Nintendo Switch

[Griffith]

http://www.nintendo.com/whatsnew/detail/first-look-at-nintendos-new-home-gaming-system

Nintendo's new system is Switch, which, as promised, is an admittedly clever, if not brilliantly designed, portable home console combo. But is too clever by half (a controller) at the expense of the fundamentals modern day console gamers take for granted? On the other hand, will every casual player (and there's way more now) that bought a Wii and plays on a phone or tablet be able to resist this super gaming tablet that you can also plug into your TV? Will Nintendo satisfy both somehow and rule the world? We'll see!

I fear it's sacrificing the power to be a viable third party host again, at least for traditional game publishers, for the sake of it's design conceit, which may or may not be that important or appealing to people that want to play on the go versus in the comfort of home. It could be stuck in no-man's land; too complicated to cart around compared to a 3DS, phone or tablet (and likely in addition to having the latter two anyway), but not beefy enough for dedicated home use compared to the alternatives. But, there's a lot of shit in flux in this industry so maybe Nintendo is getting ahead of the game and has more tricks up their sleeve (there was talk of "NX" running on phones and tablets; maybe Nintendo plans to become Steam and this is just one box =).

Anyway, still, my stance for a while has been I'd prefer if they just made a PS4 that also plays Nintendo exclusives for the win.

[Walter]

As a former huge Nintendo fan who hasn't cared about Nintendo in ~6-8 years, this announcement didn't move my needle very much. Instead, it merely met my expectations based on all the leaks over the past year: A home console that can be converted to a handheld. The question remains what the rendering power difference will be between the two -- two different experiences? Merely a resolution difference (TV is 1080p and handheld is 720p?).

Those technical details aside, I recognize that the seamless experience is a nice feature, but it's not a huge plus for me personally. I play games in one setting: My office. I don't  have the time or the means to play while traveling, except on rare occasions where I'm on a plane, and even then, I'd rather not be playing Skyrim. On top of all that, I really  hope they aren't going to sacrifice the ergonomics of the controller for the sake of portability. Those slide-off controllers looked quite flimsy, tiny, and I wonder how it'll feel in the hand. Probably each the size of a Pez dispenser? That doesn't sound great, but Nintendo generally nails controllers... right?

Development-wise, combining their generally stellar portable lineup with the home console lineup is very promising. I maintain that the Nintendo DS was the best console of the last decade. There hasn't been that incredible a library of games since the PS1. But whether they can recreate that same momentum via the Switch remains to be seen (personally, I think the development bubble around the DS was just lightning in a bottle, before the budgets for games exploded with the arrival of HD). It was also nice that Nintendo also teased some new games: New Mario, Splatoon and Mario Kart. But after the lackluster reception of the WiiU despite some great games, Nintendo is really going to have to bring it this generation in order to make any sort of impact.

[Aazealh]

The modular aspect is clever, as is the social one. Will third party developers play along though? That's the big question.

Equally important (and intertwined) is the power available. Both Sony and Microsoft are going all out on "MORE POWER!!!" after years of stagnation. They've already announced shorter hardware cycles. Meanwhile a "tablet-like" device is going straight-up against... tablets, the makers of which come out with new revisions each year. How long until any tablet beats the Switch? I wouldn't be surprised if 2017's iPad did. Lastly and most importantly, they better nail the ergonomics. The controllers must be amazing to use in any context, and the whole thing better be super resilient as well.

Add all that together and you get a pretty tall order. I hope Nintendo has nailed it, because they sorely need it.

P.S. Skyrim is a 2011 game. It's not going to sell a system in 2017.

[Griffith]

Yeah, all good points, and most not in Nintendo's favor (all their first party games being under one roof is the biggest plus to me). It just seems a bit too cute and not practical enough beyond impressing tech enthusiasts for solving to a problem nobody was having. I certainly don't see it addressing the issues Nintendo has had with it's home consoles since the GameCube, which is that it's basically not giving itself an equal playing field to compete on. I don't get why they didn't try to capitalize more on the success of the Wii's motion gaming unless they themselves reached the limit of it; this looks more like a new Wii U but now you can take the cumbersome GamePad anywhere (and apart so you can lose it more easily =). I mean, I voted maybe because "never say never" but they might end up with something here that's not optimal for home or portable use, so...

New Impromptu Poll: How long until Nintendo is purely a software company beyond producing some custom controllers for tablets or something!? And how awesome would it be to just have Mario Kart on your PC or the latest Sony console (maybe it's their destiny to work together, after all =)? Probably better than this, right?

[Nomad]

If Nintendo manages to build an online support as current (ps/xbox like) I'm in.  My biggest issue with Nintendo has always been purchasing the same games over and over without any kind of emulation or backward compatibility in whatever console may be available.  I'm at the point in my life that I do not have the time to dedicate long hours on gaming, so the Switch perhaps is the answer to my current position.

[Griffith]

It's so bizarre that we're finally getting a Zelda game with voice acting, too.

 

That's not exactly true either...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CD-i_games_from_The_Legend_of_Zelda_series

And as bad as those games are, it's still sad they were doing something then that's taken Nintendo decades to catch up to. Anyway, I haven't seen the video but I'll pick it up for Wii U even though I fear it'll feel like a half-assed step child of a port, but I'm not getting a Switch unless it proves legit. Being able to play Skyrim and Skyrim-like games does not a great platform make today. I mean, is it just a Wii U that also functions as a high powered 3DS? What's it really offer beyond that existing technology? You can use it as a tablet with blue tooth controllers at the park? I can already do that and don't want to. 6-12 great first party games, half of them already available in previous iterations? Not enough. If this wasn't Nintendo nobody woud give it a second look and it carries the dangerous potential of becoming just a portable Wii U rather than the next Wii.

[Sareth]

I'm really tempted to blow my tax return on the Switch now.

[Walter]

I'm really tempted to blow my tax return on the Switch now.

That's pretty much what I'll be doing. THANKS OBAMA.

BTW: "Preorders of the all Nintendo Switch versions have entirely sold out at Amazon, Walmart, and GameStop." Ohhhh Nintendo...

[Johnstantine]

That's pretty much what I'll be doing. THANKS OBAMA.

BTW: "Preorders of the all Nintendo Switch versions have entirely sold out at Amazon, Walmart, and GameStop." Ohhhh Nintendo...

The master edition of BotW sold out in three minutes. I didn't even know it had gone up.

[Griffith]

Oh look they still have some!

https://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-Switch/dp/B01LTHP2ZK/



And you can get it tomorrow with Skyrim for $100 less! I'm sure you'll all be buying this amazing technology right now. =)

[Aazealh]

Oh look they still have some!

https://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-Switch/dp/B01LTHP2ZK/

 

Missing the point.

[Griffith]

Missing the point.

I am!

Look, I hope it's awesome and changes the game and all that, but I'm a burned Wii U owner with the right to some healthy skepticism. I would love for Nintendo to prove me wrong, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to require it this time (it seems like this happens every other generation, though I've owned every flagship Nintendo console at some point, so... =).

[Aazealh]

Look, I hope it's awesome and changes the game and all that, but I'm a burned Wii U owner with the right to some healthy skepticism. I would love for Nintendo to prove me wrong, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to require it this time (it seems like this happens every other generation, though I've owned every flagship Nintendo console at some point, so... =).

I'll say, I'm quite glad I entirely skipped out on the Wii U, which seemed like a good idea but was badly bogged down by the rapidly evolving tech landscape almost right from the start. I like the Switch concept a lot though, and in particular the fact it can be entirely portable. I'm not sure I'll actually ever plug it to my TV, which has been gathering dust for a couple years now. I wonder if I could make it work with the Rift though...

Anyway I understand why you'd sit that one out. Personally I have little interest in consoles this generation (although Sony's exclusives on the PSVR are alluring), but the Switch is different enough that I think it'll complement my PC gaming well. Plus I can take it on plane flights and that could be pretty handy.

Fun fact is that Nintendo actually invited me to test the system out (as part of my job) but I can't be bothered to get my ass to the event. Also apparently the Zelda collector's edition is all sold out here as well. Didn't even think that might be a thing when I preordered earlier, but I guess it worked out just right.

[Griffith]

I'll say, I'm quite glad I entirely skipped out on the Wii U, which seemed like a good idea but was badly bogged down by the rapidly evolving tech landscape almost right from the start. I like the Switch concept a lot though, and in particular the fact it can be entirely portable. I'm not sure I'll actually ever plug it to my TV, which has been gathering dust for a couple years now. I wonder if I could make it work with the Rift though...

My favorite thing about the Wii U is that I can take it into the bed at night, or keep playing while my wife switches on something she wants to see on TV. I don't travel much though or think it'll be much use to me outside the home anyway. Of course, if it's basically a pumped up Wii U travel edition (be afraid), I've already got the right one, problem is Nintendo won't be making games for it anymore. We'll see if they're even nice enough to slash prices on Wii U games, particularly in the e-shop, but I'm not holding my breath.

Anyway I understand why you'd sit that one out. Personally I have little interest in consoles this generation (although Sony's exclusives on the PSVR are alluring), but the Switch is different enough that I think it'll complement my PC gaming well. Plus I can take it on plane flights and that could be pretty handy.

That's probably the feeling of a lot of people that sat out the Wii U and therefore aren't feeling the burn right now (full disclosure: I got it as a gift so it's not bitterness from money lost, but it hasn't been a whirlwind experience from Nintendo either, ending now in a hearty, "Fuck off and buy the Switch!")

Anyway, complimenting my PC experience is what I thought about my Wii U too, and it does serve that function to a degree, but the problem is, no matter how cool it is, if it bombs or no third parties support it then you have no games to play on it. My PC experience basically compliments itself with console ports from X-Box and PS4, Nintendo is an afterthought or gets dusted off when company is over. IDK, everyone thinks it's great, but my fear is we're letting the style of the technology ("it's a helicopter that's also a submarine!") overshadow the substance ("does neither well, chance of survival 50/50 at best"). I think it's certainly the case with the technology sector where it's being judged like some piece of art in itself instead of a piece of equipment.

Obviously you have it in mind for your lifestyle, but coming from my own experience I can't help but be skeptical. Also, no snark, couldn't you do something comparable to that with a good tablet and a bluetooth controller for similar cost/effort, plus everything else it could do that the Switch probably won't? I know it streamlines and focuses the gaming the experience and you get the Nintendo experience with it, but my point with the Shield comparison was people could already reasonably do stuff like this and just aren't, which means it's either about Nintendo's credibility or their games (which I get with Zelda; it just happens I can already play it). I'm just not completely sold on either count.

I guess it also appeals to all those 3DS users so if they make "the Switch"... but damn, didn't they probably already buy like two upgraded 3DS systems? I'd be a little wary for what this means for my 3DS if I were them too (and I am =).

Fun fact is that Nintendo actually invited me to test the system out (as part of my job) but I can't be bothered to get my ass to the event. Also apparently the Zelda collector's edition is all sold out here as well. Didn't even think that might be a thing when I preordered earlier, but I guess it worked out just right.

The Mastermind strikes again!

[Walter]

Well from my perspective, the Switch isn't exactly a slam dunk. I'm just impressed they managed to move me at all, given my entrenched feelings about the company over the years. I sat out on what feels like three console generations at this point. I did so because Nintendo hasn't really moved me in ... well,  close to a decade. The last time they really impressed me was Super Mario Galaxy. And, I've patiently waited for them to take bigger, more confident swings.

What impressed me about the Switch debut last night was the original first-party stuff, which I feel like we're still just seeing a fraction of. A little-known thing about Nintendo internally is that in preparing for the Switch, they consolidated their portable development and console development teams. This has always been a prospect that's excited me, and I was waiting for the other shoe to drop with what they were going to debut. What I saw last night was an impressive first taste -- enough to make me feel more confident about the prospect of the Switch. This was, of course, a far cry from the confusing experience of the Wii U's announcement ("Huh? Is this a new console or a Wii tablet add-on?"). Reggie really sucked the air out of the room on that one...

There is still quite a bit I am skeptical of. I don't really have any interest in the prospect of bringing a tiny controller to a party in the hopes that people will play quick-draw with me. The portable aspect of the console isn't super valuable to me and my playing habits. I tend to play while sitting down either on my couch or office. I'm concerned that the current touch screen (with no included stylus) won't be conducive to Nintendo porting or iterating on games like Super Mario Maker, which is a shame because it really seemed like they were onto something amazing with that. And this also could mean they won't be able to translate many of their DS-3DS learnings. Nintendo could still drop the ball on third-party support (have they been great about this since the 90s?). It's what always drags their consoles' life cycles down. Of course I have a PC where I can play newer, more processor-intensive experiences, I'm thinking more about the legs such a platform might have.

[residentgrigo]

I voted yes, with zero doubt on my mind. I didn´t expect the Switch to be half a Wii, as this will make portable play a bit "challenging" but not all games will need to fit all styles, i guess. The 720p resolution of the portable display is great and but it apparently won´t replace the 3DS in the long run, due to the mediocre battery life. We will need a new Nintendo portable soon-ish though...The 3D is 6 years old!
The lack of region-lock is secretly the best feature. Will this be a mass market "appropriate" console, as the usual 64 and beyond problems can already be seen.
Who knows, but let´s hope so. They desperately need a win in the console field, as i am fed up with keeping my Nintendo consoles in my cupboard for most of the year.

On the games: A Mario 64 / Sunshine sequel, No More Heroes 3 and a Unreal 4 engine SMT main entry game? Faints. Xeno 3 needs a new art style though, so fugly. Zelda finally got voice acting too. 15 years late but still! The launch window lineup is overall the usual joke, expect lots of WiiU remasters too. I will thus play Zelda on my WiiU, and then final sell it.
I plan on getting the Switch 1 year late, as i always do. No news here and the presentation itself was lastly kind of "eh".

[Walter]

it apparently won´t replace the 3DS in the long run, due to the mediocre battery life.

It's not dramatically different:
Switch: 2.5-6.5
New 3DS: 3.5-7
Old 3DS: 3-5

We will need a new Nintendo portable soon-ish though...The 3D is 6 years old!

A new portable from Nintendo is extremely unlikely at this point.

[Aazealh]

My favorite thing about the Wii U is that I can take it into the bed at night, or keep playing while my wife switches on something she wants to see on TV.

Playing in bed is likely to be how I'll play it most of the time. It's also why I thought the original Wii U concept was great, even though it eventually wasn't enough for me to get it.

Of course, if it's basically a pumped up Wii U travel edition (be afraid), I've already got the right one, problem is Nintendo won't be making games for it anymore.

Well it's a lot more powerful than the Wii U as well, if you care about that.

Also, no snark, couldn't you do something comparable to that with a good tablet and a bluetooth controller for similar cost/effort, plus everything else it could do that the Switch probably won't?

I don't think you could, simply because tablet games are souped up smartphone games, and I have zero interest in that. The only people I ever see play games on a tablet are usually running Solitaire or some Bejeweled clone. It's just not for the same audience at all. And to address the Shield specifically, which can stream PC games, well I've got my PC for that. Again it's just not the same thing. I'm not a big fan of tablets to begin with, not the form factor itself but the fact they're crippled smartphones with bigger screens. I like the Surface Pro line a lot (which has real games), but again, that's not really comparable to something like the Switch.

I know it streamlines and focuses the gaming the experience and you get the Nintendo experience with it, but my point with the Shield comparison was people could already reasonably do stuff like this and just aren't, which means it's either about Nintendo's credibility or their games (which I get with Zelda; it just happens I can already play it).

Well it's about the games of course. I mean that's what sells a system. I trust Nintendo that the hardware will be durable, but that's about it. By itself the brand isn't enough to get me to buy anything.

I guess it also appeals to all those 3DS users so if they make "the Switch"... but damn, didn't they probably already buy like two upgraded 3DS systems? I'd be a little wary for what this means for my 3DS if I were them too (and I am =).

I actually come more from the 3DS angle than the Wii one myself. And I didn't buy any of the upgraded versions.

I don't really have any interest in the prospect of bringing a tiny controller to a party in the hopes that people will play quick-draw with me.

Kagan may have a different perspective on this.

I'm concerned that the current touch screen (with no included stylus) won't be conducive to Nintendo porting or iterating on games like Super Mario Maker, which is a shame because it really seemed like they were onto something amazing with that. And this also could mean they won't be able to translate many of their DS-3DS learnings.

That's a strange way to look at things. I don't think it'll make any difference. I personally never really used the stylus with the NDS or 3DS, I clicked with my fingernail instead. Going for a capacitive touchscreen shouldn't change anything except it'll be much more convenient for the players. They might have to tailor objects so they're more adapted to bigger input devices (fingers), but I don't think that'd be much of a problem.

Nintendo could still drop the ball on third-party support (have they been great about this since the 90s?). It's what always drags their consoles' life cycles down. Of course I have a PC where I can play newer, more processor-intensive experiences, I'm thinking more about the legs such a platform might have.

It's nothing new, but the problem is there's only so much they can do to entice people to develop for them. Either the 3rd party devs like the console and want to develop for it or they don't. And Nintendo's philosophy, to try and differentiate themselves instead of releasing the same box with more power, just doesn't resonate with many of the big studios. New control schemes, new ways to think about gameplay... They'd rather make a big FPS. Or maybe it doesn't make financial sense, because it's unique to their platform, so that's less sales. Either way, it'll be like usual: they'll release a couple games and either ramp up or curtail their efforts depending on how well they sell.

[Ruhe Strom]

Buying this thing seemed like the way to go for me since I skipped the Wii U, but I'm holding out for the moment until we see what other games are announced. At this point I'd be buying it just for Zelda, and that's nowhere near worth it to me. Honestly I was a little surprised that we didn't hear anything from Retro Studios at the conference. I was hoping for something to whet the appetites of us Metroid fans, although weathering through long waits is what we're all about.

Oh well, at least Suda51's got a new platform to continue spreading his joyously quirky reign of fun.

[Griffith]

Playing in bed is likely to be how I'll play it most of the time. It's also why I thought the original Wii U concept was great, even though it eventually wasn't enough for me to get it.

That's a good way to go, the problem is the sticks and buttons are still a bit loud for intense play next to a sleeping loved one, so Smash or even a platformer like Shovel Knight can be trouble, but maybe it's just me. =)

Well, it's a lot more powerful than the Wii U as well, if you care about that.

To that end I care more about it being competitive and surviving in the marketplace so its not in the same position as Wii U a few short years from now, so I'd like it to be on par with the XB1 and PS4. It being better than the Wii U only hurts my feelings that I'm getting the downgraded version of Zelda. Anyway, Nintendo has a tendency to save their butts the next time out after screwing the pooch, and the Switch certainly has the requisite hype and goodwill to be setup for success if they have their platform and game lineup in order.

I don't think you could, simply because tablet games are souped up smartphone games, and I have zero interest in that. The only people I ever see play games on a tablet are usually running Solitaire or some Bejeweled clone. It's just not for the same audience at all. And to address the Shield specifically, which can stream PC games, well I've got my PC for that. Again it's just not the same thing. I'm not a big fan of tablets to begin with, not the form factor itself but the fact they're crippled smartphones with bigger screens. I like the Surface Pro line a lot (which has real games), but again, that's not really comparable to something like the Switch.

A better, though less aesthetically similar, comparison that I can personally attest to is a laptap. When I went back to college I bought a cheap Toshiba Satellite, which became my only computer when my PC finally crapped out, and I played a ton of games on it from the Mass Effect series to Diablo III at home (where I plugged in a monitor) and on the go (usually at the school library or visiting my family =). Perhaps the stress from that finally sent it to an early grave after a few years, but I've sort of pined for a gaming laptop and that portability since (it was pretty much my whole entertainment center for a couple years and did the job well enough). I don't notice a lot of people pursuing that play style even though it's very possible, but if Nintendo can cultivate and encourage it as an improved mobile experience while still offering competitive home entertainment that covers a lot of ground indeed.

Well it's about the games of course. I mean that's what sells a system. I trust Nintendo that the hardware will be durable, but that's about it. By itself the brand isn't enough to get me to buy anything.

I'm not sold on any of those fronts yet, in particular I'll want to see just how well the Switch holds up as a handheld device with small detachable parts. That shit is always going to fall between the seats at the worst possible time when juggling it, but as you say Nintendo usually has their shit together on this front.

I actually come more from the 3DS angle than the Wii one myself. And I didn't buy any of the upgraded versions.

Me either, but I did need a replacement first gen model because I wore out my shoulder buttons playing Mario Kart 7.

Kagan may have a different perspective on this.

It's only for sophisticated rooftop soirées and the bedroom as previously discussed.

[MrFlibble]

The only reason I got a Wii U was because of the upcoming Zelda game, d'oh. I'll wait until their line up is decent before getting the Switch, at least until they release some decent Metroid and Star fox titles, I don't like how they're releasing updated games as if they're sequels and I hope they don't make a habit of it.

[Aazealh]

I'm holding out for the moment until we see what other games are announced.

Well they've already announced Super Mario Odyssey, Arms, Splatoon 2, Xenoblade Chronicles 2, No More Heroes 3... Those all sound pretty neat to me (although the Mario-in-NYC thing weirds me out a bit).

That's a good way to go, the problem is the sticks and buttons are still a bit loud for intense play next to a sleeping loved one, so Smash or even a platformer like Shovel Knight can be trouble, but maybe it's just me. =)

Beats my snoring, believe me.

so I'd like it to be on par with the XB1 and PS4.

Never gonna happen unfortunately. That ship sailed with the Gamecube. And I'm fine with it honestly. For games that require actual heavy computing I have my computer. Funny story: my brother was playing a game recently and his PC is 6 years old so it ran like crap. He was desperate to enjoy the game and decided to buy it again on his Xbox One just so it would run smoothly. Sadly for him, it was still worse on the XBOne than on his computer.

A better, though less aesthetically similar, comparison that I can personally attest to is a laptap. When I went back to college I bought a cheap Toshiba Satellite, which became my only computer when my PC finally crapped out, and I played a ton of games on it from the Mass Effect series to Diablo III at home (where I plugged in a monitor) and on the go (usually at the school library or visiting my family =). Perhaps the stress from that finally sent it to an early grave after a few years, but I've sort of pined for a gaming laptop and that portability since (it was pretty much my whole entertainment center for a couple years and did the job well enough). I don't notice a lot of people pursuing that play style even though it's very possible, but if Nintendo can cultivate and encourage it as an improved mobile experience while still offering competitive home entertainment that covers a lot of ground indeed.

Actually a lot of people play on laptops nowadays. Only "PRO GAMERZ" and grumpy old men like me stick to desktop computing. You should see the kind of stuff they have these days. Giant ass "notebooks" with 21" screens and desktop components.

[Johnstantine]

Never gonna happen unfortunately. That ship sailed with the Gamecube. And I'm fine with it honestly. For games that require actual heavy computing I have my computer. Funny story: my brother was playing a game recently and his PC is 6 years old so it ran like crap. He was desperate to enjoy the game and decided to buy it again on his Xbox One just so it would run smoothly. Sadly for him, it was still worse on the XBOne than on his computer.

Why wouldn't he just upgrade his video card? He could get one twice as good as the xb1 for half the price!

I've slowly been making the transition to PC and it's been awesome. Nintendo will always have my money, though.

[Aazealh]

Why wouldn't he just upgrade his video card? He could get one twice as good as the xb1 for half the price!

That's what he's doing now. But buying the game a second time for $20 was originally more alluring than getting a new graphics card for $200.

[Sareth]

I've decided to go ahead and get the Switch whenever I can freakin' find one to pre-order. I pre-ordered Zelda and I'll probably sell my copy of Mario Kart 8 to get the Deluxe version. I backed Yooka Laylee during its Kickstarter and the Wii U version was canceled so I'll have to upgrade to the Switch version when it becomes available. I'll definitely have to get Splatoon 2 and Xenoblade 2, and hopefully FromSoftware will put out the Dark Souls collection this year.