Author Topic: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?  (Read 7739 times)

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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2004, 07:40:47 AM »
(can't remember if it's the Nexus or Vortex, I could be wrong on both accounts)

That would be the Nexus, at least that's where they appear when people "call" them. The Vortex of Souls is where the Snail Count ended up.

Killing the Griffith here and now would in actuality be killing Guts' child, being it's not Griffith's body but the child's body that Griffith's spirit has taken hold of.

Well, I don't really think the Demon Child still exists in that body.

If the realms merge and Griffith's spirit is back in the God Hand's den then Griffith (as Femto) will have a corporeal body as well as the other God Hand members.

I'm not sure their ethereal forms will ever disappear, but anyway we saw that Guts was able to harm Slan to some point with the DS, so he might do more to Griffith than just destroy his "vessel", if he ever gets to fight him.

Not to mention the fact that Griffith doesn't seem to be able to be reached or hurt in any way by conventional weapons, remember the arrows getting through him?

Offline xechnao

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #26 on: December 16, 2004, 08:17:08 AM »
Well, I don't really think the Demon Child still exists in that body.

I'm not sure their ethereal forms will ever disappear, but anyway we saw that Guts was able to harm Slan to some point with the DS, so he might do more to Griffith than just destroy his "vessel", if he ever gets to fight him.

There was an event at the valley of swords considering the dchild....though, it ain't still clear IMO, if it was the child indeed or Griffith lying to himself
And the game plays on people's backs and they don't even have a clue about it, wasting their energy because their attention is distracted by the rulers' game itself.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2004, 04:23:06 PM »
There was an event at the valley of swords considering the dchild....though, it ain't still clear IMO, if it was the child indeed or Griffith lying to himself

What I meant is, though Griffith indeed seems to have heritated some of the Demon Child's characteristics and personality, including his care of Casca, as we saw in volume 22, I don't believe the Demon Child himself to be still living in this body.

Griffith took it over as a vessel, and now it's his, I don't think the Demon Child is still trapped inside, and that when/if the body died, he would. To me, it's no more than remainings of his being that Griffith got at the same time as he got the body.

Of course, we're in Speculation Nation, and so it's just my take on things at the moment.

Offline Tristram

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #28 on: February 11, 2005, 06:30:39 AM »
I think that the way it will all play out is pretty simple.  They will both kill eachother, though I think Griffith will die first.  Then Guts finally somewhat at peace will die; something like that anyways.

Then again that is too typical of japanese comics. Miura will find something so insanely cool that it will blow our minds.  Maybe he'll have Guts pullout an Uzi and shout out, "I'm-a gat, muthafucka!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Offline Griffith

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #29 on: February 11, 2005, 07:41:24 AM »
*SPOILERS*















Griffith will sacrifice himself in order to save Guts/Casca.

Offline Tristram

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2005, 08:08:47 AM »
*SPOILERS*



Griffith will sacrifice himself in order to save Guts/Casca.

Speaking of sacrificing oneself...  if someone really narcisistic got ahold of a Beherit...  to become an apostle wouldn't he have to sacrifice himself?

Would Idea shoot himself in the face under this circumstance?
« Last Edit: February 11, 2005, 08:41:48 AM by Aazealh »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #31 on: February 11, 2005, 08:42:48 AM »
Speaking of sacrificing oneself...  if someone really narcisistic got ahold of a Beherit...  to become an apostle wouldn't he have to sacrifice himself?

Would Idea shoot himself in the face under this circumstance?

You haven't read the manga, have you?

Offline Tristram

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #32 on: February 11, 2005, 08:44:41 AM »
You haven't read the manga, have you?

I have... but my memory = teh suck.

What did Idea shoot himself in the face and I missed it?

Seriously though... if someone was in love with themself/sacrificed themself I supposed it'd be Wild since ya know, the guy was full of himself.

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #33 on: February 11, 2005, 10:25:24 PM »
Speaking of sacrificing oneself...

I make a rare post outside of Current Chapters or Shootin the breeze, and what happens? It's used as segue to stupidity. Great.

Offline Tristram

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #34 on: February 12, 2005, 02:13:56 AM »
I make a rare post outside of Current Chapters or Shootin the breeze, and what happens? It's used as segue to stupidity. Great.

I was being serious.  What would happen in the case of someone who loves themself???

I mean how the hell would that work?

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #35 on: February 12, 2005, 10:46:14 AM »
This is off topic Tristram, please try to search for answers first, and only then to post.

I was being serious.

That's worse, in a way.

What would happen in the case of someone who loves themself???

The case of an apostle bearing the Brand has already been seen. He didn't love himself, but sacrificed the world around him in exchange for a better one. That's vague, but that's how it is. He's called the Beherit-apostle, and there are many threads with all the answers you need out there already.

I mean how the hell would that work?

Causality makes it so everything has a purpose, and that absurd stuff doesn't happen. It's not like apostles find beherits on the road side one day just by chance, and that the Idea of Evil has to deal with it whatever the outcome. It's all planned.

Now let's close the off topic parenthesis.

Offline Tristram

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2005, 04:21:39 PM »
This is off topic Tristram, please try to search for answers first, and only then to post.

That's worse, in a way.

The case of an apostle bearing the Brand has already been seen. He didn't love himself, but sacrificed the world around him in exchange for a better one. That's vague, but that's how it is. He's called the Beherit-apostle, and there are many threads with all the answers you need out there already.

Causality makes it so everything has a purpose, and that absurd stuff doesn't happen. It's not like apostles find beherits on the road side one day just by chance, and that the Idea of Evil has to deal with it whatever the outcome. It's all planned.

Now let's close the off topic parenthesis.

Sorry for going off topic, it just sparked a question in my mind, and had me confused in a few ways.  I will re-read the whole Beherit Apostle part...  I mostly just remember how he was able to do some weird stuff such as give (name doesn't come to mind) the flat faced preist super msucley feather powers.

Sorry again for the off-topicness, the question was a bit of an impulse... but I really am glad I asked it, now. :) Thanks.

Offline Arashi

Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #37 on: March 01, 2005, 08:44:28 AM »
I've been pondering over this question for a considerable time. Will Griffith fall and how? So I'll try to expound my theory as I've thought it out.

The manga, to my mind, can be divided into three major parts, each with a climax point in it. The first part begins with the meeting of Guts & Griffith (1st climax point). Until the Eclipse they constantly are in contact with each other and closely interact. After the second climax point, Griffith's transformation into Femto, Guts' and Griffith's roads break apart, their attitudes towards each other cardinally change (at least concerning Guts we may be sure). The third climax part is Griffith's rebirth as the Millenium Hawk. This event brings Guts and Griffith together again. The circle is enclosed. 

As we can see now, both characters are now close to the achievement of their purposes. Guts is going to find his nemesis and have revenge, Griffith - to obtain his so long desired power. But Griffith is now a superficial being. It seems to me that now his former aim is too small for him. The creature like Griffith Reborn does not need simple power over humans. But Griffith continues to pursue his dream, and I am not sure whether he does this on some other purpose or just mechanically, because it has been everything for him before. And if so, what then? What will he do when he has all he wanted at his hand? People like Griffith, who burn in the fire of their ambitions, often find themselves at loss when their dreams come true. They reach the end of the road - and it turns out to be a dead end.

As for Guts and his revenge. It is him who is the protagonist of the manga, despite all his dubious actions. So it would be logical if he does away with his bitter enemy and "saves the day". Besides, Guts is probably the only one who is able to kill Griffith, as it seems that the Hawk cannot be harmed by any usual weapon or person. All this is logical. But what will be achieved by Griffith's death? The world of the manga is inevitably coming to the Apocalypse. This process can't be stopped by the powers of a man, even the man Guts is. Only a being with supernatural powers is probably able to do something. Such being is Griffith. But I am sure he will never do anything just for "greater good". So how can everything be saved? It is clear that sacrifice is needed. But how?

My idea is this: Griffith must by his own free will let Guts have his revenge. In such a way that Guts will not realize it until the end. Only this way can Guts be a seeming "hero" and Griffith can make a voluntary step to sacrifice. The victory seems to be achieved by Guts' sword - but without Griffith's free-will sacrifice it would have been nothing. A perfectly uncertain ending, Miura-style. No good, no bad. No black, no white. Or, as a version, Griffith may save Guts at the cost of his life, but this seems less likely to me - too cliche.

So, this was my looooooong speculation on the topic. Thank you for attention.  ;)
« Last Edit: March 01, 2005, 08:47:15 AM by Arashi »

Offline Concealed_Rage

Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2005, 03:45:20 AM »
I think that Griffith with the new band of the hawk will accomplish his dream. Griffith will become king and control all of Midland. When this happens guts will probably ally/recruit and small army to overthrow him, and there will be a huge battle allowing guts and a small group people including the skull knight to take out Griffith/gods hand. If you think about it its doesn't sound to far fetched, Guts will never be able to get to Griffith with that small group of his, especially since Griffith is almost aways surrounded by the new band of the hawk. Guts would need a great force to get in close enough to destroy Griffith, plus Guts is a natural strong willed leader. Guts kind of reminds of Griffith before the eclipse "except less arrogant", I have no doubt he could be a successful leader.
"He appeared right in front of me, and he wasn't a demon... but what looked like a human. As if he'd been yanked from before into the present unchanged. I gazed at him and for a second... I forgot to kill him."
- Guts from Berserk

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Re: Any of you wonder how Griffith's downfall will happen?
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2005, 01:24:05 PM »
*SPOILERS*














Griffith will sacrifice himself in order to save Guts/Casca.

To me Griffith appears to be to selfish to do that unless it ment for him to gain something, after all I have always seen him more as a politician than a virtous knight.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2005, 01:26:20 PM by ELEKTROFUNK »