Author Topic: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?  (Read 32635 times)

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Offline Forest Wraith

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #25 on: October 11, 2006, 10:38:07 AM »
It isn't the majority of the story, exspecially when so many volumes have gone past since then: It's a pivotal moment in the storyline. As I have pointed out before: although The Eclipse is indeed horrific and sad; it is the emotions evoked by the Eclipse that gives readers a viscereal, emotional investment in the story and really sheds light on Guts' character. In fact, I've started to affectionately think of The Band of the Hawk as Miura's sacrifice . . .
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #26 on: October 11, 2006, 12:19:25 PM »
Hi CommanderCasca, welcome here. :serpico:

I have to sadly agree that my dear Casca was indeed tortured and sodomized by those bastard monsters.

Well there's no real evidence of this, as I pointed out in my first reply to this thread. Rather, she is shown as being almost penetrated by one of them, and then Femto appears and it stops. But right after, horror, Femto himself rapes her. This setting wouldn't make sense, nor be nearly as dramatic, if she had previously been raped already. It's not impossible that she was, but I don't think you should jump to conclusions.

i am still horribly disturbed that a majority of the book was such a horrid and graphic depiction of the undoing of a character i can so easily empathize with.

Actually, counting even the pages where she's captured after Judo's death and those just showing Guts hacking at his arm, it's less than 40 pages from beginning to end. The book has 240 in total. The reason it seems so slow, long and horrible is because it concerns a character whom we've been attaching ourselves to (well, that and it's still relatively lengthy).

Offline Gurifisu

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2006, 04:01:52 AM »
No, she was not raped by the other apostles.  She might have been... sexually totured but not raped.

The reason is... If you look back on how Griffith first met Casca he saved her from being raped.  Casca even refered to him as an "angel"... he gave her a sword and made sure she was covered.  So he gave her a life that she could live for.

Now before she was raped by femto... the same thing was about to happen, but in a different context.  He saves her, and then procceedes to take away that meaning that he had given her to live her life.  He saves her, but this time the angels help is indeed not that easy.

If she had been raped I wouldn't see the point... it's just so perfectly set up if she deosn't get raped by the apostles and instead is saved by Griffith.

Another reason I think this is the fact that Casca loses her mind afterwards... it was almost like Griffith was taking back what he had given her (like one of those molested boys with the blank stares).  Plus you have the demon child thing... you could say it was tainted by all of the apostles that raped her then.  Plus once again I don't Griffith would have sloppy seconds  :casca:... purely from the way he'd viewed himself (you do retain some of your persona).

I personally think their's alot of genuis in how this story is set up, and I think that makes more sense if she was only raped by Femto.

Why hold the tentacle up in suspense if another one had already gone in.  That would somewhat ruin that moment of suspense.
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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #28 on: October 12, 2006, 07:01:56 PM »


Why hold the tentacle up in suspense if another one had already gone in.  That would somewhat ruin that moment of suspense.
One, two , or ten tentacles.....it doesnt make it any less suspenseful IMO.....The fact that we are about to witness the very act is suspense enough....Think about it....we all know how popular alien bondage is in the anime/manga world is.....Im sure Miura is leaving it up to the imagination what those apostles did...but i can assure you....it was most likely pretty vile and definately sexual. :puck:

Offline jepn30

Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #29 on: October 12, 2006, 08:20:05 PM »
I agree Biq in that much of what we witness in the manga seems to be a set of concurrent events. It's compiled in such a way that it gives us the perspective's of each of the important players, without quickly cutting from one event to another and so on. Dramatically this structure works quite well. First, since the story was intially released episodically focusing on the perspective(s) of [a] specific character(s) for the length of an episode makes for a more coherent reading experience. As opposed to jumping from one character to another every other panel, which is often harder to follow. It also hightens the dramatic tension by allowing us to become more involved in what is happening to the individuals. It also increases the impact of cliffhanger scenes; since once the story changes focus, you may not know what is going to happen for another two episodes.

I will post more on this later...

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2006, 08:20:41 PM »
The fact that we are about to witness the very act is suspense enough...

Yeah, but that doesn't reinforce your point. What matters is that there was suspense at that point, and that it was interrupted, only to happen right after with Femto. This doesn't support the idea that worst events had already taken place.

Think about it....we all know how popular alien bondage is in the anime/manga world is...

Actually, it's not very popular. It's a pretty marginalized genre, limited to pornographic works and mostly known through a handful of infamous titles. Its relative "popularity" on Internet isn't reflective of a reality in the manga market. It's not a major theme of Japanese comic books or anything like that. Anyway, even though the way the apostles capture Casca can remind the reader of that genre, it doesn't prove your point.

Im sure Miura is leaving it up to the imagination what those apostles did...but i can assure you....it was most likely pretty vile and definately sexual.

Unfortunately I don't think you can assure anything in this case.

I agree Biq in that much of what we witness in the manga seems to be a set of concurrent events.

Well, I didn't feel like it was necessary to reply about this back then, but yes, BiQ-- was right.

Offline Griffith

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2006, 09:21:38 PM »
Yeah, in addition to the specifics Aaz mentioned, to say Casca was raped before Femto simply doesn't make sense dramatically, or logistically. If she had truly been gang-raped by transformed Apostles, she would have already been destroyed, physically as well as mentally.

Now, that's not to say that she wasn't seriously violated by the whole ordeal, but the worst of it, the rape itself, was with Femto alone, and with good reason.

Offline Lithrael

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2006, 12:15:24 AM »
I hop on bandwagon.  Gurifisu is absolutely right; from a dramatic and narrative standpoint it has to be Griffith and no one else who rapes Casca.  As for the crotch-blood, good lord, look at the claws on those tentacles!  That thing'd only have to tap her on the cootch to get that effect.

She obviously was literally passed around at least a little, since the claw-tipped-tentacle guy and his friends weren't in the group that picked her up.  But she's unconscious or semi-conscious in his debut scene, and it's his 'ok boys I'm going for it' nudge that wakes her back up.  Just a nudge, mind, there's nothing suspicious on his head when he turns around.  Now, if she's passed out from being shaken and cut up and terrorised by apostles, I understand how that could still surprise her back to awareness. 

If on the other hand she's already been gangraped by apostles, it's tough for me to imagine a mere nudge would be enough.  It's also tough to imagine Femto's dramatic fingerbang even being noticeable, short of his use of God Hand Sex Charisma +19 (which he doesn't turn on until after Slan's speech, IMO).

But like Gurifisu said, it's the narrative quality that clinches it.  Griff saves her from rape, creating her identity.  Griff-as-Femto saves her from rape...  just to rape her himself, destroying her identity.

Offline mike.william

Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #33 on: October 17, 2006, 06:14:44 AM »


But she's unconscious or semi-conscious in his debut scene, and it's his 'ok boys I'm going for it' nudge that wakes her back up. 


This is the greatest quote I've read in the history of the last 24 hours.  Next time I have sex, I'm gonna yell out "OK BOYS, I'M GOING FOR IT!" right before the deed.

Holy shit, I can't quit laughing at this.

Also, I just realized that I spent 15 minutes reading a discussion on the evidence backing a fictional demon-gang raping that may or may not have fictionally occured.  I now feel sad inside.  DAMN YOU BERSERK.

As for my take : No way batman gets sloppy 100th's, and Idea wouldn't risk having the apostles kill the child, so I don't believe she was raped before Femto.

Offline Dirty Dog

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #34 on: December 03, 2006, 05:04:30 PM »
I don't think she was violated before femto, not because of the timing but because the same demon was about to "penetrate" her for most of the time there was to rape her, and judging by the size and shape of its "penis", there would've been blood.
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Offline Locus of Agony

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #35 on: February 05, 2007, 01:23:36 PM »
Best Jigsaw impression: "Oh yes, there would have been blood."  :void:

I've always assumed there was a little time compression between the moment Casca is attacked by the creatures and Guts killing spree.

I always pictured Guts arriving mere moments after they had torn her clothes and armour from her, being none to gentle this alone would explain the wounds on her body, and they had just lifted her into the air to begin their business. Femto halts the proceedings, and then the nightmare truly begins.
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Offline Blues

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #36 on: March 17, 2007, 08:13:28 PM »
Sorry for digging up a semi-old topic, but It's been dug up before and I just felt like adding something.

Imo, people are either to vehement in trying to say she was raped or wasn't, and it comes down (again, my opinion to this) to that we don't know what really happens between Casca's "torment" and Guts "rescue" attempt. The way its shown to -me-, there's a clear gap of time (whether it be a minute or twenty) until Guts shows up. I think people under-estimate how "massive" the area was, Judeau and Casca witness Pippin's battle (and assumed death at that time) and had enough space to run wide with a horse and not go "Why my good sir, isn't that Guts on yonder fighting for his life yelling at the top of his lungs with the sound of flesh being ripped asunder!?"

In other words, while there was chaos everywhere, it was clear to (me) at least that there was so much chaos and space (this is even visible when the eclipse starts) and regardless (er, Casca wasn't a virgin, just to those citing blood as clear reason) Casca was not in the same exact state at the closing of the previous episode. If they just threw her down for awhile or just moved her or even raped her, I think its up to "personal interpretation"  with no clear intended set, Miura is leaving it up to the audience for a sense of suspense.

I don't see why people think Griffith/Femto cares about how "unclean" Casca is. All of the hawks were sacrificed and branded, and as seen with Wyald and the apostles prior Femto's ascension, they just wanted to feast/enjoy themselves, they had no intention of keeping Casca clean for him. They were attempting to violate her regardless, they weren't trying to keep her nice and tidy. Also, to my knowledge, Femto raped Casca out of an intention to injure/hurt Guts, not because of some inane lust or just wanting to do it (feel free to correct me on this). If both had died prior, it simply wouldn't have happened. The apostles were lawless, they were trying to kill Guts and the Hawks, they were the intended sacrifices. Again, to me there is no right answer, just assumptions and personal guesses that are left up to each individual.

Offline Locus of Agony

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #37 on: March 17, 2007, 09:14:52 PM »
But then we have to argue over whose assumption or personal guess is right! :guts:

Seriously though, given the sheer size of some of those things, it's doubtful she'd been penetrated much before Femto's awakening. Assuming she was it couldn't have been the creatures we see holding her up upon Guts arrival, she simply wouldn't have survived.

Then again, as you said, since there is no way to be sure, a personal guess is all we have.
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Offline Blues

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #38 on: March 17, 2007, 09:59:07 PM »
well as you said its just personal assumption, nobody is right or wrong here. For all we know, she was passed around the block 20 times till she landed there or they simply moved her to the place and point we next see her.

In my perspective, the fingers/hands had already touched her in "inappropriate" places and she wasn't bleeding profoundly from them during that moment or when Guts arrived, so as to why the inner thigh was so suggestive, who knows, but for some reason I do agree its more theatrical/dramatic to assume it lead up to Griffith's intervention.

Offline Circe

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #39 on: April 23, 2007, 10:55:44 PM »
I personally think she was. Not anything huge or sticking anything in. @__@ possibly? But we already saw that a few apostles wanted to, namely the first big one we see. That gorilla one I can't remember his name =.= gomen. But hey they've got tentacles and they ripped off her clothes screaming oooh a woman a woman. *shrugs* To me as a girl makes me think holy crapola they're doing something bad! They may not have penetrated her, but they damn well touched her. Those tentacles were going up her thighs and every which way *shrugs*. And hey I haven't seen many apostle penises, which I wouldnt' want to anyways but you never know there could have about 20 down there that are just a bunch of spurting tentacles.

Rape is basically when someone says no but the other person keeps touching them in "naughty" places. So to me thats rape, does that mean she was penetrated no. Possibly. We'll never know unless she comes back and mentions it though I seriously doubt she would.

No, she was not raped by the other apostles.  She might have been... sexually totured but not raped.

The reason is... If you look back on how Griffith first met Casca he saved her from being raped.  Casca even refered to him as an "angel"... he gave her a sword and made sure she was covered.  So he gave her a life that she could live for.

God I love that post Gurifisu! I have to agree, BUT I also have to disagree as well. When I was re-reading that part Griffith says something along the lines of Just because your a nobleman does not mean you can act like a god. Well Griffith once he becomes Femto is considered a god, so now he believes he has the right to. Not only that but he wanted to show Guts who she truly "belonged" to. We all saw how he got on top of her when he was ill, or atleast he tried to. To me I thought he was showing he wanted her and then he heard her talking to Guts and now the man he hates yet loves takes the one thing he thought would always follow him no matter what. SO to me the apostles weren't allowed to really penetrate her, raped her yes in my opinon, but no penetration. That was something their "god" was allowed to do. *shrugs*

Offline Okin

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #40 on: May 29, 2007, 10:09:07 PM »
I know its old but I have to respond to this:
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yeah I remember that, it was like a parking cone with a giant bee-stinger.

in the anime when I saw that I was like "noooooooooooooooooooooooooo"  because I remember seeing this horrible sack of crap anime, Urotsukidouji, where this guy put his weiner in this girl then she swelled up like a soda can and exploded, then his penis started absorbing people souls and was as big as a train (I am not kidding).  Me and my friend Deannie like to joke about this.

I may have to start up a thread in the miscellaneous section, for speculation on why Japanese artists are so obsessed with huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge tentacle penises (penii?)

HAHAHAHHAH! :troll: Thats the craziest anime ever, and I know about the tentacle crap. (I wish I didn't :judo: )

At first, it looked to me like she was violated through and through before Femto was hatched, but you've all made many convincing arguments. The cuts and blood could have been caused by the way the Apostles were handling her, but there's a difference between what a tentacle and a horn made out of solid bone would leave. I would say its pretty obvious she wasn't treated politely by the Apostles, but the focus on how she was overwhelmed by Femto and the fact that one rape by a horrible monster is plenty to make their child what it was makes me believe she wasn't full on penetrated by the Apostles. The advent of being gangbanged by horrible monsters that just killed and ate all your comrades is plenty to make you feint I think.
Course I wouldn't know..lets ask the local rape victim! :troll:

In conclusion, the Apostles did stuff to her, but only Femto penetrated her, otherwise the demon-child would look more like a piece of pulled-pork than a deformed fetus. Mmm....pulled-pork
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #41 on: May 30, 2007, 05:43:13 PM »
The cuts and blood could have been caused by the way the Apostles were handling her

Could have? I think that part's obvious, you pretty clearly see the claws cutting her skin.

otherwise the demon-child would look more like a piece of pulled-pork than a deformed fetus. Mmm....pulled-pork

Real subtle there dude...

Offline Okin

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #42 on: June 01, 2007, 04:06:49 PM »
Considering the topic, and the fact that I've only recently encountered pulled pork in the last 10 years I don't think so. But I admit I'm being pretty unsensitive so I apologize.
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Offline Pakman

Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #43 on: July 18, 2007, 03:29:34 PM »
Besides, Femto's not gonna get sloppy seconds.  He's a Godhand damn it! ;D

lol this ought to end all speculations. Why would the "prince of darkness" get sloppy 2nds, 3rd, 10th???? I mean, there is just no way.
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Offline Phemt81

Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #44 on: August 03, 2007, 05:13:35 PM »
For starters getting gang raped by a bunch of monsters is something not even Miura would be likely to show, so it would make sense for them to jump to another scene for that alone.

Not really, Miura showed that kind of images for Wyald, so, yeah he would have shown apostles raping Casca if they did.
Casca was not raped by minor demons.


But like Gurifisu said, it's the narrative quality that clinches it.  Griff saves her from rape, creating her identity.  Griff-as-Femto saves her from rape...  just to rape her himself, destroying her identity.

Awesome interpretation, and i agree.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #45 on: August 03, 2007, 05:23:31 PM »
Not really, Miura showed that kind of images for Wyald, so, yeah he would have shown apostles raping Casca if they did.
Casca was not raped by minor demons.

You're missing Sparnage's 2 years old point. Wyald didn't actually rape Casca.

Offline Phemt81

Re: Was Casca raped in the Eclipse by the apostles?
« Reply #46 on: August 03, 2007, 07:50:43 PM »
You're missing Sparnage's 2 years old point. Wyald didn't actually rape Casca.

I didn't say it, i meant that Miura shows sexual abuses when they happens, just like Wyald did during the rescue of Griffith.
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