Author Topic: Episode 292  (Read 70931 times)

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Offline SaiyajinNoOuji

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #250 on: February 07, 2008, 07:44:33 AM »
Anyways, rules of the internet or not.. who gives a shit? Easiest thing to do is not reply to such comments thus leaving them in their own little world called belly-button.
Well not replying would work if the majority of people could get the hint that when the question isn't answered the first time, it probably wont be answered the 2nd or 3rd, but shit, its the god damn internet. Everyone thinks they are a god damn unique beautiful snowflake and no one could POSSIBLY have asked the question they want to ask, so fuck reading the first 4 pages of a thread, let me ask the magical question guys....

"Has the date of new episode been released guys?"

So thus if we don't reply with smart ass hateful remarks, other people will think its "O.K." to ask the same god damn question instead of doing a bit of looking before they hit the reply button.
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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #251 on: February 07, 2008, 08:11:39 AM »
Worst. Thread. Ever. Anyway, I imagine people that buy YA to read Berserk already don't buy it when Berserk isn't in it, so an official strike probably wouldn't be necessary or have much impact. =)

Also, we're officially at the point where we're complaining about people complaining about the people complaining, so let's stop here before someone complains about my complaining and we officially reach five degrees of complaining. :void:

And Guts[LCF], the DH volumes do get better.

Offline SaiyajinNoOuji

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #252 on: February 07, 2008, 08:53:55 AM »
http://objection.mrdictionary.net/go.php?n=2407972  :troll:

Anyways, I am hoping for a quick Ganishka flash back on his rise to being the ultimate sacrifice for Griffith.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #253 on: February 07, 2008, 08:59:37 AM »
Anyway, if I were japanese, I would boycott Young Animal. Things only change if it hurts in the pocket.  :troll:

I don't think you understand how things work. You can be sure that if the editors at Young Animal could have Berserk published in every issue, they would. They'd probably pay a lot of money to guarantee it, too. Like Griffith said, it's not like people buy YA regardless of whether Berserk is in it or not. On the other hand, no monetary considerations of any kind are likely to be able to force the author to change his work schedule. He doesn't work because he needs money to live. Not to mention that you don't even know why the publication's halted in the first place.

Anyway, those discussions are redundant, boring and fruitless, and I'm not too fond of people inviting the state of mind of "I'm reading but not buying because [insert any excuse here]," so let's please try to move back to talking about the episodes themselves and what will happen next in the story. Otherwise we might as well lock the thread.

Offline Judo

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #254 on: February 07, 2008, 03:39:26 PM »
Everyone on this board SHOULD be buying the DarkHorse mangas though!

i rather stick with the panini-edition in my mother-tongue... thanks.
possessing every volume twice would be a bit too fanboyish for my taste an too demanding for my wallet.
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Taking the audience to a jungian journey into the collective unconscious by using the shadow as a metaphor for the primal self that gets repressed by the modern persona... and also by using an underground setting and labyrinth office design to represent both: the depths of the psyche and the dungeon-like isolation of our increasingly mechanistic society which prevents people from finding satisfying work or meaningful connections with others.

Offline Guтs

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #255 on: February 07, 2008, 05:31:13 PM »
Judo, obviously I was just stating that we should be buying the mangas at all, seeming the majority of the people here speak english so I mentioned DarkHorse. If you can get it in your native language than good for you. You possibly already knew what I meant but decided answering with a smart-ass comment instead, congratulations on a new level of internet awesomeness.

Alright anyways, back to the topic at hand!

I don't know if its been mentioned and I read the whole topic a while back but, I noticed a pretty big similarity between the Idea and the Reincarnator.

Alright, this is the Idea from the Lost Episode in Volume 13 where Griffith communicates with the Idea itself.



And then we have Ganishkas Reincarnator, the reincarnator in general doesn't look like a floating piece of heart but... this is strikingly similar.




Any thoughts on what this could mean? I also highly doubt this is a coincidence... seeming we aren't suppose to know about the Lost Episode either, I mean how did Ganishka succeed to create his own 'Idea' or the power of 'Idea' in a smaller dose? Theres obviously a connection, so how and where did he find this power or the magical arts to create... which could mean Idea isn't just the counscious of mankind but also the work of something else, just a speculation really... but what do you guys think?

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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #256 on: February 07, 2008, 05:52:37 PM »
I don't know if its been mentioned and I read the whole topic a while back but, I noticed a pretty big similarity between the Idea and the Reincarnator.

I think it was, yeah. We didn't just discover it in the latest episode. Also, the what? Reincarnator? Did you just come up with this name? Because it's not accurate and I wouldn't use it if I were you. It just invites confusion, since we've got a pretty specific meaning for the concept of Incarnation (referring to Griffith).

Any thoughts on what this could mean? I also highly doubt this is a coincidence... seeming we aren't suppose to know about the Lost Episode either, I mean how did Ganishka succeed to create his own 'Idea' or the power of 'Idea' in a smaller dose?

That construct doesn't replicate the power of the Idea of Evil, it replicates the power of a beherit. It really can't be compared. Honestly, I think the similarity is mostly just visual, despite its coolness. It could be more since the two are distantly related, but so far nothing has hinted at it.

which could mean Idea isn't just the counscious of mankind but also the work of something else, just a speculation really... but what do you guys think?

Well, either you don't consider episode 83 canon and then the Idea of Evil is merely the God of Berserk, about which we know next to nothing, or you take it into account, and then I'll just quote it:

Quote
An ocean of feelings all humans have deep in their souls
A common consciousness that transcends individuality
Their collective consciousness
Its dark side is this swelling ocean
I was born from these swells
As the ego of this world

This world itself is I
The darkness that dwells in every human heart
The Idea of Evil
This is God

Leaves little to the imagination I think.

Offline Guтs

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #257 on: February 07, 2008, 06:47:53 PM »
I believe 83 to be canon, it was removed because Miura thought it revealed too much information too soon, thus making it quite plausible.

Yeah the Beherit thing is true, its more like he created his own beherit but it's safe to assume that Beherits are all connected to Idea itself. Agreed on the fact that nothing has been hinted to the fact that Ganishka's Daka creating machine has even anything related to Idea, but the fact that it looks anything like Idea can be speculated about, I think we can agree that Miura usually doesn't make coincidences just so something looks cool though. We have no information really on this Ganishka machine besides the way it works, but how it was created... we know its magically infused with those Kushan wizards but how can wizardry create something as powerful as a Beherit (considered to be the most powerful object in Berserk existance, a lesser power shouldn't be able to create something like Beherit). Besides the end of episode 292 looks somewhat like Idea (the form, obviously it could be anything but it comes from deep into the spirit realm, so has he made contact with Idea or?) I know about how Idea was created and what was said, but maybe theres more to it. If all humans were to think about cake, would it create a cake? Bad example, but you get what I mean, souls are a lot deeper then human counsciousness for sure but just our deeper parts of our soul (darkness etc) would create a God? I always thought there was a bit more to the creation of Idea then the collective counscious and souls of humankind. Some sort of outer power that with all this unseen human energy (counscious and soul) could make something like that. I guess you could argue about the Big Bang theory (having nothing to do with Berserk obviously), energy just swelling up and then one day creating what we know as Earth, Stars, Solar Systems, Galaxies etc... so wondering where all the focus of this energy went, how did it get there and create Idea, form itself and was it able to do all this on its own etc... but yeah I'm probably wrong about all this, just throwing ideas out there.

Gotta cut away, clear away, snip away and sever this umbilical residue that's keeping me from killing you..

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #258 on: February 07, 2008, 10:43:37 PM »
I believe 83 to be canon, it was removed because Miura thought it revealed too much information too soon, thus making it quite plausible.

That was over ten years ago though. The finer details may have changed significantly.

Yeah the Beherit thing is true, its more like he created his own beherit but it's safe to assume that Beherits are all connected to Idea itself.

We know beherits come from very deep within the spiritual world, but while it wouldn't be too surprising, nothing proves they're directly connected to the Idea of Evil itself. We actually don't know much about their creation, what we see during the Occultation ceremony is pretty vague (Griffith's tears making ripples that send beherits up).

the fact it looks anything like Idea can be speculated about, I think we can agree that Miura usually doesn't make coincidences just so something looks cool though.

I don't know, it depends I think. And it's more like some parts of that thing look like some parts of the Idea of Evil. If you look at both entities in their entirety, they're not alike at all (and the orifices aren't situated similarly either).

We have no information really on this Ganishka machine besides the way it works, but how it was created... we know its magically infused with those Kushan wizards but how can wizardry create something as powerful as a Beherit

What are you talking about? It was obviously created by capturing and stitching many apostles together. It can be clearly seen when you look at it. They are the link to the astral world. The Kushan casters we see aren't powering it, they're more probably just maintaining it active by relaying Ganishka's power to it, or exerting some sort of control on it to keep it stable. It doesn't seem to be very different from the way they control familiars.

Besides the end of episode 292 looks somewhat like Idea

I don't think it really looks like it to be honest. I can see why you're reminded of the Idea of Evil, but when looking closely it just doesn't match.

If all humans were to think about cake, would it create a cake? Bad example, but you get what I mean, souls are a lot deeper then human counsciousness for sure but just our deeper parts of our soul (darkness etc) would create a God? I always thought there was a bit more to the creation of Idea then the collective counscious and souls of humankind.

Well, I get your example but I don't think it's very pertinent, nor makes for a good point. You're free to believe what you want though, even if that goes against what the Idea of Evil said about Its own creation.

Offline Guтs

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #259 on: February 08, 2008, 01:26:06 AM »
Yeah I agree that its a FAR stretch and goes against what Idea has said in the first place but like you said it was ten years ago and the finer details might change significantly... and technically that Lost Episode shouldnt be there... but it could be possible that Idea's design would not change. And I wonder why they would bother to even show those tentacle things if... they were just for cosmetic purposes.

I know what you mean by Idea not looking like the Daka Creator, but we have only seen those types of "tentacles" in two areas. One which is Idea and the other being Ganishka's Daka machine. When both were "reincarnating"/"demonizing" (just to use those terms) they were both spewing out "air" like that, which is a similarity nonethless. I agree that the overall design of both do not look anything alike. I just have a hard time of letting it go as just a mere coincidence.

Ganishka might be usurping power from Idea itself to attain a more powerful form. He might not be getting God's power but more like stealing it. Again just speculation with what I've noticed and other people said. I don't know really, I think its an interesting possibility, but if I was to go with everything that was said and take word for word what episode 83 said, I agree that this wouldn't be plausible at all. But like you said, things might have changed and some details altered. Just can't wait to see what happens in Episode 293  :guts:

Edit: Correction, theres one other character that has a similar outting as the Daka Creator and Idea of Evil. Rosine, in her last transformation she had some of those on her sides and her propulsor was also in the shape of this. Although this is in a very different situation, it might just be a coincidence... but who knows, she could create her own minions too.

Heres a picture to show you what I mean.



All in all I'm probably just thinking too much about those tentacles... but its still fun to think of it as a possibility.

EDIT 2:

I was just taking a shower and thought of something... probably too extreme and unprobable but I'll still share it since it does make some sort of sense, nonetheless it's Berserk related and this topic has been suffering from "I want next episode to come out" crap. If Ganishka is indeed stealing power from the Idea with his man-made beherit (which could be just like an ordinary Beherit or similar to a Crimson Beherit (God Hand Beherit) to try and acquire some of those God Hand powers for himself. TO some extent it could make sense, we don't know the limits of his Daka Creator, we know he needs power strong enough to rival a God Hand (I doubt he'd be doing this if he knew he didnt stand a chance). What I'm speculating is that Ganishka is making a "fake" God Hand Ceremony to become somewhat of a Demi-God Hand or Fake but still with great powers enough to rival Griffith. All this might seem a bit far fetched... but the children's prophecy said something about a giant black shadow will block out the sun over the entire city. This could be a reference to the "Hand" that spawns from the earth to reincarnate a human into a God Hand. Although the shape of the shadow we do see betrays this theory somewhat, I think its interesting nonetheless. If this was to happen, the Law of there being only 5 God Hands normally might have some sort of side-effect causing the normality to be disturbed weakening the powers of the God Hand members... giving Guts a standing chance. Wow, sorry this is really really far fetched, but I find it somewhat interesting nonetheless. This might be what hurts the God Hands/Griffith enough for Guts to even be able to fight him.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2008, 02:34:20 AM by Guтs »

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Online Griffith

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #260 on: February 08, 2008, 03:12:26 AM »
This might be what hurts the God Hands/Griffith enough for Guts to even be able to fight him.



THIS might be what hurts the God Hands/Griffith enough for Guts to even be able to fight him. :guts:

(the sword, not the encyclopedia =)

Offline Okin

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #261 on: February 08, 2008, 04:06:46 AM »
Man you're getting lost in your own thoughts. With how much of a rant you're going on just write a fan-fiction on what you think is happening.

All I can say on the subject is:

If an apostle is linked to deeper layers of the astral world than a human is normally,

Then Ganishka's new greater form may be linked to deeper layers of the astral world than an apostle. :schierke:

It's so baseless I can't even make a good conditional statement.

The example of Rochine's apostle form only proves to me that Miura draws all organic orifices that jets of gas exit from that way. Anything else that performed the same function wouldn't look like a natural part of an apostle's body.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #262 on: February 08, 2008, 12:28:05 PM »
it could be possible that Idea's design would not change.

If you're talking about the Idea of Evil's appearance, then it definitely hasn't changed. It's still in the manga, at the end of episode 82.

And I wonder why they would bother to even show those tentacle things if... they were just for cosmetic purposes.

They're not really tentacles. And actually, save for the specific panels you posted, the orifices don't look completely similar. In the Idea of Evil's case, they're meant to be like truncated arteries, while in the case of Ganishka's device they're longer appendages situated at the base that might have once been part of an apostle's body. It also seems that they were used to expulse Daka newborns under "normal" circumstances. Also, when the Daka-maker started pumping the deadly fog in and out, all orifices contributed to it, not only those you pointed out but also the various mouths covering the thing as well as the hole at the top.

I know what you mean by Idea not looking like the Daka Creator, but we have only seen those types of "tentacles" in two areas. One which is Idea and the other being Ganishka's Daka machine. When both were "reincarnating"/"demonizing" (just to use those terms) they were both spewing out "air" like that

Well, you disproved what you're saying here yourself later in your post. It's also not air they're expulsing/taking in: for the Idea of Evil it's that "ocean of feelings" it talks about and in which it floats, and for the Daka-maker it's the deadly fog (in what is, let's not forget it, a very specific situation). Furthermore, the Idea of Evil probably does that all the time, like a heart pumping blood, so I don't think it's related to a transmutation process in particular. As for the Daka-maker, see what I just said about its various orifices and their different uses.

Edit: Correction, theres one other character that has a similar outting as the Daka Creator and Idea of Evil. Rosine, in her last transformation she had some of those on her sides and her propulsor was also in the shape of this. Although this is in a very different situation, it might just be a coincidence... but who knows, she could create her own minions too.

Uhh yeah, and so could the Snail Count, and the Beherit Apostle could transform people by stinging them. Are you comparing the creation of pseudo-apostles to the the work of the Idea of Evil in order to justify this superficial, aesthetic similarity? Because it doesn't make sense, and it can't work. Besides, Rosine's appendages are again not completely similar to what we're comparing them to, and in her case they're specifically used to help propel her in the air. I find myself agreeing with Okin in this case: all this shows is that it's likely the resemblance is coincidental, no matter how interesting it may seem.

If Ganishka is indeed stealing power from the Idea with his man-made beherit (which could be just like an ordinary Beherit or similar to a Crimson Beherit (God Hand Beherit) to try and acquire some of those God Hand powers for himself. TO some extent it could make sense, we don't know the limits of his Daka Creator, we know he needs power strong enough to rival a God Hand (I doubt he'd be doing this if he knew he didnt stand a chance).

Ganishka doesn't know what the result is going to be like. That's why this is an extreme and desperate move. He's not doing this because he knows for sure it'll give him the edge over Griffith, he's doing this because he knows that nothing else will work. There's one thing we do know for sure though: that in the end, Ganishka will lose. As for acquiring the powers of a member of the God Hand, even putting aside many of the problems that would raise, there's still the fact that they can't materialize themselves in the corporeal world without underdoing a very complex and rare process, like Griffith did. What you're suggesting would mean that the Occultation and Incarnation ceremonies were complete wastes of time and resources. That seems rather unlikely to me.

What I'm speculating is that Ganishka is making a "fake" God Hand Ceremony to become somewhat of a Demi-God Hand or Fake but still with great powers enough to rival Griffith.

See above. If doing it in such a half-assed way works as well, then why does the God Hand even bother with their constraining rituals?

All this might seem a bit far fetched... but the children's prophecy said something about a giant black shadow will block out the sun over the entire city. This could be a reference to the "Hand" that spawns from the earth to reincarnate a human into a God Hand. Although the shape of the shadow we do see betrays this theory somewhat, I think its interesting nonetheless.

The children's prophecy that was delivered to them by Griffith. Honestly, I don't think a hand is going to appear. In fact I'm quite sure it won't happen. It seems obvious to me, considering the illustration, that it's referring to what Ganishka will become. A shape resembling a multi-armed creature.

If this was to happen, the Law of there being only 5 God Hands normally might have some sort of side-effect causing the normality to be disturbed weakening the powers of the God Hand members... giving Guts a standing chance. Wow, sorry this is really really far fetched, but I find it somewhat interesting nonetheless. This might be what hurts the God Hands/Griffith enough for Guts to even be able to fight him.

Yeah, like you said this is rather implausible... And it's not so much that there's a "law" about there only being five members of the God Hand, but rather that when Femto was born they just (logically) said the hand was complete and that was it.

Offline Guтs

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #263 on: February 08, 2008, 09:08:05 PM »
I know my theory is wrong, but I was shooting it out there, mainly because for the last 50 posts it was whining and bitching about when the next episode was out. I mentioned it was interesting, and shot out a theory with it, but like I also said, I hardly believe any of what I said and its plausibility, only just starting a conversation that would space us away from the long ass wait and constant nagging of when the next episode is coming out.

Although, I'll thank you Aazealh for actually answering it without flaming and disrespecting, as many others would do. Had that nicely constructed, answered all possible questions I had about the theory, even if it was wrong, it was nice to read what you had to say about it.

@GnM, yeah obviously the Dragon Slayer will have to do the work... but at his present state (Guts)... he wouldn't even be able to get even somewhat close to any of them, he could barely do anything versus Ganishka and needed Zodd's assistance to do any sort of damage. Griffith merely walked in and kicked his ass, so to speak. So Guts has one long way before I can even see him able to reach them with his sword. Hence, something needs to happen to the God Hand to either be weakened or Guts gets another "upgrade", make that a few.

Honestly though, what kind of "gear" or spiritual enlightment or w/e will happen to Guts will he need to be able to fight the God Hand? Berserker Armor.. is making him really weak outside of Battle (worse and worse as each one goes by) so I can't see him having too many more intense battles like the one versus Ganishka. He might get somewhat healed in Elfhelm but who knows. Just wanna know what you think will make this large difference in power, narrow down to a winning chance for Guts?

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Offline CnC

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #264 on: February 08, 2008, 09:16:05 PM »
I know my theory is wrong, but I was shooting it out there, mainly because for the last 50 posts it was whining and bitching about when the next episode was out.

I don't see how knowingly piling on b.s would be considered much better.  :schierke:
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Offline Okin

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #265 on: February 08, 2008, 09:42:47 PM »
I don't see how knowingly piling on b.s would be considered much better.  :schierke:

That's exactly why I wanted him to post it as a what if, not a theory.

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Offline Baldulf

Re: Episode 292
« Reply #266 on: February 08, 2008, 10:41:46 PM »
On the other hand, no monetary considerations of any kind are likely to be able to force the author to change his work schedule. He doesn't work because he needs money to live.

Doesn't he? (I don't know,that's because I'm asking)

In fact,apart from his works and some random interviews, I don't know anything about the life of the author.

« Last Edit: February 09, 2008, 01:44:02 AM by Baldulf »
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Offline kimedog

Re: Episode 292
« Reply #267 on: February 09, 2008, 12:40:27 AM »
http://www.skullknight.net/encyclopedia/images/DSbanner2.jpg

THIS might be what hurts the God Hands/Griffith enough for Guts to even be able to fight him. :guts:

(the sword, not the encyclopedia =)

I don't know.  An encyclopedia can sure hurt if its thick enough, or if Griffith suddenly became illiterate, it could hurt him from not knowing how to read!
I don't suffer from insanity....

I ENJOY EVERY MINUTE OF IT!!!

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #268 on: February 09, 2008, 12:16:17 PM »
Although, I'll thank you Aazealh for actually answering it without flaming and disrespecting, as many others would do. Had that nicely constructed, answered all possible questions I had about the theory, even if it was wrong, it was nice to read what you had to say about it.

You're welcome, I'm glad you appreciate my responses.

yeah obviously the Dragon Slayer will have to do the work... but at his present state (Guts)... he wouldn't even be able to get even somewhat close to any of them, he could barely do anything versus Ganishka and needed Zodd's assistance to do any sort of damage.

Well, keep in mind it's a matter of context. Maybe if Griffith was hit by the Dragon Slayer right now it would harm him and even be able to kill him. And the worlds are already merging together, so it could be only a matter of time before the others are within Guts' reach. Not to mention that he might not kill them all one by one himself.

Doesn't he? (I don't know,that's because I'm asking)

He's been rich for a long time already, and he's spent most of his adult life working continuously.

Offline Ramen4ever

Re: Episode 292
« Reply #269 on: February 09, 2008, 04:54:20 PM »
I'm looking forward to the next episode. Though unlikely, any contact (or even a lack of contact.) between Ganishka and the pumping stuffed red turkey :idea: would be truly interesting. If he gets power from the Idea of Evil, that opens a whole new door on the relationship between the dark forces. If he gets diddly-squat apart from what his "device" will give him, well that would be interesting as well.
As for what I think will happen, well as much as I would love to see any interaction with the Idea of Evil, I don't think this will be the moment it comes out of retirement.

In other words, I think we're gonna get a episode of troops gathering outside the city, a few interesting words from Ganishka.. something about how he feels that his power IS OVER 9000!!!. and maybe a hint or more about how Griffith plans to fight him without exposing "himself"
to the human troops. *Cough Pontiff Cough*
If we do end up getting a deep philosophical episode giving us a tad more insight into the world of Berserk I would be pleasantly surprised.

Offline Walter

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #270 on: February 09, 2008, 05:20:22 PM »
and maybe a hint or more about how Griffith plans to fight him without exposing "himself"
to the human troops. *Cough Pontiff Cough*
Even if Griff transformed into another apostle penis-monster, at this point the Pontiff is so taken with him he'd praise it as GOD itself.
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Oburi

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #271 on: February 09, 2008, 05:32:44 PM »
Even if Griff transformed into another apostle penis-monster, at this point the Pontiff is so taken with him he'd praise it as GOD itself.

and so would I...

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #272 on: February 10, 2008, 01:12:34 AM »
BTW, Berserk will be in the next issue of YA (February 22). Miura apologized for the wait and said the story would resume in Wyndham castle.

Offline CnC

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #273 on: February 10, 2008, 01:24:43 AM »
BTW, Berserk will be in the next issue of YA (February 22). Miura apologized for the wait and said the story would resume in Wyndham castle.

AWESOME!
I'm sick of following my dreams.  I'm just going to ask where they're going and hook up with 'em later...
- R.I.P Mitch Hedberg
CnColors!

Offline Walter

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Re: Episode 292
« Reply #274 on: February 10, 2008, 01:25:18 AM »
BTW, Berserk will be in the next issue of YA (February 22). Miura apologized for the wait and said the story would resume in Wyndham castle.
Excellent news AND insight into what the episode will be about. Miura always pulls through.

PS: If someone else asks when 293 is coming out, it's INSTA-BAN.
:femto: :slan: :ubik: