Author Topic: Episode 251  (Read 31616 times)

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Offline MaN

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #100 on: February 15, 2005, 04:45:47 PM »
Maybe he wants to use her Demon Child reputation to his advantage. After all, another burned mansion or two is no big deal for Farnese, right? And then Magnifico could valiantly save his Father, maybe even putting him at Magnifico's mercy. Or let him die, and take over the throne. (But there are two more brothers to deal with).

Seems too contrived.. and anyway Farnese does not seem to be the "Mansion burning demon child" anymore... I think its just going to be something new.. may be opening a new thread / introduction of more characters for Miura to string along.

p.s. I suggest you stray away from this "demon child" line of thinking... it really pisses Aaz off
When there is nothing left to burn... you must set yourself on Fire

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #101 on: February 15, 2005, 06:53:02 PM »
may be opening a new thread / introduction of more characters for Miura to string along.

Temporary minor supporting characters, you mean?

Offline Walter

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #102 on: February 15, 2005, 09:29:59 PM »
If Magnifico is trying this path, then that would mean he is trying to please his father by accomplishing something by himself as opposed to on father's orders. But judging from his speech in 251, he's not in his best parent-appeasing mood right now. And since he's painted Farnese as a victim, it would seem strange to go ahead and sacrifice her.
My thoughts are that Magnifico has given up appeasing his father, and now is attempting to succeed him by no longer simply follow orders. He's a rogue I tell you!
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Offline Headless Death

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #103 on: February 15, 2005, 10:56:47 PM »
Did you read what I've been saying?
I thought it was still Speculative. ;)

My thought was Farnese may be meeting them later at the ship,  she just must finish this favor. And perhaps it may be like Guts favor to Griffith.  An assassination.  Otherwise perhaps a means to further disgrace his father.
But either way, I expect Serpico to be a part of the plan.

Offline Rhombaad

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #104 on: February 15, 2005, 11:27:35 PM »
And perhaps it may be like Guts favor to Griffith.  An assassination.  Otherwise perhaps a means to further disgrace his father.
But either way, I expect Serpico to be a part of the plan.
Yeah, if it was an assassination I'd hope Serpico would be with her, otherwise.....well, imminent death.

darkbane

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #105 on: February 16, 2005, 01:07:41 AM »
Seems too contrived.. and anyway Farnese does not seem to be the "Mansion burning demon child" anymore... I think its just going to be something new.. may be opening a new thread / introduction of more characters for Miura to string along.

p.s. I suggest you stray away from this "demon child" line of thinking... it really pisses Aaz off
What he was pissed about was you not reading the manga again before making an incorrect statement. Not that I hold it against you or anything.

But anyway, it is just a bit contrived, you're right.  :) But it's just a possible speculation about what use he has for her aside from marriage, and I'm trying to think about her in this situation too. Farnese right now doesn't have any skills to speak of, except being a problem child and having family connections to important people. She's outlawed, it seems. She's no good with a sword, and her magic aptitude, even if it would be tolerable in society, isn't even starting to manifest yet. No administrative skills either. So it makes me wonder, what possible use for such a useless person could Magnifico have (aside from political marriage, which I don't want to believe in  ;D)

Offline MaN

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #106 on: February 16, 2005, 05:10:43 PM »
Temporary minor supporting characters, you mean?
Yeah but then again there have been other characters that I never thought, would end up as long as they did, at least when they were first introduced...

Quote
Farnese right now doesn't have any skills .....
may be true but ...
Quote
An assassination.
seems quite intriguing. Their father will probably not really expect Farnese to do something like that and so may be her being skill-less won't be a big factor. Also it would fit right in with the demeaning conversation Magnifico has with her where he blamed all her 'devilish' actions on their father... sort of riling her up against him.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: darkbane
What he was pissed about was you not reading the manga again before making an incorrect statement. Not that I hold it against you or anything.
Wow you did you research...  ;D. I guess I have not been here long enough to know a discussed topic from 199X or the exact dialoge from page 187-188 in volume 17 etc. etc. There are new people joining everyday so it helps everyone if one the oldies can actually point you in the correct direction.... aaa ... once in a while
« Last Edit: February 16, 2005, 05:16:16 PM by MaN »
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #107 on: February 16, 2005, 06:28:37 PM »
I wouldn't call Farnese useless. She hasn't shown stunning abilities until now, but her time will come I think, she's come a long way since the H.I.C.K. days.

I guess I have not been here long enough to know a discussed topic from 199X or the exact dialoge from page 187-188 in volume 17 etc. etc.

It's from 177-178 actually, and it's not so much the fact that you didn't know these elements, but that you replied to someone giving you the information as well as the episodes to look into (well, he made an error) without looking yourself in return. Then again, it didn't "piss me off", I just made a remark...

darkbane

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #108 on: February 16, 2005, 06:55:45 PM »
I wouldn't call Farnese useless. She hasn't shown stunning abilities until now, but her time will come I think, she's come a long way since the H.I.C.K. days.
Useless from Magnifico's POV is what I'm thinking. Well, apparently not, since he needs her help with something. I guess she's a good babysitter... not exactly what Magnifico may be after though.

Some Guy

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #109 on: February 16, 2005, 07:24:27 PM »
Well, I don't think that 'USELESS' is the word to use >:(.  He is certainly has the strength and ability to be great ally as he has shown to be in the past. I think that he will on the ship with Guts when it sails whenever that might be as far as episodes are concerned... How he gets there is for Miura to tell us

You're right, I meant to say that he dosn't seem needed in the story right now, so I don't think he'll interact with the characters much, at least until things start to heat up.  I do feel he will, though eventually.

Offline Sparnage

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #110 on: February 17, 2005, 09:50:25 PM »
*Ahem*

Btw Joseph... I hope your name doesnt clash with me  ;D

The huge difference in our avatars should prevent any confusion.

That and the fact that in two months it's no more new Vagabond, even in the states; I'va been spoiled on a volume a month. Considering it's the other of the two manga/comics I have any interest in following... well, I guess it's good for my focus on Berserk. =)

Whats the other?

Well, it may just be his noble upbringing and lack of recent experience with his sister, but Magnifico sure was being an asshole; he was more condescending than their father.

Really? It's possible but she did fuck up alot like her father more or less says, but prehaps he was trying to overlook it as best as he could.

Quote
And I have this strange desire to see Guts stroll into the masion in his filthy, bloody black armor and ask, "Hey, you, where's Farnese?"

It's been a while since he stormed a castle. ;D

Hope so, I think most people here have become acquired to her presence in the group. Regardless I don't believe she won't end up in the story eventually, she has been learning magic and just getting used to the dark lifestyle travelling with Guts.

Regardless Farnese seems to be the type to stick to her word, and I'm sure her brother would be no exception to this. For her to join the group again would be to dismiss the deal she made with her brother, now some kind of understanding from both sides could be made to do this meaning both siblings end up happy.... thats not the Berserk way though. If Griff is right then that could mean Magnifico truely has dark intentions, making it more than justified for Farnese to join Guts and the rest again without guilt on her conscience. I look forward to finding out.

We at least know for sure that this is very much against Farnese's wishes, showing her sentimental affection for the dagger and mail made it quite clear if nothing else in the story did and on that note showing how much she has changed to be much more selfless person since she has been with the group. Evidence of character development is always a good thing.


Serpico wouldn't leave Farnese behind. He's like her personal slave toy   :-X. J/k but he does know of their blood bond and he's quite attached to her, I doubt he would leave her. But this is all superfluous anyway  because Guts and co will come rescue her in the next episode.  ;D

That possibility can't be totally ruled out, incest is hardly virgin territory in the story. :-\

Heh, yeah, that would be nice... not sure if it's going to happen though... right now.. guts is in such bad shape, I really don't want him... moving... at all... except he's going to have to... no way he's going to go to the ship in a stretcher...

He is probably more than capable to fight Apostles even now if he really wanted to, he is just being alot less reckless for a change and taking it easy.

And I do find myself wondering if Guts will come across any of the former Hawks who split the group after Griffith's imprisonment.

Thats an interesting thought, I would like to see that but it was only ever mentioned briefly around 20 volumes ago so it's pretty unlikely. On that note it can't be too much longer before the crew finds out Guts origins.

Can't wait for 252. :)

darkbane

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #111 on: February 17, 2005, 10:55:56 PM »
That possibility can't be totally ruled out, incest is hardly virgin territory in the story. :-\
Not that it's impossible, but that's not quite what I meant. I don't really see their relationship bending that way anytime soon.

Thats an interesting thought, I would like to see that but it was only ever mentioned briefly around 20 volumes ago so it's pretty unlikely. On that note it can't be too much longer before the crew finds out Guts origins.
Farnese seems to be catching on, although presently Schierke has the most info on Guts (aside from "that annoying chestnut"). Well, they just need to compare notes, or grill Puck, to find out the whole thing. I think that they will find it all out when the group meets the elf king, though, because that story is obviously directly related to Casca's mental condition.

Can't wait for 252. :)
Agreed.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #112 on: February 18, 2005, 08:22:46 AM »
Whats the other?

Berserk. There are 2 manga/comics he's following: one is Berserk, and the other is Vagabond.

It's possible but she did fuck up alot like her father more or less says

Well, depends how you view it. Nobody was paying her any attention, so she drew it to herself...

that could mean Magnifico truely has dark intentions, making it more than justified for Farnese to join Guts and the rest again without guilt on her conscience.

Well, if he were such a nice guy, he could have offered them the boat without any counterpart. It doesn't mean that he's necessarily fomenting some evil plan, but he's most probably only looking out for his own interest.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #113 on: February 18, 2005, 08:51:15 PM »
Farnese seems to be catching on, although presently Schierke has the most info on Guts (aside from "that annoying chestnut"). Well, they just need to compare notes, or grill Puck, to find out the whole thing. I think that they will find it all out when the group meets the elf king, though, because that story is obviously directly related to Casca's mental condition.



They're after Guts' secrets.

Anyway, I think it would be great if they found out by running into Griffith and the Hawks and watching Guts' explode. =)

Schierke theoretically knows about Griffith (if she caught that name-drop from Guts' deranged raging ego) and knows Guts was branded by The Hawk, she just doesn't seem to realize that they're one and the same. Or, she doesn't care enough to mention it, but I'm voting for ignorance on this one for now. Anyway, since she's more personally involved with the Griffster herself, her reaction should be more interesting than the rest of the crew, "Oh, you were that strong commander that killed 100 men? Wow."

darkbane

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #114 on: February 19, 2005, 03:42:57 AM »
...her reaction should be more interesting than the rest of the crew, "Oh, you were that strong commander that killed 100 men? Wow."
Right, after all the monsters that they've run into, human opponents aren't of any signifficance.  ;D And Schierke is pretty pissed at good ol' Griffith right now, what with the witch extermination and all.

Well it's probably gonna be like you say, because it's kind of hard to imagine them all sitting down and calmly talking about the eclipse or the old Hawks. Guts isn't very talkative by nature, either. Although he did give Jill somewhat of a lecture on "Beherits and Modern Society", something the rest of his current party minus Ms. Witch might appreciate.

Offline Kirika-chan

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #115 on: February 19, 2005, 11:54:44 PM »
Everyone seems to be implying that Farnese will not be able to return to the group because of Margnifico's favor, but her father had already forbidden her from leaving the mansion. Even if she hadn't met anyone, she'd still be unable to leave. So Magnifico's favor could be completely unrelated with her ability/inability to return.

(Not that I think that Farnese wouldn't agree to stay behind as the 'favor' in exchange for the ship. It would be a hard decision but it would allow her to be decisively useful to the group for the first time, so I think it's a sacrifice she would be willing to make.)

That also makes it completely normal that Serpico would leave her behind. They've got a ship so they have to let Guts and the others know. If Farnese can't leave the mansion, who can she send to deliver the important news? He's the only one. How could he refuse to go and tell the group that they have a ship?
...Now, whether he'd agree to stay with the group instead of returning to Farnese, even if she asked him to, is a completely different matter.

This makes me very afraid because it would make a lot of sense to leave Farnese in Vritannis, from story point of view. Right now, I have no interest in the outcome of the battle of Vritannis. They can massacre every last denizen of the city that I couldn't care less (as long as the gang has already left). If Farnese would stay behind, that would change the situation completely! It would tear me apart 100 times over if she got slaughtered in the battle, so I'd have a definite emotional investment in its outcome. Farnese's magical weapons and magical studies could have been intended to make her a character we care deeply about, not a competent warrior...
I hope I'm wrong and they rescue her!!
« Last Edit: February 20, 2005, 12:40:18 AM by Kirika-chan »

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #116 on: February 20, 2005, 02:56:31 AM »
Everyone seems to be implying that Farnese will not be able to return to the group because of Margnifico's favor, but her father had already forbidden her from leaving the mansion. Even if she hadn't met anyone, she'd still be unable to leave. So Magnifico's favor could be completely unrelated with her ability/inability to return.

(Not that I think that Farnese wouldn't agree to stay behind as the 'favor' in exchange for the ship. It would be a hard decision but it would allow her to be decisively useful to the group for the first time, so I think it's a sacrifice she would be willing to make.)

That also makes it completely normal that Serpico would leave her behind. They've got a ship so they have to let Guts and the others know. If Farnese can't leave the mansion, who can she send to deliver the important news? He's the only one. How could he refuse to go and tell the group that they have a ship?
...Now, whether he'd agree to stay with the group instead of returning to Farnese, even if she asked him to, is a completely different matter.

This makes me very afraid because it would make a lot of sense to leave Farnese in Vritannis, from story point of view. Right now, I have no interest in the outcome of the battle of Vritannis. They can massacre every last denizen of the city that I couldn't care less (as long as the gang has already left). If Farnese would stay behind, that would change the situation completely! It would tear me apart 100 times over if she got slaughtered in the battle, so I'd have a definite emotional investment in its outcome. Farnese's magical weapons and magical studies could have been intended to make her a character we care deeply about, not a competent warrior...
I hope I'm wrong and they rescue her!!

Don't worry, you're wrong. =)

Offline Freddy C

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #117 on: February 21, 2005, 01:48:14 PM »
Just read the chpater, somewhat late.

Firstly, I just like to make a point, although it's probably wrong, but we have not heard Magnifico make the request yet, from the feeling of Serpico, it might be that he just left after he misunderstood something and assumed that Farnese isn't coming back.

I was thinking something to do with sex when I first read about the favour, but I quickly dismissed that.

I think Guts will not be doing anything drastic about this, he will, IMO trust  Serpico's words. He might worry a lot, so will the others but I think Farnese'll stay where she is for now.

Which lead me to think that her personality, if she stays at the palace will definitely change for the worse the next time she meets the gang.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #118 on: February 21, 2005, 09:56:49 PM »
Firstly, I just like to make a point, although it's probably wrong, but we have not heard Magnifico make the request yet, from the feeling of Serpico, it might be that he just left after he misunderstood something and assumed that Farnese isn't coming back.

In a fancy new outfit? With specific directions about a ship being prepared?

Which lead me to think that her personality, if she stays at the palace will definitely change for the worse the next time she meets the gang.



Just how long do you think she plans to stay there?

I'm pretty sure the rest of the group isn't going to let Farnese stay behind, nor that she'd want to. Especially when the city starts burning down.

Offline aufond

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #119 on: February 22, 2005, 03:54:59 AM »

Mabey she is having Serpico lie to the group for some reason..  She is dedicated to following Guts on his journey, and she's not about to stick her neck out to get them a ship and then not go with them...

I wonder how far Miura has this planned out??
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Offline Akin

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #120 on: February 22, 2005, 07:23:57 AM »
I just reread, and I just noticed on the last few pages Casca is eating Puck.   Funny ^_^


Oh and there is a new chapter this week right?  No preview still. =(

http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/farnesenostay.jpg

Just how long do you think she plans to stay there?

I'm pretty sure the rest of the group isn't going to let Farnese stay behind, nor that she'd want to. Especially when the city starts burning down.

Hrm... I suppose Schierke might have to speak up about things (she'll only do it if she has to though)...  and when will anyone in guts's new "family" learn about him... currently, they don't know much... (except maybe Puck, but he's absent minded and probably forgot it all ^_^)  even Schierke, who knows more than most, doesn't even know that he was the 100 man slayer...  I'll have to go back and re-read, but I'm fairly sure she doesn't even know that... [/ramble]
« Last Edit: February 22, 2005, 05:45:20 PM by Akin »

Offline Griffith

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #121 on: February 22, 2005, 08:48:01 AM »
even Schierke, who knows more than most, doesn't even know that he was the 100 man slayer...

I doubt she even knows there was a 100 man slayer until the gang mentioned it.

Offline Akin

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #122 on: February 22, 2005, 08:50:54 AM »
I doubt she even knows there was a 100 man slayer until the gang mentioned it.

She's been living a pretty sheltered life until recently.... she might not have even known there was a war until it was mentioned (possibly)...

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 251
« Reply #123 on: February 22, 2005, 09:54:46 AM »
She's been living a pretty sheltered life until recently.... she might not have even known there was a war until it was mentioned (possibly)...

She saw Griffith and the Neo Hawks regrouping at Shet and crushing the Kushans there, rescuing the Midland people, so she knew about the war...

Offline Akin

Re: Episode 251
« Reply #124 on: February 22, 2005, 03:58:35 PM »
She saw Griffith and the Neo Hawks regrouping at Shet and crushing the Kushans there, rescuing the Midland people, so she knew about the war...

Er... not that war... I meant Midland + Tudor (chuda) war... which lasted 100 years.... oh shit, I'll just stop now. *dies*

Arg... This is what happens when you post right before you go to sleep and then post again 5 hrs later when you wake up without much sleep.

Edit: spelling fixed
« Last Edit: February 22, 2005, 08:39:07 PM by Akin »