Author Topic: griffith(reborn) talking to spirits  (Read 5751 times)

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Offline angelene

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griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« on: April 22, 2002, 04:04:50 PM »
I've seen it mentioned in more than one thread and I forgot which chapter exactly it shall be in [ correction: searching through forum posts -- it's ch195 it appears :)] but... I'm remarkably curious about that...  why should spirits of the dead gather around griffith...? what does this mean...?

also, for some reason, I find it very hard to visualize the scene myself. particularly, I cannot for the love of it get a mental image of what griffith's face/eyes would look like during such an event. that is, I can imagine that, but I'm not sure if it makes much sense anyway. would it be possible for anyone to kindly point/provide me with an image (or two) from such scene? (thanks).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Walter

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2002, 04:50:47 PM »
In no particular order:







Why do they gather around Griffith? Hmm... Its just an assumption, but my take on it is that he drew them there. They were lost souls, but Griffith was like a beacon to them. Just as Guts and Casca are spiritually an anomaly, Griffith is also.

It could also be that he summoned them so he could perform a miracle in front of a crowd... Who knows? A very cool scene, regardless.
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline angelene

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2002, 03:47:00 PM »
aww, thanks.  :) :) :) :) :)

this, actually, looks strange, endeavouring, and much different/more than I would expect, to me. I'll elaborate: the scene seems to hold a very light, positive vibe... which I wouldn't expect to happen anywhere near reborn-griffith... technically he's still a holy "demon" (for lack of better word) even if he no longer is femto (neither he is the 'old' human griffith for that matter) and both Guts and Casca's brand did eagerly cut, sprayed and bleed in front of him...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Walter

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2002, 04:01:45 PM »
Quote
aww, thanks.  :) :) :) :) :)

this, actually, looks strange, endeavouring, and much different/more than I would expect, to me. I'll elaborate: the scene seems to hold a very light, positive vibe... which I wouldn't expect to happen anywhere near reborn-griffith... technically he's still a holy "demon" (for lack of better word) even if he no longer is femto (neither he is the 'old' human griffith for that matter) and both Guts and Casca's brand did eagerly cut, sprayed and bleed in front of him...

You have to understand, he is Griffith. 8)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline angelene

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2002, 04:18:06 PM »
like... a blatant contradiction...?  or a huge exhibitionist...?  ;D


ps. the quote in your sig, where does it come from?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Marcus

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2002, 04:36:31 PM »
Well, I believe that he is trying to tell the people that he really is the "Hawk of Light" without scaring the shit out of them.

However, Femto was an ass....
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Walter

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2002, 09:28:20 PM »
Quote
like... a blatant contradiction...?  or a huge exhibitionist...?  ;D


ps. the quote in your sig, where does it come from?

No I just meant that hes Griffith. Hes not evil, or good. Hes just Griffith. Hes himself, and every emotion that comes with him. That scene is very typical of how we have seen him in the past.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Marcus

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2002, 10:14:37 PM »
True true. However, since he has Casca and Guts' baby's body, he seems to be struck with the child's feelings of protection toward his parents. Er.. Well towards Casca anyways (saves her from rocks when he meets Guts at Godo's place). I finally got my hands on a scanned version of that! *so happy* Sad about Serpico tho.. Griffith did sacrifice what he loved but he is true to his dream and I can't seem to hate him.. He is the ultimate dreamchaser in all of us and his ambition seems to have no end. The one person that stopped him from sight of his dream was Guts and he said this before he doomed all the Hawks to death at the eclipse. I have no doubt that he will get his hands on his own country/castle, strange that Schierke calls him the Hawk of Darkness. Does she know something that we don't? ^^;;

On a side note, Rakshas is an awesome character and I've added him to my list of great fighters: Griffith, Guts, Serpico, Skullknight, Zodd, and Rakshas. Also, we haven't seen Griffith fight yet have we? He stabbed the Kushan General through the head and then his men start protecting him. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a fight like old times.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Walter

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2002, 10:47:17 PM »
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strange that Schierke calls him the Hawk of Darkness. Does she know something that we don't? ^^;;

Check out volume 14, Farnese refers to the same character.
Quote

On a side note, Rakshas is an awesome character and I've added him to my list of great fighters: Griffith, Guts, Serpico, Skullknight, Zodd, and Rakshas. Also, we haven't seen Griffith fight yet have we? He stabbed the Kushan General through the head and then his men start protecting him. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a fight like old times.

Chapter 193 shows Griffith doing a pretty typical Griffith move.
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline crazyCelt

Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2002, 12:08:58 AM »
Quote
On a side note, Rakshas is an awesome character and I've added him to my list of great fighters:

I wasn't aware of this but a "rakshasa" is a monster of Indian legend. After reading this description it would appear Miura did model Rakshas after it. I just hope for Rakshas' sake that Guts doesn't figure out the uncle trick.  ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Spike

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2002, 01:51:59 AM »
Do they mean "uncle" as in, "I give", or "uncle" as in Uncle Milty? :D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline angelene

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2002, 03:02:26 PM »
Quote

No I just meant that hes Griffith. Hes not evil, or good. Hes just Griffith.


yes. that's what I meant actually. he does not act for good or for evil. he just does, always true to himself as long and as far as the Dream applies. still that is what makes him a '(blatant) contradiction' at times &in acts: I think this expecially comes to show when Guts is around.
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Offline *Gyom*

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2002, 04:01:30 AM »
have you noticed that that scene is pretty similar ( or rather the opposite ) of the one where Casca gave birth to the 'trio child'
it seems that the child passed gathered by demons to rounded by human spirits with its mutation into ReGriffith, i can't explain it clearly...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Fletch

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2002, 08:34:52 AM »
Quote
have you noticed that that scene is pretty similar ( or rather the opposite ) of the one where Casca gave birth to the 'trio child'
it seems that the child passed gathered by demons to rounded by human spirits with its mutation into ReGriffith, i can't explain it clearly...


good parallel. i think the idea here is when the demon child was born, it chose evil & was thus surrounded by demons... then griffith reborn appears at the rebirth festival, again surrounded by demons (and angels of the god hand). here we're kind of looking at the "white hawk" being born in the public eye, if that makes sense. and instead of demons, we get comparably innocent lost souls from the last battle. i'd like to point out, though, that he's still surrounded by demons in this scene; all around the camp, for his security, apostles hide in the trees and in the shadows. the moral i always took from that scene: changing character, but constant "inner darkness." that killer ambition is still there, & griffith still cares only for his dream (and possibly casca & Guts, but who knows, maybe they still figure into his dream somehow). plus, it's sweet irony to see how the ideal of the white hawk is made manifest only with aid from the powers of darkness, when once he had the opportunity to be a savior within his reach as only a man.

anyway, miura rockz haRdc0r3 stylez. l33t drama skillz~!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline zod_the_imortal

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2002, 01:57:22 PM »
is griffith more powerfull than the good hand members now?
cause ive been thinking in volume 14 rigth after he changes in to femto when Farnese says "the use that brings the dark hawk the blind king of the white sheep serves as a shepard to the villany of the black sheep" now the way i figure this is a kind of premonition of things to come. the dark hawk = griffith wiil have his kingdom to rule over white sheep = humans but still under the black sheep = god hand power but this later changes after griffith is reborn then later in volume 22 shiruke repeats the same frase but a little diferent "we must make use of the dark hawk. the king of the blind white sheep is the master of the black sheep whit burdens of sin" the king is no longer blind and he is the master of the black sheep so is he more powerfull than god hand now i think that at this point griffith wants more than a kingom as he says hes plotting something big THAT BASTARD
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Walter

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2002, 04:12:46 PM »
Those quotes couldnt possibly be more vague.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline zod_the_imortal

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2002, 04:19:07 PM »
;D those are the only ones i got ;D
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Marcus

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2002, 04:28:56 PM »
I believe he's trying to say that perhaps the reborn Griffith is more powerful than the God Hands?

He mentions about the prophesy that Farnese and later Schierke repeat: White blind sheep, etc..

Perhaps he misread the translation of what Schierke said and thinks that the King is unblinded, perhaps giving Griffith more power than the Godhands?

Not exactly sure... ^^;;
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Offline zod_the_imortal

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2002, 06:15:48 PM »
u got it thats my question
do u guys think that hes more powerfull than god hand now
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline roberto999

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2002, 06:24:03 PM »
He is not mightier than the godhand. He is the thing that he was always supposed to be: their Messiah on Earth.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
Hey I am reborn

Offline Spike

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #20 on: May 06, 2002, 12:35:39 AM »
 I'd think that the reason why Griffith MAY be "mightier" than the God Hand is because he can now directly function in the human realm, while the God Hand are still relegated to indirectly manipulating humanity by fate.  Griffith is now flesh, the God Hand is ethereal...for a lack of a better term. ::)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Marcus

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #21 on: May 07, 2002, 03:09:40 PM »
Good point, however did Griffith retain all his Godhand powers? Remember, he's no longer Femto but Griffith and all that signifies.
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Offline angelene

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Re:  griffith(reborn) talking to spirits
« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2002, 04:12:36 PM »
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Good point, however did Griffith retain all his Godhand powers? Remember, he's no longer Femto but Griffith and all that signifies.


I think Griffith might have retained part of his Godhand powers, and/or disguised them as different.

also, I was pondering --  since he is now back to his human disguise,  flesh plus a-certain-something, esoteric and not exactly describable, would he:

(a) be bound to destiny/fate(Idea?) just like every human, like when he was human, hence controlled by it and every action he takes is just a step forward on the path to which he's been designated [ just like he was designated to receive the Beherit, use it and become the 5th of the Godhand?]?

or

(b) since he is still, technically, part of the Godhand, would he be able to maneuver the mechanisms of fate and trick apostles &humans (the black and the white sheep?) towards his dream?

or

(c) since he is still, technically, part of the Godhand, but not only that [ he doesn't belong to the (human) world but he doesn't seem to  belong to the Godhand level either anymore], would he be able to escape the mechanism of fate and trick it towards his own dream?

surely he has not achieved his dream yet (and after having sacrificed all that was sacred and dear to you, wouldn't you be a lite pissed -- umm well I would) and what if the Idea had another idea for him (pun somewhat intended) after all? would he be able to fight it? I think that what griff have been pursuing was not the dream he's destined to, rather : the dream he'd want for himself -- he wants to be other than what he was born, is and would be bound to become -- he compares himself and is compared to a bird - a white hawk - which may hint: freedom? free will?

ah, I'd better stop rambling now.


;D



ps. Marcus, the quote in your sig ("The King of the blind White sheep is the Master of the Black sheep with a burden of sins. He is the one who will bring true darkness into the world.") um... is it what Farnese/Farnese says in vol 14 or what Schriecke (sp?) says in some of the most recent chapters? I have a different translation of the former and it got me curious.