Serpico's Superior Skills?

[Dirty Dog]

Guess I missed the part where he deflected an attack that could have could have killed Guts, among about a dozen other things.

thus how he is "Supporting"

Farnese would also be dead. Guts would be alone with Casca still...  yeah you're right, he had no effect on the manga at all.

He's "saved" her a couple of times, but there's no way we can be sure she needed saving.

his skill probably puts him in the top 1% of human fighters thus he will LIKELY win 99% of the time.

I would agree, if 100% of the fights were against human fighters.


can't really argue with anything else.


Also, I would say that puck isn't as important as he used to be, and that if it weren't for where the group is going, Serpico would probably be more (if not equally) important.

[Serpico]

thus how he is "Supporting"

Who said he isn't supporting. I clearly said he was PIVOTAL. 
When you save important characters you are pivotal.

thus how he is "Supporting" :schierke:He's "saved" her a couple of times, but there's no way we can be sure she needed saving.

You can't be serious... 

He stopped her from being crushed by a giant chandelier
He stopped Guts from impaling her with a sword
He caught her hand when she fell off a hundred foot tower
He scooped her out of the way of a giant tiger

These are just a few examples. Yes she did NEED saving and if you aren't sure of it then that says a lot about your opinions.

Again, you and CnC both need to try reading the manga.

[CnC]

Bitching, no. Pointing you your lack of reading comprehension yes.

Not Pivotal?
Guess I missed the part where he deflected an attack that could have could have killed Guts, among about a dozen other things. Farnese would also be dead. Guts would be alone with Casca still...  yeah you're right, he had no effect on the manga at all. An imaginary man just saved Guts from dying in a fight with Zodd that Guts WOULD have lost.

Could of, would of, DIDN'T.

By your logic, Shisu is far more important a character than Serpico could ever be; and yet I don't see you idolize her with the same fervor.  EDIT: Apparently we need to work on your definition of "pivotal" as well.

Who said he isn't supporting. I clearly said he was PIVOTAL. 
When you save important characters you are pivotal.


You can't be serious... 

He stopped her from being crushed by a giant chandelier
He stopped Guts from impaling her with a sword
He caught her hand when she fell off a hundred foot tower
He scooped her out of the way of a giant tiger

These are just a few examples. Yes she did NEED saving and if you aren't sure of it then that says a lot about your opinions.

Again, you and CnC both need to try reading the manga.

Look apon all these examples you've listed and tell me which one has drastically changed the narrative.  Don't feed me "he has saved Guts" BS.  If Guts were killed in these scenarios it really wouldnt be a complete story, would it?

Now I like Serpico as a character.  People have already speculated in the past (the serpico-apostle thread) that he'll have a stronger role in the narrative.  However, as of this point he has done little more than help advance the story rather than be pivotal.

Ultimately, you're not going to convince me (or I would go as far to say anyone) on the outcome of hypothetical battles based on situationally driven events.  I'm afraid that Miura's crafted a bit more complicated of a story rather than your standard Shounen, power level battle based fare.  Bringing up these conversations, even when they're well articulated, are still juvenile.

[Serpico]

Could of, would of, DIDN'T.

By your logic, Shisu is far more important a character than Serpico could ever be; and yet I don't see you idolize her with the same fervor.

Ultimately, you're not going to convince me (or I would go as far to say anyone) on the outcome of hypothetical battles based on situationally driven events.  I'm afraid that Miura's crafted a bit more complicated of a story rather than your standard Shounen, power level battle based fare.  Bringing up these conversations, even when they're well articulated, are still juvenile.

Thanks for all the laughs man. Everything you say gets more rediculous. By my logic Shizu IS more critical than Serpico to the plot. Absolutely. I kinda feel like like Guts dying under a tree as a baby would have hindered the story just a little. 
You seem to be implying she isn't here which is quite absurd.

No one has attacked or questioned Shizu so why should I talking about her here exactly. Lots of characters are critical, including both Serpico and Farnese. I agree with you Puk was critical as well as Isidro frankly, but no one is saying they arent, unlike what you have said regarding Serpico.

If you wou read you would know that some other people already do believe Serpico could beat the people I mentioned. Your assumption you know EVERY other fans opinion is also completely absurd. I never said he could certainly beat any apostle or god-hand. I said I'd like to see him fight some.

Actually you have the Shounen power lvl concept. I will openly admit Serpico is less powerfull than an apostle, yet I think he has a chance to win with his cunning. You seem to be convinced he will lose by power levels alone.

[CnC]

I added a bit to my above post, as there really isn't anything worth replying to in your last post (but thanks for proving my point about you're being juvenile).  cheers.

[Locus of Agony]

While I'll not even attempt to debate the "pivotalness" (that's bad I know ) of one character over another, I think Serpico, that CnC and Walter's point is mainly this:

We are in the story for Guts, his plight, his vengence, his outcome.
Everything Puck, Farnese, Serpico, Isidro, or Schierke do is to somehow compliment Guts, this being Miura, his supporting cast have more recognition, memorability, in short a life of their own, that does not comply and may even conflict with Guts goals.

Be that as it may, Guts remains central (truly pivotal) while the rest of the cast exists to elevate or aggrivate him.

That's why the question of wither or not Serpico can beat Guts is somewhat superfluous, even he does, we will be more concerned with how that duel effects Guts then Serpico.

As I said before, it's not that Serpico can't beat Guts, or even if he's a better fighter or not (I think their too diseperate to compare but I digress) it's just that Guts is the major player, and as such, Serpico's goal are secondary.

[CnC]

Be that as it may, Guts remains central (truly pivotal) while the rest of the cast exists to elevate or aggrivate him.

Thats partly what I'm saying.  There are other characters that dramatically alter the direction of the narrative.  Serpico hasn't done that (yet).

[Serpico]

I added a bit to my above post, as there really isn't anything worth replying to in your last post (but thanks for proving my point about you're being juvenile).  cheers.

No problem. I'd give up if I was you too.

Could of, would of, DIDN'T.

Look apon all these examples you've listed and tell me which one has drastically changed the narrative. Don't feed me "he has saved Guts" BS. If Guts were killed in these scenarios it really wouldnt be a complete story, would it?

I can feed you a little bit of how Serpico and Farnese has both saved Casca on various occasions if you prefer? Does it change the narrative if she is dead? or if Guts still has to carry her kicking and screaming on one arm while fighting. Guts was frankly on the verge of a breakdown before their arrival. They have DRAMATICALLY changed the tone of the manga. They are deeply intwoven to everything that has happened on Guts end for the last 16 volumes. If you don't see that on your own then there is no convincing you.

You can admit or not Serpico saved Guts, doesn't matter to me. If you want to believe he could have killed Zodd and the other 50 apostles there, or Ganishka's attack would not have killed him then so be it.

[Skullgrin140]

Serpico's a pretty cool character, he Served Guts several times and It would be interesting to see him fight Griffith, but he's left especially for Guts to kill, so instead Serpico should go up agaisnt Rakshas

[CnC]

I can feed you a little bit of how Serpico and Farnese has both saved Casca on various occasions if you prefer? Does it change the narrative if she is dead?

Oh nice, I see what you did there.  We're going to bring Farnese in as a reason Serpico is a pivotal character?  Clever monkey.
If its your plan to argue every occasion or character that has put the main character in dire straights as pivotal then everything is pivotal.
And thusly, Serpico's contributions are greatly lessened in consequence.  Did I just blow your tiny fuckin' mind?

or if Guts still has to carry her kicking and screaming on one arm while fighting. Guts was frankly on the verge of a breakdown before their arrival. They have DRAMATICALLY changed the tone of the manga. They are deeply intwoven to everything that has happened on Guts end for the last 16 volumes. If you don't see that on your own then there is no convincing you.

Guts DID have a breakdown right before Farnese (and with her, Serpico) showed up again.  The beast is still around and Serpico has had no affect on that front.  Your argument that they are deeply interwoven (the correct spelling, btw) with Guts for 16 volumes doesn't really work as all they've done is advance the story.  Its only since volume 26 that Guts felt that he had comrades again, but even that is not as pivotal as you say.

Honestly, you've found a very drawn-out way of saying "nuh-uh" in most of your posts with very little substance behind it.   Unless you really have anything substantial to add to this debate of what you think "pivotal" means, drop it.  That way you can resume professing your love of all things Serpico and not actually have to attempt elevated conversation (preferably with spell-check).

[smoke]

This thread is fucking amazing. Never before have I read only 2 pages and gotten a headache.

suupah bishi serpico powah cunning swordu attakku!!

[Serpico]

Oh nice, I see what you did there.  We're going to bring Farnese in as a reason Serpico is a pivotal character?  Clever monkey.

If its your plan to argue every occasion or character that has put the main character in dire straights as pivotal then everything is pivotal.
And thusly, Serpico's contributions are greatly lessened in consequence.  Did I just blow your tiny fuckin' mind?

Better than a dimwitted monkey like yourself eh?

You can't put together that Farnese is alive because of Serpico. 2+2 is hard for some I suppose.

I explained Serpico's direct affects on the plot but you can't process them.

You call me juvenile then get riled up to cursing and name calling. LMAO, you're pathetic man, and you prove it at every turn. You're as easy to play as a fiddle. You're right though, my mind is blown at your sheer stupidity.

Honestly, you've found a very drawn-out way of saying "nuh-uh" in most of your posts with very little substance behind it. Unless you really have anything substantial to add to this debate of what you think "pivotal" means, drop it. That way you can resume professing your love of all things Serpico and not actually have to attempt elevated conversation (preferably with spell-check).

The fact it all has to be spelled out for you is nothing to be proud of. Where exactly is your substance there? I used specific examples. The fact that you can't process them is a personal problem on your end. You are the one backing your claims up with nothing.

Do everyone a favor and read the manga, since you obviously haven't  You look like a real fool.

[Ben]

This thread is fucking amazing. Never before have I read only 2 pages and gotten a headache.

suupah bishi serpico powah cunning swordu attakku!!

EXACTLY, we need to get it on topic and back to Isidro's apparent and godlike superiority, all proven with my flawless logic.  As I said, he's never actually been beaten in one on one combat, spared Serpico while displaying humility in pretending to submit, and he wouldn't allow his dream to be effected by a woman (a la Farnese).  In short, Isidro is the ultimate strong one, as demonstrated by the flow of logic in this thread.

[SaiyajinNoOuji]

At this stage in the game, Serpico would get man handled by any of the Lieutenants/Commanders in Griffith's army. With that, do you honestly believe that Serpico would have a chance against Griffith right now? I think not, for one thing, all we have seen Griffith do is give the eye and all apostles for the most part are his bitches.

With that, his aura makes everyone feel all weak in the knees. We don't even know yet if Griffith has to break his current form to use all of his God Hand powers. If he doesn't he can just crush him with his mind like he did during the eclipse when Skullknight busted in and rescued Guts and Casca. Also even if Griffith did have to break his form it wouldnt take away from the fact that he is a God hand, you know, the power right before "God". I think you are putting him on a a level a little to high then he really is.

Although hey may be a skilled fighter, there is no way he can stand against Griffith/Femto.

Aaz I already answered Walter in a note since he asked not to continue the discussion here. I will cite them to you as well in a note if you like. Can't exactly agree my next statement is "ridiculously biased and unfounded" since I have seen Griffith, Silat, and Serpico each fight Guts multiple times. Its pretty well founded.

This quote... You say that your responce is well founded but lets look at what its founded from. Its founded from the time that Griffith let his emotions get th ebest of him when dueling the second time with Guts. He went ahead and attacked first and straight ahead instead of keeping calm and parrying like he did the first time. With that it was only one swing.

If you are basing your entire argument when it comes to this quote as well founded, well my man, i think every is right except for you.

You also have to think that Griffith was imprisoned for sometime while Serpico was doing his thing. Then comes the fact that Griffith is now a god in human form.

My point still stands. He would have no chance in hell to win against Griffith, I don't think he would even put up a good fight.

[Serpico]

@ Saiya

I stated pretty clearly the entire time Serpico would die in a fight to the death with god-hand Griffith so you are arguing to deaf ears on that point. Just because I want to see them fight doesn't mean I think Serpico can or will win; I've stated this several times.

As far as saying Serpico can beat human Griffith, I also conceded that it would be a toss up on the last page. There is plenty enough to "found" my speculation though. It's based on the skills I have seen from both of them. I don't really care that others have a high opinion of Griffith. It has a solid basis, just as my opinion of Serpico does. Frankly my opinion of Griffith is high as well.

EXACTLY, we need to get it on topic and back to Isidro's apparent and godlike superiority, all proven with my flawless logic.

I conceded to the ultimate power of Isidro on the last page. 

[Walter]

Thread locked because it turned into a fucking flame war. Man, you guys are meeeeeeean when pushed. Can't even carry a cordial conversation about a hypothetical fight with FICTIONAL CHARACTERS.

Locke'd