Poll

What do you think of the humour (or lack there of) in Berserk?

It's Great! Don't change a thing Miura!
54 (73%)
Comedy's great, but I could do with more of it.
5 (6.8%)
Humours fine, but I could do with less of it.
8 (10.8%)
I wish there was a lot less humour.
4 (5.4%)
Isidro and Puck should die in a fire! (I'm a faggot)
3 (4.1%)

Total Members Voted: 69

Author Topic: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?  (Read 7721 times)

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Offline Locus of Agony

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Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« on: January 21, 2007, 12:50:38 AM »
There's been a lot of talk about how annoying (or lovable) Puck and Isidro's upbeat humour is in the world of Berserk.

How do you feel?
For every single day you lived, for every fragment of your broken dream, the night is so evanescing.
Don't let anyone walk over your dreams, don't let them fall on the path.
If they do, I will be one meter behind you, I'll pick up and clean them for you.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2007, 01:15:18 AM »
Is there really a need for such a poll? It's mostly always the same kind of people complaining about Puck and Isidro and God knows what else. Their opinions are usually not worth caring about.

Offline March of Flames

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2007, 06:12:12 AM »
I like Berserk just the way it is. Why would the author just throw in humor if it didn't play an important part in the overall feel of the manga? It doesn't make sense how someone could love Berserk but have a huge problem with Puck.
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Offline CnC

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2007, 06:38:01 AM »
Jeez.  Every now and then a person has a beef with how Puck (and now Isidro and Magnifico) bring a bit of levity to the story.

These characters bring a necessary balance to what would otherwise be a very somber story.  Also, these comedic breaks help bring the audience into believing the more fantastical elements of the story.

So yea.  Like Aaz said, is there really a need for this poll?


...
And why do you think Femto was a Raven?  thats another idea for a poll.
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Offline Locus of Agony

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2007, 12:32:14 AM »
Because Femto the White hawk, Femto the Red hawk, and Femto the Black Hawk weren't accepted! :serpico:

Apoligies. I was just curious to see how these opinions would stack up on a poll. I also belive Berserk is fine the way it is, but I'm sure there are a lot of people who disagree for different reasons, not JUST Puck haters, although I know there are a lot of them out there.

Lock if you need to...
For every single day you lived, for every fragment of your broken dream, the night is so evanescing.
Don't let anyone walk over your dreams, don't let them fall on the path.
If they do, I will be one meter behind you, I'll pick up and clean them for you.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2007, 12:47:24 AM »
Because Femto the White hawk, Femto the Red hawk, and Femto the Black Hawk weren't accepted! :serpico:

Well these aren't much better anyway... How about "Femto, the Wings of Darkness?" Sounds right to me. :SK:

Offline Locus of Agony

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2007, 12:59:24 AM »
Heh, sound like a mouthful, but it sounds like a name change is in order. Thanks for the suggestion.

Back to my orginal question/poll though, obviously most of us are happy with the way Berserk has everything ballanced, but for those who don't, I'm interested in hearing their opinion.

No statement goes unqualified: As long as it's not just PUCK SUXXX!!!11!!!!  :puck:
For every single day you lived, for every fragment of your broken dream, the night is so evanescing.
Don't let anyone walk over your dreams, don't let them fall on the path.
If they do, I will be one meter behind you, I'll pick up and clean them for you.

Offline Tzur

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2007, 02:51:04 AM »
I voted for the first option; the comic relief is an essential balance in the story. I trust Miura's judgement of course, so I wouldn't mind at all if he decides to kill off Isidro sooner or later.

As for Puck... he's not going anywhere, dammit! :puck:

Offline Stream

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2007, 12:33:38 AM »
Hmm I take it it's fine the way it is, but I wouldn't like to see it "lighten up" more than now... Actually I might even like it more if it becomes "darker" again, since I loved the atmosphere of the first three volumes.

Anyway, Miura is the man, whatever he does is right.  :miura: :guts:
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Offline Dirty Dog

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2007, 12:54:31 AM »
Even Hamlet (in which every main character ended up dead at the end, aside from Hamlet's friend whats-his-face) had some humor in it.
I think the reason people have a problem with Puck and Isidro is because the light seems much brighter when you're in the dark. (earlier parts of Berserk were so dark that anything light/humorous/happy seems extreme in comparison and their immediate reaction is want it turned off)
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Offline Skullgrin140

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2007, 05:40:46 PM »
Its ok I suppose, a Story like this needs a little bit of Humor

Offline All_4_Yume

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2007, 05:46:32 PM »
It's cool the way it is now but I think the humor was done best from volumes 1-15.
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Offline Omega Tom Hanks

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2007, 09:22:07 PM »
Things need to stay the same its going great right now and I dont want them to change a thing
Why in God's name would I wanna keep writing about characters whose central preoccupation are weed and dick and fart jokes? I mean, ya gotta grow man. Don't you ever want anything more for yourself? I know this poor hapless son of a bitch does. I look into his sorry doe eyes and I just, I see a man crying out. He's crying out, "When Lord? When the fuck can your servant ditch this foul-mouthed little chucklehead to whom I am a constant victim of his folly, so much so that it prevents him from ever getting to kiss a girl! Fuck! When, Lord when? WHENS GONNA BE MY TIME?

Offline Ben

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2007, 11:27:04 PM »
I demand that Miura have three volumes devoted to an Isidro/Puck side story, in which it is revealed that all trolls were wiped out by a mysterious disease, and the preview at the end of it tells us to expect another seven volumes waiting to get to Elfhelm.

Offline relmneiko

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2007, 05:52:19 AM »
Humor's fine, as long as the character doesn't exist solely for humor.

In early volumes, Puck served as a sort of voice that let you know at intervals that Guts really wasn't as much of an asshole as he seemed, and he played a role in the arc with that moth-demon girl (sorry, the name escapes me at the moment). I can also see him having a plot-relevant role once the party reaches Elfhelm.

Isidro, however, doesn't seem to do much. Okay, he's another fighting arm, but he doesn't really add anything unique to the story, he has revealed little background so far, and really seems to have no involvement with story events other than following the party along. That could well change in the future but... right now I find him rather lacking, and frankly I find Puck and Evarella funnier anyway. :puck:
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2007, 10:41:41 AM »
Isidro, however, doesn't seem to do much. Okay, he's another fighting arm, but he doesn't really add anything unique to the story, he has revealed little background so far, and really seems to have no involvement with story events other than following the party along.

We must not have read the same books then... Even making abstraction of everything else (and that's a lot), without Isidro Casca would have died in Albion.

Offline Ben

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2007, 07:51:21 PM »
Being entirely serious here, I would have to say that Isidro is probably my favorite character in recent volumes (aside from our protagonist, of course), and all of the Isidro hate really annoys me.  He has saved Casca (and even Casca and Farnese at Enoch village), and the parallel between Isidro/Guts and Guts/Gambino is starting to play out a bit, if only hinted at. 

I can understand why some people dislike the Puck and Isidro comedy, but I enjoy it as a simple break.  I mean, if you're going to keep a work fresh for 30+ volumes, you can't just have constant gore and action, and any well developed story has to have humorous moments.  I think the real debate here is "Do you wish Miura just kept redoing the Black Swordsman arc over and over, or actually develop the story in logical and meaningful ways?" Or how about nonstop eclipses back to back? I mean, it's not like the humor aspect with Puck wasn't somewhat there in volumes 1-3, so I would think that people would have to know what they were getting into.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2007, 10:19:14 PM by bph »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2007, 10:16:17 PM »
I think the real debate here is "Do you wish Miura just kept redoing the Black Swordsman arc over and over, or actually devlope the story in logical and meaningful ways?" Or how about nonstop eclipses back to back?

You really hit the point here, but it's even worse than that. You have the people that wish the whole series revolved around the Hawks during the Golden Age. Mostly Griffith, Judo, Guts and Casca (in that order of preference, with maybe Casca and Guts being interchangeable). Then you have those that want Guts to eternally kill apostles and random people because they like "gore and violence," with duels with Zodd every 10 episodes or so. There are variations among these 2 groups (sometimes relatively big), but covering everything in detail wouldn't be worth the time. What matters is that all of these individuals actually miss the point of Berserk as a whole. They like it for the wrong reasons. They don't understand it past the broadest aspects, and ultimately can't enjoy it for what it really is.

Rather, they only see what they want to see in it, misconceptions usually nourished by mistranslations and from which fan-fictionish, bizarro versions of Berserk emerge. This also means that they'll never see its true greatness. They fondly recall a "better time" that never really existed and their favorite lines are sometimes so wrongly worded they might as well have made them up. They often incoherently hate fundamental parts of the manga based on reasons so trivial and illogical it boggles the mind, and fail to realize that their own favorite moments couldn't exist without them. Let's not forget the ever affirmative claims that "XXXXX is useless, YYYYY never did anything, ZZZZZ is a side-story that has no bearing on the real plot;" disarming by their ignorance. In the end I think it comes down to narrow-mindedness associated with a lack of vision (and dare I say maturity/intelligence?).

Now just so it's clear, this rant isn't really at its place here, and it's not aimed at anyone in this thread. It's not meant to spark a debate, it's just a commentary in reaction to what bph said on a phenomenon that has existed for years now and is honestly tiring.

As for Isidro being your favorite character after Guts, bph, I can easily see why. He's received a lot of character development since his introduction and is globally interesting for a lot of reasons (potential, goals, flaws, personality, etc). There's much to like about him.

Offline Serpico

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2007, 02:36:44 AM »
Personally, I love the comic relief characters. They are especially good on re-reads where I pay more attention to the detail and jokes. I think it is balanced pretty well as it is though, doesn't really need any more or less.

Offline Blues

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2007, 09:24:47 PM »
Aazealh hit it square on. I myself (Have been a "kept up" reader since 01 and started buying localized in 04 I think) was a little leery after the so called "Black Swordsman" piece shifted gears. I think the biggest problem (I'm being brutally honest here, so people don't get offended please) is that people go and either
A)watch the anime and then re-read the manga via scanlations in a very fast time.
B)Scanlations of manga, then the anime, all in a short period
They end up cramming over 15 years (?) of Berserk in about six months/a year's time (even less for some?) and with the anime focus being on the golden age, this is the most predominant focus, and people keep expecting Guts to hunt down every last apostle and then have a good old fashioned showdown with Griffith (not that I wouldn't mind one myself, but not in this sense).

Instead, they get new characters, new plot elements and they view the whole recent 30-50 episodes as "side story", viewing only the Hawks build up and downfall with Griffith's ascension to Femto as the focal point leading to Guts' vengeance. They've limited their selves to the story and expect the most minimal amount of it and limiting their view and limits for Miura into what "they expect to see". Bah, I'm just repeating Aazealh, but yes, people seriously need to slow down and re-read the manga before jumping the gun, I personally don't want to see Guts, Griffith and Zodd confront each other every damn volume. One of my favorite things about this work is I can go back and see Zodd and Guts in nearly a 12-15 year history have had less than 5 confrontations (sans the games), and I believe less than 2 actual "Battles"....

Offline mike.william

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2007, 07:55:48 AM »
It only seems to be lightening up because no one has attempted to rape Casca in the most recent episodes.  Just be patient, Berserk can't go on for long without someone trying to rape Casca, and then it'll seem really dark again.   :troll:


Just to digress a bit, there have been 6 rapings/attempted-rapings of Casca that I can remember.  We need to start a betting pool on how many times this happens to Casca before Berserk ends.  If we all ante up 10 dollars and dump it in a savings account, someone will win a decent pot by time Berserk ends.

My bet is 37.


Offline Blues

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2007, 08:13:11 PM »
I say less than 10 total (as in from now till conclusion), I have no doubt Berserk will wane in and out of "light" and "dark" phases till its conclusion, there's less reasons for her to have "rape" attempted on her. The most recent one (to my memory) served to show she still had her little warrior spirit in her (or at the very least, memory of the previous time it happened) and slaughtered her attackers. We've also already had the Eclipse and the parts prior where soldiers from other armies found a woman soldier "rapeable", so imo there's not too many reasons to see it happen 30+ more times.

Offline Odekun

Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #22 on: April 06, 2007, 05:02:47 AM »
Why is that mentality so rampant everywhere?  I haven't been following Berserk for almost half my life so I can't appreciate it?  I understand that you probably have a deep connection to the series, still following it closely and even discussing it on forums for so long, but I don't think that just because I read the entire thing in two or three sittings I'll never understand it as well.  Sure, rereading it I may catch additional details, but I agree with you guys on everything that's great about Berserk--for example, some guys that hang out at my house too much (it's kind of an open door college sort of thing) talk about Berserk every once and a while, and lately whenever they do I have to take a walk, usually at two or three in the morning, so I don't just start yelling at how stupid they are for what they regard the main points of Berserk as.

I know it's just a generalization, just because I've been exposed to it for a shorter period of time doesn't mean I don't fully comprehend it.  Actually, I was attracted to the series probably for the same reasons you still enjoy it--I have seen your point firsthand though about how some people are attracted to one of the surface elements of Berserk and expect only that from it.  I swear the next time I start talking about some interesting part of Berserk and some guy laughs and yells "demon rape" I won't be able to control my actions, but those are just the kind of people I'm around at this time in my life.

Sorry for the rant, I know the post wasn't directed at an individual--you probably haven't even seen me post on the forums before, this being my second post, but I really don't want to be thrown in with the same lot that somehow find a way to anger me despite being the epitome of passive and laid back (probably not so much in text as I'm sure you've concluded :P).

Offline Forest Wraith

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #23 on: April 18, 2007, 12:08:58 PM »
Hey, I'm one of those people who has read large portions of Berserk in a short period of time too. When I saw the Anime and heard that there was a Manga, I had to know more, once I learned that the series was still on-going; I got excited: "Wow, this is one of the best works of art I've ever seen . . . And I get to literally watch it develop? Awesome!" The complaint about "new" fans isn't directed at ones like you and me who can appreciate all the different aspects of Berserk: It's directed at those who are too immature to see the subtleties of the series and who have a very narrow view of Berserk and it's themes.
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Beckoning round the bend.
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Offline Circe

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Re: Berserk: Lighten up? or Darken down?
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2007, 09:38:46 PM »
I'm actually glad for abit of comedy here and there. In a way its showing some more human emotions. Every piece of human emotion is expressed. Hatred, Envy, Love, ect so why not some laughs? Also the comedy may die down once Puck and Isidro see how truly evil the berserk-verse can truly get. But really after the eclipse and everything that happened I had cried so badly. I remember just waking up and reading volume 13 last summer and then prying myself away to get to work thinking omg omg that was the worst thing I need to know if it gets any better. I ran home started reading more and cried for Guts when Casca not only lost her mind but lost her baby and then rejected him. That might make me a crybaby to cry over fictional characters but I'd become so engrossed and loved all of them so much I couldn't help but feel depressed. If the series gets darker I won't mind I'm actually expecting that BUT some comedy here and there gives a little giggle before a huge fighting scene ect. Honestly though it isn't just Puck or Isidro who bring alittle humor once in awhile. Even though their scenes are meant to it doesn't mean its just them. After all Schierke has a few funny moments, as well as everyone else. *shrugs* Either way I don't mind if it gets darker but abit more humor occasionally when the timing is alright I wouldn't mind. Then when I read some scene where Griffith becomes King while Guts is hurt or something I won't go outside and beat someone with a bat out of anger.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2007, 09:45:50 PM by Circe »