Difference between occultation of a human to become a Godhand and "Apostle-ification"?

[Ulysses]

Hi,

I always wondered how much the process of a person to become a God Hand differs from one becoming an Apostle.

Apostle possess their physical body while Godhand, unless one is incarnated, are purely in astral form.

So, I believe during the process, a person like Griffith actually "dies" ie their physical body is destroyed or their self is somehow removed from it and descends to deepest parts of vortex and meets God of Abyss. This also means, Godhands are completely demon.

While becoming of apostle keeps the body intact and corrupts the self/soul via sacrifice. This was told during Black Swordsman arc.

Also, I believe apostles do not get to visit God of Abyss. Obviously the big bad can not be bothered with little dumb Snake Baron. So, who teaches them about "Do what you please"? Godhand themself?

Please let me know if my understanding is correct?

 

[Aazealh]

So, I believe during the process, a person like Griffith actually "dies" ie their physical body is destroyed or their self is somehow removed from it and descends to deepest parts of vortex and meets God of Abyss.

There is no need for speculation, we see exactly how it's done during the Eclipse. Griffith's corporeal body dissolves and is refashioned into Femto, but the new body in question is only ethereal. Meanwhile Griffith's soul descend into the Abyss and meets with its God.

This also means, Godhands are completely demon.

I don't think talking about demons is really helpful here. The God Hand are former humans who have been radically transformed by being infused with an enormous amount of evil power.

Also, I believe apostles do not get to visit God of Abyss. Obviously the big bad can not be bothered with little dumb Snake Baron. So, who teaches them about "Do what you please"? Godhand themself?

It happens just like what we see with the Count. The Beherit brings the prospective apostle to the God Hand's little Escherian hub, and they hold the ritual there. As it is in sight of the Vortex of Souls, it's easy to imagine how Void could just scoop some of the evil power from there and infuse it into the apostle to transform them.

 

[Ulysses]

It happens just like what we see with the Count. The Beherit brings the prospective apostle to the God Hand's little Escherian hub, and they hold the ritual there. As it is in sight of the Vortex of Souls, it's easy to imagine how Void could just scoop some of the evil power from there and infuse it into the apostle to transform them.

Perfect. And while he is pushing that evil into the apostle, Ubik or Slan indoctrinate him/her about the creed of demons? "Do as you will"? Atleast that what I believe. May its a detail too trivial. Anyhow.

There is no need for speculation, we see exactly how it's done during the Eclipse. Griffith's corporeal body dissolves and is refashioned into Femto, but the new body in question is only ethereal. Meanwhile Griffith's soul descend into the Abyss and meets with its God.

Okay, so when those black veins were attaching on him, this is what was happening. Corporeal body getting dissolved and refashioned into ethereal body.
Thank you very much.

The reason I asked this was more speculative. We know when a Apostle dies, his soul together with evil power is sucked into vortex of souls while body is reverted back into whatever it was at the time of occultation (is occultation right term for becoming an apostle?).

So now, assuming, speculatively, if a Godhand "dies", it will amount to their ethereal body being sucked into vortex of soul? Because there will be no body in the physical world anyhow.

I don't think talking about demons is really helpful here. The God Hand are former humans who have been radically transformed by being infused with an enormous amount of evil power.

Yes, demon is not the right term. Zodd is a demon too. Calling them demon is understatement. They are ... more than demons. Radically transformed former humans is the perfect phrasing for them.

 

[Aazealh]

And while he is pushing that evil into the apostle, Ubik or Slan indoctrinate him/her about the creed of demons? "Do as you will"? Atleast that what I believe. May its a detail too trivial.

Yes, it is trivial. It's also unlikely that any indoctrination is needed. They can just do whatever they want with their newfound powers. Pretty simple.

Okay, so when those black veins were attaching on him, this is what was happening. Corporeal body getting dissolved and refashioned into ethereal body.
Thank you very much.

We see it directly once the fist has closed and the "feast" starts, while Guts is still at the top.

(is occultation right term for becoming an apostle?).

No, Occultation is just a more specific way of saying Eclipse, and that applies only to events pertaining to the God Hand. For apostles, it's just the "ceremony of receiving evil". Sounds better in Japanese. I went into details about it on Patreon.

So now, assuming, speculatively, if a Godhand "dies", it will amount to their ethereal body being sucked into vortex of soul? Because there will be no body in the physical world anyhow.

That's right. In theory, if a member of the God Hand were to be destroyed, then nothing corporeal would be left behind.

Yes, demon is not the right term. Zodd is a demon too. Calling them demon is understatement. They are ... more than demons. Radically transformed former humans is the perfect phrasing for them.

Yeah I mean the word "demon" doesn't have a specific definition in the world of Berserk, so it's best to use the words we are provided with. Zodd is an apostle, Femto is a member of the God Hand. Otherwise things can get confusing fast, especially with regard to other creatures like incubi, ogres or the like.

 

[Ulysses]

Yes, it is trivial. It's also unlikely that any indoctrination is needed. They can just do whatever they want with their newfound powers. Pretty simple.

We see it directly once the fist has closed and the "feast" starts, while Guts is still at the top.

No, Occultation is just a more specific way of saying Eclipse, and that applies only to events pertaining to the God Hand. For apostles, it's just the "ceremony of receiving evil". Sounds better in Japanese. I went into details about it on Patreon.

That's right. In theory, if a member of the God Hand were to be destroyed, then nothing corporeal would be left behind.

Yeah I mean the word "demon" doesn't have a specific definition in the world of Berserk, so it's best to use the words we are provided with. Zodd is an apostle, Femto is a member of the God Hand. Otherwise things can get confusing fast, especially with regard to other creatures like incubi, ogres or the like.

Thanks a lot, it was very helpful.