Episode 367

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
I also would not mind them trying to add a bit of dialogue themselves.

Bad idea. The more things they add that aren't directly from Miura, the less qualitative the result will be. And I'm repeating myself, but they're probably filling in the gaps quite a bit already. I don't believe the dialogue in the past three episodes was verbatim from Miura.
 
There has to be more dialogue going forward from here though. There will be another arc after this one (who knows, maybe even more than one). We all know how massive Berserks arcs usually are (apart from the black swordsman ofc). How boring would it be if the characters dont talk to each other like they used to or rarely have internal thoughts? Maybe currently they want to focus on the events taking place on Elfhelm and explain later. Like how Zodd got there or Schierke and Farneses reaction to all this. I also hope they didnt forget about Skull Knight (impossible right?).
 
Bad idea. The more things they add that aren't directly from Miura, the less qualitative the result will be. And I'm repeating myself, but they're probably filling in the gaps quite a bit already.
Understandable. I suppose we just need to get used to it. Honestly the character I most worry about is casca, just because we have been waiting to get more of her thoughts and dialogue. It is what it is though.
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
How boring would it be if the characters dont talk to each other like they used to or rarely have internal thoughts?

Well... You're seeing it already. :shrug:
I imagine there will be episodes with more dialog in the future just because there's no other choice, but at this point I'm pretty sure it's going to be as minimal as can be.

Maybe currently they want to focus on the events taking place on Elfhelm and explain later. Like how Zodd got there or Schierke and Farneses reaction to all this.

We'll see but I wouldn't hold my breath.
 
Bad idea. The more things they add that aren't directly from Miura, the less qualitative the result will be. And I'm repeating myself, but they're probably filling in the gaps quite a bit already. I don't believe the dialogue in the past three episodes was verbatim from Miura.

But we are left in a world where episodes 365 onwards look like this:


I believe with the path they have chosen in adapting it as a manga, they should try to make it a decent one.
 
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Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
But we are left in a world where the episode 366 onwards look like this:

Going with this analogy, what needs to be considered is that you may not like the music they would play.

I believe with the path they have chosen in adapting it as a manga, they should try to make it a decent one.

I've no doubt they're already trying to make it as good as they possibly can.
 
I've no doubt they're already trying to make it as good as they possibly can.
You're right, poor choice of wording. I meant they should use all the tools available to them in telling the story.

Moving away from this (sorry for shifting the focus a bit), I did enjoy Griffith using the wind to strip the cherry blossom tree and specifically the two smaller panels depicting the blossoms being blown as you would see in a natural real life way, almost calm, which i thought contrasted the moment nicely.

Also on the second panel of the third page, I found that Zodd being able to land a hit because of Gut's diminished senses was a nice way to depict that specific weakness he now carries, although at first I thought the hatching on Zodd's paw was meant to depict movement.
 
Oh jeeesus here we go again. Will Casca be taken to Falconia? If so I dont think she would be kept as a prisoner. If Griffith have to keep her alive I can see she might be allowed to roam "free". She might also feel she has to stay due to her child. That could give us a closer look inside of Falconia while still getting Casca back. If Miura intended her to be kidnapped I hope they do it more nuanced than a prison cell. Sure Guts and Co would have strong motivation go to Falconia asap but its just another save Casca mission. I am excited to see where it goes next even though there are obvious problems. The art was pretty good except for a few panels.
 
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After reading 367, I'm kind of amazed that they let something like Farnese and Schierke's disappearing act happen. I mean, I could understand some internal dialogue from them to the effect of, "I know this man is evil, but I am in awe and I can't move", but to have them vanish from panel to the next is just bizarre. I was thinking maybe Griffith's wind attack pushed them away but they're not even in that panel, and Griffith is already holding Casca by then, so just... whatever.

Looking back, Zodd showing up through the World Tree branches is also a weird decision. At first, I didn't even notice that that is what happened; I figured Zodd just flew to Skellig (he can fly and time flows differently on Skellig, so he had time to fly there; even with the "those with evil intent can't get here" concept in play, Griffith manifesting could have negated whatever defenses allowing an already nearby Zodd to fly in; but nope, World Tree, I guess, contradicting Sonia's previous statement (though maybe Zodd could use his Griffith-sense or whatever he has to navigate the branches)). Of course, that World Tree traversal seems to have taken its toll on Zodd, as he now looks like a weird homage to King Caesar from Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla.

As for Casca going to Falconia: I would be curious to see how they explain someone that's branded existing in a city full of Apostles and ruled by one of the God Hand. I would assume she would bleed to death from the brand in there, but I guess Griffith could do something to negate the effect of the brand... which is a very weird statement to type...
 

Griffith

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
I'll just expand on what I said in the chat, that the leaks and everyone's reactions, including my own, managed to lower my expectations so much I wasn't disappointed again! There was indeed more dialogue than alleged, and an interesting, dare I say, Miura-esque, twist at the end! Plus, I'm still not comparing this to the idealized version of Miura's Berserk that should have been; this reanimated corpse of our beloved that we can't let go of is all we're going to get in this Faustian bargain, so kiss her dessicated lips fully!

Kidding aside, I think I get the continued variance in expectations and response now even though we're largely all seeing the same things. I'm coming at this with zero expectations and therefore low standards for such a project, it's basically an idea that's never worked, so if the result actually rates like a five out of ten, I'm pleasantly surprised! Whereas if you had very high standards for such a project to even be considered in the first place, and were expecting at least a seven or eight, you're naturally going to be disappointed. It's the expectations game, and we're all just coming at it from different starting positions. We'll adjust accordingly in the middle as it continues... or quit. =)

Anyway, the fissure in the ground so Griff's version of Ganishka monsters, the vortex, or more God Hand could come out is what made it for me. If Griffith had just grabbed Casca and jumped in his Zodd flying machine like Bowser in SMW, I'd be feeling pretty nonplussed about it, but like @TheWillOfT has been saying, I can see how the big picture points work and can imagine Miura doing them... just way better is all.

After reading 367, I'm kind of amazed that they let something like Farnese and Schierke's disappearing act happen. I mean, I could understand some internal dialogue from them to the effect of, "I know this man is evil, but I am in awe and I can't move", but to have them vanish from panel to the next is just bizarre. I was thinking maybe Griffith's wind attack pushed them away but they're not even in that panel, and Griffith is already holding Casca by then, so just... whatever.

After viewing the episode more closely, I did notice they were also in a WIDE shot standing a few feet back, tiny as can be, from Griffith and Casca, and, while it's still weird we don't see the moment they're sort of shuffled aside, reading it with that context makes it seem like they just didn't appear in the proceeding shots with Guts for "stylistic reasons" (like, their presence was already inconvenient and it was easier not to keep drawing them too anyway =).
 

DANGERDOOOOM

Rest In Peace, Kentaro Miura. We will miss you.
It looks great! Great job on the teams part. I thought this looked better than the last two we got.

Still no sign of Skull Knight??? And it looks like Femto is going to kidnap Casca???:isidro: What a turn of events!

Also looks like something is forming under Femto's feet on the last panel. Looks like some astral forms with eyeballs :magni:
 
Kidding aside, I think I get the continued variance in expectations and response now even though we're largely all seeing the same things. I'm coming at this with zero expectations and therefore low standards for such a project, it's basically an idea that's never worked, so if the result actually rates like a five out of ten, I'm pleasantly surprised! Whereas if you had very high standards for such a project to even be considered in the first place, and were expecting at least a seven or eight, you're naturally going to be disappointed. It's the expectations game, and we're all just coming at it from different starting positions. We'll adjust accordingly in the middle as it continues... or quit. =)
Haha weirdly I only have nice things to say about these episodes when I talk about them IRL. But when I get to discussing them seriously, I can't help falling down the big Miura shaped vacuum in this Berserk. The great thing about this though, is that they have stated many times they are very self-aware that this is their position, so my criticisms are adressed by that alone.
 
The fissures sort of look triangular...probably just coincidence but made me wonder if it's supposed to be brand shaped, and then could it be related to the brand in Skullknight's blood memory. I think that was the first time we saw a brand laid out on actual terrain. Given his loved one was buried on this island, yet also died in his arms as he witnessed that brand, maybe that took place here?
 
Well, the two pages with Dannan, Isma, and Isidro were a pleasant surprise. Dialogue! People saying words!

The rest was about as eh as before. Zodd's... here. Guts just kind of shuffles around him to keep failing to hit Griffith. How did Zodd get here? Will it ever be explained? Who knows? And Poor Farnese and Schierke. Even one shot of their eyes as Griffith approached would have been something, but they just blip from holding Casca to standing a little ways away after Guts swings. Also, did they and Guts fall into the chasm that formed? It's a bit unclear.

Overall I'd say this was actually an improvement over the last two, as at least the flow of events felt more natural, if truncated. Mori is staying very true to his word about not adding things he doesn't know, so I guess this is about what we should expect from here on. I won't say much about Casca getting kidnapped yet, since I have to imagine SK will do something before Griffith leaves, so maybe things won't play out that way? We'll see.
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
The fissures sort of look triangular...probably just coincidence but made me wonder if it's supposed to be brand shaped, and then could it be related to the brand in Skullknight's blood memory. I think that was the first time we saw a brand laid out on actual terrain. Given his loved one was buried on this island, yet also died in his arms as he witnessed that brand, maybe that took place here?

Doesn't seem intended to represent the brand to me. As for the location of Gaiseric's death, it's assumed to be his capital city (where Falconia currently sits). Note that we did see the brand displayed similarly on the refugee camp at the end of the Condemnation arc. Fitting for a "once in a thousand years" event.
 
I think what I'm missing the most is Guts. You can't help but compare this to the hill of swords, and there seeing Griffith near Casca was enough to send him into a panic. Here I can't quite tell if he's rushing at Griffith because Griffith is approaching her or if it's because Guts wants to just keep attacking Griffith because "GRRRIIIIIIFFFFIIIITHHHH FSSRGBIHDSADCCHU".

If I had to make a prediction, next episode will have Guts leap back out of the chasm with the armor already on, continuing the trend of few inner thoughts from him.
 

Rhombaad

Video Game Time Traveler
I read the episode the minute it came out. I wish I'd avoided some of the leaks and spoilers in this thread before reading it. Next time, I'm not even going to check the current episode thread until the episode is out. Well...I'll try my best, anyway. :void:

I liked this episode more than the last two. I thought it was easier to follow, and I continue to enjoy Studio Gaga's art. I can't believe these guys were just doing backgrounds, coloring in black spaces, etc. before this. They're really giving it their all.

I'm fine with stuff missing if Mori wasn't told about it. For example, I could see Miura describing what happens with Zodd in this episode, but not stating outright that Sonia was there, or that Griffith somehow led him to the island. Mori could always infer that Sonia or Griffith led him there somehow, but I'd prefer he not do that. I'd really like a page or two at the end of every future Berserk volume with an explanation of their choices, what they had to guess at, etc. from Mori and Studio Gaga. I think knowing their thought process would really help in wrapping my head around some of their decisions.

That being said, I think what we've gotten so far aligns with that we were told at the beginning. Mori was only going to write what Miura told him. If he couldn't remember something, or if Miura didn't mention something to him, he wasn't going to show it. He also said it wasn't going to be perfect, because the genius that was Miura wasn't writing or drawing it anymore. So far, I'm satisfied with what they've delivered, based on Mori and YA's mission statements. I just really, really hope that they change the name of the series when it hits the volumes. A small subtitle would be the least they could do. We'll see, but I don't have much hope for that.

As for the content of the episode, I wasn't expecting the attempted kidnapping of Casca at all, or the breaking-up of Skellig. I wonder if the specters are leftover from the men who died on the island during the previously mentioned invasion. (They want their armor back! :ganishka:) I don't expect the kidnapping to go off without a hitch, because I think it would lead to a very boring result. It makes much more sense for Casca to be with the group. It would only work if she offered some new perspective on Falconia, but I really don't want it to go that way. We'll just have to wait and see.
 

Flying Shadow

Shadow Owes its Birth to Light
My first impression
- there is a clear contrast in the way of drawing.. There were drawings was amazing, and other looked a weird.. Overall, it was a very good episode.
- Griffith seems to have planned well to turn Elfhelm into chaos only by using his evil power without the need for his armies or followers.. I think it's a great idea and shows how powerful Griffith is.
- Casca was kidnapped by Griffith.. This is a pivotal moment in the future of the story.. So far, I find that exciting.. But the attempt to kidnap her may fail.. We will see how it goes.
- It's vague and totally unclear what happened to Farnese and Schierke..?! Did they even try to protect Casca? It's a negative thing in this episode.
- Gatsu mission to get Griffith now seems more complicated and more dramatic.. It hurts me so hard to see him unable to do anything but go through a zodd and wave his sword to no avail.. He's helpless, and what happened in the end of this episode is a continuation of his suffering.
- I was expecting Danan to be with Skull Knight and her appearance in the events to be more prestige and powerful to help Gatsu.
- I expect a surprise appearance for skull knight as usual, He's just waiting for the perfect moment.
- it seems that events are moving on an unexpected path.. I'm looking forward to the next episode.
 
You can really tell this is the bare bones story points now. Zodd shows up literally not a single word exchanged between him and Guts, it's as if Zodd is just a generic no name apostle that is just lunging at Guts undeserving of any characterization, Guts's internal thoughts are extremely basic, almost not even needed.It's clear Mori doesn't know these characters like Miura that's a given and has no idea how they should react to certain events. you can feel the missing pieces and it's so frustrating. I'm not hating but it's really upsetting for me, but I'm still glad this continuation is happening. First of all I really hope Casca doesn't get kidnapped, but with this much emphasis on Griffith holding her she probably will be, I was thinking that he's just trying to do something with her in this moment not wisk her away. So the spectral entities manifesting from below could be linked to that, it could be a number of things, but I'm guessing it's the wicker men the captured enemy soldiers having been removed from the prison they were in, they live beneath the ravine in elfhelm and they are coming up from the ground so it's the first thing that came to mind, Griffith's overwhelming dark force might be influencing them in some way. I have this feeling Conrad is going to appear too and just decay everything. If Griffith can fully control the boy by having Casca he could posses even more power, and be capable of things we've never thought of.

Also if Casca does get kidnapped I'm picturing her in falconia during the coronation all dressed up with Griffith, her memories are very hazy right now, so it's possible she could be swayed by Griffith.
I really don't want another tower of conviction but this time it's falconia, and another ceremony is taking place etc.

Leaked coronation scene with Casca and Griffith in falconia!!!????

 
if casca does get kidnapped, i do believe Griffith will try to sway her like he tried with Rickert, what does happen when a person branded for sacrifice continues to love the person? the same way guts extreme hate and struggle makes him even more of a powerful sacrifice, maybe griffith will try and use Casca for something more, if miura were still alive we would get some nice internal toughts and dynamics between the two, but now i don't know,

but in any case i don't know where Miura were going wigh Casca, its clear that both of them need some time parted to fully heal

anyway just missing rickert and his heavy pimp hand to do some real damage to griffith
 

Aazealh

Administrator
Staff member
You can really tell this is the bare bones story points now. Zodd shows up literally not a single word exchanged between him and Guts, it's as if Zodd is just a generic no name apostle that is just lunging at Guts undeserving of any characterization

It goes further than that: Zodd serves no real purpose here. Nothing would change if he wasn't there.

Guts's internal thoughts are extremely basic, almost not even needed.

That's pretty much the point, I think. They won't have him think anything of note because they don't know what Miura intended, so it's just throwaway lines, in this case: "one after the other!". Same thing with not having Farnese and Schierke say, think or do anything, but then having a bubble where they scream "kyaaa!" as they fall down. It's useless, and maybe because it's useless they felt comfortable including it. The problem with that is it underlines what's missing even more. In that case just having nothing would be preferable.

So the spectral entities manifesting from below could be linked to that, it could be a number of things, but I'm guessing it's the wicker men the captured enemy soldiers having been removed from the prison they were in, they live beneath the ravine in elfhelm and they are coming up from the ground so it's the first thing that came to mind, Griffith's overwhelming dark force might be influencing them in some way.

I really don't think it's the Wicker Men. They were inactive and the Volvaba is the one who watches over them, plus I don't really see how they would literally tear up the ground and produce that black ooze. It's got to be something more serious than that.

If Griffith can fully control the boy by having Casca he could posses even more power, and be capable of things we've never thought of.

I think it would mainly prevent the boy from leaving the city to go on adventures with his parents. It's a way to mitigate the risk associated with that transformation, not to gain more power. Plus let's be honest, given what just happened, Griffith doesn't look like he needs any more power. He's nigh invulnerable.

if casca does get kidnapped, i do believe Griffith will try to sway her like he tried with Rickert, what does happen when a person branded for sacrifice continues to love the person? the same way guts extreme hate and struggle makes him even more of a powerful sacrifice, maybe griffith will try and use Casca for something more

Not to burst your bubble but he's the source of her trauma and she just had an attack when she came out, plus simply being in his presence causes her terrible pain. Would be hard to "sway" her short of a full brainwashing given all of that. Putting that aside, Guts isn't a "more powerful sacrifice", that's not how it works. The sacrifice was complete when they were all branded. The fact Guts and Casca survived for so long afterwards is inconsequential to Femto.
 
By the way, didn't the Skull Knight say something along the lines of "What Casca wants may be not the same as what you want" to Guts?

Maybe it was supposed to be foreshadowing for the fact that Casca will actually want to stay with Griffith?

Or was he referring to Casca being afraid of Guts when she woke up?
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
By the way, didn't the Skull Knight say something along the lines of "What Casca wants may be not the same as what you want" to Guts?

Maybe it was supposed to be foreshadowing for the fact that Casca will actually want to stay with Griffith?

Or was he referring to Casca being afraid of Guts when she woke up?
Well, Casca is unconscious right now. So I'm not sure why what Casca might want is even a factor. But what Skull Knight said was likely tied to the thorns around Casca's heart when they finally restored her. Casca wanted to escape her trauma. Guts wanted her to wake up from it. So here's what Schierke said at the time, when she realized the trauma will be carried into her restored mind:

Schierke: If she keeps her sanity while having memories of such a horrible experience
Schierke: It will bring her an enormous pain that we can't imagine.
Schierke: ...Or rather, she broke down because she couldn't endure it.
Skull Knight: What you wish for may not be what she wishes for.
Schierke: ...Now I understand.
 

Griffith

With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
Also, guys, give her and the big guy some credit: Casca loves Guts, she doesn't want to be with Griffith, he had already become an obligation and burden before he literally marked her for death, turned into a monster, raped her, corrupted her unborn child into a deformed monster itself and then stole that child's body for a vessel. That last part is the ONLY conflicted feeling or hangup she's going to have with Griffith, the rest is going to be pretty obviously a lot of hurt at best, and likely hatred. Griffith betrayed her more than he did anyone else.
 
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