Author Topic: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY  (Read 5227 times)

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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« on: August 08, 2002, 02:09:43 AM »
I saw this in the #Hawks IRC the other night and thought it could be better determined here.
They were trying to determine the exact dimensions of the dragonslayer to get it's weigh.

So, what are the weight and dimension of the massive sword?
Thickness of the blade is not a fun calculation, don't forget, it gets thiner in the middle.(I've seen this clearly SOMEWHERE).  Average is the best bet.

It is just a "slab of iron" so density is easy to find.

Probably been done before.  But I don't look through ancient threads.  I bet a bunch of people don't either.  It can be fun to go back over old ideas anyways.  At least it is fun for the newbies.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2002, 07:26:29 AM »
Uh huh.... Being GIVEN the answer isn't any fun.  
Were those BOTH suposed to be threads? One just goes to the Misc threads.  
The other goes to a different post which wasn't what I was looking for.  You may not I had a few posts on that thread.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline crazyCelt

Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2002, 06:04:43 PM »
I did a very rough calculation before using the density of iron and it came out to around 410 lbs. This is just assuming the Dragonslayer is a rectangular prism so I would guess that number is off by about +/- 20 lbs. neglecting the handle, tapering width, and the triangular prism that makes up the edge of the blade. Of course the dimensions to begin with aren't definite so it's certainly anyone's guess.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Gael

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2002, 08:51:21 PM »
umm i'm from australia, what are lbs in kilos? or even pounds?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin_Gatsu

Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2002, 11:38:39 PM »
It's 2.2 pounds per kilo.

Also, it's more than likely that the Dragonslayer is made from something other than iron.  I've actually done a lot of reading on bladesmithing and I'm currently an apprentice to a blacksmith  ;).  Pure iron is not commonly used for weapons because it is too hard.  It's more likely the dragonslayer is made of a high carbon steel, or wootz (damascus) steel.  Although I know quite a bit about swords, I don't know how one would even begin to forge a blade of that size.  Casting it would make it too brittle, and just hammering and moving the metal around would take many, many blacksmiths.  The closest thing I know of that is hand forge and around that size is an anchor.  Well, probably not all anchors... but I remember reading somewhere that they used to at some point forge anchors that way... so being able to make a blade like the dragonslayer would be possible... albeit incredibly insane and difficult to forge.  It would take years...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2002, 06:23:41 AM »
Ok then.  Consider what materials Godo had available when he made it.  Umm I DON'T know much about metals, but I doubt Godo could get those.
I assume by iron being hard, you mean that I is brittle or something.

I doubt that the dragonslayer would be made from a lump of metal.  It probably had the basic shape to start with.  A slab of metal.  You then, basicly, just have to bevel it.  If you watch the opening of the first ep of the TV series, it shows Godo working on it.  
He is a master blacksmith  afterall.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2002, 09:39:52 AM »
Quote
Ok then.  Consider what materials Godo had available when he made it.  Umm I DON'T know much about metals, but I doubt Godo could get those.
He is a master blacksmith  afterall.

So why do u think doesn t he have the connections to get the required materia or any other rare element he needs!
i mean how do u think he became a master of his "art"!?
or why has he the reputation of one!?
think bout it!
...
...
..
.. ... ... .. right he had to proove it several times and not only by quantity or good blacksmith skills but by the outstanding quality of his weapons that are demanded even by the king!!

-maximus
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2002, 01:30:27 PM »
My point was not the availability of materials as much as what materials could be produced.
I have no doubt that he could get any known materials he wanted.  Especialy when he is making a sword for the king.
Its more a question of what metals are known.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Drachenfels

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2002, 01:21:41 AM »
EDIT:

Posted too early...

Anyway, I think Godo could have made a Damascus stell sword, the best sword in the middle ages(which was only avaiable in the near east, like araby, i think). Since Berserk takes place in a wannabe-middle-age world, I think it would certainly be possible.
Not that forging the DS would be possible anywhere except a fantasy setting, of course...

Offline Maximus

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2002, 02:40:18 AM »
Quote
My point was not the availability of materials as much as what materials could be produced.
I have no doubt that he could get any known materials he wanted.  Especialy when he is making a sword for the king.
Its more a question of what metals are known.

don t forget the power of magic that is definitely part of the Berserk story!^^

-Maximus
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2002, 10:43:36 AM »
Ah, but untill Godo saw that apostle he didn't belive in the supernatural.  

I wouldn't rule out that Godo has superhuman strength like Guts does.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2002, 10:53:35 AM »
AAUUUaaaauuuuuAAAAUUUGH!!!

The DS isn't forged in a normal way! Godo made it for a joke! He just got a big slab of IRON, cut the shape and sharpened the ends. Its not made the proper way! It not laboriously turned and hammered! It was a joke, so Godo most likely bodged it!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2002, 02:43:30 PM »
Quote

The DS isn't forged in a normal way! Godo made it for a joke! He just got a big slab of IRON, cut the shape and sharpened the ends. Its not made the proper way! It not laboriously turned and hammered! It was a joke, so Godo most likely bodged it!

NO it was definitely not just made for fun!
it was ordered by the king to create a sword that could even kill dragons!
so godo did his best and created this huge weapon with all his power,will,skill and heart!(i guess^^)
yet it was none of his buisness who the f.... could ever use this weapon!


@majin tenshi:
i don t believe either that godo has supernatural powers.
yet it doesn t mean that he has no connections that might be touch with magic!
he might just buy  rare or special materials from such people and doesn t care how they got to get these things...!?
what do u think!?


« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin_Gatsu

Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2002, 02:58:44 PM »
If no normal human can weild the sword, who used it to kill the dragon?  And what do we know about dragons in the Berserk world... not much!  For all we know, the blade could be enchanted by the dragon's blood or it's soul, or maybe the previous bearer of the sword did something to it. ???

Hm... maybe we are straying from the original topic here  :P
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2002, 03:00:21 PM »
Hmm? I remember reading somewhere that the King ordered it, and Godo made the Dragonslayer for a joke, because he didn't beleive dragons existed. And the King almost had him killed for it, because no man alive could lift it.

Think about it, would YOU make something that absurd if you were going about it seriously?!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Kuroi-san

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2002, 03:07:47 PM »
Quote
If no normal human can weild the sword, who used it to kill the dragon?  And what do we know about dragons in the Berserk world... not much!  For all we know, the blade could be enchanted by the dragon's blood or it's soul, or maybe the previous bearer of the sword did something to it.  ???


There _was_ no orginal bearer of the sword. The DS was just sitting in Godo's armoury gathering dust, until Guts came along.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin_Gatsu

Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2002, 03:22:00 PM »
Maybe I read a bad translation of Godo's speech about the Dragonslayer... In the translation I read he said "The king was sick" and that he made the sword "because he was the only one there".  Godo said that the dragon was killed by his blade but he didn't know how.  There was no mention of his disbelief in Dragons in this translation.
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Offline Olivier Hague

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2002, 07:05:03 PM »
Quote
Maybe I read a bad translation of Godo's speech about the Dragonslayer... In the translation I read he said "The king was sick" and that he made the sword "because he was the only one there".  Godo said that the dragon was killed by his blade but he didn't know how.  There was no mention of his disbelief in Dragons in this translation.

That "translation" is crap. Sorry. ^^;

Offline Majin_Gatsu

Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2002, 08:27:44 PM »
Quote

That "translation" is crap. Sorry. ^^;



I figured as much   :P...  They dub Rickert as saying "Kickass!" when he sees Zodd put his arm back on after the Eclipse  ::)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Maximus

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2002, 03:20:24 AM »
Quote

They dub Rickert as saying "Kickass!" when he sees Zodd put his arm back on after the Eclipse  ::)

hehe... he..he...h...? :P
these translations surpise me over and over again... :o


« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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Offline Majin Tenshi

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2002, 04:13:46 AM »
I belive that Godo would do his best with any weapon he made.  He wouldn't make a piece of junk.

"Godo said that the dragon was killed by his blade but he didn't know how"
Godo doesn't believe in dragons.  That is the reason for the "joke" everyone talks about.  He made the sword so "it could kill a dragon" like he was asked.  It wasn't his fault it would take a sword no one could swing to kill a dragon.


EDIT:  That translation sounds like one of those stupid outakes from the DVDs....
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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2002, 05:58:25 AM »
Quote
If no normal human can weild the sword, who used it to kill the dragon?  And what do we know about dragons in the Berserk world... not much!  


I think it was once said(maybe a bad translation) that only the fact that he can't be overcome by humans makes a dragon a true dragon. So in some sense, Griffith could be the Dragon...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »

Offline Maximus

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Re: Dragonslayer - How absurd is it EXACTLY
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2002, 06:42:03 AM »
Quote
I belive that Godo would do his best with any weapon he made.  He wouldn't make a piece of junk.
Godo doesn't believe in dragons.  That is the reason for the "joke" everyone talks about.  He made the sword so "it could kill a dragon" like he was asked.  It wasn't his fault it would take a sword no one could swing to kill a dragon.
EDIT:  That translation sounds like one of those stupid outakes from the DVDs....

Agreed!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 11:00:00 PM by 1031209200 »
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