something I thought up.

K

Kart

Resident /b/tard
I almost felt this is hardly worth posting, almost.

What is griffith doesn't want gutts anymore although he wants gutts to want him which would explain why he as never directly attacked him, but destroyed everything around gutts, I don't think it would be out of the question for him to try to kill caska in order to fully gain gutts infatuation.
 
IgnusDei

IgnusDei

mmh-hmm good.
looks like someone has come to attempt to claim Xechano's mantle as Dark Lord of ESL.

and woo! his first act as such is making yet another "Griffith is gay and wants guts to be his love-thing" thread.

All Hail!
 
K

Kart

Resident /b/tard
dare you imply that i am saying griffith is homosexual? nay, I am saying that Griffith simply wants gutts to lust after him (I'm using lust as it's ment to be used) as he once did, it's more a matter of control, he wants to have control over him again, whether it's out of hatred or love (again none homosexual, there is love between males when they are extremly close) or perhaps he sees gutts as a friend finally because he has become his equal. either way there is no man love involved in this theory, and i am not trying to take his place, god I want no part in bannings.


Also, what about slan? she has a strange interest in gutts, what are the opinions of this?
 
O

Orlandu

Kart said:
I almost felt this is hardly worth posting, almost.

What is griffith doesn't want Guts anymore although he wants Guts to want him which would explain why he as never directly attacked him, but destroyed everything around Guts, I don't think it would be out of the question for him to try to kill caska in order to fully gain Guts infatuation.
Click to expand...

I think this is out of question, because why would Griffith do such a thing ? ??? He just saved Caska, and she is the "mother" of the body Griffith lives in now, and we saw that because of that baby's mind, Griffith couldn't control his body !!!

I think that Griffith doesn't care too much about Guts. Griffith even asked Rickert to come back to the band of the hawk, but not Guts!

Also, Griffith didn't destroy everything around Guts on purpose, The elvish Mine crumbled because of the fight between Zodd and Guts. So it was none of Griffith's doings.

Thus everything is up to Guts, if he wants revenge over Griffith, he knows where to find him (same thing if he wants to join the new Band of the Hawks, which, I guess, isn't likely going to happen ^^)! And if he wants to stay in Elfheim by Caska it's up to him (because as it has been said that he's the One who struggles (according to SK), and the one who can go against casualty) .... And finally, I think that if everyone (except Griffith and those who don't know guts) is so interested in Guts (including Slan, Zodd, SK, etc ...), it is because he's the one who can truly change things (I guess you should read the topic about USO).

I hope what I said was understandable ;D and possible
 
O

Orlandu

xechnao said:
Take this part out of your post.
Click to expand...

Could you explain a bit why I should remove this ? I guess that after their little meeting in the snowy graveyard, Griffith clearly showed he didn't care much about what would happen to Guts. Isn't it ?
 
F

Femuth-Black Hawk

Guts...?..Love...?...Why?.....
Orlandu said:
Could you explain a bit why I should remove this ? I guess that after their little meeting in the snowy graveyard, Griffith clearly showed he didn't care much about what would happen to Guts. Isn't it ?
Click to expand...

no,no,no...
i don´t think that griffith don´t care about guts.
he was the only one, who griffith respect(because of his strenght)

the best example is:
at the eclipse griffith(femto) could kill guts,but he didn´t...
so even as a god hand member he was feeling something to guts....

and the reborn griffith talked to guts,like he is still his friend..
that´s my opinion
 
asmer

asmer

Femto-Black Hawk said:
the best example is:
at the eclipse griffith(femto) could kill guts,but he didn´t...
so even as a god hand member he was feeling something to guts....
Click to expand...

But how do you know Griffith hadn't killed Guts, if the Skullknight hadn't come to save him and Caska ?...
 
O

Orlandu

Femto-Black Hawk said:
no,no,no...
i don´t think that griffith don´t care about guts.
he was the only one, who griffith respect(because of his strenght)

the best example is:
at the eclipse griffith(femto) could kill guts,but he didn´t...
so even as a god hand member he was feeling something to guts....

and the reborn griffith talked to guts,like he is still his friend..
that´s my opinion
Click to expand...

I don't totally agree with you ... because even though Griffith seems to be the same as before, I guess after he has reincarnated into a new body, he might feel as if reborn with some past memories , thus he wants to be sure of his decisions (such as, if it is still really worth taking his own kingdom without the past band of the hawk's members, or to put it in another way, if his previous companions were still required to accomplish his goals).

IMO, that's why he comes first to see Guts and Caska, in order to know if he still has feelings or grudges against them. After their little talk, he sees that they are not required anymore .Further more, if you remember, Griffith had some strange "grudges" against Guts, because he is the only one who made Griffith forget about his dream for a little while, and on the opposite, Guts was the only light Griffith could see while being kept in the dungeon, and while being tortured (except from the God Hands, but that's not the point here :)) so I would maybe think that Griffith's first purpose was to analyse his feelings towards Guts, to know if Guts could once again lead him astray, thus if he had to kill him, or if Guts was no obstacle (hinderance) to his goal and thus if he could leave Guts alone with his Struggle to Live.

Also, I think that once Griffith is sure that he holds no grudges nor feelings for Guts (thus no particullar friendship) we could say that he doesn't care about Guts (if the word doesn't suit you, I could say that Griffith won't hurt nor save Guts, or he is indifferent about Guts' doing, as long as he doesn't interfere with his dream)

And at last, I agree that the "new" Griffith talks to Guts as a friend. But, I think that knowing the ability of Griffith to adapt to nearly anybody (especially to someone he fought alongside with), it wouldn't surprise me that it is just his way of talking to someone. Also if you remember the monologue of Griffith (while talking with princess Charlotte before the firste eclipse) about his dream and his friends, IMO, Grifith has still not "promoted" Guts to a "rank" of friend, because he probably has still not understood why Guts acted like he did (when parting from the band of the hawk). So as a conclusion, I would say that he may speak as he is Guts' friend but doesn't think that way.

Once again, this is only my opinion about the "new" relationship beetween these two men (well 1 branded-man and 1 once-man-then-God-Hand-then-man???-again).And I hope I could explain clearly what I had in mind, but feel free to ask me further explanations about some dark points in my posts (sorry if my english is too bad :-[ ) or to refute them as long as you bring arguments proving me wrong ;D ( I'm not talking about anybody in particular ... not Xechnao at least ;D )
 
F

Femuth-Black Hawk

Guts...?..Love...?...Why?.....
I aggre whit all what you said except that griffith probably didn´t know why guts had left the hawks.In vol.12 you can see that griffith get shocked by Caska as she repeat the words ,which griffith said to charlotte about his dream and true friends.he was cornered by caska and guts.
 
D

DarkShurikn

Meiyo
Orlandu said:
Once again, this is only my opinion about the "new" relationship beetween these two men (well 1 branded-man and 1 once-man-then-God-Hand-then-man???-again).And I hope I could explain clearly what I had in mind, but feel free to ask me further explanations about some dark points in my posts (sorry if my english is too bad :-[ ) or to refute them as long as you bring arguments proving me wrong ;D ( I'm not talking about anybody in particular ... not Xechnao at least ;D )
Click to expand...

True.. when someone is saying you are wrong without refuting with arguments, i consider him wrong.. except if it's really obvious. I'm sure i'm not the ony one to think the way i do..
 
O

Orlandu

DemonX said:
griffith says he would ask for guts to join him again.
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I can't read the manga now but i don't remember Griffith to even think about Guts in that way after he became Femto ...

and as I said before :

1. I would maybe think that Griffith's first purpose was to analyse his feelings towards Guts, to know if Guts could once again lead him astray, thus if he had to kill him, or if Guts was no obstacle (hinderance) to his goal and thus if he could leave Guts alone with his Struggle to Live.

So IMHO Griffith didn't want Guts to come with him.

2. bring arguments proving me wrong ;D

P.S: BTW I read the trans of c180 to c182 and there is no clue about Griffith "wanting" Guts ...
 
M

Miyu

I'm smiling on the inside.
Orlandu said:
I can't read the manga now but i don't remember Griffith to even think about Guts in that way after he became Femto ...

and as I said before :

1. I would maybe think that Griffith's first purpose was to analyse his feelings towards Guts, to know if Guts could once again lead him astray, thus if he had to kill him, or if Guts was no obstacle (hinderance) to his goal and thus if he could leave Guts alone with his Struggle to Live.

So IMHO Griffith didn't want Guts to come with him.

2. bring arguments proving me wrong ;D

P.S: BTW I read the trans of c180 to c182 and there is no clue about Griffith "wanting" Guts ...
Click to expand...

Playing devil's advocate here.

During the Sword of Hills scene, Griffith does check to make sure that he doesn't have anymore feelings for Guts, but that isn't saying that he anticipates Guts to refuse his offer. Right now, Griffith is trying to rebuild a new Band of the Hawks to aide in his quest of becoming King.

Guts has proven himself as a great swordsman by being able to live as long as he has despite being branded. Anyone with knowledge about warfare or who is trying to build an army would want to recruit Guts. It's Guts' skill that Griffith wants in this situation. The fact that Guts refused probably didn't matter to him much, but I don't think he would have left Guts if Guts did decide to join him.
 
O

Orlandu

Miyu said:
During the Sword of Hills scene, Griffith does check to make sure that he doesn't have anymore feelings for Guts, but that isn't saying that he anticipates Guts to refuse his offer. Right now, Griffith is trying to rebuild a new Band of the Hawks to aide in his quest of becoming King.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with you, but Griffith isn't saying either that he "wants" Guts to be a part of his new BoTH. :) ( we can keep saying this loop for a long time ::) )

Guts has proven himself as a great swordsman by being able to live as long as he has despite being branded. Anyone with knowledge about warfare or who is trying to build an army would want to recruit Guts. It's Guts' skill that Griffith wants in this situation. The fact that Guts refused probably didn't matter to him much, but I don't think he would have left Guts if Guts did decide to join him.
Click to expand...

I partially agree. I think that it might be very hard for Apostles and branded men to live alongside with each other, even under the influence of a God Hand. Yet, humans and some Apostles don't seem to live well together ( if Grunbeld was not there Mule could have had some problems ??? ...). So IMO, Griffith, as a great tactician, could have thought about that, thus preventing Guts and Caska to come along.

But it is all speculations of what could have happened if .... :)
If Griffith didn't received a red Beherit, maybe he could still have reached his Goal. ;)
 
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