Femto/Griffith reborn change of mind?

When I'm looking everywhere on this website, I see people who say, yeah griffith, femto and griffith reborn are exactly the same person, well, at least the same spirit.
What it appears now when I read the manga, is that griffith reborn looks much more humanist than femto... I mean, when guts and griffith talk to each other at the grave of the hawks, griffith doesn't provocate him like he did when he was femto (first at the eclipse and then when they see us at the ceremony with the count). Plus, he holds caska in his arms, and in many points he looks like the first griffith (his behaviour in his new band of the hawks). Actually, we know that he doesn't feel sorry at all for what happened at the eclipse ("it seems that i am free") so it proves that he still doesnt have any humanity left , but, his thoughts, especially about the baby of caska and guts are not really the type of thoughts of a demon lord i guess. Besides, he didn't really feel sorry either for the lost of men when he was still griffith in the golden age.
So I got two theories : the process of resurection in a new human body turned his heart , in spite of everything, a bit more human.
We all know that griffith is really intellligent and he knows how to adapt his behaviour to any situations, and maybe, he tries to appear more human to make human people closer to him.

Your theories are sort-of conflicting. Do you beleive he acts more human or he is more human?

What we do know is that he was, pretty-much, testing out the human capacities of his body (or lack thereof) on the hill of swords. When he felt a heartbeat at the sight of Guts fighting Zodd he thought it the result of the demon child being his vessel.

Hey Orange Jaïpur, welcome aboard.

Orange Jaïpur said:

When I'm looking everywhere on this website, I see people who say, yeah griffith, femto and griffith reborn are exactly the same person, well, at least the same spirit.

Click to expand...

Femto is Griffith's ego after it was "corrupted", and the new Griffith is an incarnation of Femto that has a few remaining thoughts and feelings of the Demon Child. Essentially, they're the same person.

Orange Jaïpur said:

What it appears now when I read the manga, is that griffith reborn looks much more humanist than femto...

Click to expand...

Well, he has a physical body, Griffith's angelic appearance, and he's playing the role of the people's savior, driving away the bloodthristy Kushans and bringing peace to Midland... His goal is to be the king, too. So a more deceitful approach is adapted, being kind, earning people's trust, etc. And then there's always the feelings of the Demon Child.

Orange Jaïpur said:

I mean, when guts and griffith talk to each other at the grave of the hawks, griffith doesn't provocate him like he did when he was femto (first at the eclipse and then when they see us at the ceremony with the count).

Click to expand...

I'm not sure his attitude is so different at the Hill of Swords compared to what it was in volume 3... He's disdainful, maybe not as harsh, but the whole situation makes things as provoking to Guts, IMHO.

Orange Jaïpur said:

Plus, he holds Casca in his arms

Click to expand...

That's the Demon Child's remnants rather than him though, hence his surprise and wonder later on. He acted on an impulse that he seemingly didn't control.

Orange Jaïpur said:

Actually, we know that he doesn't feel sorry at all for what happened at the eclipse ("it seems that i am free")

Click to expand...

We know he doesn't feel sorry, but that specific line isn't about that, he's saying that he's free of any feelings toward Guts (relating it to his old life). And we also know he didn't tell everything at that moment, since he felt something while watching Guts fighting Zodd (Demon Child, again).

Orange Jaïpur said:

his thoughts, especially about the baby of Casca and guts are not really the type of thoughts of a demon lord i guess.

Click to expand...

Since they're the Demon Child's, they're obviously not Femto's. Nothing too complicated here I think.

Orange Jaïpur said:

Besides, he didn't really feel sorry either for the lost of men when he was still griffith in the golden age.

Click to expand...

Really? Remember that scene in the river with Casca? After the night he spent with Gennon? The kid that died on the battlefield with his toy? He didn't like to lose soldiers, I think he cared. That's even what the God Hand told him during the Occultation, that to make all these deaths worth something, he had to go on.

War is war of course, but we wasn't emotionless at that time, in spite of his own tries.

Orange Jaïpur said:

So I got two theories : the process of resurection in a new human body turned his heart , in spite of everything, a bit more human.
We all know that griffith is really intellligent and he knows how to adapt his behaviour to any situations, and maybe, he tries to appear more human to make human people closer to him.

Click to expand...

It's a bit of the two, but that's nothing really new actually. I don't like the way you word it, however. During the incarnation process he inherited some of the Demon Child's being, to what extent we don't know, and he's posing as a savior, gentle and all, so disguising his "evil" nature. Don't hesitate to run a search for older threads on the subject if you're interested, there are a lot of them.

Oh, so that's it. I confess that I didn't understand what griffith was saying about the demon child's feelings. So the fact that he used him as a vessel made a change in his heart. So I was right in my first theory. But like you say, he also act as a savior, so the second is true too.

Really? Remember that scene in the river with Casca? After the night he spent with Gennon? The kid that died on the battlefield with his toy? He didn't like to lose soldiers, I think he cared. That's even what the God Hand told him during the Occultation, that to make all these deaths worth something, he had to go on.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I remember, but he also said at the fountain with charlotte that his "good workers" (talking about soldiers of the hawk) are ok, spending their blood for his dream. That idea didn't disturb him. Well, i know you're right about his emotions before but the essence of this idea began when he was still human. It grew up as he was corrupted.


Anyway thanks for those answers that helped me :)

Orange Jaïpur said:

So the fact that he used him as a vessel made a change in his heart.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure you can say that it made a change in his heart, it's more like it's parasiting him, I think.

Orange Jaïpur said:

Yeah, I remember, but he also said at the fountain with charlotte that his "good workers" (talking about soldiers of the hawk) are ok, spending their blood for his dream. That idea didn't disturb him.

Click to expand...

Like I said, he tried his best to suppress his emotions. Now it's not because he said so at the time that it was true, as you know.

So wait, the demon child is Gut's child.. but corrupted by Griffith during the Eclipse? So technically, it's still Gut's child?

Tell Me Why said:

So wait, the demon child is Gut's child.. but corrupted by Griffith during the Eclipse? So technically, it's still Gut's child?

Click to expand...

Of course, it's his son. That's why he always haunted him.

So basically you're saying that every bit of Griffith from the Golden Age is pretty much gone.. and now that he's reincarnated.. he's just a mixture of Femto and the Demon Child. All of the somewhat "nice" or "emotional" feelings he has are actually from the Demon Child, and not from Golden Age Griffith.

?

DarkDragoon said:

So basically you're saying that every bit of Griffith from the Golden Age is pretty much gone.. and now that he's reincarnated.. he's just a mixture of Femto and the Demon Child. All of the somewhat "nice" or "emotional" feelings he has are actually from the Demon Child, and not from Golden Age Griffith.

Click to expand...

Golden Age Griffith became Femto. He transformed himself into Femto, so he is Femto (he didn't simply cease to exist). And yes, nowadays, the new Griffith is Femto in a physical body with remnants of the Demon Child.

As for the feelings he has, we only saw the Demon Child's feelings interfering with him on the Hill of Swords, he felt something when watching Guts fighting Zodd, and he saved Casca impulsively. The rest of his actions, as far as we know, aren't related to the child (he cared about his parents, other people...). It's just Griffith behaving like he sees fit, and we don't know about his real plans, so I wouldn't call him "nice" even if he rescues princesses and eats cakes with kids in the middle of a field. We don't know much about Griffith's state of mind anyway, so speculating about his thoughts is somewhat risky. We'll have to see how it all turns out in the end.