D
DemiAngel
Guest
Griffith finally gets his kingdom, marries princess Charlotte, and is portrayed as the ultimate hero of legend.
Then what?
Then what?
You mean Ganishka's ghost. =)Abul-Abbas said:Then it's Ganishka's time to shine.
Duststorm said:Anyone watched the end of cowboy bebop? Maybe Guts will kill Griffith at the cost of his own life.
Nonsapient said:How human is Griffith now?
Nonsapient said:his goal will end with him feeling far more hollow than the eternal striving did.
Nonsapient said:I have a hard time seeing Griffith turning into Satan and just persecuting the land for no reason (outside that of belonging to ).
Nonsapient said:I want to see Griffith regret. It will make him more real to me, where he hasn't really seemed so since the Eclipse.
Aazealh said:He's a supernatural being now, and as such it's normal that he hasn't seemed real to you. He's not a normal man anymore, even the characters in the story comment on how he's like a character out of a fairy tale.
Nonsapient said:How much of the original man remains in Femto, then, and how much is nothing more than Idea's finger-puppet? If that balance shifts too far to the side of finger-puppet, we don't have much room for drama between Griffith/Guts/Casca.
Nonsapient said:He can wear the Griffith 1.0 suit, but I think there may be more than just that sliver in him, even if it is repressed in order to hide from his weakness/pain/himself.("God no, of course I don't care about you guys any more... jeeze...")
Nonsapient said:How much of the original man remains in Femto, then, and how much is nothing more than Idea's finger-puppet? If that balance shifts too far to the side of finger-puppet, we don't have much room for drama between Griffith/Guts/Casca. After all, what would be your motivation in killing a robot dressed as your friend?
Aazealh said:Well, I guess a quick way of going about it would be to say that Femto is basically Griffith without anything good in him. Just pure evil. Like I said, it's hard to guess how he thinks or what he wants considering the amount of power and knowledge he has now access to. While he appears to be the same man as before, he's really not the same at all. As for being Idea's puppet, that's a little more complicated than that. You see, Griffith's whole life up to the Eclipse was planned so it would happen the way it did. Same for everything surrounding it. He was engineered specifically to become Femto. So in a way he was really always a "puppet" from the first time. The subtlety here, that I have explained to people many times in the past, lies with causality. Griffith does what he wants, and so do the apostles and the members of the God Hand. But they were created and the events around them were shaped in such a way that what they would naturally want is what the Idea of Evil wants them to.
Nonsapient said:The name Godhand
Nonsapient said:Arguing the amount of 'Idea Influence' versus Griffith in Griffith 2.0 is a pointless exercise akin to arguing how much of God is present in a biblical Jesus.
Nonsapient said:Beyond that, I've always possessed the (likely erroneous) feeling that Idea's influence over the Godhand was somewhat more direct than causal action.
Aazealh said:Just a quick note, but I never understood why people attach it. It's "God Hand". There's a space.
I'm not sure you understood what I told you, and your comparison seems clumsy to me. Griffith's life was completely manipulated from before his birth and up until he became Femto. Then, if we go by episode 83, the Idea of Evil told him to do as he wished. He is probably following an agenda that somehow goes along with the other members of the God Hand's own agendas (and ultimately, all of them together work toward a goal that the Idea of Evil set), but his status grants him more potential freedom now than he ever had before. I think you're just confusing yourself with your Griffith 1.0 and Griffith 2.0 appellations. I just don't see how the amount of influence the Idea of Evil exerts upon Griffith is related to the extent of his similarity to his old self. Those two things are on completely different levels and don't oppose each other at all.
What do you mean exactly?
Nonsapient said:The Idea-Influence in Griffith bit that I am talking about; It seems I've assumed/gotten the impression that some measure of Idea's will is present in Griffith/Femto. As in, the transition from Griffith 1.0 to Femto involved a substitution of Idea's Will for some of Griffith's own original nature. I can't figure out how I reached that belief, and now regard it as suspect, but maybe that will help you understand what I meant.
Nonsapient said:I've always viewed Causality as the larger stroke used to define the general form Idea is creating, with the God Hand being its brush for fine work. (I guess I got this from Guts as the struggler? In a purely deterministic world, he could never struggle against his fate, only fulfill it; Causality speaks to me of determinism).
DemiAngel said:Griffith finally gets his kingdom, marries princess Charlotte, and is portrayed as the ultimate hero of legend.
Then what?
avidwriter said:He's the "good guy" and he's mostly thought of as a murderous bastard. (again I'm not 100% of this but mostly from what I've read he's feared and hated.)
Aazealh said:By whom? Guts is mostly just an unknown wanderer. Whether people like him or fear him when they meet him mostly depends on the context of the encounter. As the Black Swordsman he's had a rather fearsome reputation, but we don't know the extent of it, nor what people truly think about it. I mean, what do you think the guys that lived under the Snake Baron's rule think of Guts' intervention in their lives? Or what about the people that were ruled by the Count? In any case, it's never been a problem for him when he came upon a new place. We've never seen people freak out saying "Oh my it's the famous criminal, the Black Swordsman! Run for your lives!" when first meeting him. Only the H.I.C.K.s were after him because of it, and they were mistaken about him.
einherjar said:As an aside... will Guts ever reveal his past to any of his companions?