Author Topic: Puck!  (Read 9214 times)

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Offline omega-anime

Puck!
« on: May 29, 2006, 03:15:15 AM »
Kuri Puck is one of my favorite characters in the manga/anime. He can get serious or become very funny haha... plus he can imitate a lot of different actors. So, I can't wait till they meet the elf king.

Notice how puck never mentioned a word about him?

Offline Chiba

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2006, 06:43:44 AM »
In my opinion Puck is a little too funny lately, it feels like it can't be serious for even one page anymore. But apart from that I like it too. :guts:

Online Walter

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2006, 07:18:35 AM »
In my opinion Puck is a little too funny lately, it feels like it can't be serious for even one page anymore. But apart from that I like it too. :guts:
Maybe you're just too serious?   :serpico: 

Puck's wit has been increasing in the past few volumes.  He's not just comic relief anymore, but provides a commentary on events (how can you not appreciate his Kundalini gag in 274?), especially when he relates it to things in our (or at least japanese) culture.

...Look what you made me do.  Now I'm talking all serious about Berserk's best comedian.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2006, 10:45:15 AM »
Notice how puck never mentioned a word about him?

It'd be hard not to notice it since Isidro and Ivalera actually question him on the matter when they learn about the Hanabufuku Ô from Schierke (in episode 238). And his answer is pretty enigmatic too... What a mysterious character. :SK:

Offline puella

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2006, 11:57:40 AM »
Many people overlook the greatest things Puck did. :miura:
He saved Guts even twice! Who else saved him in the manga? SK?
Other than that, Puck has always been supervising and worrying about that reckless man.
As for his jokes, I often saw some members complaining about that. I think it's mainly because they can't understand the jokes in Japanese. It's a bit helpless because jokes are one of the most difficult things to translate. Sometimes I also have a problem understanding English/French jokes and they never sound funny to me.
The best way is to learn Japanese and their culture. That's why I often took much time tracing Puck's jokes in the manga, because I'm not Japanese. :puck:
But if you can't do that, at least you should try to understand the context instead of disregarding it: that's the way to go.

Ok, I'll stop ranting now. This message board is too small to talk about Puck's great role in the manga anyway. :puck:

Offline Chiba

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2006, 12:50:43 PM »
Maybe you're just too serious?   :serpico: 

Puck's wit has been increasing in the past few volumes.  He's not just comic relief anymore, but provides a commentary on events (how can you not appreciate his Kundalini gag in 274?), especially when he relates it to things in our (or at least japanese) culture.

...Look what you made me do.  Now I'm talking all serious about Berserk's best comedian.

Stop spoiling, I haven't read past volume 29 yet. ;)

A joke every now and then is fine, but I have the feeling that you see Puck more in Chibi form than in its actual look. I like to see Berserk as a serious story and don't want too many jokes in there.

But maybe I really misunderstand Puck's role, I'm currently re-reading the manga (read it 3 years ago for the first time) and I'm now up to volume 14 and already found a ton of new things which I didn't understand or misinterpreted before.

Offline vlad

Re: Puck!
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2006, 01:41:54 PM »
Many people overlook the greatest things Puck did. :miura:
He saved Guts even twice! Who else saved him in the manga? SK?
Other than that, Puck has always been supervising and worrying about that reckless man.
[/quote/]
While I agree with you on this, it feels like his role back in the Black Swordsman days was also to get Guts back in touch with his humanity. He did stick around during that most crucial period, despite Guts' best effort, which I doubt many would be able to.
Messed up with quoting - should start from "While I agree..." sorry.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2006, 01:54:00 PM by vlad »

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2006, 01:46:53 PM »
Stop spoiling, I haven't read past volume 29 yet. ;)

I don't think Walter was just referring to post-29 volumes actually, so that's not much of a spoiler, don't worry.

I have the feeling that you see Puck more in Chibi form than in its actual look.

Well it's not the case. You can realize it pretty easily by taking a close look at episode 274 for example. People just don't pay enough attention to details, and the elves are often relegated to the background these days (leaving space for other characters to develop I guess). That's one of the reasons Puck's witticisms may appear to be standing out to you, because they're less easy to skip while reading.

I like to see Berserk as a serious story and don't want too many jokes in there.

If you think there are too many humorous lines and that they detract from the rest of the story then maybe you should simply reconsider the way you see Berserk as a whole. Sometimes people's expectations and beliefs don't match reality, it's a recurring problem with Berserk.

But maybe I really misunderstand Puck's role, I'm currently re-reading the manga (read it 3 years ago for the first time) and I'm now up to volume 14 and already found a ton of new things which I didn't understand or misinterpreted before.

Could be. It's also hard not to miss or misinterpret things when one doesn't read the original directly from the source unfortunately, like Puella said.

While I agree with you on this, it feels like his role back in the Black Swordsman days was also to get Guts back in touch with his humanity. He did stick around during that most crucial period, despite Guts' best effort, which I doubt many would be able to.

I think that was supposed to be included in the "Puck has always been supervising and worrying about that reckless man" comment.

Offline vlad

Re: Puck!
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2006, 02:14:46 PM »
I think that was supposed to be included in the "Puck has always been supervising and worrying about that reckless man" comment.
OK, I guess your interpretation makes more sense, especially in this case :schierke:

Offline general zig

Re: Puck!
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2006, 10:33:16 PM »
Do you think it was a good decision to not include pluck in the anime? They could of put him in the first episode and maybe for a split sec now and then. It could of still came out to 25 episodes.
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Re: Puck!
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2006, 10:39:49 PM »
Do you think it was a good decision to not include pluck in the anime? They could of put him in the first episode and maybe for a split sec now and then. It could of still came out to 25 episodes.
Because of the way the anime adapted (omitted) sections of the manga, Puck's true role wouldn't have played out until later in the story. And since the scope of the anime was focused on the Golden Age arc, including Puck would have been a distraction.

It sucks, but it makes sense from the anime producer's perspective, since they wanted to (apparently) make the series self-contained.
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Re: Puck!
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2006, 05:05:17 AM »
Puck stinks.

Well no, but his Chibi form is over-used. It's just really distracting to have Guts in some dire circumstances and the rest of the party tense as hell while Puck is there going  :puck: and stuff. STOP IT, MAN. YOU'RE KILLING THE MOOD.

And I know Aaz or Walter will pop in and go "Hey, stupid, you're wrong because..." and they're probably right but even still...I will always be annoyed by chibi Puck.

Normal Puck's great, though.

Online Walter

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2006, 05:46:26 AM »
"Hey, stupid, you're wrong because..."
Well... you are  :puck:  Comic relief (specifically not taking a story too seriously) is a necessary aspect to all good writing.  By your logic above, you  probably also didn't like Guts making wise cracks throughout volume 10 ("STOP IT MAN, YOU'RE KILLING THE MOOD! FOCUS ON THE GRAVEYARD INFILTRATION, OK?!").

Hating Puck seems to be a really typical trend in newer readers of Berserk.  Maybe he's just an acquired taste for some people? Anyway, you should really look at all sides of the story before you start harassing one of the most popular characters in the series (and drawing flame from everyone here who likes him...).
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Offline Griffith

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2006, 07:34:51 AM »
Come on, do the Sunday comics ruin the newspaper? That's what Puck is (literally at times, and that's when he's at his best IMNSHO). I don't even really notice him beyond that; I mean, I look forward to and appreciate his jokes (and insight), but he doesn't stick out or spoil scenes for me (just another dimension). As a matter of fact, his being "over-used" is probably the reason why; it's a staple of the series (has been since, and was even addressed directly in, Lost Children). If Miura only did it randomly and out of nowhere every once in a while, then it would be awkward and stick out like a dripping facet... but as it stands, it's like the steady humming of a refreshing air conditioner. =)

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2006, 12:11:43 PM »
And I know Aaz or Walter will pop in and go "Hey, stupid, you're wrong because..."

Hey stupid, you're wrong because...

Anyway, these moments can also be taken as self-parodying and in a way even as a form of author commentary. They're what saves the series from taking itself too seriously, and far from detracting from its perfectness, they actually contribute to it. Over the years I've come to realize that people's incomprehension of Puck ("Kuri" or not) is most often a simple question of immaturity on their part, and that no amount of explanation will make them see the error of their ways.

Offline Judo

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2006, 02:13:55 PM »

I get what you're trying to say, but isn't it an issue of taste after all?

If you like certain elements of the story or not, is imo just conditionally a matter of maturity.
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2006, 02:27:20 PM »
I get what you're trying to say, but isn't it an issue of taste after all?

Obviously, bad taste plays a big role in it. Awful tastes and shitty opinions can't be reasoned with, but fortunately these people usually don't stick to Berserk very long (there are exceptions, like for everything). That's another way to put it, but I prefer to be more tactful.

If you like certain elements of the story or not, is imo just conditionally a matter of maturity.

Yes, under the condition of not having bad tastes to begin with of course, though the two are often intertwined. This poses the question of people that read Berserk for the wrong reasons.

Offline Judo

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #17 on: June 26, 2006, 03:00:01 PM »
well, whoever reads Berserk just because of "MUCH BLOOD", "BIG MONSTERS" and "FREQUENT RAPE SCENES" has my pity for missing the best part of it.

But isn't there a little difference in not realising things like charakter-development or cultural references at all and disliking Puck?
Rock Concert Manual #237:
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Offline Aazealh

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2006, 03:07:41 PM »
But isn't there a little difference in not realising things like charakter-development or cultural references at all and disliking Puck?

It amounts to the same, and since the same people are concerned most of the time, I'd say no. Besides, it's not a matter of disliking a character here but saying he's perturbing the story. That's quite an assertion. Now, if this thread has to keep going, how about talking about the character itself instead of trying and failing to justify bullshit (sorry, I mean opinions and tastes)? People's incapacity to understand/appreciate certain elements of the story is only interesting to them and therefore shouldn't be exposed in specific character threads but rather in their own separate ones.

Offline Funkmasta Zeph

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2006, 08:08:18 PM »
The comedy in berserk is what it keeps it from being an overdramatic attempt at being SERIOUS COMIX.

Most of it actually helps make the series more human (yes, even Puck sometimes).
Being all frowny and glum is not what realism is about. If you want realistic humane characters, by god. They must make comical observations sometimes.

That was my main problem with the anime, and one of my favorite things about Berserk.
Its range and dedication to all spheres of human interaction.

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2006, 11:26:47 PM »
There's certainly more to discuss about Puck than whether or not you appreciate his comic relief.  :puck:  Puck’s our introduction and emotional link to the entire species of Elves (specifically piskies).

Many enigmas still surround Puck's relationship to his home, the much-anticipated Elfhelm.  For one, we don't really know why Puck left home in the first place (he says that he was “bored.”).  It could simply be there weren’t enough human children to play with in Elfhelm, as Puck really seems to enjoy playing with them in the human territories.  But as the creator of this thread mentions, when asked why he never spoke about the power of Hanafubuku Oh, Puck remains silent. This has led many to speculate that there may have been a falling out between Puck and the king, or just among the denizens of Elfhelm in general.  However, there are still other unexplored possibilities.

The more I read about the history of the elves through Flora and Puck, the more I think they as a species may now resent humans for having become ignorant of their existence.  While children, Guts and his Band are a large exception to this general rule, there used to be much more interaction between humans and elves.  Because of the sweeping changes that Holy See spread over the human world, areas where elves used to live have been abandoned (many examples of this, primarily the mountain near Godot’s Hut, and the tree Puck comes across in the Misty Valley). But, where’d they go? I don’t think they would have died simply because they were continually ignored.  The situation is more like the two species just stopped being friends.  I think they may have all migrated to Elfhelm, which may have become a final safe haven (and melting pot, and boiling kettle for human rejection) for their kind in a world over-saturated with human ignorance. 

In that atmosphere, I somehow think that Guts and his party wouldn’t be well received. Especially if they’re actually harboring an elf-criminal :puck: and a young, if somewhat talented witch :schierke:

PS: Then again, after I've written this whole huge monster, I think it may actually be more likely that Elfhelm will just be crazy party island  :guts:
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Offline Trashcan

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2006, 05:21:43 AM »
And after being Crunched, Munched, Slashed, Bashed, Beaten, Burned, Zapped, and half-Drowned, Guts deserves the chance to booze up and black out with the best of them.
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Offline TheBeast43105

Re: Puck!
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2006, 04:55:51 PM »
I find it funny when people say that other people are wrong because the persons opinion is different than their own.
 
Anyway, I think Puck is cool. The humor is well integrated into the seriousness and drama of Berserk in my opinion.

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Re: Puck!
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2006, 05:33:29 PM »
I find it funny when people say that other people are wrong because the persons opinion is different than their own.
Well I don't find it funny when people turn a thread that's just generally about "Puck!" into a popularity contest and a peanut gallery shouting match.  While we could be seriously discussing the character, all you care to do is mock others and give your one-line opinion on the matter.  Thanks, it's really helping the thread go places.

So, ok guys. We get it: not everyone likes Puck. Can we move on, please? I have a huge post above that could easily take the thread in a new, constructive direction.
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Offline vlad

Re: Puck!
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2006, 05:50:47 PM »
Quote
the more I think they as a species may now resent humans for having become ignorant of their existence
It is possible, but IMHO the playfull nature of the species does not indicate that they would become resentfull. I'm leaning more in the direction of kind-of acceptance that things have changed and that they can't do much about it. This would lead them to choose "exile" and keeping with those humans that seem to be more attune to the natural (for lack of a better word) order of things.
Quote
I think they may have all migrated to Elfhelm, which may have become a final safe haven
That would seem plausible, but there could still be other places that do not get mentioned simply because humans don't notice them. This is speculative and probably irrelevant, but it could matter in case  that your theory of Hanafubuku Oh (and Puck) proves true.