Aazealh said:Encountering a member of the God Hand inside the Sea God? That would be somewhat unexpected. That being said, I do expect to see some very interesting things inside that monster.
Co-sign, in its first appearance in episode 240 the Makara might have been the scariest-lookin' monster Guts ever faced, I think I was actually worried for him:Aazealh said:Ah, OK then. Actually he reminds me of the first time we saw a Makara. I was quite impressed by the thing at the time.
That is probably the best word I can think about.Rhombaad said:Griffith seduces others in order to bend them to his will/unite them to his cause, whereas Guts unconsciously draws people to his side (whether he wants to or not) and continues to do so to this day.
Griffith is such a good foil to Guts, and I'm glad you pointed this out because honestly I wasn't thinking about the contrasts between Guts and Griffith. This is one of the many things I love about Berserk. Miura doesn't give us half-asses material, instead he gives us a high quality storytelling.I just enjoy this subtle black and white relationship between Guts and Griffith, two people who are so different in their methods and personalities.
I know this isn't some historic revelation, but I thought I'd share what I was thinking and see if anyone else had something to add or if they disagreed with my train of thought.
Good eye, brother.Rhombaad said:I just thought this was interesting and reminded me in a way of the parallel between Guts' and Griffith's "methods" of charisma. Griffith forces (not really the right word, but I couldn't think of a better way to describe it) his charisma on others in order to bend them to his will/unite them to his cause, whereas Guts unconsciously draws people to his side (whether he wants to or not) and continues to do so to this day.
Hehe, I wish I could take credit for that observation, but I believe someone brought it up a long time ago elsewhere on the forum.Gobolatula said:Good eye, brother.
I hadn't thought about it in terms of goals, but your absolutely right. The Sea God is (at least for the moment) all that stands in Guts' way of reaching Elfhelm.Gobolatula said:Another thing is, both Guts and Griffith are both inches away from their goals at this point. It's interesting to see that their lives are kind of parallel in that way, time wise. Both fighting giant monsters to get to where they wanna be.
I'm not sure we can say that Femto didn't use his powers. He just didn't use brute strength. Nor, given the circumstances, would I say that he defeated Ganishka so much as he used him for his intended purpose (that of merging the worlds together).Rhombaad said:I noticed while reading the episode that Guts' encounter with the Sea God kind of parallels Griffith's encounter with Ganishka. Both opponents are monstrous in size and strength, and appear impossible to overcome. Griffith was able to conquer Ganishka without using any brute strength or his powers resulting from being a member of the God Hand (aside from the reaction of apostles to members of the GH, which appears to be innate), but because he was meant to defeat Ganishka and bring out the merging of the Worlds.
What hierarchy?Draculoid said:If a God Hand WAS to show up i guess it would be Conrad....just because he seems lower in their hierarchy so more likely to appear earlier on and also seemed to be shown in relation to the plague/infection in the same way i feel the Sea God may be infected
There is no official hierarchy that we know of, but if you're going by their order of appearance at the Eclipse ceremony, Conrad appears second to last, before only Void himself, and he's arguably the only other member to perform rites by raising the alter (though Slan and Ubik obviously participate as well). When we see them during the Fantansia episode, the order of Conrad's and Ubik's appearance are reversed though, which means... absolutely nothing, like I said.Draculoid said:If a God Hand WAS to show up i guess it would be Conrad....just because he seems lower in their hierarchy so more likely to appear earlier on
Streeeeeetch! C'mon guys, if you're going to make false equivalencies, don't set them up like a reasoned argument is coming.Draculoid said:and also seemed to be shown in relation to the plague/infection in the same way i feel the Sea God may be infected.
But it's appropriate for Conrad because of his association with rats, the plague, and urban death? I don't even know that any of that matters (Qliphoth wasn't especially Slannish, save for the fornicating Trolls, but trippy enough), and this whole thing seems "pretty trippy" to me anyway: a pirate ship, that are tentacles, that are people, that are giant slugs, that are bigger tentacles, that are the beard of what I'm going to safely assume is the biggest mouth in the world.Draculoid said:We already saw Slan recently...this seems too out of place for Ubik, i imagine him being in some sort of "trippy" encounter/ location.
Ya think?Draculoid said:Void will be closer to the end.
And where are the rats here? What's the connexion to disease? What's this "God Hand infection" you're talking about? Nothing you say makes any sense.Draculoid said:You think Conrad being related to plague/infection is a stretch? The only times we have seen him manifest himself in the physical world has been through plague rats....all I'm saying is IF its a god hand infection in the sea god it might be him due to that, do you have any better justification for it being any of the other members?
No, I'm pointing out that that has little to do with the sea. =)Draculoid said:You think Conrad being related to plague/infection is a stretch? The only times we have seen him manifest himself in the physical world has been through plague rats....
There's nothing to indicate an infection of any kind.Draculoid said:all I'm saying is IF its a god hand infection in the sea god it might be him due to that, do you have any better justification for it being any of the other members?
You bias based on height!Draculoid said:I realize there is no real hierarchy, guess that was a stretch on my part...i always see Conrad and Ubik as less powerful followed by Slan and then Void for no real good reason.
Yeah, but I don't think it really matters. Qliphoth was a lot like that, and no Ubik there.Draculoid said:By "trippy" i meant more of a mind game like set up, also more crazy surreal looking enemies like the ones shown in his Fantasia manifestation.
And, as far as anyone can see, you were absolutely wrong. Congratulations!creampuff_war said:I raised the idea in December of Conrad being the sea monster based mainly on the image of the brand and the amount of blood, which struck me as remarkably similar to the Guts' encounter with Slan.
Remarkably similar? I think that's exaggerating the reality. If you really want to see something comparable, how about this?creampuff_war said:I raised the idea in December of Conrad being the sea monster based mainly on the image of the brand and the amount of blood, which struck me as remarkably similar to the Guts' encounter with Slan.
|Volume 15 (Rosine)||Episode 318 (Sea God)|
You're missing my point. Look at volume 26. She sensed Slan's presence. It was like a huge wash of chaos over her at the time. There's been nothing like that on the island.creampuff_war said:Schierke made the comment that the sea god's power is immense, and that fighting such a creature is beyond hope.
So then your argument is that Guts is aware that it's a God Hand, but is keeping it secret for now?And Guts reaction CAN change. His first encounter with Zod was different than, say, the snail count.
not at all, although that's possible. The same sensations he felt during Slan's encounter need not exist in order for a God Hand to be present...I think. Maybe not though.Walter said:So then your argument is that Guts is aware that it's a God Hand, but is keeping it secret for now?
Possible like it's possible Guts is an elf and Zodd is his father, though I don't even think it's that possible. Even if Guts could hide his thoughts from someone he's currently sharing a form of consciousness with, as dubious a proposition as any motive he might have to do so (none), Guts doesn't very well hide his important thoughts from the audience, "I better not think about the God Hand I know is in here, it'll be a spoiler, and I don't want to ruin their awesome speculations!" If he's not thinking about sensing a member of the God Hand, he's not sensing one.creampuff_war said:not at all, although that's possible.
Her physical presence is probably the least important factor to her sensing or feeling the effects of powerful spiritual energy like that. As a matter of fact, minus a physical form she's more susceptible to such energy, as she mentioned in volume 22 when spying on Griffith, using a bird as her physical anchor so she wouldn't get lost in his power. Her presence in and of the armor doesn't make a difference either, as we saw the first time they did this; she had no difficulty sensing and assessing the spiritual power of the Kundalini, for example.creampuff_war said:Schierke's lack of being engulfed by a wave of chaos this time could be b/c of her physical presence not being in the actual area. She is out of body, holding on to Guts this time. Guts is also wearing the Berserk armor this time, wrapped in it with Schierke.