intuition and imagination in their very purest form in order to express his thoughts and feelings.

i think that artists do think carefully bout what they do!
sometimes they just let creativity and heart take over and finish things up!
but not always cauz there is always somekind of plan or idea they follow!? :-/
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once he masters to use those abilities in the most efficient way, he might be able to accomplish something really exceptional.
Art may be able to reflect the creators soul and it will at the same time trigger intense emotions in the beholder of the Art, in case the beholder identifies himself with the artists emotion it will be some kind of a unique compound between their souls.

agreed!however i think art can just trigger emotion but no relationship in any way between the artist himself and the beholder...
there is on both sides a special understanding or equal opinion on something and that seems to make them sit in the same boat or being in some special relation to eachother.
however havin or sharing something no matter what, isn t enough for any relation.
the artist just wanna to express and trigger reactions but he isn t about to lure people or to build up relationships with people that d be the same as him!?
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I, personally, think that music is the highest of all forms of art, since it does not use a language, as we know it, anymore. music is pure esthetic for its own sake. it is for sure the most abstract of all arts and it is thus capable of triggering a wide variety of emotions in the beholders soul (i am using the word soul intentionally, if you want to you can exchange it with another term). the song (not the ones in the charts but f.E. |"Suteki da ne" from FFX) is an interesting specific kind of music, because it gives you something to feel and something to think about.

as i said i don t believe that there is a "highest form"of art!
obviously there are differen t levels concerning art ,however
it doesn t depend on how u express urself and it isn t even a question of quality or quantity but what finally counts is that u point out something individual that always carries ur very personal language within!

Quote

At this point i want to thank Kentaro Miura again, in my humble opinion he mentioned to master the art of storytelling as well as the art of drawing to a level of perfection, and his creation called berserk added a lot to my life. Lately when I had a very deepgoing discussion about life and dreams with a close friend of mine, we often illustrated our views on certain things with the story of berserk. This was quite a magical momentum for me, thus i realized again what one man can be accomplish through art. And it just fascinates me.

yes that s really special!
but however i don t believe that this was his very first aim...u know he does his thing no matter if it is succesful or not ...he follows his path all the way till the end...
i even think that he doesn t know yet what berserk means to some of us but when he gets to know it ll be kind of reward for him and for the bonebracking work he does every night.
Art is an expression of something individual...what its gonna trigger u don t know...

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline trapped_soul

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Re: Art
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2002, 05:22:16 AM »
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because it just expresses something of urself in a language that u wanna use...

yeah, but moreover i'd say that some thoughts cannot be explained with words, at least for me a spoken language is not the ideal medium to do that.

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i think that artists do think carefully bout what they do!
sometimes they just let creativity and heart take over and finish things up!
but not always cauz there is always somekind of plan or idea they follow!? :-/

i didn't mean that an artist doesn't think at all about his aim. I meant like if you can see your goal clearly you can act impuslively. For example, miura needed to develop his character very meticulously. I am totally sure that he knows Guts and Griffith better than he can ever depict their personality in the manga. Once he knew his characters that well, he was capable of acting out of pure inspiration; the characters awoke to life, and miura's heart (not his brain!) were the key to the development of the story.

Quote

agreed!however i think art can just trigger emotion but no relationship in any way between the artist himself and the beholder...
there is on both sides a special understanding or equal opinion on something and that seems to make them sit in the same boat or being in some special relation to eachother.
however havin or sharing something no matter what, isn t enough for any relation. the artist just wanna to express and trigger reactions but he isn t about to lure people or to build up relationships with people that d be the same as him!?

i didn't mean that the artist and the beholder have something like a relationship when i said "unique compound between their souls." Though i admit it sounded like i did. I meant that once you're confronted with the creation of the artist, once you feel exactly the same way about something the artist is "talking" about, interest is reviving withín yourself. And you - or at least I - feel like: it's great to know that there are people out there who seem to have the same train of thoughts, the same emotions, the same ideas as I have.
Quote


Quote

as i said i don t believe that there is a "highest form"of art!

when did you say that? ^^
well, I myself didn't think about different levels of Art at all, until I read a book of Vilem Flusser, a czech philosopher, which appealed very much to me. He was, at some point in the book, in short, trying to say that the more abstract an emotion or a kind of art, the more divine it is. love and music are as abstract as nothing else, and they are therefor categorised on the "highest level". However, even those two didn't stand a chance at the end of the book... ^^

I never said that this is valid for every human being. it is just a thought that appealed to me very much.

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it doesn t depend on how u express urself

absolutely. everyone has to find out what works best for him. well some people don't want to express anything at all...

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and it isn t even a question of quality or quantity but what finally counts is that u point out something individual that always carries ur very personal language within!

but what is quality itself. what is the scale for quality itslef. for some people rave tunes have enough quality to make them go berserk. for some people hollywood BS works well.
In my opinion you explained perfectly what quality is when you say "that u point out something individual that always carries ur very personal language within!
". If someone mentions to put his dreams, his thoughts into a creation, into reality, if he mentions to blur the border between imagination and actuality, and if it is his very personality that one can sense once he is confronted with the artists creation, then his work has what i call quality.
this is exactly what is essential if you create something: to let your personality, your identity flow into your creation, to make your creation be a part of you.

Quote
yes that s really special!
but however i don t believe that this was his very first aim...u know he does his thing no matter if it is succesful or not ...he follows his path all the way till the end...

exactly.

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Art is an expression of something individual...what its gonna trigger u don t know...

i'm not sure. in some case you may be right. but try to think about the compositions of nobuo uematsu, or susumu hirasawa as a musical metaphor. (i know I get back to music very often i'm trying to explain something.)
Their work is what i call a trade-off between art and commerce. They have a clear mission. They are to create music that shall trigger a specific emotion, music that fits plenary to a certain moment in the plot of Final Fantasy or Berserk. They inflict their personality into their composition, they try to make it emotional, they act intuitively. And yet I'm pretty sure they know what kind of emotion their music is going to trigger.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Maximus

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Re: Art
« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2002, 06:38:09 AM »
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yeah, but moreover i'd say that some thoughts cannot be explained with words, at least for me a spoken language is not the ideal medium to do that.

i didn t say that language might be the best medium...(think about the medium Hesse for example uses...)
is there a ultimate medium that is perfect for everything!??
i say that for every topic, every thought,idea however u call it there is a special medium that might fit best to express the right thing with the right effect.
so u r right if u say :"SOMETIMES WORDS ARN T ENOUGH!"
but not always cauz there are topics, scenes or whatever that are more likely to be expressed through words.
however it is either a question of ability and of the direction in which the talent of someone refers...
so in ur case it is ur great talent for music with all it different parts as rythm,tone ,volume,colour....
others might use other skills or mediums to express their believes but they won t do that worse cauz it is not the medium that makes the difference!
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i didn't mean that an artist doesn't think at all about his aim. I meant like if you can see your goal clearly you can act impuslively. For example, miura needed to develop his character very meticulously. I am totally sure that he knows Guts and Griffith better than he can ever depict their personality in the manga. Once he knew his characters that well, he was capable of acting out of pure inspiration; the characters awoke to life, and miura's heart (not his brain!) were the key to the development of the story.

totally agreed!
i guess i just misunderstood! :-[
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i didn't mean that the artist and the beholder have something like a relationship when i said "unique compound between their souls." Though i admit it sounded like i did. I meant that once you're confronted with the creation of the artist, once you feel exactly the same way about something the artist is "talking" about, interest is reviving withín yourself. And you - or at least I - feel like: it's great to know that there are people out there who seem to have the same train of thoughts, the same emotions, the same ideas as I have.

i guess i m meaning quite the same as u.
i mean if u think back about our experience with "siddartha"...(as one example out of ??)
that was really awesome,..i mean he sometimes really spoke out of my heart and touched or treated some topics that i thought that only i think about...
i mean these are unbelieveable moments that make u stronger!
as u said just to know that there are people who seem to have same emotions the same ideas as i have.

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when did you say that? ^^

oops i modified...MOOODIFIED!?sos bout that!
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well, I myself didn't think about different levels of Art at all, until I read a book of Vilem Flusser, a czech philosopher, which appealed very much to me. He was, at some point in the book, in short, trying to say that the more abstract an emotion or a kind of art, the more divine it is. love and music are as abstract as nothing else, and they are therefor categorised on the "highest level". However, even those two didn't stand a chance at the end of the book... ^^

... ... ...äh can t say anything bout that!^^

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I never said that this is valid for every human being. it is just a thought that appealed to me very much.

alrighty then!^^
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but what is quality itself. what is the scale for quality itslef. for some people rave tunes have enough quality to make them go berserk. for some people hollywood BS works well.

thats why i said that art is not bout quality in general.
u can write "den ärgsten song"and still there ll be some "marktproleten die was besseres im auto laufen hom!^^  ^^  ^^
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In my opinion you explained perfectly what quality is when you say "that u point out something individual that always carries ur very personal language within!
". If someone mentions to put his dreams, his thoughts into a creation, into reality, if he mentions to blur the border between imagination and actuality, and if it is his very personality that one can sense once he is confronted with the artists creation, then his work has what i call quality.
this is exactly what is essential if you create something: to let your personality, your identity flow into your creation, to make your creation be a part of you.

exactly.

cool! 8)
Quote

i'm not sure. in some case you may be right. but try to think about the compositions of nobuo uematsu, or susumu hirasawa as a musical metaphor. (i know I get back to music very often i'm trying to explain something.)
Their work is what i call a trade-off between art and commerce. They have a clear mission. They are to create music that shall trigger a specific emotion, music that fits plenary to a certain moment in the plot of Final Fantasy or Berserk. They inflict their personality into their composition, they try to make it emotional, they act intuitively. And yet I'm pretty sure they know what kind of emotion their music is going to trigger.

yes u got me !so there are even forms of art that have a special aim!

good conversation buddy! ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Soth

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Re: Art
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2002, 09:44:31 AM »
I think I´ve lost the scheme.... :'(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Walter

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Re: Art
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2002, 09:11:54 PM »
The "highest form" of art is Super-Saiyan Vegetto. Duh...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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