Will Casca return to Griffith?

Status
Not open for further replies.
I was just wonderring about what Skullnight once said to Guts, about what wanted may not be what Casca wants. So what do you guy's think. Will she return to Griffith's side once her memory is restored? Will the fact that Griffith's body is her son's sway her mind? Discuss!
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Foreverjung said:
I was just wonderring about what Skullnight once said to Guts, about what wanted may not be what Casca wants. So what do you guy's think. Will she return to Griffith's side once her memory is restored? Will the fact that Griffith's body is her son's sway her mind? Discuss!

Femto raped Casca and turned her son into an inhuman. What mental gymnastics are you pulling in your head for her to want to "return to Griffith?"

When Skull Knight mentions the dilemma (what you want may not be what she wants), it was brought up within the context of restoring her mind, which could imply that she does not want to be restored.
 
Walter said:
The dilemma that Skull Knight proposes is within the context of restoring her mind, implying that she may not want to be restored.
Could it also mean that she may not want the revenge that Guts wants. I honestly always perceived it like that.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
Joe Chip said:
Could it also mean that she may not want the revenge that Guts wants. I honestly always perceived it like that.

Well, I wasn't stating it in absolute terms, just noting that the line had context, which could inform us about SK's cryptic prophecy.
 
It probably won't be the case, but ever since I read the chapter where Skull Knight uttered those words, I've wondered whether there might be a twist to this. What if it's Guts that ends up having doubts? He's been stricken with guilt for abandoning Casca and has tried his hardest to make things right. If Casca returns to normal, leaving all the crap behind and starting a new life with her at his side might start to sound tempting. Conversely, we don't know how fresh the Eclipse is in Casca's mind. Does she remember the time that's passed, or will it be like waking a day after? She might feel even more hatred that Guts for what happened.

As I said, it probably won't be the case, but I always thought this might be an interesting idea to explore.
 

Lord Leith

Welcome back Casca
I'm pretty sure that Casca has no direct affection or love for Griffith himself, so her joining his side is extremely unlikely. After all that she's been through, Im sure that she'll at least feel resentment and at most feel hatred but I do think its fair to say that due to Griffith using her child as a vessel for his rebirth that subconsciously she may have an indirect soft spot towards Griffith, but again, this is less so affection for Griffith than it is her own child. How she'll come into grips with this internal conflict, I have no idea but it is something I look forward to potentially discovering now that Casca has awakened out of her broken mind state.
 
I never understood were people got this idea from. She clearly hates Griffith now...

What SK was referring to was something along the lines of her not wanting to be healed, perhaps not even wanting to be alive.
 
DERA said:
[...] What if it's Guts that ends up having doubts? He's been stricken with guilt for abandoning Casca and has tried his hardest to make things right. If Casca returns to normal, leaving all the crap behind and starting a new life with her at his side might start to sound tempting. Conversely, we don't know how fresh the Eclipse is in Casca's mind. Does she remember the time that's passed, or will it be like waking a day after? She might feel even more hatred that Guts for what happened.[...]
[emphasis added]

I think if there's one thing the past episode has made pretty clear, it's that there will be no "return to normal" - and I think that's in large part what SK's warning is about. Guts wants to get back the Casca he knew in the Golden age, but SK warns him that that's not how people work. Even without deep, psychological trauma, you cannot unlive your experiences, any more than you can un-ring a bell. To quote the late great Sir Terry Pratchett, "anything that happens stays happened". This, to me, is the biggest reason to discredit theories about Casca "going back", be it to Griffith or Guts, or to being the commander of the Hawks. Her character is going to move forward, not back. It's much more exciting that way, too. After all this time, she deserves the chance to grow, rather than to regress.

(incidentally I don't mean to be overly nitpicky about your wording, I just drew attention to it to help make a point :) )
 
I think there is a strong case for Griffith kidnapping Casca in the future. However I doubt Casca would ever willingly choose Griffith over Guts, he ruined her life, drove her insane and left her for dead, there's not much to gain from hanging out with your rapists.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
SleepersWake said:
To quote the late great Sir Terry Pratchett, "anything that happens stays happened". This, to me, is the biggest reason to discredit theories about Casca "going back", be it to Griffith or Guts, or to being the commander of the Hawks. Her character is going to move forward, not back. It's much more exciting that way, too. After all this time, she deserves the chance to grow, rather than to regress.

I don't think anyone expects Casca will be 1:1 who she was back in the Falcons. That's just nonsense — not worth engaging with. However, this is not going to be an entirely new character, either. I do think her qualities from that time will eventually emerge. Just as the Guts we know now is an evolution of who he was in the Falcons, this IS still Casca, and we do know that character, and she will certainly have her share of nuances and personality changes as a result of the Eclipse.

MrFlibble said:
I think there is a strong case for Griffith kidnapping Casca in the future.

I'm curious what you think makes that a strong case. I can't say I've ever considered the idea, but it doesn't seem to me any more or less likely than other scenarios, and it sounds like a cliché setup for the final confrontation (not to mention disempowering Casca from an active role). That is to say, it doesn't sound like Miura.
 

Fancypantaloons

Trapped in time. Surrounded by evil. Low on gas.
Archer1215 said:
She isn't like Rickert, who was not present for the Eclipse and found something new to protect in Erica to help him grow past the loss of the Falcons.

And he slapped that bastard :rickert:
 
Walter said:
I'm curious what you think makes that a strong case. I can't say I've ever considered the idea, but it doesn't seem to me any more or less likely than other scenarios, and it sounds like a cliché setup for the final confrontation (not to mention disempowering Casca from an active role). That is to say, it doesn't sound like Miura.

I agree, it sounds cliche for a series like Berserk and it's not what I or I hope Miura would choose. I think it's likely because Griffith eliminates the possibility of Guts exploiting his weakness. Namely the demon baby taking control of his body. If he has Casca locked up in a room in Pandemonium, it may prevent the Moonlight boy from visitng Guts and company.

If assuming Griffith can't harm Casca directly, his only option to protect his secret is to capture her, it may also be that he is the only demonic being powerful enough to enter Elfhelm, but now I'm getting ahead of myself.

It also gives Guts an incentive to leave the safety of Elfhelm and go after Griffith. Now he is entirely morally justified in pursuing him.
 

Walter

Administrator
Staff member
MrFlibble said:
I agree, it sounds cliche for a series like Berserk and it's not what I or I hope Miura would choose.

Then why are you here arguing the merits of this ill-advised scenario?

I think it's likely because Griffith eliminates the possibility of Guts exploiting his weakness.

He doesn't seem too concerned about that at the moment.

If assuming Griffith can't harm Casca directly, his only option to protect his secret is to capture her

That seems rather limiting, given that we're talking about a being with near-godlike powers.

It also gives Guts an incentive to leave the safety of Elfhelm and go after Griffith. Now he is entirely morally justified in pursuing him.

Sure but there are so many other reasons Miura can cook up to suffice that without resorting to a cliche "save the princess" plot. While I think it might be interesting for Casca to in some way come face-to-face with Griffith and/or the child (or for her to see one of them turn into the other) and see that scene play out, a kidnapping scenario where Casca is kept like a bird in a cage for Guts to rescue sounds extraordinarily cheesy and off-brand to me.
 

jackson_hurley

even the horses are cut in half!
Walter said:
Sure but there are so many other reasons Miura can cook up to suffice that without resorting to a cliche "save the princess" plot. While I think it might be interesting for Casca to in some way come face-to-face with Griffith and/or the child (or for her to see one of them turn into the other) and see that scene play out, a kidnapping scenario where Casca is kept like a bird in a cage for Guts to rescue sounds extraordinarily cheesy and off-brand to me.

Not to mentionned that we already had two kind of scenarios like that in the story : Princess Charlotte being rescued from Ganishka and Casca "kidnapped" by Mozgus crew to burn her (so it's not exactly the same but still is close to).

And then there was the trolls too.

Like you mention Walter, I'd like it more if Casca was to see her son transform (or whatever how it works) into Griffith or something like than her being kidnapped by Griffith.
 

Lithrael

Remember, always hold your apple tight
It's one of the current Unanswered Questions, exactly what is going on with the Boy and/slash Femto. It's a complete cipher at this point because we haven't been shown any hint of Femto being concerned or distressed over the kid's solo forays. We haven't even been shown whether he knows, though I can only assume he does. All we've got so far is him appearing to suss out that he's got some of the kid's feelings (sort of literally inside him/not actually his as such) at the Hill of Swords. And we know Zodd is interested in keeping tabs on the situation.

If Casca could be useful as some kind of bargaining chip for Femto to use against the Boy, he already would have nabbed her/kept the option of easily nabbing her (intervening before they left on The Boat). So Femto either doesn't think having control over Casca is useful to him, or, if she would be useful to him, he hasn't realised it yet. OR he's just so confident in being able to get her if needed, he hasn't made any moves yet. (OR he's being really prescient and wants the main crew to accomplish some Tasks before he intervenes.)

I wonder if it's more like, Femto has figured that the Boy cares about Casca and Guts, but figures that trying to get one or both under his thumb would rock the boat rather than reinforce his position.

I think we've been shown clearly that Femto himself couldn't care less about either of them - on par with how he considers Rickert, they'd be welcome as friends or ignored as enemies proportional to how much of a threat they represented. Femto isn't really capable anymore of being invested in whether people like him or hate him, beyond how it affects his plans. So his treatment of Casca and Guts will depend completely on how the Boy would react and what exactly the Boy's status means to him.

One of the interesting questions, to me, is whether Femto can accurately predict the Boy's reactions - does he have an explicit understanding of the Boy, or could he make mistakes in trying to control him? Does he even want to, or is the Boy the last/only bit of excitement in this new life where he's practically an all powerful god?

I mean, now that he's got his Incarnation and his Empire and stuff, unless/until some unexpected and powerful opposition shows up, he's turned off Survival Mode and is playing in Build Mode, the challenge is essentially gone - will he get bored with just being able to waltz through all the content? Is bored a thing he can get anymore?
 
Foreverjung said:
I was just wonderring about what Skullnight once said to Guts, about what wanted may not be what Casca wants. So what do you guy's think. Will she return to Griffith's side once her memory is restored? Will the fact that Griffith's body is her son's sway her mind? Discuss!

Hey yeah, I remember thinking something similar as well that maybe what Skull knight was getting at was that Casca might not want to kill Griffith or that she might still have some attachment in helping Griffith achieve his dream. A possible motivation for her could be that she does not want everyone’s death during the eclipse to be meaningless so helping Griffith is her misguided way of giving their deaths meaning or something?
I vaguely recall a scene where guts is remember seeing Griffith for the first time after the eclipse and I think he says something like "I forgot it had to kill him" or “I lost the urge to kill" and Rickert during his rant when he slaps Griffith says "I couldn’t get angry, I couldn’t shoulder that burden" so I don't think hating Griffith is something that come easily to them but I could be misremembering that.
I know it's not the most popular opinion and from what I’ve read, a lot of people feel like it would ruin the character of Casca, but I hope something like that turns out to be the case I think it would make for some heartbreaking story telling between her and Guts. and I think it would be kind boring if she just flat out hates Griffith.
 
Good God tekkman that would be the shittiest thing ever if casca still wanted to help Griffith achieve his selfish dream and wanted to validate the Hawks deaths by helping him out. What do you think that the brutal savage way he murdered the Hawks will have no bearing on Casca? That she thought so little of them as people she would try to salvage their miserable death by the very man that betrayed by trying to help said man with his dreams. If you honestly think this than you are grossly misjudging casca as a character. Casca cared for the Hawks very deeply, she may not have consciously thought of them this way but she cared for them like surrogate family. I would honestly be very shocked if casca was not vengeful toward Griffith for what he did to them for his own benefit after all they did to stand by him. And also...Griffith fucking raped her? Casca needs to hate Griffith for everything he has done to her. It certainly wouldn't be boring if she did.
 
Well, im sorry you feel that way Vixen :( i guess we will just have to disagree. i can't tell if you genuinely want me to answer those questions like why would Casca want to help someone who has murdered her friends/raped her and i feel like if i try you are going to be rude but i'd love hear what your ideal scenario is for when Casca and Griffith meet up or what you think should happen between her and Guts.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom