Author Topic: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?  (Read 2917 times)

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Offline Nosfy

Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« on: September 13, 2014, 09:27:36 PM »
Hi guys, this is my first post!
I've just finished reading the series and have been finding this forum's discussions really interesting!
I think this theory wasn't discussed yet, as I've used the search option to look for it, but if it's something that has been already talked about on the podcasts(which are really good btw!) or somewhere else, I am sorry and please feel free to delete this thread.

So most of you probably know what the Fibonacci sequence is, but if you don't here's a quick explanation from the Wikipedia page:
"By definition, the first two numbers in the Fibonacci sequence are 1 and 1, or 0 and 1, depending on the chosen starting point of the sequence, and each subsequent number is the sum of the previous two."
Following this rule we obtain the sequence:
1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144...

Something I've noticed is that some of Berserk's biggest climaxes story-wise have happened in volumes with numbers that belong to this sequence! Here are some examples:

Vol. 3 - First time we see the Godhand, following the fight vs. the Count
Vol. 5 - Nosferatu Zodd's first appearance
Vol. 8 - Guts leaves the Band of the Hawk
Vol. 13 - Eclipse's Climax
Vol. 21 - Griffith's reincarnation at the Tower of Conviction
Vol. 34 - Creation of Falconia
---
Vol. 55 - Miura said the story was 60-70% done in April 2009, and I quote a post from Walter from 5 years ago:
Anyway, let's reason this out to get a vague prediction of Berserk's future. Let's split the difference and say it's 65 percent through. That would mean the series would be complete at around volume 55 or so.
Knowing Berserk, the series will probably end with a big climax, right?
 
Some holes this theory may have:
 - What actually makes an "big climax story-wise"? I mean how can we compare Zodd's first appearance with, the Eclipse, Falconia's creation or even the end of the series?
 - I couldn't think of any "big climax" for the first three elements of the sequence (1, 1, 2)
 - There are clearly some events left out like:
     - Guts return to the Band of the Hawk (vol.9)
     - the reunion with Griffith (vol.10);
 - How come there aren't any significant climaxes between the volumes 34 to 55? What does that make of Elfhelm (Casca's supposed cure)?

So what do you guys think? Just a curious coincidence or may have Miura planned it to be like this?

PS - I am sorry for any grammar mistakes, I am still trying to get my english to be more articulate!

Offline Walter

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2014, 12:11:06 AM »
Hi! Welcome to SKnet.  :void:

Interesting assessment you've made, though I've never put much stock in numerology. Personally, I think you hit the nail on the head with your first self-critique of the reasoning:

- What actually makes an "big climax story-wise"? I mean how can we compare Zodd's first appearance with, the Eclipse, Falconia's creation or even the end of the series?
Bingo. You've picked events that occur in volume releases coinciding with Fibonacci's sequence, but aside from a few, the events seem rather arbitrarily chosen. If we were more comprehensive, I'm sure the pattern wouldn't be quite so neat.

The other thing is, Miura doesn't seem to care much about the actual volume numbering. Remember, those volume releases happen on the publisher's end. His schedule doesn't revolve around them. It revolves around the episode publications in Young Animal.

In terms of story structure, he's more concerned with story arcs. Events aren't punctuated around the volumes, but instead  flow organically. This of course leads to some awkwardness. There are a number of examples, but the biggest recent one is that Falconia's dramatic entrance happens in the first episode of Volume 35, even though it would have been the absolutely perfect conclusion to Volume 34, since that episode ends the Falconia Chapter AND the Millennium falcon Arc. A new arc (Fantasia) begins directly afterward, not at the beginning of a volume, but in the second episode of one. Also, every other episode in Vol 35 focuses on Guts' side of the story.

Anyway, don't be disheartened by it. I've read crazier theories!
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline IcePuck

Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2014, 12:16:24 AM »
I think you did a fine job of shooting down your theory by yourself. =) Just by looking at all the events/lack of events you mentioned, it's already 4 misses versus 3 hits by volume 10; what kind of a pattern or coincidence is that? You're performing the folly of selective bias.

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2014, 04:58:39 AM »
I don't think Berserk follows the Fibonacci sequence. You've seen yourself that your theory doesn't hold, even when you're purposely trying to prove it. Besides, why would Miura ever do that? It'd be pointless from an artistic perspective, a mere gimmick.

Offline Nosfy

Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2014, 09:25:50 AM »
Thanks a lot for your responses guys, this was really the first time I tried anything like it so your feedback is really important!

Offline Aazealh

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2014, 11:28:45 AM »
Thanks a lot for your responses guys, this was really the first time I tried anything like it so your feedback is really important!

No problem man, that's what the forum is for. I know it's never nice to see that an idea doesn't pan out, but that's a big part of speculation in general.

One piece of advice I would give for the future is to always be extra-critical towards the holes a theory might have. Try to debunk it yourself from all angles first. Doing things that way ensures that whatever theories are left standing tend to be reasonably solid.

Offline Oburi

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2014, 07:28:56 PM »

In terms of story structure, he's more concerned with story arcs. Events aren't punctuated around the volumes, but instead  flow organically. This of course leads to some awkwardness. There are a number of examples, but the biggest recent one is that Falconia's dramatic entrance happens in the first episode of Volume 35, even though it would have been the absolutely perfect conclusion to Volume 34, since that episode ends the Falconia Chapter AND the Millennium falcon Arc. A new arc (Fantasia) begins directly afterward, not at the beginning of a volume, but in the second episode of one. Also, every other episode in Vol 35 focuses on Guts' side of the story.

I think it's pure luck that the Millennium Falcon Arc just happened to start at the beginning of Volume 22. Other than Volume 1, it's the only time that's really worked out.

Offline Johnny Apples

Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2014, 10:39:33 PM »
Hi! Welcome to SKnet.  :void:

In terms of story structure, he's more concerned with story arcs. Events aren't punctuated around the volumes, but instead  flow organically. This of course leads to some awkwardness. There are a number of examples, but the biggest recent one is that Falconia's dramatic entrance happens in the first episode of Volume 35, even though it would have been the absolutely perfect conclusion to Volume 34, since that episode ends the Falconia Chapter AND the Millennium falcon Arc. A new arc (Fantasia) begins directly afterward, not at the beginning of a volume, but in the second episode of one. 
 


I know that this particular manner in which the last two episodes of the Falconia Arc were collected in the volumes 34 and 35 may have seemed odd or jarring to many fans, but I personally thought it was a neat little coincidence. For the final volume containing all-Millennium Falcon Arc/Falconia Chapter episodes to end with the one entitled after the upcoming arc, while conversely, the volume  that debuts the Fantasia Arc actually begins with the episode entitled after the preceding namesake arc's chapter. Accidental, unintentional stroke of creative genius on Hakusensha's part, if you ask me    :ganishka:

Offline Walter

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2014, 01:01:48 AM »

I know that this particular manner in which the last two episodes of the Falconia Arc were collected in the volumes 34 and 35 may have seemed odd or jarring to many fans, but I personally thought it was a neat little coincidence. For the final volume containing all-Millennium Falcon Arc/Falconia Chapter episodes to end with the one entitled after the upcoming arc, while conversely, the volume  that debuts the Fantasia Arc actually begins with the episode entitled after the preceding namesake arc's chapter. Accidental, unintentional stroke of creative genius on Hakusensha's part, if you ask me    :ganishka:

I'm afraid I'm going to need a flow chart to understand this explanation.  :???:
:femto: :slan: :ubik:

Offline Delta Phi

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Re: Does Berserk follow the Fibonacci sequence?
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2014, 11:45:52 PM »
Interesting, we just finished talking about the Golden Ration and Fibonacci sequencing in my 20th Century post tonal music seminar. After looking over a massive list of piece that supposedly fit into the ratio we all concluded that it was a bunch of bullshit. The margin of error that was required to make those pieces fit was so large it was amazing that anyone took (takes) this stuff seriously. You can find relationships in just about everything if you try hard enough