Author Topic: Serpico and Griffith  (Read 3043 times)

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Offline Blade

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Serpico and Griffith
« on: July 30, 2006, 08:47:17 PM »
I was just thinking this a while ago, and it seems that Serpico is quite the strategist, particularly in combat, and his fighting style isn't unlike that of Griffith himself.  I'm wondering if this might possibly help Guts in some way or perhaps that Serpico might actually encounter Griffith at any point?
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Offline SaiyajinNoOuji

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2006, 09:16:39 PM »
I was just thinking this a while ago, and it seems that Serpico is quite the strategist, particularly in combat, and his fighting style isn't unlike that of Griffith himself.  I'm wondering if this might possibly help Guts in some way or perhaps that Serpico might actually encounter Griffith at any point?
I'm almost certain that Griffith wouldnt even break a sweat if they fought.  :SK:
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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2006, 09:26:30 PM »
I was just thinking this a while ago, and it seems that Serpico is quite the strategist, particularly in combat, and his fighting style isn't unlike that of Griffith himself.  I'm wondering if this might possibly help Guts in some way or perhaps that Serpico might actually encounter Griffith at any point?

Again, one of my theories is that Guts -may- form his own army, in which no doubt Serpico would provide the strategies. However this is very unlikely, and while Serpico is a bit like the old Griffith, he just can't win against Femto. Keep in mind he once repelled Guts with the bat of an eye, I doubt he hasn't retained this power.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2006, 09:28:57 PM »
I think the Serpico/Griffith comparisons have been done to death honestly.

I was just thinking this a while ago, and it seems that Serpico is quite the strategist, particularly in combat, and his fighting style isn't unlike that of Griffith himself.

I don't think their fighting styles are all that similar actually. Griffith uses a saber, Serpico a rapier.

I'm wondering if this might possibly help Guts in some way or perhaps that Serpico might actually encounter Griffith at any point?

Serpico will probably meet Griffith at some point if he sticks around Guts, but I don't see how that's supposed to have any particular significance. Griffith isn't a mere man anymore.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2006, 10:49:25 PM »
Again, one of my theories is that Guts -may- form his own army, in which no doubt Serpico would provide the strategies.

What, like he does now? =)

Even if the old Band of Brand theory finally comes to fruition, Serpico's still going to rank behind Guts and Schierke in the decision-making department. Don't forget that Guts is still a superior strategist himself. On that note, like Griffith's, Guts' strategies actually work. When was the last time one of Serpico's did? He only gets all this cred because Guts has complimented his strategy... before defeating it.

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2006, 12:50:30 AM »
Yet it was often very well planned even in those instances. Again, if he did form his own army (I'm invisioning more of a counter-force than simply using his party). I was thinking more military planning for Serpico, just as Griffith has his own advisors and their own roles, I see each of Guts band playing a different part should such a thing happen. I wouldn't suspect it to happen at all, yet it would go something like that in my book.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2006, 01:44:04 AM »
Yet it was often very well planned even in those instances.

Like when he attacked the Makara head-on and was blasted out of the sky? Or when he was similarly reckless and would have been killed by the Kelpie has Schierke not saved him? And when he challenged Guts and would have been killed again had he not spared him? He either came up with strategies beyond his execution or that didn't meet the needs of the situation. In any case, talk is cheap, his strategies failed despite how nice they sounded, you see.

Again, if he did form his own army (I'm invisioning more of a counter-force than simply using his party).

I don't think anyone would confuse his current party with an army, counter-force is the vaguer term.

I was thinking more military planning for Serpico, just as Griffith has his own advisors and their own roles, I see each of Guts band playing a different part should such a thing happen.

That really goes without saying, and wasn't what you stated before. The point is all battle strategy and direction has been between Guts and Schierke for obvious reasons, not Serpico (despite his own usefulness).

Offline CnC

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2006, 02:06:30 AM »

Done to death

mmm... deja vu
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Offline Holsety

Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2006, 08:42:21 PM »
What, like he does now? =)

Even if the old Band of Brand theory finally comes to fruition, Serpico's still going to rank behind Guts and Schierke in the decision-making department. Don't forget that Guts is still a superior strategist himself. On that note, like Griffith's, Guts' strategies actually work. When was the last time one of Serpico's did? He only gets all this cred because Guts has complimented his strategy... before defeating it.
This doesn't, as a strategist, better than Serpico. I doubt someone would claim that Zodd or the Skull Knight have displayed better strategy but clearly both are superior to Serpico. Serpico has used incredible tactical skill which placed Guts in a good deal of danger during the cliff fight, and later proved himself near "normal" Guts' level.

However, you're right; he's not really coming up with any team strategies right now. The only good reason to think he'll be working his strategy into a team setting rather than into his own fighting is if he actually begins to do so.

Like when he attacked the Makara head-on and was blasted out of the sky? Or when he was similarly reckless and would have been killed by the Kelpie has Schierke not saved him? And when he challenged Guts and would have been killed again had he not spared him? He either came up with strategies beyond his execution or that didn't meet the needs of the situation. In any case, talk is cheap, his strategies failed despite how nice they sounded, you see.

If I got things straight - and I think I do - Serpico specifically says he thinks it'd be foolhardy for him to go against Guts. He's not stupid or overestimating his abilities when he confronts the Kelpie, Guts, etc. In the case of Guts he always feels he's putting his life on the line, for Farnese's honor or (in the case of the third fight) her life. Although he seems to feel his chances of victory are slight, he feels risking his life is a worthy gamble. Considering it's Farnese, I would say he's emotionally a fool - I don't really care much for her - but strategically if  he finds the loss of his own life acceptable he's making a worthy, intelligent decision. Moreover he can do such emotional things with a cool head, always trying to find ways to give himself every advantage he can - Guts certainly hasn't done this. Yes, Guts has the power to dash into things, but Serpico doesn't; but unlike most other, weaker characters he always maximizes his abilities.

The kelpie was giving Guts lots of trouble. Serpico might have been barely up to it, but there wasn't much choice for him. He had to step in, regardless of whether he could handle it or not.

However, I can't defend the Makara case cuz I don't know what it is.
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Offline Griffith

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Re: Serpico and Griffith
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2006, 02:39:40 AM »
The point was that Serpico's strategies didn't work, plain and simple; doesn't matter the context or the odds. This isn't about what's fair. Guts faces long odds all the time, fighting creatures of superior strength and supernatural ability, but he finds a way to win within his means. That's why you don't see me on here writing a bunch of lameass excuses for him.

Anyway, I'm not saying Serpico isn't a good strategist, but he's overrated by superficial readers (and Serpico fanboys) that think he's some sort of genius on par with Griffith. Guts is equally underrated.

Serpico's superb strategy and skill stand out more than Guts' because Serp doesn't have much else going for him. That's why so many characters, most notably Guts himself, comment on it (superficially reinforcing the idea). Furtermore, people tend to overlook those qualities in Guts because he's so physically impressive to begin with (it's also a common and comforting cliché, "the little weak guy is smarter and more skilled than the big dumb strongman" i.e. David and Goliath). This phenomenon has been pointed out within the story itself for both characters (as early as volume 2 in Guts' case). It's an illusion, or maybe a delusion for some readers at this point.

BTW, if you don't know what a Makara is, or that Serpico fought one, why are you even engaged in this argument?