Author Topic: What I don't understand about Guts  (Read 5913 times)

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Duststorm

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What I don't understand about Guts
« on: December 06, 2007, 09:29:28 PM »
First of all please go easy on me I only read berserk once so I may have missed things.

Why doesn't Guts blame Gambino for his death and all the abuse he had as a kid? He seems to blame and hate himself for it. With Griffith he blames him for everything and hates him so why doesn't he feel the same about Gambino? Also why does Guts view himself as a monster? For example like the time he killed Julius' son he later has a dream that he was a monster like figure killing his child self. Also the with :beast: as another manifestation of his view on himself after he killed all the demon kids.

Offline vlad

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2007, 10:04:46 PM »
I'll try and shed some light on the subject if I may. First off the Gambino dynamic, well he's Guts' father figure, someone whose respect and approval is the most important, though scarcely received. Gambino most often made Guts feel not worthy, offering only a rare kind word or gesture (the ointment for the nose wound eg.). He blamed him for what happened to Shihsu (lover/wife) and generally viewed him as a burden a bad omen even. Still a rotten father was the only kind Guts had so he still looked up to him, thusly the patricide hit him hard and he reacted in a typically childlike manner, that is to think that he is to blame (this is often a case with abused children in real life, even children whose parents get divorced at a young age). With Griffith the story is different in that he is more grown, so he can place the blame at the right doorstep.
As far as seeing himself as a monster goes it is specifically provoked by killing Adonis since he sees a lot of himself in the kid, an unkind and strict father and so on, hence the dream you mentioned it only further amplifies his sentiment.
The last part of your post is a bit unclear to me though, I understand that you think the Beast to be Guts' view of himself right? Well IMHO that is not accurate, the Beast is more a manifestation of all of his negative emotions and the darkness in him, not what he thinks/sees of himself but acctually a part of him. It's almost a separate entity, one brought about by extreme trauma etc.
Hope this long winded post makes sense and helps a bit.

Duststorm

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Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2007, 07:01:34 PM »
       Thanks vlad, for the effort of explaining it to me. But about the beast of darkness is it the berserk part of Guts?

Online Walter

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Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2007, 07:12:44 PM »
I guess one could call it Guts' BERSERK PART, since functionally that's what the Beast acts as when it manifests itself. But to be more precise, the Beast is a psychological manifestation of all the violent, repressed feelings developed over the course of Guts' travels. I like to think of it as a crutch Guts' relies on in his most desperate moments a side of him he's now trying to shed.

I'm sure I'll catch flak for trying to oversimplify what the Beast is, but I just prefer to be brief in these types of descriptions so it's more clear. There's certainly more to be discussed about the creation/nature of the Beast.
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Offline Ironhand

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2008, 07:52:26 AM »
Good post Vlad. I was going to say something similar. :ganishka:

 :beast: Who cares about the beast so long as it makes Guts kick ass? At least that's enough for me.

Offline Skorne

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2008, 01:28:10 PM »
Good post Vlad. I was going to say something similar. :ganishka:

 :beast: Who cares about the beast so long as it makes Guts kick ass? At least that's enough for me.

The question should be what are the long term complications that are going to come with the beast.  That's what i would like to know.  Even if he does kick ass when berserk how will that affect his surroundings down the line. 
« Last Edit: January 05, 2008, 02:50:11 PM by Skorne »

Offline Ironhand

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2008, 12:11:24 AM »
You're right, I am concerned about that as well and hopefully it will work out better than the previous owner. I am just starting reading 30 and hopefully Guts will heal since he really looks horribly emaciated. If he keeps this up too much he won't need to bleed to death for the armour to finish him.

Offline slayer81

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Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2008, 12:31:47 AM »
The question should be what are the long term complications that are going to come with the beast.  That's what i would like to know.  Even if he does kick ass when berserk how will that affect his surroundings down the line. 
Precisely! I've not yet made it as far as the Berserk Armor/Beast dilemma, but from what I have gathered, neither of them are good news (Considering both should come slapped with a Surgeon General's Warning  :guts:) and it is unsettling to think what could happen to our ever-so-brave hero! Alls I've got to say is, somebody had better be ready to pull a hat trick

Online Walter

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Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2008, 01:16:02 AM »
Precisely! I've not yet made it as far as the Berserk Armor/Beast dilemma, but from what I have gathered, neither of them are good news (Considering both should come slapped with a Surgeon General's Warning  :guts:) and it is unsettling to think what could happen to our ever-so-brave hero! Alls I've got to say is, somebody had better be ready to pull a hat trick
Yes, but as you'll see when you get to that point in the series, it's made explicitly clear by his recent encounters that he's no match for the forces he's pitted himself against. He has to somehow up the ante, even if it costs him dearly.
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Offline willowhugger

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2008, 07:56:16 PM »
First of all please go easy on me I only read berserk once so I may have missed things.

Why doesn't Guts blame Gambino for his death and all the abuse he had as a kid? He seems to blame and hate himself for it. With Griffith he blames him for everything and hates him so why doesn't he feel the same about Gambino? Also why does Guts view himself as a monster? For example like the time he killed Julius' son he later has a dream that he was a monster like figure killing his child self. Also the with :beast: as another manifestation of his view on himself after he killed all the demon kids.

Actually, I'd like to make a dissenting opinion.

1. Guts killed[/i] Gambino in the end.  Whatever the case, that chapter of Guts life is over.  The realization his father figure/mentor sold him to the most traumatizing experience of his young life still obviously haunts him, but its rather pointless for Guts to continue hating the man actively when he's dead.  Still, its clearly a terrible wound in his psyche.

2. Well, Guts DID just kill an innocent kid.  The idea he views himself as a monster for it is hardly peculiar.  On a related note, Guts also has severe issues that he killed his father-figure and has killed hundreds of other people.

Offline einherjar

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Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2008, 12:24:15 AM »
The realization his father figure/mentor sold him to the most traumatizing experience of his young life still obviously haunts him . . . Still, its clearly a terrible wound in his psyche.

I don't know about that... If it's still an open wound to him, he doesn't really show it.  When was the last time Guts flipped out over someone touching him? 

Guts also has severe issues that he . . . has killed hundreds of other people.

No, he doesn't.  The people Guts has killed, by and large, were necessities of his life first as a mercenary, and now on the Interstice.  I think Guts recognizes this.

If you're referring to the creation of the Beast of Darkness, however; I see your point.  But...
I guess one could call it Guts' BERSERK PART, since functionally that's what the Beast acts as when it manifests itself. But to be more precise, the Beast is a psychological manifestation of all the violent, repressed feelings developed over the course of Guts' travels . . . a side of him he's now trying to shed.
The Beast is the aspect of Guts' personality that enjoys all the violence and killing.  In the Jungian sense, it's Guts' shadow.  And Jung believed that if one did not come to terms with it, the Shadow would rule him... Which does not bode well for someone trying to repress that shadow, only to draw upon its power in his moment of dire need.

Offline willowhugger

Re: What I don't understand about Guts
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2008, 01:55:43 AM »
1. I don't know about that... If it's still an open wound to him, he doesn't really show it.  When was the last time Guts flipped out over someone touching him?

Berserk Manga Volume 2?

2. No, he doesn't.  The people Guts has killed, by and large, were necessities of his life first as a mercenary, and now on the Interstice.  I think Guts recognizes this.

Yes, which assumes Guts was gleefully enjoying life as a mercenary instead of it being the only thing he knew.