Mushi said:Yeah, sure wasn't expecting that one, it kind of makes sense in a crazy woman scorned kind of way, especially since she's trash... on that note, I hope the only reason he's concerned is because the knife was poisoned and has the antidote. =)
Anyway, fuck that, ZOMBIE-UEDA-4-LIFE! You guys see that shit!?
Mushi said:Anyway, fuck that, ZOMBIE-UEDA-4-LIFE! You guys see that shit!?
Whoops, my bad. I ment Dreft and his post about how "some random character who hasn't been seen for God knows how long"Baldulf said:No,I was thinking about the Kurando part.Didn't cath the action there.
The Akemi part was good and a surprise but not hard to understand.
Walter said:Akemi says something about having been Seijuro's woman on page 18 (printed page number), just before she throws herself in the rapids.
I should have spoiled out a few of my statements, and I have retroactively done so with mine and Uriel's posts. My rationale at the moment was: Griff, CnC and Uriel have seen it already. Who else actually keeps up with Vagabond on these forums?Mushi said:Have we just suspended spoiler tags here? Glad I read it first, you guys even add pictures ("here's the best moment!" =).
There's always the possibility the wolf who dragged Ueda in from the fields will have one last chomp of justice. But seriously, yeah I personally think this is the end of the arc.Akemi will probably represent the last, most surprising, strike of anyone connected to the Yoshioka ("look out, Oko has an axe, Musashi!"), but it's like Takuan told him, all those people had family and ones they loved, that loved them too.
Up next, Farmer Musashi! Or, Edo.Time to get out of Kyoto. =)
Walter said:My rationale at the moment was: Griff, CnC and Uriel have seen it already. Who else actually keeps up with Vagabond on these forums?
Walter said:There's always the possibility the wolf who dragged Ueda in from the fields will have one last chomp of justice.
Walter said:But seriously, yeah I personally think this is the end of the arc.
Up next, Farmer Musashi! Or, Edo.
Walter said:PS:BaldulfDreft, we last saw Akemi in Volume 21. So, it wasn't that random really. You can even sort of see her considering this action in vol 21, when Seijuro perhaps jokingly suggests her using her charms on Musashi to make him "lose his edge." You know... this all reminds me of when he stepped on that nail just after he thought he was unstoppable in volume 12. He always gets brought back down to earth.
Well, her crush on "Takezo" was pretty petty, and she's had at least a year with Seijuro, even allegedly been engaged to him, so it's pretty clear where her REAL affections were, I think.Dreft said:I wonder what was going through her head, as she felt an affection for both Seijuro and Musashi.
Yeah I tend to agree, however for this situation, I wasn't even aware the chapter was out yet, so what do I do but click the thread's title on the main index, and it takes me to the newest post, which may or may not contain spoilers. So, you see for the brief time after the episode is released, I think spoilers should be tagged. After a few days/weeks, it's fair game.About the spoiler tags... The fact that this is a topic about the newest vagabond chapter, shouldn't that be enough evidence that there will probably be spoilers in this topic? That people should read the chapter
first, and after that, the discussion in this thread?
Walter said:Well, her crush on "Takezo" was pretty petty, and she's had at least a year with Seijuro, even allegedly been engaged to him, so it's pretty clear where her REAL affections were, I think.
Yeah I tend to agree, however for this situation, I wasn't even aware the chapter was out yet, so what do I do but click the thread's title on the main index, and it takes me to the newest post, which may or may not contain spoilers. So, you see for the brief time after the episode is released, I think spoilers should be tagged. After a few days/weeks, it's fair game.
Sparnage said:I was interest to see, they have been taking the ethereal side of things up a notch with the ghosts appearing around him, not just related to the psychology of two fighters before a duel or whatever. I'm not sure what I think about that personally.
Sparnage said:Also, was that fall big enough to kill Akemi, and if so, why did she wait to kill herself right on front of Musashi? Did she want to get back at him that much to try and leave him with guilt? Maybe she expects him to save her.
It would be interesting to see if Musashi even cared. I get the impression he does have some regret from killing so many people, maybe this will push his guilt further.
Mushi said:The river is supposed to kill her more than anything to do with the jump. Keep in mind, she also tried to drown herself in the novel, under different circumstances, and was rescued by... Uncle Gon (sadly, Gon is gone in Vagabond).
Mushi said:Anyway, he certainly seems affected, quite an emotional roller coaster he's been on, after all.
Walter said:Several months until the next chapter. I believe it said Feb 7...
Uriel said:And I have it on good authority that there is a reason for Inoue's time off. Details will be discussed once I get some confirmation, though it won't affect many of us, me thinks.
Inoue said:This is the last chapter in volume 27.
But, there were some things that are missing, so I will be touching it up.
Look forward to it.
Mushi said:Is it anymore extreme than Inshun's out of body experience in volume 8? I always feel these things are more spiritual than supernatural; not meant to be taken totally literally, but abstract thoughts and feelings that need to be thought of and conveyed in the abstract.
Or who knows? Maybe Musashi has schizophrenia, or depression with psychotic tendencies, something like that. =)
The river is supposed to kill her more than anything to do with the jump. Keep in mind, she also tried to drown herself in the novel, under different circumstances, and was rescued by... Uncle Gon (sadly, Gon is gone in Vagabond).
Anyway, he certainly seems affected, quite an emotional roller coaster he's been on, after all.
Sparnage said:My concern is I suppose how literally it is supposed to be taken, it seems rather literal. Treading corners on a concept that can bring a bit of a different angle in a subtle way is one thing. But, and I'll emphasise in my opinion, although Vagabond is one of my more preferred mangas I think they take it too far in some parts.
Not just with the outer body experiences, but certain elements are too exaggerated for my liking. The Musashi novel spoke about several related concepts in similar ways to Vagabond, but stood to a more philosophical stance on spiritual existence and related concepts, not fully fledged ghosts and merging mind reads etc. That being said I'm still reading it and enjoying it, so it's just nitpicking really.
Sparnage said:Yeah, I almost forgot about that in the book. Seems like Musashi's the only one that can save her now is the Musashi. It could go on a different path from the book and have her die now, but I doubt it, she has too much of an important role.
Sparnage said:Anywho, shame he is leaving right away after the fight instead of returning to Koetsu's and seeing Kojiro again.
Mushi said:Well, you're being rather vague in what you think is too far versus what's acceptable to you, and how/why, even your initial comment about this one wasn't very specific. I think Inoue does an excellent job conveying the spiritual experiences Musashi and others are having to us through exaggeration. I mean, you can't draw abstract concepts and feelings, you have to draw something to get the concept across and make the reader feel it, akin to flashbacks or simply showing us a mental image. A lot of things boil down to Musashi's own experience and perception, like when Inshun's spirit was talking to him, only Musashi heard it. It wasn't like Inshun was a full-fledged spectre. It goes back to the whole spiritual versus supernatural thing. Using Berserk as familiar ground for comparison, I certainly don't think Musashi's "ghosts" are anything like the ones we see Guts' encounter.
There's other examples, such as the fight with Seijuro; like on the last page of the first chapter of volume 22, when it shows Seijuro standing there after having been cut down. Seijuro wasn't actually standing there like that, it obviously wasn't literal as his upper body went flying, but it conveyed the gravity of the moment. Same territory when Kojiro attacks Ittosai and his body looks like a raging series of wild brush strokes, and when he wrote Musashi's name, the large brushstrokes Inoue used to convey his body. Even just those shots of Musashi at the beginning of chapters where he's standing out in nature, in a forest or lake, etc.
In a nutshell, I think there's a lot of romanticism, which encourages things like ghosts and spirits in a natural sense (like, not the "Boo!" kind), and impressionism in Inoue's work in Vagabond, and taking it literally, in some cases, borders on misinterpretation. In any case, I don't really understand your concern, I guess it depends on how you look at it and what perspective you have on these things, spiritual and artistic, coming in.
Yeah, I'm voting save, mostly because it would be better than Musashi just watching her kill herself in front of him. I disagree that she's important though, at least in Vagabond. Inoue could always make her more important like in the book, but as it stands, he could just as well kill her now.
I don't know, what's more to say? He could still drop by on his way out of town, but yeah, seems like he does just want to get the hell out of there (and with good reason, like it's getting harder and harder to escape).
Sparnage said:Soz about the late reply, craming for exams. I didn't intend on getting into it.
Sparnage said:The thing is with this sort of issue, parts I don't think are good you will have a an answer and perspective to why you think it's justified. But ok, I will use a few examples I really didn't like.
Sparnage said:Using the example of Musashi vs Inshun, it is obvious that Inoue wanted it to be a very poignant moment in the story, otherwise he would not have stretched it out to be comparable to a Naruto or Dragon Ball Z arc. It seemed he really wanted to make the foundations of story more clear on how he makes the psychological, spirtual and philosphical aspects of Musashi and other significant characters, and went to lengths to articulate the situation.
I would agree that it was a good chance to do so in many aspects. It's a turning point for Musashi in his character development which of course is a significant story element. I can't help but feel it was taken too far though. The whole situation during the nearly two volumes of the fight taking place shows their perceptions and whatnot, I think it was just overdone how much Musashi, Inshun and other surrounding characters go back and forth looking at the situation from every possible angle... overkill might be a fitting for the context. There were others that followed what I would consider to also be overdone, but that situation was a particularly heavy.
Sparnage said:Whats more, I think it's just ridiculous with the whole thing about taking it to new depths into "mind battling," Ki or whatever they call it with the Kami'Izumi ise no kami hidetsuna character, I couldn't get into that at all. The way the guy in the flashback defeated the young Sekishusai and In'ei in the name of Ki, philosophy or whatever just didn't work for me at all, not as a reader, Otaku or an ex fighter. It could've been overlooked if again, Inoue didn't put so much emphasis on it, that's the painful bit.
Sparnage said:A similar feeling I got from Musashi's defeat on Sekishusai, a bedridden old master who managed to out-psych him or whatever, it can be interpreted in several ways but I was just.... well not taking it seriously.
Even if he didn't take it like Eiji's story line where Musashi realises that bothering an old retired master would be petty and dishonerable (although something along those lines would've been a better alternative I think) Inoue's choice to follow this concept further onto a new level was just... well I might say pointless but he was definitely trying to get something across, but I didn't like it at all, and even if you don't agree I hope you can at least see why people might feel this way.
Sparnage said:I just enjoyed seeing them interact. But I suppose if they spent another 10 minutes together this time it'd probably lead to a premature battle the story isn't ready for yet.