Griffith
With the streak of a tear, Like morning dew
N7Paladin said:I've recently started watching the Sopranos since it was added to Prime.
Spoiler: Still the best show.
N7Paladin said:I've recently started watching the Sopranos since it was added to Prime.
Griffith said:I didn't think there was a novel, but just the screenplay written and directed for film by Crichton?
Griffith said:Anyway, yeah, despite seeming super pretentious to start it wisely was more down to earth and pretty good that way throughout, and didn't cheat the audience with it's intrigues...well, except the part where it subverted our expectations by dangling those "bigger mysteries" only to ultimate come back around to what we expected in the first place, but with gratification delayed for season 2; if they'd told us up front no robot uprising until season 2 we'd have revolted.
Griffith said:I thought they did a good job paying things off, like they came out and had a stance on most of the questions they posed instead of leaving it up to us or just folding it into another mystery.
Griffith said:I appreciated Ford's takes throughout for this reason, even when he was being evil.
Griffith said:Of course, the danger here is the writers really have freedom to BS at any time. Anybody can be a secret robot, or a robot following programming, or be brought back as a robot, or as their real human counterpart because the one that died was a robot, etc, but hopefully the show won't fall into that or at will at least have fun while doing so.
Anybody can be a secret robot, or a robot following programming, or be brought back as a robot, or as their real human counterpart because the one that died was a robot, etc.
Salem said:I will eventually finish the season, but initially this very thought of how the series would play out haulted me from much enjoyment. I made it a few episodes in and lost interest. Hopefully I'm wrong.
Aazealh said:Oh yeah you're right. I always assumed it was based on a novel because it's a Crichton story, but the book is just the screenplay.
Aazealh said:I wasn't bothered by the plot, and in fact I'm not particularly in a hurry to get to the straight-up robots vs humans part. I certainly hope it'll be more nuanced than that actually.
Aazealh said:I did find the whole "mixing 30 years ago with today" thing a bit cheap though, because it means a lot of the characters and settings didn't change at all in that span of time, and I find that unrealistic. Young and old William also don't really look like each other. I get that it serves the big reveals and it was well done, but it still is kind of a cheap trick. A few other things were lame but overall I got what I came for.
Aazealh said:Yeah, I thought a lot of things hinged on the last episode and I was pleased with what they did.
Aazealh said:I was pleased with how his character turned out, but I felt that the change from "devious, evil schemer" to "benevolent old schemer" was too sudden. The only thing carrying it was Hopkins' masterful acting.
Aazealh said:Yeaaahhh and I already have expectations about this for S2.
Salem said:I will eventually finish the season, but initially this very thought of how the series would play out haulted me from much enjoyment. I made it a few episodes in and lost interest. Hopefully I'm wrong.
Walter said:It's a card they CAN play, but they have (thus far) been judicious and meaningful about how they have played it.
Griffith said:BTW, can we talk about the soundtrack? Not the pop song remixes but the cool ambient stuff that sounds right out of Mass Effect (which I'm happy they used it liberally).
Griffith said:I went through the same process of looking for the book and being like, "Huh, he didn't write a book (that's what he does)? I guess they're really making all this up like new... Probably for the best."
Griffith said:Yeah, at some point I realized what they were doing was more what I wanted than the expectations, but at the same time, they still need to navigate those waters in season 2 now. I hope they still have a nuanced plan as you suggested, because the whole thing is a bit reductive unless you're a true misanthrope like Ford.
Griffith said:In retrospect it sure feels like it's not worth the time investment, so to speak,unless we get a lot more from it and Harris in season 2. One thing about it I did like was that the man loves robot trope was ultimately subverted and Harris didn't have some come to Jesus moment because Delores remembered him. It's so the expectation that I wouldn't have even blamed them, but of course not, he was who he became for 30 years and that's rarely undone in 30 seconds. That's about the only thing that makes it special and not worse than if he were just Logan.
Griffith said:So, did Ford have Delores shoot a host version of him because he doesn't have Arnold's conviction and/or couldn't resist seeing how it all played out or was his conviction to be reincarnated as one of them, our evolutionary successors, like Bernarnold? And will they get right to this or does it hinge on if season 2 is a hit without him? =)
Griffith said:Finally, when do we find out you're really a host created to be some perfect curator of Berserk information? I mean that as a compliment of course, "Aaz, what are these sketches Miura did of you?" "They don't look like anything to me." =)
Griffith said:I also appreciated Felix, whose still a fucking moron unless he's outright Ford's agent, having that "Am I?" moment only to have Maeve admonish him.
Griffith said:BTW, can we talk about the soundtrack? Not the pop song remixes but the cool ambient stuff that sounds right out of Mass Effect (which I'm happy they used it liberally).
m said:One of the things I didn't like was howFelix and Sylvester just went along with whatever Maeve told them to do, as the given motivations for why they did it were really hard to believe (to me at least).
m said:Another thing I didn't quite like is how they handled the dual timeline situation, particularly how the show seemed intent on keeping confirmation of it as some sort of big reveal. Because of the way they did things in general one had to go over what had happened in previous episodes and consider the information given then in light of new information presented in the latest episode, and I'm not sure that's a good way of going about things, at least I'm not a fan of such an approach.
Aazealh said:... to the point that I'm surprised it wasn't revealed Felix at least is a host... And I'm still not ruling that out for season 2.
Aazealh said:That closely mirrors what I said in my previous post!
m said:But who knows, perhaps it's not the case and this is one more reveal they're holding on to for as long as they can.Didn't Maeve already confirmed that Felix is human? It may have been when he realized that Bernard was a host.
Oburi said:You guys realize I started a thread for Westworld back in July of 2014? http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=14384.0
I thought it was going to be very interesting at the time (I always thought the original had a really cool concept and it would be perfect for an updated version) but it seems I was the only one . Sadly I haven't had time to watch it yet but I will soon hopefully.
Aazealh said:She did, but I don't think she's necessarily a reliable indicator. She's still following her programming, unlike Dolores. It'd only be a matter of her being programmed to not see that he was one.
m said:I for one liked all of the soundtrack, pop song remixes included. Part of the fun of watching the show was wondering if I would recognize any of the songs
Aazealh said:The original movie still laid down a foundation that this show is very clearly built on. And for what it's worth I think the original is superior in several areas. This is by all means a successful reboot though, and I wish every reboot was as reverential and on-point as this one.
Aazealh said:Yep. And for all the enjoyment I got out of seeing Dolores destroy Old Billy ("oh what ravages time does, one day you'll die and become dust, the dust I will walk on as an immortal new ruler of this world"), this kind of super bitter, super cold and dehumanized rationale doesn't really go well with the rest of her character. The same way Maeve's "calculating queen bitch" mode just doesn't make for a credible "boohoo my poor daughter" transition.
Aazealh said:I think we will get more of it. Dolores and William's story isn't over IMHO. And I think he might even end up waxing poetic about how different things could have been had she truly awoken all those years ago, when he first fell in love with her. That would work best if he was dying at her hand as he delivered it, of course. I would vastly prefer that to something lame like Maeve killing him. UNLESS she did as Dolores was forgiving him, herself not having the heart to kill him after all.
Aazealh said:P.S. Speaking of Logan, that was such a confusing conclusion for him (Where'd he go on that horse? Did he die? Did he go crazy? ) that I kinda expect to hear more in the future.
Aazealh said:Well you just about summed up my main Ford hypotheses. I think resurrecting him as a different, younger host (played by an actor who would cost a lot less) would be the easiest – and probably laziest – option.
Aazealh said:That had me genuinely laugh to myself on the train while commuting.
Aazealh said:Hahaha, I don't know man, he's TOO stupid for me to be honest. They probably should have fleshed out his humanistic reasons and/or cowardice better...
Aazealh said:Yeah I enjoyed it, even the intro, the piano stuff...
Oburi said:You guys realize I started a thread for Westworld back in July of 2014? http://www.skullknight.net/forum/index.php?topic=14384.0 I thought it was going to be very interesting at the time (I always thought the original had a really cool concept and it would be perfect for an updated version) but it seems I was the only one . Sadly I haven't had time to watch it yet but I will soon hopefully.
Aazealh said:Sorry bro, you were too early.
Griffith said:I still haven't seen it (maybe this weekend)! But it sounds cool and I'm even a bit disappointed they didn't find a way to make it canon to the show. I'm just glad they're largely extrapolating from that rather than butchering a much larger original work.
Griffith said:You big romantic.There is potential there though, like he could still be wormed into her heart (which would be significant considering her change), and show the capacity of humans and hosts alike to be evil but also to change and be redeemed. Plus, she's basically put on the black hat now and it's a thin line between a righteous fight for life and a massacre (and the humans presumably don't get to come back).
Griffith said:This was a topic of derision among friends; so, humble William falls in love with a robot, goes berserk and physically assaults and humiliates the heir to the company and dad and the board is just like, "Screw my son, have my daughter you don't love and the company!" I guess William's newfound dominanmce simply translated back to their real lives (Logan was practically ugly crying, "You're an animal!" at the end)? Maybe they just didn't record everything back then and Logan came off looking more like a loser lunatic. *shrugs* =)
Griffith said:BTW, wouldn't Richard Attenborough have been even better as Ford, since he's the proto-Ford anyway, and he would contrast even better when things got heavy?
Griffith said:Me too, and I've got a minor challenge for you if you're game: which Mass Effect track is "Freeze All Motor Functions" making me think of?
Walter said:I guess I was preparing for something in LOST territory, delivered verbally, paired with shitty horns/violins blaring, cut to commercial.
Walter said:William is man in black. The Maze is a path to consciousness. Dolores is Wyatt, and the cannibalism shit was just nonsense, I guess? Dolores must gain the ability to kill a human, bypassing her previous limitations, to become truly free (and does). The uprising happens, putting Season 2 in a much more interesting spot. And last but not least — providing William with exactly what he wanted from the park (which made me think of Zodd in Fantasia )
Walter said:Behnahd (my favorite character) basically did nothing in this episode, except alluding to Maeve that she has been “awakened” before. Unsure of what to expect from him moving into the new season. He seems the most unchanged.
Walter said:Ford’s role subverted from evil monster to evil monster with a heart of gold for robots? Okay, I'll bite. But I'm willing to bet that Ford's role isn't actually over. His shadow will loom large somehow in season 2, or I think it would be missing something.
Walter said:Speaking of Season 2, there are a delightful number of ways it could go, and that's very refreshing for a show of this ilk. I'll always respect a good, ballsy new direction. The park can't (easily) continue to operate as things are, but I can foresee a comedic way of them starting the next episode by humans pretending everything is just fiiiine -- perfectly safe! The rumors of uprising are ex-exaggerated! A few glitches on the periphery of the world, well away from our sex saloon!
Walter said:That being said, I think the show still hasn't quite explored how out of control this could truly spiral, or even really dipped their toes into what kind of society or culture the hosts would make for themselves if truly "free." I'm hoping it's not just "humans but with longer life spans."
Aazealh said:Ehh, frankly I think they came pretty damn close. There's a lot of parallels and quasi-references that kind of make sense. I'll be more than happy to talk about it once you've seen it.
Aazealh said:Guilty as charged! And I just think it'd be more interesting than PURE EVIL or whatever, and also make better use of season 1 having been all about establishing their common history.
Aazealh said:Yeah I mean it could be explained a number of ways, but the fact it was left open felt odd to me, like this wasn't concluded and there's some more in store, even if it's just a mention in passing.
Aazealh said:Hmm I don't know, I mean Hopkins really brought all of his subtle creepy-viciousness to the role and I'm not sure Richard Attenborough had that same unease-inspiring power in him. He was more of a misguided old fool in Jurassic Park.
Aazealh said:SAREN!
Griffith said:Spoiler: Still the best show.
N7Paladin said:Finished it, you weren't kidding. It was fantastic.
Walter said:Fuck Damon Lindelof.
Griffith said:Sounds like a great show, assuming that's a euphemism!
Walter said:I started watching The Leftovers on HBO. First episode seemed promising, and I've heard it gets better as it goes. But then I noticed his name as the creator and writer. And now I can't watch it.
Eluvei said:it's set in the Lost Cinematic Universe (LCU).