All things that glitter are not gold

I'm wondering if Farnese's visit to the noble party played a more important part than Farnese's own soul searching. When the nobles were being attacked by the pishachas, Farnese lunged for the silver lantern than for any conventional weapon. I'm wondering if this could have triggered some thought process in the nobles where they start experimenting with silver to combat astral creatures. Silver is an expensive commodity in the Berserk world and only the nobles have the means to acquire it, but short of obtaining elemental weapons or enchanting a weapon by slaying apostles, it seems to be the only method for non-magic users to fight astral creatures. Perhaps Lord Vandimion will become an obstacle in Griffith's plan to become king if Vandimion becomes recognized as the generous noble funding an elite regiment equipped with silver to deal with Ganishka's familiars.

you're drawing a lot of assumptions based on a seemingly meaningless aspect of Farnese's actions. I think that action was meant to show a maturity/bravery in Farnese that her family was not aware of before. I highly doubt that the conclusions brought about would lead to some kind of arms race for silver.

You know, that's an interesting idea you have here. Regiments equipped with silver to fight against familiars and other supernatural beings... But I see a few problems. First off, I'm not sure the nobles understood that silver was the key to defeat the tigers, even though Farnese told Roderick about it. But since it's hard to say we can give them the benefit of the doubt. Second, the war is happening now. To have silver weapons (armors would be a bit heavy) forged in large quantities would take time, and by then he Neo Hawks might have ended the conflict already. Third, will Vandimion go out of his way to oppose Griffith by equipping a whole army? He's not a general, and he's not even Griffith's enemy for now, they're more or less on the same "side." Fourth, would soldiers and generals even agree to it? I'm sure they'd find it fanciful and inconvenient without hard evidence. Fifth, even if all of this happened, I don't really see it hindering Griffith's ascension to the Midland throne. Queen Charlotte is his lover basically, so he can be a legitimate king by marriage if he wants to, and nobody can oppose him by brute force save for the Kushans (for now).

Now some other possibilities that occurred to me while reading your post: The fact the nobles saw Guts and his group deal with the Pishacha, with Vandimion's daughter among them, might (or not) give them something to nuance Griffith's prowesses with (I'm mainly thinking about Federico de Vandimion here). Also, in the eventuality that Griffith will become a tyrant in the future, Vandimion and others could create and fund a resistance group, using silver weapons to try to fight against his apostles (not very likely IMHO and I doubt it'd work very well, but since we're at it...).

Just one small point, silver weapons worked fine on the trolls and the tigers, but nither of those are apostles. IMHO nothing really points to the fact that they could actually harm apostles (any more than the conventional weapons could).
As for "La resistance" I'd put my money on Farnese's mother, there seems to be more to her than meets the eye, besides she comments that lord Vandimion is sort of a coward.
Just my take, feel free to disagree.

vlad said:

Just one small point, silver weapons worked fine on the trolls and the tigers, but nither of those are apostles. IMHO nothing really points to the fact that they could actually harm apostles (any more than the conventional weapons could).

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Well it's hasn't been shown so we can't say it's sure, but in essence they're supernatural creatures with a corporeal body, so it's not impossible either. I really wouldn't be surprised if silver had an effect on them. Now like I said I don't think it'd work very well anyway because of the fact they're not pure astral beings like the trolls (plus they're inherently stronger anyway), just like it doesn't work as well on familiars due to their hybridism (part astral, part material), but I think it'd still provoke a reaction, no matter how small (at least some smoke or something like that).

It's in the same vein than what happened with Schierke's hair (burst into flames) when she used it against an apostle in Flora's mansion in volume 26. The reaction was actually not as spectacular on trolls when she used it first in volume 24 (it didn't seem to touch any of them though), but it was enough to make them flee instantly.

I'm with CnC on this one. The point of that scene, in my opinion, was to show how much Farnese has progressed from a cowardly, mischievous pawn in her mother and father's eyes into a brave and intelligent woman of the world. She wasn't overtaken by the intense and dire situation. She overcame her fears and took action. The silver property being used was just the backdrop for proving that, and also highlighted her recent exposure to the world of magic.

Aaz has already pointed out the nobles' ignorance to the properties of silver and the feasibility in producing silver armaments so quickly. But that's not even to mention the difficulties any would-be general would encounter in rousing the nobility enough to actually FIGHT. Most of them would be completely worthless on the battlefield, silver weapons or not.

I guess this sort of fits in with topic...

but would a silver weapon be able to 'hurt' Ganishka's fog form?

Malachai said:

but would a silver weapon be able to 'hurt' Ganishka's fog form?

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Nope. You need something that has astral qualities for that (like the DS).

I'd also like to mention how Sir Vandimion was trying to make everyone at that party, think that these creatures had no supernatural aspect to them. So for him, (or anyone who wants funding from the Vandimions), to accept that those creatures weren't just an illusion from a drug, or some hybrid tiger, is going to be pretty hard... given their veiw of the world.

So in other words, for them to start using silver weapons, they're going to have to accept that these creatures attacking (and saving) the city... are "supernatural" creatures, that have something to do with magic, and are real.

Abstraction said:

I'd also like to mention how Sir Vandimion was trying to make everyone at that party, think that these creatures had no supernatural aspect to them. So for him, (or anyone who wants funding from the Vandimions), to accept that those creatures weren't just an illusion from a drug, or some hybrid tiger, is going to be pretty hard... given their veiw of the world.

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Don't underestimate him too much though, he was mostly calming the crowd and diverting their attention, making it so that his daughter wouldn't be accused of being a magic user (a disaster for their family). Besides, Schierke confirmed that part of what he was saying about the creation of the tigers was true. He's a brilliant orator (the point of that scene), so if Miura wanted it so, I don't think Vandimion would have trouble bullshitting his way through it and convincing people that silver works better on the mutated beasts (by drugs and crossbreeding of course!), even if he himself knows better about their nature.

I was just pointing out that he would have to admit that these creatures were supernatural in order to start a silver weapons forgery. (which he really didn't want to, even though it slapped him in the face that they weren't normal) So he'd have to admit he doesn't know what's happening, (which he also didn't want to do) instead he trys to rationalize a situation, without all the information.

Abstraction said:

I was just pointing out that he would have to admit that these creatures were supernatural in order to start a silver weapons forgery. (which he really didn't want to, even though it slapped him in the face that they weren't normal)

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Not necessarily, like I said if we go so far as to imagine he'd start a movement to forge these, he could very well use the same kind of excuse he already provided once, and that is partly true: that these creatures are specially breed and all that. Then inventing some reason why silver works well on them, maybe because they're allergic or whatever else he could find. The point is that he could convince people to do it without openly saying "hey they're magic monsters," even if people would know the truth deep down. Not to mention that after all that happened these guys may be willing to believe in magic anyway (Ganishka even appeared in front of them, and made quite an effect on everybody... And the night's not over yet).

Also, while he insisted and managed to convince the nobles that these monsters weren't magical (in fact it was mostly about the elves), it wasn't so much because of his own beliefs but rather because he didn't want them to panick and then to start accusing his daughter of being a witch. That was basically damage control on his part (the main characters comment on it and praise his acting skills), I don't think you're seeing that aspect of the scene. He basically managed to put on an act that convinced people even though everything went against him. It's a demonstration of his impressive charisma.

Yeah.. I was going off of the premise that further on down the road, he'd actually tell them what they're dealing with, and not have to lie, or misconstrued things to get this done.

I agree.

Aazealh said:

I don't think you're seeing that aspect of the scene. He basically managed to put on an act that convinced people even though everything went against him. It's a demonstration of his impressive charisma.

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Oh no, I definitely caught that. It reminded me of (hypothetically) a preacher being faced with scientific proof ,that life exists on other planets. But would still find a way to justify it somehow.

It's also a demonstration of his ignorance, to the world he lives in.

Abstraction said:

It's also a demonstration of his ignorance, to the world he lives in.

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Sorry to insist, but I don't think so actually. It's more like he knows about it to some extent (as I said, his explanation is actually half-correct from what Schierke said), but willingly lies about it to the others to prevent trouble among the nobles. He doesn't care about the fact they're magical monsters or that there are elves in the room, he's just more concerned about the public image of his family and that's why he quickly deviates the topic after dismissing it as a drug induced illusion. He also played it cunningly in that regard by implying that the nobles were falling into the Kushans' plans by believing what they were seeing, and that other people would make fun of them.

Let's not forget that we don't know much about his character, but that he seems quite knowledgeable in general, and not one to be taken aback by such supernatural manifestations. He looks like a pretty pragmatic guy to me. It's shown by how quickly he regained his composure, and how little time he needed to assimilate the situation. In spite of his strong influence within the Holy See he's really a businessman, not a clergyman, and I don't think he's so narrow-minded that he wouldn't acknowledge magic when he saw it (and then again, like I said he seemed to know about it to some degree). Now of course that doesn't mean he's an expert in the magic field, but from the dialogue in that scene, he appears as being perfectly conscious that he's actually saying bullshit, but does so nevertheless for the sake of keeping the nobles in check. This is how Guts & co viewed his performance as well; consider these lines of dialogue:

Schierke: In a way, it's impressive.
Guts: Your father is a tough guy.
Farnese: ...I also think so...
Lady Vandimion: Confronted with so much fact...
Lady Vandimion: As usual, he amazes and impresses me.
Lady Vandimion: Of course, he is more of an actor compared to Magnifico.

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Well, ya got me there.... (not a big surprise to you I'm sure)...lol

I'll go ahead and ag..... ag.... agree. DAMN!

I'm with aaz. I don't think Vandemion's ignorant of whats actually right in front of him, quite the opposite. His ability to sway the crowd was indeed impressive. ....that and it looks like the nobility isn't the smartest bunch around.

....that and it looks like the nobility isn't the smartest bunch around.

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That's been a running theme since 'The Golden Age'.

Besides the obvious problems of limited supply and unsure investors, there is a third problem. Namely, pure silver has very poor tensile strength. Swords or spearheads made from silver would bend, twist, or break off after one or two uses. Silver arrows might be a better option.