SKnet's official I-Told-You-So thread?

[Aazealh]

(so I'm guessing you meant xenophobic, maybe)

I don't think there's a word for what he meant to be honest.

However, I DO agree with the fact that anyone should be able to bring up whatever idea they have (as long as it involves Berserk and isn't something that already has happened) to Speculation Nation, no matter how crazy it is, so if I wanted to stake something that is a million to one .

Which is the case already. I don't even know why this is being brought up.

So I have an idea, how about a thread within Speculation nation that's all for General speculation that doesn't have the necessary amount of evidence to be considered something that can be proven one way or another.

Bah, what difference would that make? It's not as if we've got too many threads. I understand your point about people not having any basis for their theories, but it's already the case most of the time anyway. That isn't a problem as long as they acknowledge that fact and accept the possibility of other members dismissing their ideas.

That way the Admins don't have to go around responding to threads that are just based on far out bullshit. In the cases that an Admin thinks that a certain theory was undeserving of Speculation Nation, the poster should have the right to present their side of the argument and then convince the hopefully objective Admin to let it stay.

When you see some of the shit that's in Speculation Nation, you've really got to wonder how bad a thread would have to be to be considered undeserving. I don't think that's the problem to be honest. Deci's posts weren't deleted, he just didn't like the feedback he got.

And finally, I think we should also have a section devoted for the times when you have heated discussions that evolve (or I guess regress) into arguments. Now this wouldn't be a section for flame wars or anything, but rather it would serve to gimp arguments and keep them from expanding into constant PMings, chat room bickering, or worse being a big ass argument clogging up space in a serious discussion thread. This section (I'd call the Fight Club) would gimp fights, in much of the same way that saying, "let's take this outside" does.

It'd be dignifying something that doesn't need to be, IMHO. And it's not like we often get arguments that would qualify. As long as it's on-topic, I wouldn't see a reason to move a discussion involving serious disagreements to a separate section. Really, people might talk of flames and all, but I think we're a rather gentle community overall.

 

[Guts intestines]

Those types of sections always make the rest of the board look like shit.

*sticks out tongue* *then wags fist*

I like my suggestions .

Which is the case already. I don't even know why this is being brought up.

Yes, you can do it, but we all know what may happen if you do, I face palmed as soon as I read that presidential race Griffith thing that Deci said, but honestly as stupid as it may have sounded I can't honestly say I know Miura's intentions, so who's to say but Miura? So basically it'd just be a way to post to post such an idea without feeling as if you're about to walk a mine field.

Bah, what difference would that make? It's not as if we've got too many threads. I understand your point about people not having any basis for their theories, but it's already the case most of the time anyway. That isn't a problem as long as they acknowledge that fact and accept the possibility of other members dismissing their ideas.

Exactly, so such a THREAD (I'm not suggesting another board) could help to make sure people think more thoroughly and review their ideas before they start creating threads based on nothing, even though they should be doing this already there's no real way to make sure they do so before hand.

When you see some of the shit that's in Speculation Nation, you've really got to wonder how bad a thread would have to be to be considered undeserving. I don't think that's the problem to be honest. Deci's posts weren't deleted, he just didn't like the feedback he got.

That's my point, my SUGGESTION is only an attempt to raise the bar a little on what threads we get in Speculation Nation, because really there are times where you look in there and the titles of some of the threads don't let you know what you're getting until you go in there and then when you read it you occasionally have those moments where you think, " What the hell? Where did such and such get the idea for this?" Then when members come in and do dismiss these types of ideas, you open the door for arguments, now if there was some type of thread as what I'm suggesting people who don't want to read stuff like "Puck is Guts' dad" don't have to (yes, I'm exaggerating maybe you see my point). And when you do enter this thread you know what to expect: just about anything, and hey maybe you'll see an idea that sounds good and you'll try to prove it, who knows?

It'd be dignifying something that doesn't need to be, IMHO. And it's not like we often get arguments that would qualify. As long as it's on-topic, I wouldn't see a reason to move a discussion involving serious disagreements to a separate section. Really, people might talk of flames and all, but I think we're a rather gentle community overall.

I see what you're getting at but I disagree. It'd be more like moving any long marathon arguments from threads, I'm not talking about disagreements more of arguments that just get out hand are going, nowhere and do nothing but take up space within a thread. You could argue that those types of arguments shouldn't happen, but they do, and instead of modding the arguers (though I don't think this happens a lot here, though we do get a lot of arguments from a user with an Admin ) and making them stop they could play out whatever little arguments they have, instead of taking space up on the thread and or PMing each other with more arguments, or creating dumbass threads like "SK.net's official I told you so thread", as well as having others jump in and choose sides. And again I'm talking more about a thread and not adding a whole board or anything like that, it would just be for those large quote unquote "discussions", like there was that one in the presidential election thread, there was that one I had with you on my first few days here, those types, they all eventually end up playing themselves out, but I think this might actually make them play themselves out sooner.

Though I will agree with you and say that they are few and far between, but when we get them they go on for sometimes multiple pages, and rarely we get threads such as this.

 

[Aazealh]

*sticks out tongue* *then wags fist*

I like my suggestions .

You guys take this to the THUNDERDOME please. Two men enter, one man leaves.

 

[Vampire_Hunter_Bob]

You guys take this to the THUNDERDOME please. Two men enter, one man leaves.

But only one man is going in to begin with.

 

[Daijyashin]

I think that if the only focus of all this, is just a claim for reply in speculative theories, it's quite childish.
A theory, even if debatable sounds hilarious? Could be outcasted? Where's the problem.
Everyone posting a speculation should be aware of its reliability.
In any forum there are members endowed of killer knowledge and member to a primal approach toward a manga.
So even if the noobs didn't have the full knowledge even to speculate, they should be smart enough to understand this limit.

To an old member, or moderator or admin, a speculation may seems empty of meaning or anyway not worthy of a quote, or simple reply.
And on the other hand, if a theory sounds GOOD, not matter how if it is posted by a noob or an admin, it will be debated.

Then I even think that not always posts or speculations must require a forced personal expectation. According to me a post should born from a different way of thinking, leaving the seeking for forced approval. None earn money or win something in forums, so I think it's better collaborate to conceive a good analysis.

 

[Guts intestines]

You guys take this to the THUNDERDOME please. Two men enter, one man leaves.

Ahem, it's FIGHT CLUB ya here me?!

But only one man is going in to begin with.

Buckbuck BUCKA!

 

[Vampire_Hunter_Bob]

Ahem, it's FIGHT CLUB ya here me?!

No. It's not going to happen.

 

[Griffith]

Scorpio: YOU WON!

Seriously, that's a thread saving Hall of Fame post.

 

[Aazealh]

I see you've edited your post, Guts' intestines. Here's my response.

Yes, you can do it, but we all know what may happen if you do, I face palmed as soon as I read that presidential race Griffith thing that Deci said, but honestly as stupid as it may have sounded I can't honestly say I know Miura's intentions, so who's to say but Miura?

So? This is a forum, not a private journal. When people post, they should expect reactions. And take responsability for what they say. Really, let's not blow this non-event out of proportion.

Exactly, so such a THREAD (I'm not suggesting another board) could help to make sure people think more thoroughly and review their ideas before they start creating threads based on nothing, even though they should be doing this already there's no real way to make sure they do so before hand.

No need for a specific thread for that. It'd just be an excuse for people to post carelessly. And it would require to enforce it as few would naturally respect it. It would also make it less easy to link to a particular discussion, and nothing guarantees that people would make a new thread after having debated of an idea, which would be redundant anyway.

That's my point, my SUGGESTION is only an attempt to raise the bar a little on what threads we get in Speculation Nation, because really there are times where you look in there and the titles of some of the threads don't let you know what you're getting until you go in there and then when you read it you occasionally have those moments where you think, " What the hell? Where did such and such get the idea for this?" Then when members come in and do dismiss these types of ideas, you open the door for arguments, now if there was some type of thread as what I'm suggesting people who don't want to read stuff like "Puck is Guts' dad" don't have to (yes, I'm exaggerating maybe you see my point). And when you do enter this thread you know what to expect: just about anything, and hey maybe you'll see an idea that sounds good and you'll try to prove it, who knows?

Your idea is actually more restrictive than the current system of some people posting just whatever they want and other people reacting to it. Also, members coming in and dismissing ideas is a good thing. Wrong theories should be dismissed for the sake of the people posting them and of the people reading them. Otherwise it opens the door to confusion, and that isn't good. Even sturdy theories can benefit from being challenged as it proves their worth. Moreover, arguments aren't necessarily a bad thing. They can be constructive and informative.

I see what you're getting at but I disagree. It'd be more like moving any long marathon arguments from threads, I'm not talking about disagreements more of arguments that just get out hand are going, nowhere and do nothing but take up space within a thread.

But then again, we've got more than enough space as it is. It's not like our every thread spans dozens and dozens of pages. Moving arguments to a specific place could also appear to be a form of censorship, as only consensual and "non-disturbing" posts would be left in a thread.

Anyway, I understand your point, and your suggestions are duly noted, but it's not going to happen for the moment. Now let's move on if you don't mind.

 

[Guts intestines]

I see you've edited your post, Guts' intestines. Here's my response.

So? This is a forum, not a private journal. When people post, they should expect reactions. And take responsability for what they say. Really, let's not blow this non-event out of proportion.

No need for a specific thread for that. It'd just be an excuse for people to post carelessly. And it would require to enforce it as few would naturally respect it. It would also make it less easy to link to a particular discussion, and nothing guarantees that people would make a new thread after having debated of an idea, which would be redundant anyway.

Your idea is actually more restrictive than the current system of some people posting just whatever they want and other people reacting to it. Also, members coming in and dismissing ideas is a good thing. Wrong theories should be dismissed for the sake of the people posting them and of the people reading them. Otherwise it opens the door to confusion, and that isn't good. Even sturdy theories can benefit from being challenged as it proves their worth. Moreover, arguments aren't necessarily a bad thing. They can be constructive and informative.

But then again, we've got more than enough space as it is. It's not like our every thread spans dozens and dozens of pages. Moving arguments to a specific place could also appear to be a form of censorship, as only consensual and "non-disturbing" posts would be left in a thread.

Anyway, I understand your point, and your suggestions are duly noted, but it's not going to happen for the moment. Now let's move on if you don't mind.

Alright, alright I concead the point. Well, there's really no point for this thread now, unless somehow Deci ends up being right and even then all you'd see from this thread would be gloating.

 

[Xem]

The "I told you so comment" was made in light-hearted humor, along the same lines as someone yelling "WOOT NEW VOLUME". I'm certainly not some whiny emo kid, yet certain board members just take things the wrong way, and since they attain a degree of authority they've decided to spin this discussion in the manner they deem fit.

Guts' Intestines, I meant agoraphobic in the sense that someone is afraid of the outside, or in a forum's sense, outside ideas. It's a bit of a stretch, but this thread is plenty evidence to back it up. This started from a meaningless post made from me, to Walter reacting emotionally for some reason (why couldn't you just leave my post alone?), to Griffith swinging in to double team, then finally ending with Aazealh rambling on.

Those who control the world, write it's history, I suppose.

Deci's posts weren't deleted, he just didn't like the feedback he got.

Wrong.

I'd PM this, but why were certain posts of mine deleted, as well as PMs ignored?

 

[Griffith]

Those who control the world, write it's history, I suppose.

You're still doing a fine job of revisionist history yourself, from your "theory" to your "persecution" over it, which as Aaz pointed out doesn't seem to actually exist. And if anyone is completely innocent here, it's Walter; you were being somewhat obnoxious, under what looked like false pretenses, and when Walter dared to administrate HIS board, you copped a big 'ole attitude about it and cried elitism. What's hard to understand about our problem with this?

For the record, Walter was baffled by your response and wasn't even going to reply, so I jumped in, as is my bellicose nature.

I'd PM this, but why were certain posts of mine deleted, as well as PMs ignored?

Wrong.

I don't know about PMs to other admins, but unless I'm missing something, the only deleted post of your's that I see is your response to Saiya's "YOU ARE ALL FAGGOTS" post, which is nothing relevant. You make it sound as if your words have been unfairly manipulated or censored to make you look bad, which is just another example of how I feel you aren't being completely forthright here, with us, the board, or yourself. The posts are all right here in the thread for people to judge for themselves, the only one that was deleted/modified from the 298 thread was your initial one which started this, which happened to also be modified by you. I don't see how we're spinning it, if you look at the posts, starting with your first, the one who's been trying to narrate and frame the issue has been you.

Look, you don't have to submit or concede or anything, just recognize and stop denying your own responsibility in what transpired.

 

[Aazealh]

The "I told you so comment" was made in light-hearted humor, along the same lines as someone yelling "WOOT NEW VOLUME".

Oh, is that so? Because your handling of the whole thing doesn't exactly spell out "light-hearted humor".

I'm certainly not some whiny emo kid

And you sure aren't coming off as one here!

Guts' Intestines, I meant agoraphobic in the sense that someone is afraid of the outside, or in a forum's sense, outside ideas. It's a bit of a stretch

It's just a wrong use of the word. No big deal, no one's going to hold it against you.

Those who control the world, write it's history, I suppose.

Hahaha man, talk about dramatizing things. You haven't addressed any of the points I politely made to you, instead you keep on spinning your fanciful tale of oppression. And it's not fooling anyone. Please, don't humiliate yourself any further.

Wrong.

I'd PM this, but why were certain posts of mine deleted, as well as PMs ignored?

Wrong my ass. No posts of yours relating to your ideas about Griffith and Ganishka were deleted. No one prevented you from expressing your thoughts in Speculation Nation. Are you saying otherwise? Because that'd make you a liar, and as patient as I am with people like you, I don't stand liars much.

Ah, and contentless posts do get deleted, especially in threads like this one. Don't do a giant quote only for the sake for quoting. Thanks.

 

[Vampire_Hunter_Bob]

Why is this thread open still? Nothing important at all is going on. I vote lock it.

 

[Walter]

This started from a meaningless post made from me, to Walter reacting emotionally for some reason (why couldn't you just leave my post alone?), to Griffith swinging in to double team, then finally ending with Aazealh rambling on.

There's no "emotion" in my first reply to you. I was just mildly annoyed at you for taking up space in an important thread to gloat about some perceived victory. You got called out for it and then were suddenly offended, making an even worse case for yourself by announcing you've harbored an unjust grudge against the administration here for months.

 

[Proj2501]

Why is this thread open still? Nothing important at all is going on. I vote lock it.

I second

 

[Guts intestines]

*Tries to disarm the situation with humor*

Take this shit to the fight club, oh wait we don't have one!

I like a little e-squabbling as much as the next guy, and Deci obviously feels like he's been wronged somehow, fact is this little exchange doesn't seem to be going anywhere.

It takes balls to try to take on the three top Admins., he could get up tomorrow find himself banned, find an effigy of his avatar hanging by a noose around its neck on the entrance of the site, and they could make it so there's no trace of him ever being a member of the site. Of course this would never happen, nor do I foresee anyone admitting any wrongness here, so as I said yesterday this thread has no point, light-hearted or not, so it should be locked eventually, unless the arguers truly think they can work this thing out.

 

[SimplyEd]

*Tries to disarm the situation with humor*

Take this shit to the fight club, oh wait we don't have one!

I like a little e-squabbling as much as the next guy, and Deci obviously feels like he's been wronged somehow, fact is this little exchange doesn't seem to be going anywhere.

It takes balls to try to take on the three top Admins., he could get up tomorrow find himself banned, find an effigy of his avatar hanging by a noose around its neck on the entrance of the site, and they could make it so there's no trace of him ever being a member of the site. Of course this would never happen, nor do I foresee anyone admitting any wrongness here, so as I said yesterday this thread has no point, light-hearted or not, so it should be locked eventually, unless the arguers truly think they can work this thing out.

I would like this to end in a rather schmaltzy happy end. Lots of hugs and tears and all that. Let there be peace!

 

[Oburi]

I just want to know how old Deci is. Six? Six and a half?

 

[Guts intestines]

I just want to know how old Deci is. Six? Six and a half?

Let's not start insulting either side, just let them deal with it.

 

[Skeleton]

To state the obvious...

Message boards aren't democracies. They're iron-fisted dictatorships. You play according to the ruler's whims or you leave, either willingly or by force.

It doesn't matter if you feel wronged. It doesn't matter if you have to get your self-esteem from the judgements of people over the internet who you will never encounter in real life. It doesn't matter if you think your opinion is equal to everyone's.

The truth is that the mods here are incredibly fair, kind people who are doing an amazing job running a damned good board. It sucks that you feel like you're being persecuted or whatever, but hey, some people get angry when you save their lives.

The bottom line is... There's the door. If you don't like it here, leave.

 

[Lithrael]

Oooh, cold and hard, Rojo.

Oh, now I remember Deci. He posted to my very own wild spec thread. Hmmm, I shall contribute to the drama.

(...) it's been a while since I've posted on forums, and in all honesty they used to be more political/religious forums, so I guess you could say I'm somewhat used to being in a defensive stance.

Yeah... the thing is the admins here might come off as high and mighty but it's a text medium. If you expect others to give you the benefit of the doubt about your tone, you should do the same in return. Like in my thread when Walter says "let me take you by the hand" to me, I don't feel it's a slight against me.

Criticism isn't something I have a problem with (...)

Just try to widen your definition of criticism then, I guess. Seriously, it's a great board. I find it strange that you think it's oppressive that the community's members set the community's tone.

OTOH, I very much appreciate the encouragement you spread around in Creation Station.

 

[Walter]

Yeah... the thing is the admins here might come off as high and mighty but it's a text medium. If you expect others to give you the benefit of the doubt about your tone, you should do the same in return. Like in my thread when Walter says "let me take you by the hand" to me, I don't feel it's a slight against me.

Yeah it's certainly nothing personal, as proven in Lith's case. Despite the fact that she's a moderator in Creation Station and one of the most goddamned awesome artists we've come across, I took her to task in that thread. I just take Berserk discussions seriously

Another thing that's not been voiced here is that at some point, EVERYONE gets trounced on SKnet. Nothing is sacred here except Miura and Berserk. It's happened to me, it's happened to Aaz (though only in his eaaarrrllly days) and it's happened to Griff. In the end, egos can be bruised, but the prevailing concept/theory wins out and everyone comes away with a greater understanding of the series.

 

[Aazealh]

I like a little e-squabbling as much as the next guy, and Deci obviously feels like he's been wronged somehow, fact is this little exchange doesn't seem to be going anywhere.

It takes balls to try to take on the three top Admins., he could get up tomorrow find himself banned, find an effigy of his avatar hanging by a noose around its neck on the entrance of the site, and they could make it so there's no trace of him ever being a member of the site. Of course this would never happen, nor do I foresee anyone admitting any wrongness here, so as I said yesterday this thread has no point, light-hearted or not, so it should be locked eventually, unless the arguers truly think they can work this thing out.

Are you trying to be an arbiter or something here? Thanks, but it's not needed.

it's happened to Aaz (though only in his eaaarrrllly days)

You've got no proof! I've destroyed the evidence!!

 

[Griffith]

As I've communicated to Deci via PM already, it's all relative. One man's elitism is simply another's standards. The balance between allowing free expression and tolerating ignorance is precarious at best, and we've chosen to error on the side of scrutiny. We have experimented the other way with results we'd rather forget, and a perception of elitism is a small price to pay to keep things at a high level for the most part. In reality, with those standards in mind, this board is pretty loose and indulgent with its members, as exemplified by this thread, and the cries of elitism are all to easy a scapegoat for people that simply don't want to be scrutinized.

Anyway, as has been said, if people can't hang with that, that's their problem, and then hopefully they won't be ours.