Episode 369

[Griffith]

The series shall be rechristened as "Ape Shit".

Not a great vibe in here. =)

You're right, I was just reusing cijhho123's expression, but as far as I'm concerned the "canon" stops at episode 364.

Yeah, the width and brightness of the red line separating these texts is growing and glowing blindingly in all but name only.

Got it. You're sticking with just "flaws," for the things I listed. And such things won't get in your way, because:


So is basically anything they put out okay as long as you get an ending?

To be fair, the narrative on a macro level IS paramount and pretty much all this project can succeed at, so other than Puck and Guts, I don't think most readers are focused on, let alone highly concerned about, the consistency of the depiction of the (un)natural laws of the Berserk world on the growing list of inconsistencies (just pencil in Puck randomly sticking around "because he's tethered to his friends" for later =). The problem is the narrative execution, specifically concerning Guts, hasn't been good or really effective either.

Maybe it's because I'm largely agnostic about the ethereal elements of the plot (#justice4gnawersRIP), but I'm actually relieved Elfhelm is off the board; Studio Gaga can't hurt them, nor us with them, anymore. It's why my immediate reaction was just make the next Arc/Chapter the last we so can dissect this and move on.

 

[Sir Schraffl]

As bad as the execution is, I'm still interested to see what happens next. Guts is basically at square one.

 

[Griffith]

As bad as the execution is, I'm still interested to see what happens next. Guts is basically at square one.

Yeah, it's pretty much most useful for seeing what would, or maybe could is the operative word, have happened and extrapolating and imagining how Miura would have done it better. See folks, best of both worlds; choose your own adventure!

 

[Lawliet]

No, not after the day of its release, which is close to 12 hours ago now.

No, I meant is there really anything to spoil here? Spoiling presumes something good to spoil. If what we're getting is shit, why bother with the tags? Hence, the toilet analogy

And yes, I'm all for changing the title. I personally use a silly synonym for "Berserk", "Bonkers". That's what I'll call it moving forward.

 

[Alonne]

Sorry, but you don't get to dictate the terms of conversation here.

i know, is just that i'm a bit tired to see this happening every time a new episode is released, i just want to talk the about the episode and were the history is going but is kind of hard to do when everyone are arguing about who's right or wrong for liking or disliking the episode, i'm sorry if it sounds rude but thats is just how i feel.

 

[Aazealh]

i know, is just that i'm a bit tired to see this happening every time a new episode is released, i just want to talk the about the episode and were the history is going but is kind of hard to do when everyone are arguing about who's right or wrong for liking or disliking the episode, i'm sorry if it sounds rude but thats is just how i feel.

Why don't you talk about it then? What have you got to say about it? Be the change you want to see. Because if we removed the messages discussing the quality of the continuation so far, this thread would still be on page 1, and mostly filled with people not understanding what's happening or why.

 

[Griffith]

It's the 5 Stages of Reading the Berserk Continuation:

Denial: "Maybe this episode it will be good?"
Anger: "It's NOT good! It's WRONG!! This is a betrayal!!!"
Bargaining: "Maybe Miura would have done this but better? Can they change the name...?"
Depression: "This sucks. They've stained Berserk's legacy. I've wasted my life on this." (the last one mostly 10+ year vets =)
Acceptance: "It's basically a summation of future events stretched into a misguided longform. I wonder what happens next..."

And thus the vicious cycle continues.

 

[Alonne]

Why don't you talk about it then? What have you got to say about it? Be the change you want to see. Because if we removed the messages discussing the quality of the continuation so far, this thread would still be on page 1, and mostly filled with people not understanding what's happening or why.

You know what, you are right.

well if we analize the episode on the first page the can see that at least schierke and farnese are ok, they somehow manage to survive the colapse of the island, i wonder what happen when griffith took casca as those 2 were the closest to her.

We then see the colapse of the island and we can see how puck and the inhabitans flee form the destruction is a shame that we could not see the reaction of the Archmages to griffith. but i hope that they are going to explain what happened to the astral creatures and why they dissapeared on the next episode, my theory is that since the spirit trees connect the astral and physical realms maybe with the destruction of the tree all the astral creatures in its proximity were sent back to a deeper layer of the astral world i remember that gut's party had a conversation with the archmages of the island about the spirit trees being important as they worked as a way to maintain equilibrium between the physical and astral world and that the world tree that griffith created when he slayed ganishka was a dragon road that was like a fissure between the astral and physical plane so i believe that the two planes are not actually merged but they are in superposed stated were members of the astral world can interact with those of the physical world, just like in enoch village (were the trolls attacked) and the reason why griffith wanted to destroy all the spirit trees was in order to strenght the world tree and bring chaos into the world by having the 2 planes collapse into one.

I have to admit that some events felt a bit rushed as they did not tell us stuff as how roderick was able to survive but i dont think that is that important as the crucial point on the episode is whats going to happen in the future, guts seems to be debastated, i've seen some theories about that ivarella and puck may dissapear with the rest of the astral creatures the same way that isma did, and considering that this could be seen as guts loosing again his friend to griffth this could be the push that would make him go on a bloody crusade againt griffith the question is how is he going to manage to damage griffith as he himself stated that he could not even land a hit on him, but we saw that he was able to cut a string of griffith hair or at least that is what appeared so maybe the Dragon Slayer is still not at the point where is able to damage a member of the god hand.

 

[Aazealh]

You know what, you are right.

When am I not?

And since you made the effort, I'll humor you and reply to your post.

well if we analize the episode on the first page the can see that at least schierke and farnese are ok, they somehow manage to survive the colapse of the island, i wonder what happen when griffith took casca as those 2 were the closest to her.

Haha, what happened is they weren't drawn because the team didn't know what to do with them.

is a shame that we could not see the reaction of the Archmages to griffith

Among other things, yeah. It's kind of a long list at this point.

i hope that they are going to explain what happened to the astral creatures and why they dissapeared on the next episode, my theory is that since the spirit trees connect the astral and physical realms maybe with the destruction of the tree all the astral creatures in its proximity were sent back to a deeper layer of the astral world i remember that gut's party had a conversation with the archmages of the island about the spirit trees being important as they worked as a way to maintain equilibrium between the physical and astral world and that the world tree that griffith created when he slayed ganishka was a dragon road that was like a fissure between the astral and physical plane so i believe that the two planes are not actually merged but they are in superposed stated were members of the astral world can interact with those of the physical world, just like in enoch village (were the trolls attacked) and the reason why griffith wanted to destroy all the spirit trees was in order to strenght the world tree and bring chaos into the world by having the 2 planes collapse into one.

This paragraph is somewhat incoherent and shows some confusion. In short, like Walter told you on the previous page, the reason for why the elves all disappeared wasn't pre-established in the story. What the Great Gurus mention about the World Tree and forests of spirit trees doesn't explain it. One would indeed expect that an explanation will be given in the next episode, but at this point we can't be too sure. We will see.

I have to admit that some events felt a bit rushed as they did not tell us stuff as how roderick was able to survive but i dont think that is that important as the crucial point on the episode is whats going to happen in the future

I'd say Roderick's side of the story has been the most fleshed out thing in the last two episodes. Also, surely what is actually shown or not shown in the episode is important to the episode. If one always just cared about future developments and not present ones, then nothing would ever matter.

guts seems to be debastated, i've seen some theories about that ivarella and puck may dissapear with the rest of the astral creatures the same way that isma did, and considering that this could be seen as guts loosing again his friend to griffth this could be the push that would make him go on a bloody crusade againt griffith the question is how is he going to manage to damage griffith as he himself stated that he could not even land a hit on him, but we saw that he was able to cut a string of griffith hair or at least that is what appeared so maybe the Dragon Slayer is still not at the point where is able to damage a member of the god hand.

I don't believe Puck and Ivalera disappearing from the corporeal world would outweigh the abduction of Casca as far as Guts' feelings towards Griffith are concerned. I also don't quite see how he could go on a "bloody crusade", unless you mean that he's going to lay siege to Falconia or something. Merely roaming around killing apostles has already been shown to be fruitless, that's how the Lost Children chapter concludes. And he can't even really do that anymore. Lastly, I think it would be quite lame if beating Griffith came down to just "upgrading the Dragon Slayer".

 

[Sayfallah]

@Alonne With Hanarr and the rest of the astrals disappearing the only chance for Guts to get a significant upgrade comes from Skull Knight who I imagine in this version will just showcase the new weapon's might by killing more blobs.

As for everyone's disappointment, Youtubers whose whole career is built on hyping up Manga are loving this new version. So is their Ad revenue. Listening to them you'd imagine this is the perfect piece of fiction, it's almost as if Miura isn't gone!

 

[Aazealh]

@Alonne With Hanarr and the rest of the astrals disappearing the only chance for Guts to get a significant upgrade comes from Skull Knight who I imagine in this version will just showcase the new weapon's might by killing more blobs.

Wait a sec, who said Hanarr disappeared? He's just standing there with the Great Gurus watching it happen! That must be on purpose, of course, this team couldn't possibly have forgotten that dwarves are a type of elf, could they?

 

[Imperivm97]

Btw guys, has Guts really moved at all in the past 2.5 episodes?

(367) After the swing, he got jostled a bit and fell. (368) Then we see him in what appears to be a crevice (but apparently not?) with the ooze dudes talking to him (never capitalized on), and later he looks up and reaches out for Casca. And now (369) he's leaning on the DS for the full sequence.

There's this small panel of Guts taking one step, so I guess the implication is that he walked up to the surface? But then he finds himself surrounded by stones at the end while he's still leaning on the DS so I can't really tell if the grass and dirt just disappeared like every other creature or if he walked around for a better view for the last page of the episode

 

[Odeon]

I never get mad but I think I might be feeling the ‘anger’ emotion. Haven’t felt like this since they fucked up game of thrones. Still I will keep hope.

 

[Somnambulist]

After the chapter ends, I wonder what "Miura's ideas" are going to amount to. Because so far, it seems to me that the only completely safe guess is Casca's abduction. Other than that? The truth is that we have 5 episodes of just filling the gaps, with the inherent liberty that such an action has. 5 episodes for basically 1 major, truly canon event? That's very problematic. It's sad, but from the moment they announced the continuation, this was always gonna be the case, let's not kid ourselves. They were never gonna release exactly what Mori knows about future story developments in manga form, it's simply impossible without a lot of improvisation. The magazine would never choose to release a fragmented manga version. They just don't have enough material to work with. The ideal option is gone (a narration with sketches), so we're stuck with this.

Also, being one person that used the word "casual" in a previous post, with said word I basically meant the majority of the readers that I see in youtube and social media, that probably haven't spent a single cent to support Berserk financially, and it shows. I never said that in a derogatory sense for any actual, longtime fan here who happens to like this project. Sorry for any kind of misunderstanding.

 

[Nosferatugatsu16]

Anyone here finds it odd that puck is just flying on the top of the island for 5 episodes? Even so i would have found it entertaining had he decided to descend and find guts down the rubble and disappear right in front of him. Maybe have a small convo about Puck tryna say something nice to guts before he turns to shiny dust and then have guts say something like " i failed to protect everyone"
Then switch back to isidro/isma part which i didnt find impactful because im not yet that sold to isma

 

[callmejoe]

Definitely a case of "eating your cake and wanting it too". It's halfway between a normal manga and a minimized story with only the key points Mori and co can remember. It doesn't succeed in either case. Best case scenario is the the next arc can take it time to put more "meat" on the bone but sits hard to see how they are going to handle something like Guts/Grifith/Casca's relationship well. We also probably won't get much more out of the supporting cast.

 

[Eternal_Void]

Greetings fellow travelers,

I've been reading the comments here for years now and indulging in the wonderful theory crafting of this community. Would you believe it, I felt like there's not much I could contribute to the conversation when there are people who've spent many thousands of hours with Berserk on their mind looking for every minute thing with special meaning that could somehow help shed light onto the murky future.
After all, what could I with my mere hundreds of hours think of that others haven't thought of years ago.

It feels like I've started building a castle while the Ancients (this is how I'm going to refer to Aaz, Grif, Walter & co, take it as a nickname of love ) are putting up their finishing touches on their keep and starting to expand outwards.
How much time do I have to spend to finish my castle and start expanding to catch up to them? How much time to get to the same realm of vast Berserk knowledge that they possess? hint:One might say the studio is in a similar situation

If you had Da Vinci standing next to you for years, telling you how to paint the Mona Lisa, guiding every brush stroke of yours, would you be able to do it, to make it as good as the original? Now imagine doing it without any help, only with random tidbits of information that you have gathered throughout the years about what he imagined the Mona Lisa to be like.

What we got with the continuation was a Behelit that tempted us to stave off the pain and buy ourselves a bit more time to relish in the past and be hopeful about the future.

Yeah, it's pretty much most useful for seeing what would, or maybe could is the operative word, have happened and extrapolating and imagining how Miura would have done it better. See folks, best of both worlds; choose your own adventure!

In an ideal world, we would have gotten cliff notes of what Miura wanted to do, a list with a short summary of all the events.
In all likelihood some of the events on that list would have changed by the time Miura got to putting them on paper, but that would be the closest we could get to the intended flow of events.
The good news is that far into the future, after Berserk's publications end, we might still get this. For that we need only wait.

I am reminded of Game of Thrones and the latter half of the show as Benioff and Weiss were getting impatient and wanted to do other projects and were approaching the end of GRR's written story in the books. Despite having the guidance of Martin and what is by all accounts the intended ending of the show, they botched it.

To get back to my comparison with, fittingly, the Mona Lisa. Da Vinci created the painting with semi-transparent glazes stacked on top of each other over the course of years. Just like Miura created an intertwined story with some notable elements appearing a hundred episodes before they are introduced into the main story.
For me the continuation is like trying to finish the Mona Lisa by painting with only 10 solid colours. Every new layer atop hides the previous glazes and all the effort that went into creating them and all the ones beneath them. The painting will look like a matt, dimly coloured, washed out shadow of itself.

The struggle ended, and in a fittingly tranquil setting might I add. We just haven't accepted it yet.

Just two people here have used the word "casual." That's a broad generalization, certainly. But you're similarly handwaving away all of the problems with the continuation by saying it's "not perfect."

So what did you think of:

• The anticlimactic, nearly off-page destruction of the gnawers (despite the dramatic tension last episode)
• Not showing key characters like Puck and Ivalera disappearing (can't say they ran out of room)
• Guts focusing on his inability to hit Griffith, and not "Oh shit, Casca was taken away by my enemy"
• The Gurus, Hanarr, Volvaba, etc. showing up just for one perfunctory panel instead of the major players they were set up to be
• The dissonance between Danan's explanation and the merging having brought the corporeal and ethereal worlds together

That's quite a few imperfections just in the past 17 pages.

Unfortunately there is only more to come.

They're definitely flaws but I still felt there were things to admire. The Art is better and I really liked the "darkest hour" feel. Guts really is at his lowest and it will be interesting to see him try to pick himself up, before likely going on the war path. I want to at least see how the story ends and I think that given what they needed to work with (having to start right before the climax, Mori having to work from memory of what Miura told him rather than any written notes or outline) they're doing a relatively decent job. Any continuation would have problem and I think that Mori and Studio Gaga would be able to do the best take (though how good it is is up in the air.)

For me the art doesn't matter, as I know, almost certainly now, there is no hidden meaning nor is there layered intent behind it. If there was intent behind it, it would be explained, but it's easier to create the art and leave the interpretation to the reader (no creative freedom for the studio).

They are too constrained for the attempt they are making. Transmitting Miura's remaining ideas is a noble cause. But choosing an episodic framework like the previous releases of Berserk was not the only option available, and it's been a mistake. It's the core of all the problems now and the ones to come.

Agreed.

If that's why it was "largely done," then it largely missed the mark. They could have had Guts say anything. They went with that.

Btw guys, has Guts really moved at all in the past 2.5 episodes?

(367) After the swing, he got jostled a bit and fell. (368) Then we see him in what appears to be a crevice (but apparently not?) with the ooze dudes talking to him (never capitalized on), and later he looks up and reaches out for Casca. And now (369) he's leaning on the DS for the full sequence.

Maybe he'll just stay there?

A prime example of the speech bubbles taking away more than they contribute, in an exceedingly important moment at that. If it wasn't an official release I'd venture to say it's ban fanfiction (which it is).

It's the 5 Stages of Reading the Berserk Continuation:

Denial: "Maybe this episode it will be good?"
Anger: "It's NOT good! It's WRONG!! This is a betrayal!!!"
Bargaining: "Maybe Miura would have done this but better? Can they change the name...?"
Depression: "This sucks. They've stained Berserk's legacy. I've wasted my life on this." (the last one mostly 10+ year vets =)
Acceptance: "It's basically a summation of future events stretched into a misguided longform. I wonder what happens next..."

And thus the vicious cycle continues.

The official "anything" doesn't matter to me, as with many other works that went awry, the true end can be wherever I choose.
I'm grateful that that Miura has given us all that he had. In my mind, the rest of the story is for us to finish with the niblets of clues that we get about the intended direction.
I am happy that we have a general direction for the events of what's about to unfold.

The Ancients will no doubt find the meaning and past foreshadowing, only for me to gain said info they have painstakingly put together by reading their comments / listening to the podcast . Thank you, for I find solace in knowing that others care so much.

 

[cijhho123]

After the chapter ends, I wonder what "Miura's ideas" are going to amount to. Because so far, it seems to me that the only completely safe guess is Casca's abduction. Other than that? The truth is that we have 5 episodes of just filling the gaps, with the inherent liberty that such an action has. 5 episodes for basically 1 major, truly canon event? That's very problematic. It's sad, but from the moment they announced the continuation, this was always gonna be the case, let's not kid ourselves. They were never gonna release exactly what Mori knows about future story developments in manga form, it's simply impossible without a lot of improvisation. The magazine would never choose to release a fragmented manga version. They just don't have enough material to work with. The ideal option is gone (a narration with sketches), so we're stuck with this.

Also, being one person that used the word "casual" in a previous post, with said word I basically meant the majority of the readers that I see in youtube and social media, that probably haven't spent a single cent to support Berserk financially, and it shows. I never said that in a derogatory sense for any actual, longtime fan here who happens to like this project. Sorry for any kind of misunderstanding.

A so called "casual" here, a legit question:
I spend almost a grand on my berserk deluxe volumes, is this money going to the studio or other third party like Dark Horse? Its really important to me to actually support the publication

 

[Aazealh]

Anyone here finds it odd that puck is just flying on the top of the island for 5 episodes?

Of course. Puck would never just stay put doing nothing like that, he'd fly down to see if his friends are alright.

A so called "casual" here, a legit question:
I spend almost a grand on my berserk deluxe volumes, is this money going to the studio or other third party like Dark Horse? Its really important to me to actually support the publication

By virtue of buying the books you're already more of a fan than 90% of online commenters, so don't put yourself down. And to answer your question: yes, of course, purchasing Dark Horse's volumes contributes to supporting the series. The money goes to the US publisher, but the author (Kentarou Miura) and the Japanese publisher (Hakusensha) get a share of it as part of the licensing deal.

 

[Sir Schraffl]

Yeah I'm getting real tired of seeing puck every episode just looking shocked at everything, I feel like if it were written properly he would be down there with everyone else.

 

[NightCrawler]

Love it. It sucks, but it's succinct and it'll probably end in 2 years at this pace, which is amazing. 5 episodes in and I think people need to get over it. This is what you'll get, pacing is horrible, writing is trash, but focus only on the broad strokes, the big events, because those seem to be the ones closer to what Miura intended.

 

[Walter]

Love it. It sucks, but it's succinct ... pacing is horrible, writing is trash

 

[Masa]

Did Danan turn out to be a nothingburger? Why was she utterly helpless when everything went south?

Rhetorical question, we can surmise why. Mori wasn't told what to do with her. I can't believe she would've been a glorified extra in Miura's version.

 

[Walter]

Rhetorical question, we can surmise why. Mori wasn't told what to do with her.

Indeed, Danan's lack of action as her island is attacked falls in the same bucket as what happened with Farnese + Schierke when Griffith approached Casca. There was no interaction because, presumably, Mori wasn't confident in portraying how Miura would have navigated them. So instead, it all gets pushed to the side (literally, in Farnese+Schierke's case), leading to several dissonant moments.

 

[Sir Schraffl]

Rhetorical question, we can surmise why. Mori wasn't told what to do with her. I can't believe she would've been a glorified extra in Miura's version.

Well I feel like miura was setting her up to be very important with her resembling skullknights old love (sorry cant remember her name) so hopefully that is still addressed.