Author Topic: Supreme King Aolsier: Previous DS owner (Read 21383 times)

Aazealh · « **Reply #25 on:** February 03, 2007, 08:34:52 AM »

Quote from: A.C on February 03, 2007, 08:27:29 AM

since Miura removed the pages with Aolsier, maybe we should respect Miura's wishes and not discuss him at all. perhaps it's better if we tried to remove the name from our memories. i'm sure that's what Miura would want.

Well, it doesn't hurt to talk about it... Episode 83 was also removed and we still discuss it anyway. Just saying... He's an interesting character, and a potential plot twist in the future.

Forest Wraith · « **Reply #26 on:** February 04, 2007, 02:00:21 AM »

Well, if Miura removed all mention of him, what chances are there of him ever making an appearence again? Not to say that I agree that he shouldn't be discussed.

Rhombaad · « **Reply #27 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:03:37 AM »

Quote from: Forest Wraith on February 04, 2007, 02:00:21 AM

Well, if Miura removed all mention of him, what chances are there of him ever making an appearence again? Not to say that I agree that he shouldn't be discussed.

It's not that we'll never see The Idea or Aolsier again, I think it's just that Miura felt he introduced them too soon and is saving them for later on in the story.

Aazealh · « **Reply #28 on:** February 04, 2007, 03:05:30 AM »

Yeah and he mentioned Aolsier again in an interview in 2003 that was published in Young Animal Arasi. Was just a passing reference but that means he's not completely forgotten about him.

Tzur · « **Reply #29 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:21:24 AM »

You wouldn't happen to have the interview, would you? I searched and found nothing.

Aazealh · « **Reply #30 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:47:11 AM »

Unfortunately I don't have that particular magazine and I don't think anybody made a transcript back then. If somebody could buy it from Yahoo! Japan auctions and scan it... But that's kind of a hassle.

Walter · « **Reply #31 on:** February 04, 2007, 05:55:32 AM »

Yeah, it's surpising how little info there is on such an apparently major character in the Berserk history. Very ... odd, don't you think?

All we really know is:

-He was the king for whom Godot forged the DS
-It's said he would appear again
-He may be related to Boscone, since they bear a pretty strong resemblance (at least, in this shot), and could be the exiled (dead/undead?) King of Tudor

Like Aaz said, if he's the original owner, and that's all we really know about him, it seems pretty clear he'll come back for it, if he comes back at all. It was never Guts' to begin with really...

That elemental ax looked pretty cool to me

Aazealh · « **Reply #32 on:** February 04, 2007, 06:44:17 AM »

Quote from: Walter on February 04, 2007, 05:55:32 AM

That elemental ax looked pretty cool to me

Yeah it was kick ass. I still regret that Guts didn't accept it.

Forest Wraith · « **Reply #33 on:** February 04, 2007, 10:02:48 AM »

Probably one of the most thick-headed things he's ever done . . . His more rash decisions you can at least understand once you know everything about Guts' back-story and his as personality . . . But in that case he didn't even bother to ask what it did:
"Oh, the Spirit Gnomes bury your enemies alive and crush them to death whenever you strike it against the ground."

That being said, I find it really weird that Miura would remove something as important as Aolsier's history with Godo and The Dragonslayer only to just have him pop up later on . . . Maybe he just really wants it to be a surprise?

Skullgrin140 · « **Reply #34 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:30:20 AM »

Looks like a really badass character, Wouldnt want to meet up with him. Still it would be interesting to see both him and Guts thrash eachother around, DS Vs DS

space_elevator · « **Reply #35 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:42:58 AM »

Hmm, if we examine that image carefully, Aolsier looks posed the way Miura draws characters leading battle charges, doesn't he? If we know he was the King of Tudor and the Dragon Slayer was forged during the Hundred Years War, it stands to reason he might have been a powerful field general. I'd venture this dragon that he fought was a powerful enemy from the Midland side. This dragon would've been similar to Zodd, a legendary battlefield figure who fought in certain battles in the war. Perhaps there's an ingenious twist to all this, and Aolsier is someone we've already seen with a double identity. Perhaps that dragon as well.

Putting aside speculation about Aolsier and relying solely on "Armament", I'd assume the dragon the king was trying to kill was an Apostle, if there was a dragon. The closest we've come to one so far has been Grunbeld, right?

bastard_swordsman · « **Reply #36 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:45:55 AM »

Quote from: Aazealh on February 04, 2007, 06:44:17 AM

Yeah it was kick ass. I still regret that Guts didn't accept it.

Let's be honest, if Guts used the Axe, he'd have broken it by now.

Aazealh · « **Reply #37 on:** February 04, 2007, 11:55:24 AM »

Quote from: space_elevator on February 04, 2007, 11:42:58 AM

Putting aside speculation about Aolsier and relying solely on "Armament", I'd assume the dragon the king was trying to kill was an Apostle, if there was a dragon. The closest we've come to one so far has been Grunbeld, right?

I tell you guys, it was Grunberd's brother. I have a hunch about it.

Quote from: bastard_swordsman on February 04, 2007, 11:45:55 AM

Let's be honest, if Guts used the Axe, he'd have broken it by now.

What makes you think so? It looked quite sturdy, and it was magical. I don't think he would have broken it.

bastard_swordsman · « **Reply #38 on:** February 04, 2007, 12:28:25 PM »

Quote from: Aazealh on February 04, 2007, 11:55:24 AM

What makes you think so? It looked quite sturdy, and it was magical. I don't think he would have broken it.

Hmm... I guess magic is an Infallible defense, in any argrument...
But I suppose the axe has other flaws. For example, in the fight against Serpico - the axe handle wouldn't provide a decent defense against falling rubble like the DS blade did. Or fighting the big whale things whose fancy Kushan name I've forgotten - he tends to have to resort to full-on imapling with the DS to kill them. Using an Axe, he'd have to chop away for a fairly long time. Still, my main point is that Guts is a swordsman, and possibly the best at that. Using the Axe could have given him some new magical tricks to play with, but it'd take some getting used to. Dozens of times, he's stated that the sheer size of the DS is all that protects him from the attacks of Apostles, so I think it's fair to say he made the right choice.

Judo · « **Reply #39 on:** February 04, 2007, 01:43:45 PM »

i bet that aolsier is the so called king hanafubuku.
since puck noticed some elvish-like aura on skully, it could be possible that aolsier has gone through a fate that has been very alike and has now reached his ultimate elf-powers wich allowed him to found his elf-kingdom on skellig.
or maybe he was washed up on the beach of skellig after a big sea-battle and made a deal with the elves(like with the god hand) to inherit their powers in order not to die.
of all berserk-characters, aolsier indeed holds the greatest potential... and grunberd arriving at elfhelm in order to seek revenge for his mother surely will boil down to a totally kickass fight between mr. firedragon and aolsier/hanafubuku.

Forest Wraith · « **Reply #40 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:30:14 PM »

Maybe the Elves are free-spirited enough to accept a Demi-Human as king but I don't see why Aolsier would bother changing his name. More then likely, they are two different people.

Dirty Dog · « **Reply #41 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:10:10 AM »

maybe he is a Skull Knight-like character, but is instead the "Dragon Knight"?

Anyway, could be that he needed it to kill an apostle that looked very much like a dragon, just look at the apostle on the cover to Volume 3 (looks like a dragon to me, anyway).
However, it seems odd that Godot would be sentenced to death for making the DS; since Aolsier was apparently able to hold it high with one arm.
Maybe he was too slow with it and died in battle by the hands of a human, and that's why Godot was sentenced to death? Godot did say "But it's nothing more than a burden when a tool goes beyond the ability of the owner." (according to puella's translation in the link that Aaz posted.)

Walter · « **Reply #42 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:22:23 AM »

Quote from: Dirty Dog on February 05, 2007, 02:10:10 AM

Maybe he was too slow with it and died in battle by the hands of a human, and that's why Godot was sentenced to death? Godot did say "But it's nothing more than a burden when a tool goes beyond the ability of the owner." (according to puella's translation in the link that Aaz posted.)

I think you're misunderstanding Godot's quote there. The DS had transcended its nature because it couldn't be used as a weapon by humans. Maybe Aolsier was something more?

Dirty Dog · « **Reply #43 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:26:57 AM »

Quote from: Walter on February 05, 2007, 02:22:23 AM

I think you're misunderstanding Godot's quote there. The DS had transcended its nature because it couldn't be used as a weapon by humans. Maybe Aolsier was something more?

I got that, I think you misunderstood me... I was saying that Aolsier died in a battle because he couldn't actually use it effectively.
And they sentenced Godot to death because the sword couldn't be used to kill humans, much less a dragon.

Walter · « **Reply #44 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:30:23 AM »

Quote from: Dirty Dog on February 05, 2007, 02:26:57 AM

I got that, I think you misunderstood me... I was saying that Aolsier died in a battle because he couldn't actually use it effectively.
And they sentenced Godot to death because the sword couldn't be used to kill humans, much less a dragon.

No, I got that, I just don't think he's dead, since it's been said he'll return. Godot was sentenced because his sword was a slap in the face to humanity, who couldn't possibly wield the DS, and conversely, who couldn't possibly surmount a dragon (which is why I think Aolsier was something more).

Aazealh · « **Reply #45 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:31:56 AM »

When people saw that Aolsier could use the DS, they started doubting his humanity. Kind of like when Silat saw the true face of Ganishka. So understandably Aolsier was pissed off, I mean he probably meant to pass for a human while being something more and that ruined his plan. Now the true question is what was his plan? Just my 2 cents.

Walter · « **Reply #46 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:33:42 AM »

I guess all this talk begs the question: does Guts match up to someone like Aolsier? If Aolsier is someone with superhuman abilities, and was the only other person able to wield he sword, what does that make Guts?

Aaz, what was Aolsier's plan? Probably to gather all the greatest blacksmiths in the country (world?) to create a sword actually capable of fighting dragons. Once he got what he came for, maybe there was no reason to "fake" being human anymore.

Dirty Dog · « **Reply #47 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:37:21 AM »

Quote from: Walter on February 05, 2007, 02:33:42 AM

I guess all this talk begs the question: does Guts match up to someone like Aolsier? If Aolsier is someone with superhuman abilities, and was the only other person able to wield he sword, what does that make Guts?

The biological son of Aolsier?

(hey, it's possible...)

@Aaz: that's very likely, but only because this is Berserk we're talking about...
@Walter's reply to me: probably more likely, in the world of Berserk...

SaiyajinNoOuji · « **Reply #48 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:41:01 AM »

Quote from: Walter on February 05, 2007, 02:33:42 AM

I guess all this talk begs the question: does Guts match up to someone like Aolsier? If Aolsier is someone with superhuman abilities, and was the only other person able to wield he sword, what does that make Guts?

Aaz, what was Aolsier's plan? Probably to gather all the greatest blacksmiths in the country (world?) to create a sword actually capable of fighting dragons. Once he got what he came for, maybe there was no reason to "fake" being human anymore.

I would almost willing to bet that its someone that we already have seen. Also if King Aolsier is on Elfhelm, I would imagine that Puck would have said something by now about a guy who somewhat resembles Guts whether it be his strength, demeanor, or what not. I know Puck is forgetful of tings but it seems like this would be one topic he wouldn't forget... maybe we will get it when they pan back to Guts and Co when they are traveling on the ship.

Aazealh · « **Reply #49 on:** February 05, 2007, 02:45:00 AM »

Quote from: Walter on February 05, 2007, 02:33:42 AM

I guess all this talk begs the question: does Guts match up to someone like Aolsier?

Before the Berserk's armor I'd have said no, but now... Maybe.

Quote from: Walter on February 05, 2007, 02:33:42 AM

Aaz, what was Aolsier's plan? Probably to gather all the greatest blacksmiths in the country (world?) to create a sword actually capable of fighting dragons. Once he got what he came for, maybe there was no reason to "fake" being human anymore.

Good question, but what purpose did that serve then? I don't think he only planned to kill a single "dragon" (apostle?). I'm curious as to what happened to him afterwards. SK seems to know of his existence, so the more I think of it the more I'm believing he'll show up in Elfhelm. Training Guts with the DS so he can take up the God Hand.

Quote from: Dirty Dog on February 05, 2007, 02:37:21 AM

The biological son of Aolsier?

Actually, why not. We've never seen or heard anything about Guts' father, and Guts' strength is incredible, beyond that of humans. If Aolsier is really the king of Elfhelm then that would make Guts an elfman, a theory that was pretty popular back in 2001.

The more we discuss this, the more I think it makes sense. I think we're on to something here.

Quote from: SaiyajinNoOuji-Trading Cards on February 05, 2007, 02:41:01 AM

I would almost willing to bet that its someone that we already have seen.

Hmm, but who? Maybe he's lying in wait for something to happen? You're not thinking of Ganishka, are you? Maybe he would have ordered the DS created to fight against Griffith?

Quote from: SaiyajinNoOuji-Trading Cards on February 05, 2007, 02:41:01 AM

Also if King Aolsier is on Elfhelm, I would imagine that Puck would have said something by now about a guy who somewhat resembles Guts whether it be his strength, demeanor, or what not. I know Puck is forgetful of tings but it seems like this would be one topic he wouldn't forget...

But do you remember Puck's strange reaction when the king of Elfhelm was mentioned? He stayed silent when Isidro and Ivalera teased him... It was very strange, I think he knows something he's not saying. Maybe he doesn't want Guts to discover the truth for some reason.