MICHAEL BAY'S transformers 2

[dwarfkicker]

Well I agree that the action in the first movie was bad at times and hard to make out, but IMO i enjoyed those scenes better. It was clear which autobots were fighting which decepticons, mainly during the final action scenes. And there was some slowmotion in the last movie that I kinda liked. The sequel didn't really have that, more explosions, more gunfire but the action wasn't any better, just more of the same. The only exception was the action scene early in the movie that I enjoyed where we first see optimus prime.

Well in that case, since you enjoy that kinda stuff I'll give it to ya
Not that I'm anyone special that you need my approval for liking something a certain way.

This is really the dumbest shit Hollywood has pumped so much money into, and I believe the success of films like this and America's decline in the education system are related.

You also gotta look at what Hollywoods been reduced to as well. How many original movies do we see anymore? We're mostly bombarded by remakes (Halloween, Friday the 13th) comic book (Marvel's got a ton more coming out), cartoon (Transformers, GI Joe, Thundercats, and Masters of the Universe) and video game movies (way too many to list here). All because the bigwigs are afraid to take a chance on anything fresh.

 

[CowTip]

Just saw it today with my brother. It was better than I expected, but that's not saying a ton. That said, I enjoyed watching it. There was lots of pointless action and plenty to make fun of. It was just a straight up popcorn flick. Some people can get into those, some people can't. There wasn't anything to take away from the movie persay, just fun to sit through if you leave your pretentiousness at the door. I wouldn't say there's much reason to see the movie a second time, but if you don't mind blowing 10 bucks just to watch some things blow up and laugh to some truly terrible jokes, then I'd recommend it. The first movie I walked away with a bad taste in my mouth and an extreme headache. At least at this one I had a little bit more fun. If you're trying to take the movie seriously, you're trying way too hard.

That said, my biggest complaint was that while the action scenes were better than the first movie, I still feel like there's too much where all you see is just a jumble of metal at extreme close up range. That and the final fight was way too short and anti-climatic.

 

[Oburi]

You also gotta look at what Hollywoods been reduced to as well. How many original movies do we see anymore? We're mostly bombarded by remakes (Halloween, Friday the 13th) comic book (Marvel's got a ton more coming out), cartoon (Transformers, GI Joe, Thundercats, and Masters of the Universe) and video game movies (way too many to list here). All because the bigwigs are afraid to take a chance on anything fresh.

O yea deff. It's not like Transformers 2 is any worse than...much else these days. I haven't enjoyed any movie i've seen in the theater this year (except maybe Drag me to Hell and Coraline.... and Watchmen). But thats what Hollywood has been reduced too.

 

[Griffith]

Hypocrisy? No. I do enjoy parody, and i laugh about everything, specially concerning "serious business" over the interbuts. That doesn't make me lowbrow, it makes you uptight.

Yeah, but you're having it both ways...

Meh, and it's not about movies, it's about supporting mediocrity.

Exactly, "serious business." =)

 

[Xem]

I haven't seen this movie nor do I plan to, mostly because I don't pay for movies I don't think I'm going to enjoy. Oh the LOGIC!.

BUT! I implore those people who criticize this movie based on the fact that Hollywood is just now failing at movie making, to go back and watch your supposed "favorites". I'm willing to bet you'll be surprised by how these new movies you compare to them really aren't any different. Hollywood is hollywood. Period!

Bottom line, get over yourselves and realize that when you were young you were less judgmental, and that these movies you put up on a pedestal are actually pretty shitty - just like what's coming out now. And hey, enjoy them in a light-hearted manner just as you enjoy the classics. Because over time, that's just what these movies will become.

 

[Aazealh]

Hypocrisy? No. I do enjoy parody, and i laugh about everything, specially concerning "serious business" over the interbuts. That doesn't make me lowbrow, it makes you uptight.

Oh you're lowbrow enough NightCrawler, please don't pretend otherwise. And just because you're a snooty killjoy whenever you don't like something doesn't mean you have good taste in anything either.

BUT! I implore those people who criticize this movie based on the fact that Hollywood is just now failing at movie making, to go back and watch your supposed "favorites". I'm willing to bet you'll be surprised by how these new movies you compare to them really aren't any different. Hollywood is hollywood. Period!

Bottom line, get over yourselves and realize that when you were young you were less judgmental, and that these movies you put up on a pedestal are actually pretty shitty - just like what's coming out now. And hey, enjoy them in a light-hearted manner just as you enjoy the classics. Because over time, that's just what these movies will become.

We must not have the same favorites then, because what you're saying here sounds like oversimplified bullshit to me.

 

[CowTip]

While I'm not going to argue that a movie like transformers is going to become a classic (though who knows, enough people watch the movie and enjoy it and it will be, even if it's just for the cheese factor), I will argue that there's always been a ton of shitty movies being produced and to claim that there was some golden age when shitty movies didn't exist is the larger piece of bullshit to me.

I'm thinking that people shouldn't be looking to the run of the mill summer popcorn flick for great cinematography. Everyone knew what Transformers was going to be before it came out. Everyone. If not, perhaps it's time you go look into Michael Bay and the first movie a bit more. I'll also make the claim that if you can't just turn your brain off to veg out just for the sake of doing so from time to time, then you probably have your head stuck way too far up your own ass.

 

[Aazealh]

to claim that there was some golden age when shitty movies didn't exist is the larger piece of bullshit to me.

Except no one said that. Meaning you don't have a point.

I'm thinking that people shouldn't be looking to the run of the mill summer popcorn flick for great cinematography.

No one's looking for great cinematography. Just decent cinematography, and maybe a little bit of originality. So, what are the great action flicks of our day? What's this year's Die Hard? Are you saying Terminator 4 is as good (or bad) as Terminator 1 or 2?

I don't care much for mindless generalizations, so please go into the details.

 

[Proj2501]

Oh man, this thread has turned into an absolute mine field. Here goes nothing.

To be straight with you all I haven't seen either TF film. Nor do I plan to. I didn't even watch the cartoon as a child.
Why? *Gasp* It wasn't my cup of tea. I liked Godzilla movies as a child and look how well that turned out. That was when I learned it's better to be safe and be cynical than set yourself up for heartbreak.

Now, that leads me to this point. It seems you've all gone from TF2 discussion to standards of what is deemed worth watching (or even liking) and what isn't.

It really does boil down to a personal taste. Someone can be labeled boring for liking movies like Casablanca, North by Northwest, Citizen Kane, There will be Blood, etc. Most people would argue that these are noteworthy films, for multiple reasons.

Flip side. There all people out there who LOVE titles like: Epic Movie, Cradle to the Grave, Scary Movie, etc. Me, I'd label these people as having 'questionable taste in movies'. I'd even go as far as to not socialize with people who enjoy these atrocities.

Different people watch and take away different things from different films. Some people will go to see a movie because there's a rapper and a super model in it. Some people will go because who the director, writer, composer is.

Ah....fuck this.

Some people have good taste and some just have bad. You know who you are. Stop supporting shit and demand quality. I think it's very safe to say there's many more production companies these days then there were 50 years ago. Meaning: more opportunity for subpar material to see the light of day. Sadly, as moviegoers (especially moviegoers with a sense of 'good' taste) we have to sift through garbage to come across something that stands apart.

Hopefully, with age comes better appreciation for FILM.

Really though, why argue over movies like this. Maybe if you're younger you'd be more passionate about this title. But I would think most people around here are of the older crowd. Fellas, this movie isn't really geared for intellectuals or even relatively smart people. It's tailored made for kids who will buy, buy, buy the merchandise.

 

[Griffith]

Hollywood has made, and still makes, most of the best movies. The whole, "Damn you, Hollywood!"

attitude is just a lazy pose we all take up once in a while. When Hollywood movies are good, they're not even considered "Hollywood" anymore because of how that's simply become a pejorative term. Anyway, there's always been plenty of garbage too.

That said, it's just as misguided to think today's bad movies will be remembered like yesterday's classics. Like Aaz said, that's just an oversimplification. Dwarfkicker was right on as well in his last post before the thread took this turn. There's more big movies being made today, and while there is more talent as well, there's just not enough to go around, and that's why there's so much creative "parity" out there, to put it nicely. And while there's going to be a generation gap among audiences, where kids today like movies we think are crap, movies like the Star Wars prequels are still never going to have the same impact, status or longevity as the original movies for a simple reason: they aren't as good.

So, let's spare ourselves the good-intentioned speeches on subjectivity, because if anything, while many have not held up, I've grown to appreciate even more just how truly well done some of my childhood favorites are. Something I couldn't recognize at the time, but I think we should all be able to recognize now when we watch a movie.

 

[yesmilord]

Just saw it last night.

You MUST take the movie at face value, because there's nothing put a pile of rubbish, product placement, boobs, and terrible one liners.

Enjoyable? Decently.
Recommend it? If you like special effects and fighting and robo guts. (robot guts, not robo-Gatsu)
Don't expect: anything except special effecits and fighting and robo guts.

Cheers.

 

[CowTip]

I had a long list of movies etc. that have come out in the last few years, but gGriffith and Proj pretty much sums things up for me. My only argument is that I don't think it's wrong for someone to enjoy a good mindless movie sometimes and I'd argue that for mindless movies, you can do a hell of a lot worse than Transformers 2.

 

[Oburi]

I love mindless movies, I love em! But IMHO Transformers 2 is the bottom of the barrel for mindless action movies.

 

[Judas Priestly]

I like it for what it was. You can't take a movie about robots from outerspace that blend in with human vehicles seriously. It's just a rollercoaster that takes you to one action scene to the next. The critics said that there wasn't any plot to the movie; they were wrong. It's there and not that really hard to follow. I can't really understand why every movie has to be Citizen Kane in order for some people to enjoy it. It's just robots beating the crap out of each other.

 

[Oburi]

Dude your just not getting it. Mindless action movies are fine, there are hundreds of good ones, but Transformers just isn't one. Like Aaz said, Die Hard 1 is just 100 times better than Die Hard 4. Terminator was 100 times better than T4. And it works the other way too, the new Batman movies are better than the old ones. Transformers is just one of those movie franchises that is bad. There is a right way to do it and IMO they just fucked it up. Honestly I could have wrote and possibly directed a better movie and more interesting movie. I think most people on this site could, I think even you could Judas Priestly.

 

[Aazealh]

I had a long list of movies etc. that have come out in the last few years, but gGriffith and Proj pretty much sums things up for me.

Griff, Proj and I wholeheartedly agree on the matter, so I'm fine with this personally.

My only argument is that I don't think it's wrong for someone to enjoy a good mindless movie sometimes

Of course it isn't. People can enjoy whatever movie they want. The whole "if you don't hate XXX you're stupid and should die" is just some folks being needlessly rude and intolerant. Effectively overreacting when they should just be apathetic. And I might accept that sort of comment if it came from a scholar with truly exquisite tastes anyway, but it's not the case.

and I'd argue that for mindless movies, you can do a hell of a lot worse than Transformers 2.

Can't comment on that since I haven't seen it.

And it works the other way too, the new Batman movies are better than the old ones.

That's debatable, depending on which ones you mean.

 

[Xem]

Dude your just not getting it. Mindless action movies are fine, there are hundreds of good ones, but Transformers just isn't one. Like Aaz said, Die Hard 1 is just 100 times better than Die Hard 4. Terminator was 100 times better than T4. And it works the other way too, the new Batman movies are better than the old ones. Transformers is just one of those movie franchises that is bad. There is a right way to do it and IMO they just fucked it up. Honestly I could have wrote and possibly directed a better movie and more interesting movie. I think most people on this site could, I think even you could Judas Priestly.

Why did you spend money on this movie again?

Also, I should note that I wasn't trying to compare this movie with what most of us consider "classics". It's just that a lot of the time we forget that our "favorites" don't necessarily hold ground with the new generations of today. And some of the movies we critique so harshly are probably going to become what we consider "classics" in the new generation. The first Spider-Man, Lord of the Rings, Dark Knight, or Iron Man for example.

 

[Griffith]

That's debatable, depending on which ones you mean.

60's Batman!

 

[Aazealh]

And some of the movies we critique so harshly are probably going to become what we consider "classics" in the new generation. The first Spider-Man, Lord of the Rings, Dark Knight, or Iron Man for example.

Those are carefully chosen examples.

By all means, all four movies you cited have mostly received good feedback. The Lord of the Rings trilogy has won 17 Academy Awards and has been nominated 30 times, for example. Those who tend to criticize it (like me) mostly do so because they compare it to the original work. I don't remember anyone on this forum (or at all, actually) saying they were bad movies in themselves.

As for those comic book adaptations, let me just make a simple comparison. On rottentomatoes.com, Iron Man is rated 93% fresh. Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen is rated 21% fresh.

Bad and good flicks have always existed. But like Griff said, the bad flicks of today don't compare to the good flicks of yesterday, and vice versa.

 

[Xem]

Those are carefully chosen examples.

I was actually going to edit my post because I thought them poor examples! Aside from Lord of the Rings anyway. I regretted not mentioning Sin City, American Psycho, and Braveheart. Though honestly I doubt these movies will be remembered in the same vein. Too much gore, I guess...

edit:: However I'm willing to bet the latest Star Trek will go down as a classic for ages to come!

 

[Aazealh]

I regretted not mentioning Sin City, American Psycho, and Braveheart. Though honestly I doubt these movies will be remembered in the same vein. Too much gore, I guess...

They're just not really the same genre. And Braveheart was released in 1995, so it's not exactly a very recent movie.

 

[Xem]

Braveheart was released in 1995, so it's not exactly a very recent movie.

Well now I feel old...


THANKS!

 

[DemonX v.2.0]

I love mindless movies, I love em! But IMHO Transformers 2 is the bottom of the barrel for mindless action movies.

I think your right. best movie of all time


Or I don't know. I thought this picture was very appropriate for this post somehow.

 

[Judas Priestly]

Dude your just not getting it. Mindless action movies are fine, there are hundreds of good ones, but Transformers just isn't one. Like Aaz said, Die Hard 1 is just 100 times better than Die Hard 4. Terminator was 100 times better than T4. And it works the other way too, the new Batman movies are better than the old ones. Transformers is just one of those movie franchises that is bad. There is a right way to do it and IMO they just fucked it up. Honestly I could have wrote and possibly directed a better movie and more interesting movie. I think most people on this site could, I think even you could Judas Priestly.

I know I could write a better Transformer movie, but it probably wouldn't appeal to a younger audience; more to the fans of the original 80's cartoon. I liked the angle in Transformers 1 that Bumblebee was Sam's protector. Maybe incorporate that to every autobot character creating a symbiotic relationship with human and robot. Dude, I could have written Star Wars 1 thru 3 ten times better than George Lucas ever did, but it ain't gonna happen. These movies are made in entertain the masses, not make sense. And you KNOW how stupid the masses are.

Not everyone likes the same thing so it's OK if you don't like Transformers 2 and OK if I do.

 

[Lithrael]

Didn't bother to see the last one in the theaters (found it a passable and/but dull mess on dvd) but I just gave TF2 a shot in IMAX. I'd have to say it was dumb as hell but I enjoyed most of it. Honestly I didn't care what else was going on after Soundwave showed up with Frank Welker's voice and pooped Ravage into the movie. Nice to see Starscream acting Starscreamy too, though sadly that was balanced by Megatron acting not at all Megatronney.

I think I'd be a lot happier with this whole end of the franchise if, for example, Starscream wasn't such a squat, ugly ass design. I'm mostly into Transformers for the toys, and the movie designs in general just aren't part of the Transformers aesthetic that I dig so much. They look like a mess and their faces don't do it for me at all. Although the TRU exclusive movie toy Bludgeon is pretty damn spiffy.