Enough strawmans. Can we get some modus tollens please?
IncantatioN said:I guess I'm the only one who scored just 1 answer correct on that Test >_>' ... but hey, I'll take that!
supa_pokute said:I know it's too early to tell, but if they decide to do the black swordsman episodes after the golden age films, do you guys think they might omit the beginning scene with Guts and the apostile that killed Carcus? I'm curious since they left it out of the TV series.
frankencowx said:Enough strawmans. Can we get some modus tollens please?
I'm not familiar with that series, [Happy Potter] however I know for certain that it isn't a "perfect transcription of every detail" from the books.
Vinsssounet said:Aaaah, so agressive. I should have known better ; it's not like I had not read you before.
Vinsssounet said:- it could, as well, being the sword repaired. Those things happens.
Vinsssounet said:it could be that the sword was just not broken during the fight. It could be lost, out of range or whatever.
Vinsssounet said:As for WHY those changes ? Let's imagine a second for x reason they don't wish to integrate Zodd appearance during the siege, giving its sword to Guts. In that case, they might want Guts sword not being broken. Therefore, they should make the issue of the fight uncertain and show Boscone is not to be taken lightly, in another way.
Vinsssounet said:If they were to do such thing, I would certainly hope they would also show us in a different scene that Zodd "cares" about Guts survival.
Vinsssounet said:That being said, that's not that I would be specially happy to see such changes
Vinsssounet said:the thing is, as long as they did get the purpose of Zodd, and this part of what he desires is a part of the anime character, I wouldn't mind. It can be a pleasure to see newly imagined scenes, as long as it got the SOUL of Berserk.
Vinsssounet said:So, you made me invent exemples for the purpose of the discussion ; yes, I'm sure you can quote them one by one and show us how wrong they are ("WHAT ? an identical sword ? did we read the same manga here, because I seem to recall seeing this very sword was outstanding people, so it's not likely there would be lots of it").
Vinsssounet said:You might also ask me "and why shouldn't we see Zodd during the siege ?". We could imagine rythm issues, or the fact that throwing a giant sword at such range could look a little dumb in anime, or any reason.
Vinsssounet said:That could go endlessly, but my point is not to have accurate exemples
Vinsssounet said:I'm only stating, once again, that I don't mind about such changes if Berserk spirit is understood and present, and that the adaptation could have valid reasons to do such changes.
Vinsssounet said:I personally look forward new scenes, whether they are here because of adaptation need, or because they wanted to show us something new.
Vinsssounet said:I can get one would not be so happy to see such new things ; this becomes a matter of taste.
Vinsssounet said:Yet, on Zodd scenes we saw on the first teasers, we can see pillars having the very same details that are drawned in the manga ; this is quite some solid proof of a detail-oriented anime in my opinion. If they can pay enough attention to get a pillar right, then it is not lack of accuracy that makes them change an armor, a sword or anything ; it is a choice.
Vinsssounet said:And yes, I said "most part of the Harry Potter movies" were such thing ; never did I say they were entirely that. You should know better and not forget the "most", you don't like inaccurate, and it changes what I said to not include it, making it wrong, or right.
Draculoid said:The fact that her eyes a obscured definitely adds to the mystery/tenstion/mood of that character/scene especially when you start seeing Conrad and Ubik literally under the disguise. I would be quite dissapointed if they showed the old lady in her entirety throught that scene. Again with the whole adaptation/accuracy nonsense arguements but I just really feel revealing her in full does nothing but take away from that scene, there is no GOOD reason for it.
Vinsssounet said:I'd totally rather these movies respect Berserk, understand it and put the essence of it in a screen, even if I have to see some characters and chapters disappear, rather than a mindless perfect transcription of every single detail put alltogether without talent.
Theoden said:If he had to do it himself, would Miura really would do Griffith with this proper style? I believe it has some chances that, no, he wouldn't do the same because of his own style evolution, in some proportions and limits of course.
Theoden said:The point I try to make is there must be some substantial changes between the manga and a more actual animated version of it; simply because they couldn't imitate the evolution of Miura's style, it wouldn't make sense I believe, everyone knows that already I guess.
So, If Griffith has a different style, I can understand why, but that doesn't mean this one
http://www.skullknight.net/griffith/comparenew03.jpg
is the "right one"...
I assume Griffith ( the member not the character ) that you were mainly talking about his hair style; which tends to become more and more curly by the time. Once more I'm not saying that If you change the hair style then we're done, I never thought that. I can't really say what else is wrong on this Griffith because it's just the entire face that doesn't correspond...
Theoden said:Well it's definitely young Griffith because of the hair, the size of the body. So this old woman should be the one showing him he way to the castle.
So, I agree that this old woman isn't a main character and doesn't have the same importance than a Guts or a Griffith. But then again, it shows well that they doesn't seem to hesitate to clearly modify the way some characters does look like.
I was thinking : The less "important" the character is, the more they allow themselves to make changes; I hope it's not the case but with what we can actually see it tends to be that way; I assume there is no need to repeat the other character changes we saw, even in a trailer.
Theoden said:Good point... I really don't know and It's disturbing... Maybe I don't get enough culture ( well it's probable ) but I don't remember any other animation movie which could be as serious as the tone of Berserk; involving on the big screen these kind of elements ( like Wyald and his giant spiky penis-tongue ) . Don't want to repeat what you said but I don't feel very optimistic about this...
I guess maybe it's a private freedom only for the manga form...
Turkitage said:LOL! holy crap that's funny. I've never had a signature here before but you just earned a spot!
Vinsssounet said:- as Griffith suggested, it could be very simply an identical sword.
Vinsssounet said:As for WHY those changes ? Let's imagine a second for x reason they don't wish to integrate Zodd appearance during the siege, giving its sword to Guts. In that case, they might want Guts sword not being broken. Therefore, they should make the issue of the fight uncertain and show Boscone is not to be taken lightly, in another way.
If they were to do such thing, I would certainly hope they would also show us in a different scene that Zodd "cares" about Guts survival.
That being said, that's not that I would be specially happy to see such changes ; but the thing is, as long as they did get the purpose of Zodd, and this part of what he desires is a part of the anime character, I wouldn't mind. It can be a pleasure to see newly imagined scenes, as long as it got the SOUL of Berserk.
Vinsssounet said:You might also ask me "and why shouldn't we see Zodd during the siege ?". We could imagine rythm issues, or the fact that throwing a giant sword at such range could look a little dumb in anime
Vinsssounet said:or any reason.
Vinsssounet said:That could go endlessly, but my point is not to have accurate exemples ; I'm only stating, once again, that I don't mind about such changes if Berserk spirit is understood and present, and that the adaptation could have valid reasons to do such changes.
Vinsssounet said:I personally look forward new scenes, whether they are here because of adaptation need, or because they wanted to show us something new.
Vinsssounet said:I can get one would not be so happy to see such new things ; this becomes a matter of taste.
Vinsssounet said:Yet, on Zodd scenes we saw on the first teasers, we can see pillars having the very same details that are drawned in the manga ; this is quite some solid proof of a detail-oriented anime in my opinion. If they can pay enough attention to get a pillar right, then it is not lack of accuracy that makes them change an armor, a sword or anything ; it is a choice.
Vinsssounet said:I can tell you're not (and you're right to be, they don't deserve such attention), because, yes, most of it is a soulless transcription of what's in the book.
Vinsssounet said:PS : I'm glad to see Casca socks will not be forgotten so soon.
Vinsssounet said:PPS : oh my, it's gonna so terrible when I'll have to say that I don't appreciate the humor in BerserK. My my!
Draculoid said:Nice analysis of the old lady Griffith! I thought the same thing when it looked like the alley and Griffith running by. The fact that her eyes a obscured definitely adds to the mystery/tenstion/mood of that character/scene especially when you start seeing Conrad and Ubik literally under the disguise. I would be quite dissapointed if they showed the old lady in her entirety throught that scene. Again with the whole adaptation/accuracy nonsense arguements but I just really feel revealing her in full does nothing but take away from that scene, there is no GOOD reason for it.
Draculoid said:Also an interesting point about Griffith looking already "other worldly" in the Golden Age. I didn't really think about it too much but he certainly does look just about identical to how he does in the CMs they showed of him on the hill of swords. Not as bad as the old lady thing for me but still, definitely see your point here.
There's no reason to believe that anyone from the former anime's staff, Studio VAP, would now be working for Studio 4°C.MaN said:Actually, it would be interesting to know how many of the old animators are on helm of the anime project.
I believe it'll be for fans. Afterall, they went out of their way to say this, "The aim of the project is to make the movies faithful to the original."Which brings me to the burning questions "Who is going to be the target for the anime series? The Berserk manga loyalists or new readership/viewership". I really hope, as Griff has been saying, that they strike a good balance.
Not true. The beherit is introduced in the second episode, and Zodd is what, Episode 6? Giant minotaur with wings. That's pretty supernatural.The last anime project (IMO) had one purpose alone "Increase manga readership". Which is why as someone mentioned earlier, they got rid of everything supernatural until the last episode
Walter said:I believe it'll be for fans. Afterall, they went out of their way to say this, "The aim of the project is to make the movies faithful to the original."
Walter said:Not true. The beherit is introduced in the second episode, and Zodd is what, Episode 6? Giant minotaur with wings. That's pretty supernatural.
Walter said:BTW guys, we're launched a new section in light of the bustling activity on this thread the past month or so. Please think about thread ideas in the coming weeks and try to be constructive!
Truder said:Griffith's Berserk Anime Recut would fit nicely in this section.
MaN said:Actually, it would be interesting to know how many of the old animators are on helm of the anime project. It might just be that apart from Miura the people are mostly accustomed to drawing the characters as they look now (say last 5 years) and hence the cels showing Griffith, for example, are much similar to recent manga episodes then the Goldern Arc 'era'
MaN said:Which brings me to the burning questions "Who is going to be the target for the anime series? The Berserk manga loyalists or new readership/viewership". I really hope, as Griff has been saying, that they strike a good balance.
MaN said:The last anime project (IMO) had one purpose alone "Increase manga readership".
Walter said:BTW guys, we're launched a new section in light of the bustling activity on this thread the past month or so. Please think about thread ideas in the coming weeks and try to be constructive!