Author Topic: Void discussion  (Read 5870 times)

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Offline Death May Die

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Void discussion
« on: February 26, 2008, 11:28:16 PM »
Void I thought would be a interesting character to discuss. As well as each member of The God Hand.

I know I don't know my solid facts here But Void in particular strikes me as a supreme being, beyond the idea of evil. Which, that probably isn't true. Griffith may very well be that also, but I recall for some reason thinking Void was the leader of the pack. Unless the Skull Knight rates up there with him.

I found it interesting that Void demonstrated just some of the bizarre powers we may see later on with the God Hand. Apart from creating a vortex, I think the power to create a portal to warp matter was very interesting.

I believe it was somewhere in volume 13 where the Skull Knight attempts to strike Void and the SK's blade is warped by a portal/void to strike against the SK himself.

I am aware that there are many pieces of the puzzle to the histories concerning the GH but I somehow recall that Void and SK's past were interlinked. Which just fuels my curiosity towards that. The layering of Berserk is so well laid out, that it enables past generations of the story to surface, even from thousands of years prior.

I also couldn't help but recall in volume 26 when Skull Knight rips open a portal/void with his sword in possibly the same means as Void had. Makes me wonder if "tearing through worlds" can be learned rather than bestowed onto a being. I guess in a way in can be learned because the witch had to rip into another world to summon a higher being for help. Which happened numerous times. But maybe that was just on a spiritual means rather than a physical means. I do recall that the "ego" can physically go so far before it can even exist. That even the ego would become lost in the vastness of the deepest realms/worlds. But does the ego count as "consequence"?

Again, I probably got my facts twisted and turned. But all the same I wouldn't want that to take away from discussing the character of Void.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2008, 10:08:28 AM »
This may be a thread about Void, but it sounds more like you're just rambling. I corrected the spelling and phrasing in your post because it was offensively bad, so in the future I'd like you to make an effort in that regard. Even if you can't get your facts straight, at least try to make it not too displeasant to read. Thanks in advance. And please keep in mind that searching for information in old threads will often quickly clear up a lot of the misunderstandings you have. Now about your questions:

I know I don't know my solid facts here But Void in particular strikes me as a supreme being, beyond the idea of evil. Which, that probably isn't true.

Yeah, it's definitely not true. I don't know where you got that idea.

Griffith may very well be that also, but I recall for some reason thinking Void was the leader of the pack. Unless the Skull Knight rates up there with him.

Void seems to act as some kind of leader for the God Hand, that's true. I don't know what the Skull Knight has to do with it, though. He's not part of the God Hand.

I found it interesting that Void demonstrated just some of the bizarre powers we may see later on with the God Hand. Apart from creating a vortex, I think the power to create a portal to warp matter was very interesting.

What do you mean by "creating a vortex"?

I believe it was somewhere in volume 13 where the Skull Knight attempts to strike Void and the SK's blade is warped by a portal/void to strike against the SK himself.

Yeah, that's in volume 13. Void doesn't create a "void" though, no matter how you look at his space/time manipulation trick. The term "void" can't apply to this situation and just isn't related to anything other than the fact it reminds you of the character's name.

I somehow recall that Void and SK's past were interlinked. Which just fuels my curiosity towards that.

That's unconfirmed.

I also couldn't help but recall in volume 26 when Skull Knight rips open a portal/void with his sword in possibly the same means as Void had.

He slashes through the worlds by using his sword while it is covered in melted beherits. It's completely different from what Void does in volume 13, not only in terms of effects but also of means. And it's still not a void. Also, for your information, he calls this technique the "Yobimizu no Tsurugi", which cannot be properly and conveniently translated into English. A simple and decent equivalent is just to call it the "beherit sword".

Makes me wonder if "tearing through worlds" can be learned rather than bestowed onto a being.

The answer is no. Void has powers because he's a member of the God Hand. SK collected and ingested many beherits over the years in order to develop this special technique that diverts their power.

I guess in a way in can be learned because the witch had to rip into another world to summon a higher being for help. Which happened numerous times. But maybe that was just on a spiritual means rather than a physical means.

Yes, it's spiritual, and it's really not the same thing at all. Witches let their spirit flow into the astral world, but their body stays where it is, in a catatonic state.

I do recall that the "ego" can physically go so far before it can even exist. That even the ego would become lost in the vastness of the deepest realms/worlds.

You're referring to something Flora said, about how magic users can't return once they go too deep in the astral world (in the Vortex and beyond). It refers to their spiritual form, so it's not related to anything physical. The ego, as in the deep self, isn't physical.

But does the ego count as "consequence"?

What?

Offline Death May Die

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2008, 06:04:29 AM »
Okay, I'm trying to do this better.

Quote
What do you mean by "creating a vortex"?

Well, if it didn't go by "vortex" perhaps is was "Abyss" referring to Volume 3 where the Void opens the thing that comes to acquire the count. I was applying this to his abilities.

Quote
I know I don't know my solid facts here But Void in particular strikes me as a supreme being, beyond the idea of evil. Which, that probably isn't true.

"Yeah, it's definitely not true. I don't know where you got that idea."

Here I made a mistake. I was meaning that Void maybe be the most powerful being introduced besides the Idea of Evil. I also applied the SK, because he is the only one I've seen to get close enough to Void or the God Hand for that matter, to attempt physical damage. Because of that I somewhat feel his powers maybe equal to those of the God Hand. Of course there isn't enough info to comfirm that either.

Quote
But does the ego count as "consequence"?

What?

Here, I was meaning "consciences." I spell checked too fast. But yes, I was asking what exactly a "ego" applied to. Does that include awareness of one's self or just the want to "better/advance" one's self. I would like to add, can the consciences proceed the "ego" in the deep layers?
« Last Edit: February 28, 2008, 06:13:59 AM by Death May Die »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2008, 08:57:07 AM »
Okay, I'm trying to do this better.

Cool, it's appreciated. :SK:

Well, if it didn't go by "vortex" perhaps is was "Abyss" referring to Volume 3 where the Void opens the thing that comes to acquire the count. I was applying this to his abilities.

Ah, I see. Well in fact, that's not really one of his abilities. It's indeed the Vortex of Souls that comes to take the Count, but that's just a natural consequence of his death. You see, the Count was dying, and in despair he called to the God Hand. They offered him a second chance, but he didn't take it, so he died and the Vortex came to take him (and tried to get Guts along the way). It's a normal occurrence when apostles die, it also happened to Wyald at the end of volume 11.

Here I made a mistake. I was meaning that Void maybe be the most powerful being introduced besides the Idea of Evil. I also applied the SK, because he is the only one I've seen to get close enough to Void or the God Hand for that matter, to attempt physical damage. Because of that I somewhat feel his powers maybe equal to those of the God Hand. Of course there isn't enough info to comfirm that either.

Ok, that makes more sense. Void is definitely a very powerful being, and so are the other members of the God Hand. However, since they're clouded in mystery, it's hard to know if there are any real differences in terms of power between them, and what they would be. Same for SK, he's quite powerful, knowledgeable and resourceful, but it's hard to precisely evaluate his "power". In fact I'm not sure it'd even be very pertinent, since Guts has fought and defeated creatures that could be considered more "powerful" than him, for example.

Here, I was meaning "consciences." I spell checked too fast. But yes, I was asking what exactly a "ego" applied to. Does that include awareness of one's self or just the want to "better/advance" one's self. I would like to add, can the consciences proceed the "ego" in the deep layers?

When we use the term in Berserk it means the self, of course. The consciousness of your own identity, and not some arrogant feeling of self-importance (that wouldn't make much sense).

Offline Death May Die

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2009, 07:11:09 AM »
I was watching some horror flicks and I came across Hellraiser, and it hit me. That the God Hand all look like they're something straight out of Hellraiser. I know there isn't any direct connection. I just thought it was funny.



http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/474/hellraiser20wall18od.jpg
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:Og_QRubWVvZbaM:http://crypthorror.free.fr/wall/h-i-j-k/h2/hellraiser.jpg

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2009, 07:16:27 AM »
Their general looks were inspired by the Cenobites to some extent. It shows the most in Ubik I think, with the "sunglasses" and all.

Offline slan69

Re: Void discussion
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2009, 09:05:11 AM »
Yeah i saw that to, and i read somewhere that Kentarou Miura likes hellraiser :guts:

Here's some pictures i thought you all might like to see where Kentarou Miura's inspiration came from for the God Hand although not quite sure where he got the inspiration for Slan

http://www.celluloiddreams.co.uk/images/hellraiser.jpg
as you can see cenobite on the far left looks a lot like Conrad and the Cenobite on the far right side looks like Void

http://www.3demonic.com/images/Hellraiser_Butterball.jpg
hahah this one is pretty obvious who it might be Ubik of course  :serpico:
Quote -

Love, hate, pain, pleasure, life, death. Everything is there… This is human... This is demonic!

~Slan~

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2009, 09:14:06 AM »
Yeah i saw that to, and i read somewhere that Kentarou Miura likes hellraiser :guts:

Here's some pictures i thought you all might like to see where Kentarou Miura's inspiration came from for the God Hand although not quite sure where he got the inspiration for Slan

Your pictures aren't showing, and hotlinking isn't recommended anyway. Rehosting pictures is always appreciated. Apart from that, I'm pretty sure everyone knows what the Cenobites look like (and even if they didn't, Death May Die already posted pictures...), and it's not like they were such an inspiration for Miura that every character precisely corresponds to another one anyway. The general look has some resemblance, but if you look in detail there are more differences than similarities.

Offline slan69

Re: Void discussion
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2009, 09:18:43 AM »
Your pictures aren't showing, and hotlinking isn't recommended anyway. Rehosting pictures is always appreciated. Apart from that, I'm pretty sure everyone knows what the Cenobites look like (and even if they didn't, Death May Die already posted pictures...), and it's not like they were such an inspiration for Miura that every character precisely corresponds to another one anyway. The general look has some resemblance, but if you look in detail there are more differences than similarities.
Sorry about that they were working a minute ago.... o well :sad: but don't worry i know that there are many differences in the God Hand characters that Miura made which looks awesome :guts: and i know that they weren't a major inspiration on Miura just wanted people to know :slan:
Quote -

Love, hate, pain, pleasure, life, death. Everything is there… This is human... This is demonic!

~Slan~

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2009, 09:25:51 AM »
Sorry about that they were working a minute ago.... o well :sad:

They're working for you and not for me because you went to the original site, and it must be blocking hotlinking. So the images are still in your cache, but won't appear to others. I changed them to links, that way people can click and see them.

but don't worry i know that there are many differences in the God Hand characters that Miura made which looks awesome :guts: and i know that they weren't a major inspiration on Miura just wanted people to know :slan:

Well I was just explaining to you why you won't find a character that looks just like Slan (or just like any other member of the God Hand for that matter). Miura has said before that the Cenobites' looks influenced him when he created the God Hand, while the idea of creating the GH itself came from the "Seven Magi" that are featured in Guin Saga. However, while it influenced his artistic direction, he still did his own thing (and so his characters are unique).

Offline slan69

Re: Void discussion
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2009, 09:37:33 AM »
They're working for you and not for me because you went to the original site, and it must be blocking hotlinking. So the images are still in your cache, but won't appear to others. I changed them to links, that way people can click and see them.

Well I was just explaining to you why you won't find a character that looks just like Slan (or just like any other member of the God Hand for that matter). Miura has said before that the Cenobites' looks influenced him when he created the God Hand, while the idea of creating the GH itself came from the "Seven Magi" that are featured in Guin Saga. However, while it influenced his artistic direction, he still did his own thing (and so his characters are unique).

what is the Seven Magi from Guin Saga, i would appreciate if you told me :casca:
Quote -

Love, hate, pain, pleasure, life, death. Everything is there… This is human... This is demonic!

~Slan~

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Void discussion
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2009, 09:47:43 AM »
what is the Seven Magi from Guin Saga, i would appreciate if you told me :casca:

Guin Saga is a Japanese novel series by recently deceased author Kaoru Kurimoto. It was Miura's biggest inspiration when he first created Berserk. The seven magi are a group of enemies Guin (the protagonist of Guin Saga) encounters and defeats in the story. Here's an illustration:


Offline slan69

Re: Void discussion
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2009, 09:52:47 AM »
Hmmm I see well its always good to know something about Berserk that you didnt know :guts: Thanks!! :slan:
Quote -

Love, hate, pain, pleasure, life, death. Everything is there… This is human... This is demonic!

~Slan~